whoa.. pls no MR mr here. Mr Wong's my daddy
er.. my apologies for the long winded post yar - i couldnt really think of a way to simplify for absorption yet summarize

Yup, yr funds' account is needed.
From experience, IMO is updated about 2 to 3 days time, depending foreign or local fund + what time executed.

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Added on September 23, 2011, 9:42 amAll guns and % of ammo prepared Sir.

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 23 2011, 09:42 AM

Yup yup - to the "ready & willing", opportunities are self created.

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Added on September 23, 2011, 11:07 amHeheh - bro, U may not want to follow buta leh. Those sifus have their personal entry/exits AND reasonings & sizing of entries.

eg. U see one fellow say GO
and U put all $ U allocated for equity funds in
... then market continues sliding.. how?

That fellow may have only pumped in 33% or 50% of his allocated ammo
and may be buying due to his/her own rules (eg. every 15% down, average down)

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 23 2011, 11:08 AM

er.. may i suggest, better focus on other stuff like kids/hobbies for now.
If U cannot tahan YET still focus on your equities' loss of value, U wont be able to zzz OR may do not-too-smart things

FYI - personally i'm down about $15K, since beginning of Sep till now, in my Equity funds' value, winching a bit in pain/discomfort but knowing well that sales is up next, i endure...

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 23 2011, 01:59 PM

Heheh - up to yesterday, KLCI down 12.98% from top + REITs are getting hit "hard" as well now.
Give it another month or two, when U see people dumping REITs (even with good DY%), it's a good indicator.
In a similar vein, when KLCI's average DY% is about 6% to 7% (way above average of 3.5%+/-), U know that it's bargain sales time.
HOWEVER, it doesnt mean it has stop falling for sure - that one U need a crystal ball. The above is just about value hunting (no crystal balls on me)

BTW, 90% discount ?!! Even in the horrible 1998 kabloey where KLCI went down more than 80% from max, we never got 90% discount lar.
Scary man if we see 90% discount (and sort of interesting... heheh to a value hunter).

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 23 2011, 02:09 PM

Heheh - no lar. I've got equity funds with another fund house, Prudential, too mar. Started thooooooooose days remember?
Just wanted to keep that when i rebooted my mutual fund investments coz of foreign focused equities via EPF (which cant be done now).

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 23 2011, 06:55 PM

More pain to come dearie
Just keep the powder dry and your targets in your sights

Personally, i wouldn't leverage unless i'm very VERY sure i know what i'm doing.
Even when i'm am, i'd have a solid cut loss & run exit plan, just in case things go bad for too long - the markets may stay down longer than i can be cash flow +ve (with the loan % dragging me down)

Just a thought

Bro, U sound like playing Magic The Gathering or some Pokemon Card battle game

Heck the way nearly all equities (stocks/equity funds, metals, commodities) are plunging like a cheap dress' neckline, we may be so confused on WHAT to buy later

Kinitos - i think in the equity funds' prospectus, U'll notice that each fund has a minimum required holdings of equities, thus some funds & fund managers just cant "move" once the hit their minimum. Then again, i may be out of caffeine when i read them prospectus

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Added on September 24, 2011, 7:17 amIn addition to Howzat's post above, personally i use mutual funds just because:
a. EPF allows me to take out $ that i cant touch or leverage on until i retire
b. Useful for shotgun approach to several countries' funds (ie. countries' equities which i'm unfamiliar with but want some exposure)
c. Long term effective cost of "trading" - ie. cost of (1 time 3% or 5.5% service charges) + SWITCHING between bond & equity funds in the long run (think EPF years K, like 10s & 20s)is much much lower than my stocks' in/out costs
d. Thus, to me it's like outsourcing the actual planting/sowing operations of a farm but personally reap and keep the produce by reviewing each of my transactions' net profit/loss at least monthly.

Those are the reasons why i'm paying PM the moolah of 3% or 5.5% + yearly mgt fees. Er.. i'm bluffing - i pay less coz either i nego with my old agent OR now i'm my best customer

BTW, those that buy, do DCA and go zzz for 20 years or so - look at the stats for PIX's 10years CAGR returns (bad & good ending dates lar) - generally hovering around 7%pa to 9%pa. Ok mar - much better than FD, as long as U go zzz and not sell/buy crazily. PIX = Index fund, well, PM's version lar coz it aint a TRUE BLUE index fund per se hehe.

Again, that's just one approach out of "millions" - your mileage (time, attention, level of expertise/experience) may vary

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 24 2011, 07:19 AM

-39 / -2.8%++ down. Heck, even Gold plunged like a cheap dress' neckline + REITs getting hammered.

