Kai W pwns em all!

Don't forget Lok C too.

have we met?

suddenly mention me like this, I was hoping to avoid this topic wan cos i debate until tired already.

i put it simple la, to me the gear is important as a tool but that's as far as the importance goes. most important part is the person holding the tool.

i could have the best paintbrush, canvas and oil but if i am no good at using them, I'm going to be producing high quality rubbish.

why some photographers cost a bomb to hire? it's not because of their gear, it's because of what they can produce. their gear is just a tool.

generally agree but 4 is not entirely true. Even L lenses have flaws but they're all very good already. Even the non-L lenses are very good.

Believe it or not, in some cases you actually have to use non-L but expensive lenses.

For example if you're using an EOS 7D - you don't have any other ultra-wide angle other than EF-S 10-22 which is not an L but the performance is superb. Zoom range, nothing beats EF-S 15-85 and EF-S 17-55 for that range. All 3 of those cost more than L lenses. Canon's TS series 45 and 90 also cost more than L, they're not L either.

define good gear.

yes. assuming a good picture is good, the better gear does make it better.

how much better depends on what the actual compared item is.

photographer still same or not?



er......... me? haha. i never used 18-55 for actual jobs .......until last month when i was in the midst of equipment shuffling (seller FFK me!!!). no choice wat. if there's a need to fulfill and if you can deliver with your set of gears, I don't see the issue. I'm not ashamed to admit that as well.

upgrade will happen when people can afford. I would have nicer gears if I can afford them as well. I upgrade whenever possible but my upgrades are around 95% for my work purpose. I focus on skill upgrade first. It's not like I purposely stay back with low-end gears to show-off or anything. I just don't believe in eating maggi noodle / grass every day just to get gears.

I've been through enough with entry-level bodies and non-L lenses. - stock photos, qualification, award and prints on various magazines and locations in Malaysia. what else can I say?

lastly I end with my gallery http://www.shutterstock.com/g/briancyc . other pages http://www.dreamstime.com/Goldfries_info and http://depositphotos.com/portfolio.php?id=1030253

All taken with non-L lens. All taken with non-semi pro / non-pro bodies. ALL taken with the head and heart.

Anyway the above is just to share my experience.

Good night, have a nice day. Can PM me if you are interested to know what setup was used for which image in the gallery.

No dude...i'm no body just somebody who admire your work + knowing ur using entry level camera is just another boost for me

I dunno about you guys. But I define gear head as people who upgrade body.

Lens is not gear upgrade. It is the necessary to have good lens.
Also, flash is not gear upgrade. It is very very important.

To really enjoy dSLR photography:
a) if you're poor like me, get the cheapest body like 1000d.
b) get lens like 11-16mm f/2.8 Tokina + 85mm f/1.8 + 70-200mm (poor man setup)
c) get a flash at least got swivel and rotate (at least Di622). Recommended 580EX2..

Maybe I'm asking the wrong question.... how about name 1 of the top 10 professional photographer that uses entry level body and a kit lens

People will say upgrade yourself and don't just simply upgrade a mere tool. I'd say upgrade the tool to get a good result. Yes I know that people are gonna say "Then if you are snapping rubbish you will get a rubbish result either way". True but why limit the usage of the new technology?

Either way, getting a good gear is always a good thing. Don't limit yourself by saying to yourself "I have to upgrade myself and etc etc". If you want it then go for it. Then again, put your financial into account, if you have the money then by all means go for it but if you don't have money and telling others to not upgrade, wouldn't that be misguided advice?


There is so much you can do with new things. You don't know how to take a good picture? those things can be learn but if you want to overcome the limitation of your entry level gear? that 1 can't be change unless the upgrade occurs.




This post has been edited by ComradeZ: Jan 10 2011, 10:26 PM

have you guys seen this - http://www.engadget.com/2010/12/24/nokia-n...lr-on-magazine/
a quote from the short newspiece -> "we wanted to show that it is not the hardware that makes a good photographer but rather the technical execution of an idea""

Well I "smell" nokia's fish in the project. For me the photo is just so-so...

who in the right mind would do that?



do you happen to know of anyone doing that?

anyway there are plenty of experienced photographers with reputation and $$$ that encourage upgrade of self / skills as priority.

perhaps you haven't met them or experienced enough to see how important is the skill upgrade.

of course if you enjoy taking whatever you like with expensive gears, that's your call. no one's stopping you or saying it's wrong.

Similar?

They can talk all they want about camera phones being able to take "stunning" pictures or "just as good as a DSLR" or "camera phones can produce good quality pics, so it's the skill that's lacking" type of rubbish.

Look at all the nice nice expensive Lighting treatment they gave it. And to top it off, a really good and intensive Post Processing to alter the colours so much which they later claim as "good colours"

And how is this going to convince us that "camera phones" can take good quality pictures, without all those fancy lightings and PP softwares to "cover" all the ugly stuff? Kinda reminds me of the time when a professional wedding photographer who took an entire pre-wedding session with a PnS Canon S90. They claimed, that it was 'highly capable" or even taking "really pro wedding pics" but did you actually see how much PP was put into it? Kinda defeats the claim which they made..

