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 Personal financial management, V2

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wongmunkeong
post Mar 22 2012, 10:57 AM

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QUOTE(Hevrn @ Mar 21 2012, 08:33 PM)
Turning 24 this year and entered the workforce somewhere in May of last year. Here's the breakdown of my monthly ins and outs;

Salary + Allowances: RM2,500 on average (nett)

Makan: RM500 (inclusive of eating out with the GF during weekends)
Insurance premium: RM200
Parents: RM500 (refused to accept it at first, but I believe its my obligation as the eldest son, seeing as they put me thru my entire life and university)
Phone: RM60
Supplements: RM130
Entertainment: RM200
Transport: RM80 (take public transportation to work on weekdays)
Petrol: RM100 (take the car out on weekends)

So after taking into account the expenses, I've got roundabouts RM730 left. No financial obligations at the moment in time, staying with my parents, using the car they got for me when I was in college. Its not as high as I like, but that'd do for now I guess, until I get a bigger paycheck.

What I have stored as what I consider as my personal wealth is;
1. Savings: RM1.8k
2. FD: RM12k on a 3 month rollover
RM5.1k with a one month maturity (to credit back int + principal into my savings upon maturity - I generally keep this as emergency funds, but if I don't need to dive into them I'll throw them back into a 1 month FD again.)
3. No credit card debt. Firm believer of spending only when I have cash in hand.

Rule of thumb when managing my funds are;
1. Excess cash for the month along with my 1 mth FD int + principal will be thrown back into a 1 month FD.
2. Keep my savings at least around RM2.5k for the month ahead.

Personal goals? Well, I plan to do a little Euro trip in 2015. Need about RM16-18k for that. Lolz. And to get a decent apartment and get ready to settle down by 30. Achievable? Hope so. More advice from the sifu's here would be awesome. Mum has adviced me to dabble in shares, but I'm waiting for the right time to start. Maybe in the next downturn perhaps? where cash is king and stocks are cheap. Haha.
*
Hi Hevrn.
IMHO:
a. Good $ management habit U've got there and at 24! notworthy.gif

b. Definitely can go for Euro trip by 2015 and buy an apartment. However, the question begging would be how "decent an apartment"

c. I've done up 2 scenarios in Excel (i hope U have Excel - else use OpenOffice or StarOffice heheh) for your easy visualization
+ one based totally on FD
+ one based on FD + Bonds + REITs +Stocks of good companies
Please do play around with the variables in YELLOW cell - can change easily without screwing up formulas
If U understand the formulas (simple ones used anyway), please go ahead and change anything
NOTE: I've only used VERY conservative expected bonds/bond funds + REITs/stocks returns.
eg.
Bond Funds can hit 10%pa+ and even now, mine's showing 5%pa+/- to 9%pa+/-, BUT i used 5.5%pa only as the expected returns
REITs' dividends ALONE can hit 10%pa+ if bought cheap, even now, mine's showing 6%pa +/- to 8%pa+/-

d. Bottom line
I'd suggest U do as yr mum says - start learning and "dabbling" with shares (normal stocks & REITs) WHILE plonking of 50% of yr 3mths FD in bonds / bond funds. Dabble = put some skin in the game, track and learn hands-on WHILE continuing book/online learning
Why?
Coz keeping yr $ in FD until U get a chance to buy deep discount/lelong stocks/REITs may be a LOOOOOONG wait.
Why not participate a bit first, while keeping some ammo dry for deep discount buys?
Asset Allocation and resource allocation comes into play here biggrin.gif.

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Mar 22 2012, 01:57 PM


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va1kyr13
post Mar 22 2012, 12:30 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Mar 21 2012, 10:05 AM)

BTW, why so shy to share here ar if it's a good investment? At least the gist or structure of it lar if too convoluted to go into details. I'm sure if it's worthwhile, lots of interested parties  notworthy.gif
*
well it hard to tell in here cause you will not really understand how it work just by reading the whole stuff. you need to see it your self how it work though what im gonna said face to face...

And if anyone are interested, just set a date and we meet. I tell much more details.

THX
wongmunkeong
post Mar 22 2012, 04:28 PM

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QUOTE(va1kyr13 @ Mar 22 2012, 12:30 PM)
well it hard to tell in here cause you will not really understand how it work just by reading the whole stuff. you need to see it your self how it work though what im gonna said face to face...

