Hey there,

Was wondering when you were gonna post it here. Let' see:

...the sub-sale house is rm140k

S&P agreement = 1400
letter of declaration = 100
5% Gov tax = 75
=================
sub total = 1575

S&P fees are standard and alright. Please find out what this letter of declaration is please. Funny how your solicitor forgot to quote you for filing CKHT 2A, which ought to cost RM200/purchaser.
Lucky you then!

disbursements
stamp duty on S&P agreement = 40
letter waiver = 10
What is this letter waiver? Please seek clarification from the lawyer.stamp duty on transfer = 900
MOT registration fee on transfer (2 titles) = 100
title and caveat search = 60
printing of documents = 70
postage/courier/telephone/other expenses = 50
incidentals = 100
================================
sub total = 1330

TOTAL = 1575 + 1330 = 2905

Disbursements look alright except for that letter waiver thingy. Am surprised you're not being billed for bankruptcy search [usually around RM30] and affirmation fees [also around RM20-RM30]

Perhaps if you want to save a bit more you can ask what incidentals are - because postage/courier/telephone/other expenses sounds like incidentals to me. If they say it's miscellaneous fees - then you're being taken for a ride coz the Solicitors Remuneration Order states that miscellaneous fees cannot exceed RM50.

Check with them and let us all know here how it went. Good luck

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 14 2010, 02:42 AM

In my first question, it's related to a condo which is free hold. Wanted to know all the steps on this.

1) To sign S&P, possibly using Developers lawyers since they're paying for it. So I guess in this part, all legal fees between me and the developer is settled. So I will not have any other cost on this part rite?

2) For bank loan, I would presume in this part, normally the bank will appoint it's panel of lawyers and buyer pays for it? If so, how much is the legal fees (I might be taking a loan of RM460-RM480K)? Can I also opt for my own lawyer since I'm paying?


Upon doing both of the both, should I say that it's completed the whole process of the purchasing of the condo? Are this the only two legal fees that I've to pay or there are other miscalleneous cost to this as well?

CKHT 2A minimum charges is RM300 for each document done by a lawyer.

Correct if I am wrong.

thanks sifu dario. point noted. I will check with my lawyer. by the way, what are actually the elements in the S&P for purchaser? (bankruptcy search, affirmation fees, CKHT 2A and e.t.c)

i'll let u know the updates.

"Hey there,

This is a really tough question. I wish I had a crystal ball to help you out on this one, but I don't.

Some land offices are efficient, some are not. Some have hardworking staff, and some don't. There's a lot of factors involved, to be honest.

But as long as the documents have been presentation for registration, it should be alright. It is already on record that the documents have been presented, but not registered. So, to be honest, I wouldn't be so worried.

If you're still curious, perhaps you can ask you lawyer to give you a timeframe. Perhaps he has dealt with that particular land office for other transactions. He would perhaps be in a better position to answer your query for the time being.

Come back here with his answer and share it with us.

Cheers."

Perhaps I'd give a word or two here - when the documents have been presented to tha Land Office, normally, the lawyer will "let go", and he will tell you that it's in the Land Office,... he won't chase the Land Office for you anymore.

What you can do is to get the presentation receipt from the lawyer, go to the Land Office concerned, make friends with the people there, and try to chase the paperwork from one step to the other, eg from the Submission Clerk to the Chief Clerk, then to the respective sections which are involved in the processing, and finally to : the District Officer, who will put his signature on the grant.

You may need to show face and go there every week if they do not know you.

Thanks Dario and Hansel...

That means I have to go to the land office every week?
I guess that is the best I can do for now...

Thanks again..I'll update you once there is any progress on the title...

[quote=icecoolman,Nov 14 2010, 11:14 AM]
In my first question, it's related to a condo which is free hold. Wanted to know all the steps on this.

1) To sign S&P, possibly using Developers lawyers since they're paying for it. So I guess in this part, all legal fees between me and the developer is settled. So I will not have any other cost on this part rite?