What type of question is that?

This post has been edited by -kytz-: Jan 10 2011, 10:49 PM

if iphone can do such nice things i straight back out from this industry liao. dowan to do since so many iphone users. i is sked.

who in the right mind would do that?

exactly

perhaps you haven't met them or experienced enough to see how important is the skill upgrade.

nope, I met them and privately [though if I'm telling who I met, you or other people would just say "he must be lying" so I will just say that I met this Ma'am B. ] . Anyway they will all say upgrade your skill first but then again at last, they will say "upgrade your gear".

What I'm trying to say is if anyone have the money, why stop them? just because they havent develop the skill? it is just as the same having high end gear and still learning the basic, it is just a tool, so any tool would be fine, no?

Even for me, I don't have money but if I do, I would upgrade. I'm not saying as if you don't have money, you must still upgrade... no.. I say "Then again, put your financial into account, if you have the money then by all means go for it"

maybe my choice of words is a bit of harsh but it is what I think is logic



P.S:If it is me, I would "upgrade" myself to d40x since I love that body but if I want to be more serious in this harsh and spreading world of photography. I would also require some new hardware

This post has been edited by ComradeZ: Jan 10 2011, 11:00 PM

advices are advices. there's many ways to see things in life. so you share your piece, others share theirs. then up to the fella with the $$$ to decide mah.

for me my path is always about starting with something simple to test the water. if suddenly work makes you have no time, or photography not your thing. abandoning also not so painful. you can even keep it without feeling that much wound in your $$$ account. of course that's my POV la, some people agree. some don't. so there are 2 sides on this matter. why you sound like to anti-people giving such advice?

then there's the other one that goes buy the best you can afford so you no need to upgrade in future. they have valid points but there are also counter points. no need to get all fired up over differences in opinion, right?

If u ask me, if I don't bloody care about you and your photography, by all means I'll just ask you to upgrade, even knowing that your problem truly is about your skills.

However, as a concerned forumer LOL I'd rather recommend a "skill upgrade" instead, as it is a free advice, no cost incurred and it doesn't hurt your wallet either.

Isnt' it so easy to ask you to BUY BUY BUY everytime you complain of a problem? That guy complains of lousy event shoot... I just say Get a super fast prime 30 f/1.4. Period? I can always do that you know, it's just so damn easy..

But, not many would really ask you about what's your real problem, how to tackle it, maybe it's a composition problem? Lighting? Let's give you steps on how to counter it , do this that bla bla

This post has been edited by -kytz-: Jan 10 2011, 11:04 PM

I'm sorry if my choice of words sounded like that by all means, skill is important but getting the right gear is also as important as it is. Thus getting a good result is a combo of both of that

once again, I'm sorry for my harsh words

This post has been edited by ComradeZ: Jan 10 2011, 11:05 PM

a lot of people under-estimate their gear. I'm sure many out there 1st thing come to their mind "my gear not good enough."

then go browse around - "eh how come this fella use same thing snap so nice?"

in some cases like if you shoot product or portraits, a 550D works like a 60D and 7D. Remember the Coffee vs Tea vs Coffee + Tea mix video from DigitalRev?

When you reach certain limitation. You will also be force to upgrade... like what you bought after buying 550d+50mm 1.8 ii at first and care to tell me what do you get after that? after you know the actual limitation? what did you bought from after you purchased your first dslr?

"Upgrading" is an easy way out *inviting flame*

Limitation?

Let's say, I have a 50 f/1.8 lens. I want a wider and faster prime. Has the nifty fifty reached it's limitation?

I guess it's kinda subjective laa, focal length for example.

Added: I got limited when I couldn't wide shots so I got a 2nd hand 1855. Also, it's very versatile..

Got myself a flashgun for event shooting as it's almost a necessity to remove those ugly shadows and all.

So yeah.. limitations

This post has been edited by -kytz-: Jan 10 2011, 11:24 PM

Comradez - chill la. kytz is just saying that some issues could be well solved by educating the person on techniques to improve the shots rather than just BUY, which doesn't exactly solve the matter but techniques learned can be applied for future photos taken.

imagine telling the fella to BUY already then the happy buyer go snap already still turn out similar, he / she will be disappointed.

that's all what kytz was saying. he didn't say don't upgrade.

you bought 18-55 for wider shot and you bought flash to light up your subjects, thats what I'm trying to tell... you reach certain limitation and the way to solve it is by "upgrading" or buying more gear.

It is simple actually, buy what you can base on what you need. Don't limit yourself just because skill aren't developed. Skill can be learn trough any tool and I mean it "any tool at all". The only thing that to avoid is overspending.