And if anyone are interested, just set a date and we meet. I tell much more details.

THX
*
Heheh - sounds WAY TOO COMPLICATED for a simple investor like me.
My momma told me not to invest in things which cannot be explained to a child or a baka like me, else i wouldn't understand and be able to manage & track them.
Thanks anyway.

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Mar 22 2012, 06:19 PM
chabalang
post Mar 22 2012, 09:13 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Mar 22 2012, 04:28 PM)
Heheh - sounds WAY TOO COMPLICATED for a simple investor like me.
My momma told me not to invest in things which cannot be explained to a child or a baka like me, else i wouldn't understand and be able to manage & track them.
Thanks anyway.
*
Agreed - never invest in something you do not fully understand or "too difficult to understand". You are just so polite as usual to avoid telling him off. I am sure you are smart enough or have sufficient financial knowledge to understand the salient points of va1kyr13's "financial product" (most consumer financial products offered in M'sia are not that complicated).

As for va1kyr13's reply: "well it hard to tell in here cause you will not really understand how it work just by reading the whole stuff." I volunteer to decipher/simplify it for fellow forumers (subject to some time lag since I may not have access to the Net occasionally). I have some experience in structuring financial products in IBs/securities firm and have taught UG/PG students in evaluating new financial products and innovation in the markets (or rather it was an assignment for them to pick new financial products and evaluate them during tutorials).

Anyway, va1kyr13's original post: "Well if anyone here got RM35,000 (sound to much huh?!) to spend in investing, would you be interested if i said you can get 15% - 19% return (sound to good to be true huh?!) annually for 4 - 7 years of investing?" When I read the paragraph, RED FLAGS appear immediately - call it instinct or whatever...

This post has been edited by chabalang: Mar 22 2012, 09:22 PM
Hevrn
post Mar 22 2012, 09:14 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Mar 22 2012, 10:57 AM)
Hi Hevrn.
IMHO:
a. Good $ management habit U've got there and at 24! notworthy.gif

b. Definitely can go for Euro trip by 2015 and buy an apartment. However, the question begging would be how "decent an apartment"

c. I've done up 2 scenarios in Excel (i hope U have Excel - else use OpenOffice or StarOffice heheh) for your easy visualization
+ one based totally on FD
+ one based on FD + Bonds + REITs +Stocks of good companies
Please do play around with the variables in YELLOW cell - can change easily without screwing up formulas
If U understand the formulas (simple ones used anyway), please go ahead and change anything
NOTE: I've only used VERY conservative expected bonds/bond funds + REITs/stocks returns.
eg.
Bond Funds can hit 10%pa+ and even now, mine's showing 5%pa+/- to 9%pa+/-, BUT i used 5.5%pa only as the expected returns
REITs' dividends ALONE can hit 10%pa+ if bought cheap, even now, mine's showing 6%pa +/- to 8%pa+/-

d. Bottom line
I'd suggest U do as yr mum says - start learning and "dabbling" with shares (normal stocks & REITs) WHILE plonking of 50% of yr 3mths FD in bonds / bond funds. Dabble = put some skin in the game, track and learn hands-on WHILE continuing book/online learning
Why?
Coz keeping yr $ in FD until U get a chance to buy deep discount/lelong stocks/REITs may be a LOOOOOONG wait.
Why not participate a bit first, while keeping some ammo dry for deep discount buys?
Asset Allocation and resource allocation comes into play here biggrin.gif.
*
Hey, thanks for the advice. Yea, guess growing up I've always been taught to value money and only spend when necessary. yes, I do love to indulge once in a while (meal at a fancy restaurant, travelling, few drinks with friends), but I try to keep it at a minimum. And I never look to spend above my earnings for the month, unless of course its a big item purchase, like my new PC i got in December where I had to blow about 3 grand.

Learnt alot from reading this thread and your inputs, keep it up! Educate us more about wealth management. Hehe.
va1kyr13
post Mar 23 2012, 12:16 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Mar 22 2012, 04:28 PM)
Heheh - sounds WAY TOO COMPLICATED for a simple investor like me.
My momma told me not to invest in things which cannot be explained to a child or a baka like me, else i wouldn't understand and be able to manage & track them.
your mom are right. You must know the nature of what you invest in. I admit it way to ridiculous and a bit unsecured if you not know well what the program is. That is why im here to help you to know what am i doin. and how does it work. how long it goes.