1) Sign S&P
2) Apply for a loan and sign loan documentation with financier's solicitors
3) Wait for project to be completed. In the interim, your bank will make the necessary progressive payments to the developer
4) Sometimes, the individual strata ttitle may be obtained in before the project is completed. In this case, your solicitor will prepare the MOT for your execution.
5) The developer will inform you when the CF has been issued, and request you to attend to collect the keys.

That's about it. Pretty straighforward.

If there are any other costs, it may be admin fees which you have to pay the developer, before you can collect the keys. The rates differ, but they will usually give you the breakdown for it.

2) For bank loan, I would presume in this part, normally the bank will appoint it's panel of lawyers and buyer pays for it? If so, how much is the legal fees (I might be taking a loan of RM460-RM480K)? Can I also opt for my own lawyer since I'm paying?
There's a link to a site where you can calculate your loan, but I don't have it at the moment. If someone else has it, perhaps he/she can post it here for your reference.

Yes you may opt for your own lawyer since you're paying, but some banks insist on a solicitor who is on the FULL panel, while some accept solicitors who are not on their panel, but do so on an ad hoc basis - subject to terms which the bank imposes, eg must be partnership, professional insurance must be more than RM2M, etc. Check with the bank first if they allow the firm you have in mind to do the matter.

Upon doing both of the both, should I say that it's completed the whole process of the purchasing of the condo? Are this the only two legal fees that I've to pay or there are other miscalleneous cost to this as well?
The other misc costs would be admin fees which I mentioned earlier. If the dev makes the payment for the deposit of utilities in your favour, they would request you to reimburse them for it too. For highrise buildings, there's a sinking fund and fire insurance which you have to contribute to. Full details can be obtained from your developer.

Hope the above helps.

---

Added on November 14, 2010, 5:52 pm[quote=Seremban_2,Nov 14 2010, 12:07 PM]
CKHT 2A minimum charges is RM300 for each document done by a lawyer.

Correct if I am wrong.

[/quote]

CKHT2A is fixed at RM200/purchaser. For CKHT1A it is fixed at RM300/vendor.

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 14 2010, 05:52 PM

Is this CKHT2A compulsory? can the purchaser opt to fill the form and submit by themself?

Yummy,

NO you DO NOT have to go to the Land Office every week, or even at all. Your solicitor's DUTY which you have PAID for extends to following up with the registration of the documents after it has been presented. If you sense a delay, call up the lawyer and ask for the latest status. If you go on your own, it would also appear to impede and undermine the work of your solicitor.

Furthermore, you really really don't want to go to a land office in Malaysia. It's worse than a fish market, in some areas. People wait from 6am to get a number.

But if you're curious....

Hansel,

If a solicitor 'let's go' of the matter and does not follow up, a complaint can be made against him and he would be subject to disciplinary proceedings. To delay the registration of a document is a serious matter, especially if there's no proof of any follow up by the solicitor.

I would never encourage anyone to bypass the lawyer and go straight to the land office to find out the status. It would be a complete waste of time, and like I said above it would appear to impede and undermine the work of your solicitor.

I'm sure you would have a dissenting view on this?

---

Added on November 14, 2010, 6:34 pmFiling it is compulsory. Appointing your solicitor to do it is not compulsory,but most people do it out of convenience la. Yes you may fill it up on your own and send it in, but it's not easy as filling up a form to open a bank account, for example.

I'll try to get a PDF format of it and post it here. Maybe tmr or so. Then you gauge it for yourself.

Honestly, just let your lawyer do it la.

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 14 2010, 06:34 PM

...thanks Dario.
from ur explanation i can guess that its not easy to fill up the form. Okay i'll ask my lawyer to do it for me.

..well,.. Dario, you certainly do have your side of the story, and am not saying I don't agree with your points too, but how I would play it out would be to inform the lawyer first that I'm going to try myself since I needed the title quickly, take it as a help for him, and not so much as an indication that he is not able to do his job,...