Thank goodness i'm underweight in Equities (like in mid to top 10s%)
Bro Boney, my guess is U are also in good shape and waiting to go bear hunting (or bear clubbing for the nastier ones?!) in about 3 to 6 months time?
Remember to wear red and not accidentally shoot me ar. I'm the one with the specs - bears no specs

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 26 2011, 01:40 PM

a. Yeah, PFES' lowest was 0.149 hit on 28/10/2008
b. Highest since 2008 was 0.3419 hit on 21/04/2011.
Note: Highest EVEH was 0.3757 in 01/11/2007

Thus there was a long crawl (6 months?) from PFES' a. to b. compared to the fall
Falls are usually more violent due to gravity

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Added on September 26, 2011, 2:15 pmWei - dont be like my mother lar, trade jadi long term investment pulak.

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 26 2011, 02:15 PM

It will go up lar bro Boney... and it will go down and up and down - the REAL question is up / down how much and when

Fellow forumers & mutual fund investors, just to share an idea:
Local focused fund - Value investing based on PM's "Market Wrap", specifically the "Market's Gross DY%" as a barometer.

Been using "Market's Gross DY%" based on a few stocks (LPI, PB, NESTLE, DIGI, UTDPLT) all this while but hard to share/proof to others until i received PM's "Market Wrap" and thought of using its historical issues to prove a point (yes yes, i'm kinda slow that way ).

Attached is the "proof" and concept for your kind consideration:


Bottomline:
When gross DY% is high, means market prices are depressed BUT stocks are still shooting out dividends (ie. biz making $).
ie. market price doesnt agree with biz
Good value buy right?

A big thanks to David83 for the 2008 & 2009 PM's Market Wrap. Kamsiah kamsiah

Note: Your mileage may vary - this is just a possible entry rule, no exit rules here yar

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 27 2011, 12:27 PM

P/E? Yup U can - i'm just presenting a simple yet effective way to buy value based on market DY% for mutual funds. Based on the P/E also can or a combo.
Me - simply put, DY% vs FD or EPF, how many % more, thus.. heheh

Methinks P/E has many different calculation variations though - forward earnings, backward/historical, mixture, thus i've noticed P/Es for certain stocks can differ by more than 10%, more than variations i've seen for DY%. Yup - DY% also has different calculation variations heheh.
I may be wrong though
er.. this paragraph based on individual stocks that i've eyeballed yar, not the example posted.

IMHO, for stocks of course U need more details lar coz your $ is "focused" vs in mutual funds' 1 fund = at least 10 stocks

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 27 2011, 12:27 PM

Heheh - bro, i got a buddy believe "sky falling" since 2007 and until now "sky still falling" for him. Perma-bear fellow - sure to get it right 50% of the time but he missed out big on the 1st Qtr 2009 to 1st Qtr 2011 run. Of course, he also "missed out big" on the 2008 fall too

BTW, i read in some books, if one were to "miss" the big falls AND the big jumps in equal numbers of time, one would actually be better off leh. So much for "always staying invested" theory. Anyone simulated this with KLCI historical index before?

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 29 2011, 08:18 AM

Er.. distribution/bearish, or me, some cash move from stocks to shorts for KLCI index futures but equity funds move only to bond funds coz I don't want to pay the service charges for equity funds again when getting into equity again.
Vice-versa during recovery & accumulation trend.

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 29 2011, 08:37 AM

1st off - sorry yar mod - serong topic a bit

Bursa's KLCI Futures Contract: http://www.klse.com.my/website/bm/derivati...ives/fkli2.html
Some better/clearer idea: http://www.apexequity.com.my/cms/main.php?...&op=page&id=337
Note: not for the faint of heart and those without risk management or sizing management skills. Can lose or make $ per half-point of index $25

I'm doing it with Hong Leong eFutures since i'm on Hong Leong's eBroking for stocks - can transfer $ around easily + brokerage $18 one-way.
and i'm doing it coz nothing to do with cash in my stock account hehe. Expecting 3 to 5 months of nothing to do with it mar.

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 29 2011, 09:10 AM

sama sama idea bro - take some $ off the table when markets are exuberant.
Heck, i dont think we want to argue with a high and happy market willing to pay us more than normal for our holdings yar?
and vice-versa - when market is so suicidal & depressed, throwing away good stuff and lelong prices

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Sep 29 2011, 09:58 AM

Heheh - bro, i was from Mutual Funds --> Stocks --> Gold --> Futures, not straight into futures lar
Basics first and i'm putting in some skin to learn properly - with real stress of greed/fear to fend off VS staying the course (of entry/exit methodologies)