If you are really interested what im gonna tell you, i invite you to my company for you to judge. I`m just messenger from my company to tell you this is an opportunity.
I not forcing anyone. Just to share with everyone.

The capital are RM35,000. The return about 15-17%. The period about 5 years - 7 years (depends on the project).
So again, if anyone interested, you can pm me, i explain more on it. "The best investment on earth, is earth!"

iStevei
post Mar 23 2012, 12:23 PM

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i dont think he interested. lol
Correct me if i am wrong tongue.gif
va1kyr13
post Mar 23 2012, 12:26 PM

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QUOTE(iStevei @ Mar 23 2012, 12:23 PM)
i dont think he interested. lol
Correct me if i am wrong  tongue.gif
*
well it sound like that. But i really meant to share good things to everyone.

Like some quote said "Sharing is caring" am i right? smile.gif

This post has been edited by va1kyr13: Mar 23 2012, 12:26 PM
yiivei
post Mar 23 2012, 12:39 PM

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QUOTE(va1kyr13 @ Mar 23 2012, 12:16 PM)
your mom are right. You must know the nature of what you invest in. I admit it way to ridiculous and a bit unsecured if you not know well what the program is. That is why im here to help you to know what am i doin. and how does it work. how long it goes.

If you are really interested what im gonna tell you, i invite you to my company for you to judge. I`m just messenger from my company to tell you this is an opportunity.
I not forcing anyone. Just to share with everyone.

The capital are RM35,000. The return about 15-17%. The period about 5 years - 7 years (depends on the project).
So again, if anyone interested, you can pm me, i explain more on it. "The best investment on earth, is earth!"
*
15% p.a? or 5 - 7 years return is 15%?


va1kyr13
post Mar 23 2012, 12:41 PM

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QUOTE(chabalang @ Mar 22 2012, 09:13 PM)
Agreed - never invest in something you do not fully understand or "too difficult to understand". You are just so polite as usual to avoid telling him off. I am sure you are smart enough or have sufficient financial knowledge to understand the salient points of va1kyr13's "financial product" (most consumer financial products offered in M'sia are not that complicated).
As i said, it hard to explain while the other parties are not see the real things. I need to completely tell what am i doin and how does it benefits. Not like i DONT want to talk here. sad.gif

QUOTE(chabalang @ Mar 22 2012, 09:13 PM)
Anyway, va1kyr13's original post: "Well if anyone here got RM35,000 (sound to much huh?!) to spend in investing, would you be interested if i said you can get 15% - 19% return (sound to good to be true huh?!) annually for 4 - 7 years of investing?" When I read the paragraph, RED FLAGS appear immediately - call it instinct or whatever...
*
What do you meant by RED FLAGS? You never the things yet and you just judge the things?
Man be real, i know there are many scammer out there who really like to tell lies. But trust me, i not one of them. I just sharing what i know, and if you really know what im gonna to tell, you not gonna regrets. This not as complicated as it look. (I just wanna tell people who are really interested in it, not just someone who just want to know what it is.) biggrin.gif


Added on March 23, 2012, 12:44 pm
QUOTE(yiivei @ Mar 23 2012, 12:39 PM)
15% p.a? or 5 - 7 years return is 15%?
*
about 15% pa. not return. The return might double up your capital. nod.gif
so if the inflation is bout 8%, you still get 7% pa.
sound a bit ridiculous isn`t? well it is true. we already have a client that get it. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by va1kyr13: Mar 23 2012, 12:48 PM
chabalang
post Mar 23 2012, 01:59 PM

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QUOTE(va1kyr13 @ Mar 23 2012, 12:41 PM)
What do you meant by RED FLAGS? You never the things yet and you just judge the things?
Man be real, i know there are many scammer out there who really like to tell lies. But trust me, i not one of them. I just sharing what i know, and if you really know what im gonna to tell, you not gonna regrets. This not as complicated as it look. (I just wanna tell people who are really interested in it, not just someone who just want to know what it is.)   biggrin.gif
*
RED FLAGS mean "a warning signal" - source: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/red%20flag
- it's a natural instinct (15%-19% p.a. returns will involve significant RISKS) since I have seen/read enough. Kindly note that I did not say it is not achievable but the RISKS have to be known/evaluated

Please note did I ever mention the word "SCAM" . I notice you are being Overly Defensive.