Let me just say I have done it before at the Petaling Land Office, and it's been quite comfortable, we just need to know where to look and to be polite when speaking to the people there, and yes, be able to speak in the Malay Language well helps a lot too. My lawyer was certainly appreciative of my efforts too.

I will only raise an issue to the Bar Council after I have exhausted all avenues to get things done, and it is truely my lawyer who is not doing his job,...

---

Added on November 14, 2010, 10:21 pmQuestion is - why do you need the title so quickly? If you take a loan and the property is charged/assigned to the Bank, do you know that it is your bank who will keep the ORIGINAL title? You'll only get a photocopy.

Banks would give the solicitor around 3 months or so to get the duly registered title out.

Secondly, with all due respect, why on earth do you want to help your lawyer? You've paid a ridiculous amount for fees, and you've got to run around figuring out other stuff for the new property you're buying, so why bother assisting him?

Would you offer to peel potatoes at a restaurant you're eating out at? Or offer to bring your own syringe to the clinic when you need a jab (or offer to sterilise it for the doc? )

You may laugh at my analogy but that's what it appears to me when you say that you offer to help the lawyer extract or follow up to obtain the duly registered title.

What do you think? Is all the trouble really justified?

Cheers.

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 14 2010, 10:21 PM

Dario,

After discussing with my lawyer, here is the amend S&P legal fee.


Sale and Purchase Agreement = 1,400.00
CKHT 2A = 200.00
5% Government Tax = 80.00
sub total = 1,680.00

DISBURSEMENTS

Stamp duty on Sale and Purchase Agreement = 40.00
Adjudication = -
Letter Waiver = 10.00
Stamp Duty on Transfer* = 900.00
MOT Registration fee on Transfer* (2 titles) - 100.00
Title and Caveat Search = 60.00
Printing of Documents = 50.00
Postage/Courier/Telephone/other expenses = 50.00
Bankruptcy Search = 30.00
Miscellanous = 50.00
Incidentals = 50.00

sub total = 1,340.00

TOTAL = 3,020.00

Hi Dario, sorry for the late reply. The lawyer told me that the legal fees would be around 1K after discounts but did not mention about breakdown of the fees ~

thank you for your kind assistance

fazlittc: How come the legal fees seemed to have INCREASED? And how come there's Misc as well as Incidentals? What's going on? And you told him about CKHT2A??

---

Added on November 15, 2010, 1:23 amdreamadream: As long as you're happy la ya. However, I would advise you to get a breakdown of the fees. It wouldn't hurt. Plus it'll make your lawyer think, 'This is one smart, savvy client. Better take him/her seriously'

Whatcha think? All the best.

This post has been edited by dariofoo: Nov 15 2010, 01:23 AM

hi, just got a quote from my lawyer for my purchase of a condo.. would appreciate advice from those who are in the know.
He says he's giving me 40% discount on the condition that i let him do the loan agreement also.

Lawyer's quote. Property sale price : RM 193,000. Loan amount: RM 130,000

A) Legal Fees
1st RM 150K @ 1% = RM1,500.00
Sub RM 43k @ 0.7% = RM 301.00
Sub-Total = RM1,801.00
Discount @ 40% = RM (-720.40)
Total = RM1,080.60

B) Disbursement Fees: (what is this?)
( Stamp Duty -Stamping Fees )
1st RM 100K @ 1% = RM1,000.00
Sub @ RM93,000.00 @ 2% RM1,860.00
Search on Private Cavage =RM350.00
Others (Misc) = RM200.00
Total : RM4,490.60

Should be able to get a 50% discount on this.

C) Loan Documents RM 130 k)
Legal Fees 1st RM 150K @ 1% = RM1,300.00
Discount @ 40% = RM(-520.00)
Total = RM780.00

D) Disbursement Fees
( Stamp Duty - Stamping Fees )
1st RM 100K @ 1% = RM 1,000
Sub RM 30k @ 2% = RM 600.00
Total : RM 1,600.00

I'm a first time buyer and the prop is valued below RM 230k. Do i qualify for the 50% stamp duty waiver?

Sub-Total Estimated : RM 7,951.20
Discounts : RM (-2,245.30)
Total Lawyer fees (estimated) : RM5,705.90

Welcome raist86,

Disbursements are expenses incurred by the solicitor. These expenses must be itemised and detailed, and any excess must be reimbursed to you.

You must ask your lawyer to give you a breakdown of the disbursements incurred. There's no such thing as scaled disbursements, like the one which he quoted you. It's ridiculous, to be honest.

Please get a breakdown and put it up here. For a rough idea look at the earlier posts.

The 50% rebate will only apply to S&Ps dated 1st Jan 2011 onwards. In your case, it would not apply, assuming that you're gonna execute it any time soon.

Hi there...very newbie in propery..hope anyone out there can help to review the charges below is appropriate ? Thank you so much in advance...

This is the refiance charges for my existing house ( borrower : me and my wife ):

Refinance Loan Amount= RM 234,000.00

Legal Fee
=========
1 Facility Agreement 2,088.00
2 Memorandum of Charge 208.80
3 Entry & Withdrawal of Private Caveat 350.00
Government Tax : 5.00% On Legal Fees 132.34
========
2,779.14


Disbursement
============
1 Stamp Duty - Facility Agreement (original) 1,170.00
2 Stamp Duty - Facility Agreement (copy) 20.00
3 Stamp Duty on the Memorandum of Charge 40.00
4 Stamp Duty - SD for own occupation & bankruptcy 20.00
5 Stamp Duty - Letter of Offer 30.00
6 Reg fee-Memorandum of Charge 50.00
7 Reg Fees-Entry & Withdrawal of Private Caveat 480.00
8 Affirmation fee on the Statutory Declaration 50.00
9 Land Search Fee (CTC Title @ RM 50/- per title) 150.00
10 Bankruptcy Search 50.00
11 Security Documents 200.00
12 Miscellaneous 50.00
13 Postage, Courier and Photocopying Charges 100.00
14 Telephone, Fascimile Charges 50.00
15 Travelling Charges 150.00
=======
2,610.00

=======
Bill Total: 5,389.14
=======



Thanks !

Hi kly,

Thanks for dropping by.
Refinance Loan Amount= RM 234,000.00

Legal Fee
=========
1 Facility Agreement 2,088.00
2 Memorandum of Charge 208.80
3 Entry & Withdrawal of Private Caveat 350.00
Government Tax : 5.00% On Legal Fees 132.34
========
2,779.14
Legal fees are quite standard and looks alright.

Disbursement
============
1 Stamp Duty - Facility Agreement (original) 1,170.00
2 Stamp Duty - Facility Agreement (copy) 20.00
3 Stamp Duty on the Memorandum of Charge 40.00
4 Stamp Duty - SD for own occupation & bankruptcy 20.00
* There is no need for 2 SDs on this. It can be incorporated into 1 and it'll only cost RM10.

5 Stamp Duty - Letter of Offer 30.00
* This should only cost RM10 as only the original is stamped

6 Reg fee-Memorandum of Charge 50.00
7 Reg Fees-Entry & Withdrawal of Private Caveat 480.00
8 Affirmation fee on the Statutory Declaration 50.00
9 Land Search Fee (CTC Title @ RM 50/- per title) 150.00
* How many titles are there? How come there's 3 titles?

10 Bankruptcy Search 50.00
* This should only cost around RM30 for 2 pax

11 Security Documents 200.00
12 Miscellaneous 50.00
13 Postage, Courier and Photocopying Charges 100.00
14 Telephone, Fascimile Charges 50.00
15 Travelling Charges 150.00

* Items 12-15 are general disbursements, and in total, RM350 is quite high. Maybe you can ask them to make it RM200-250.

=======
2,610.00

=======
Bill Total: 5,389.14
=======
Other than that, it seems alright.

Your savings would not really be much, but if you ask me, it's still money right?

If you're gonna ask the solicitor to review it, let us know the results.

Good luck

Thanks Bro for you kind assitance !! Yes appreciate you help here !! Cheers