All I ask for is more information...like what Wongmunkeong did. I just wanted to help out fellow forumers to understand the RISKS, instead of just focusing on the returns. Understanding the RISKS is as important as knowing the potential returns... A lot of investors only look at the upside without evaluating/knowing the downside (some do not even bother or too lazy to assess/know the risks involved).

This post has been edited by chabalang: Aug 10 2012, 10:30 PM
va1kyr13
post Mar 23 2012, 02:17 PM

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QUOTE(chabalang @ Mar 23 2012, 01:59 PM)
RED FLAGS mean "a warning signal" - source: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/red%20flag
- it's a natural instinct (15%-19% p.a. returns will involve significant RISKS) since I have seen/read enough with more than 20+ years in the financial/academic (lecturing in finance) industry. Kindly note that I did not say it is not achievable but the RISKS have to be known/evaluated

All I ask for is more information...like what Wongmunkeong did. I just wanted to help out fellow forumers to understand the RISKS, instead of just focusing on the returns. Understanding the RISKS is as important as knowing the potential returns... A lot of investors only look at the upside without evaluating/knowing the downside (some do not even bother or too lazy to assess/know the risks involved).
*
speaking of the risk, i also aware of that. But in this program, the risk are low cause of the plan made by the company CEO. It secure even the world economic are bad. Maybe this is kind of new investment product that you never come across before. Well if you really want to know, you can meet with me. I want you just hear or know what the plan made so far. And give you opinion after hearing one of our seminar.
chabalang
post Mar 23 2012, 02:50 PM

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QUOTE(va1kyr13 @ Mar 23 2012, 02:17 PM)
speaking of the risk, i also aware of that. But in this program, the risk are low cause of the plan made by the company CEO. It secure even the world economic are bad. Maybe this is kind of new investment product that you never come across before. Well if you really want to know, you can meet with me.  I want you just hear or know what the plan made so far. And give you opinion after hearing one of our seminar.
*
Thank you for your kind invitation. I have to politely decline your offer.

For your personal interest (I presume you are working for the firm), any investment product that promises High returns but Low risks - you really need to evaluate it CAREFULLY, very carefully...(i) are the returns achievable (ii) are the risks understated or are there blind spots?

P.s. You can call me Selfish...if I really know an investment that offers HIGH returns but LOW risks - why I should share it with others. Once too many people in the market knows my High-return but low-risk investment/strategy, market efficiency will neutralize the risk-return payoff (i.e. returns will start to fall and risk will increase)...you may say it is too academic but it is the reality. I am semi-retired but still very much involved in the financial industry - getting paid for doing something I like to do during my free time/retirement.

This post has been edited by chabalang: Mar 23 2012, 02:51 PM
jeff_ckf
post Mar 23 2012, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(va1kyr13 @ Mar 23 2012, 02:17 PM)
speaking of the risk, i also aware of that. But in this program, the risk are low cause of the plan made by the company CEO. It secure even the world economic are bad. Maybe this is kind of new investment product that you never come across before. Well if you really want to know, you can meet with me.  I want you just hear or know what the plan made so far. And give you opinion after hearing one of our seminar.
*
I always tell the people who can offer CONSISTENT 10% returns to just approach the EPF. Seriously, they will be delighted and most of us here as EPF contributors would be equally delighted if your plan is accepted by the EPF so that we can get better returns than the curent "high" of 6%.
BabySteps
post Mar 24 2012, 04:29 PM

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Income in RM:
Monthly Salary = 2700 after all deduction
Variable Side Income = 0 - 600

Expenses in RM:
Food = 600
Transport = 50 (Touch n Go & Parking)
Entertainment = 100
Phone Bills = 100
Parents = 300
Groceries = 100

Monthly saving into savings acc: 700 (Pay yourself first)

Asset
Saving = 6,000
Fixed Deposit = 30,000
Unit Trust = 2,000 (AmDynamic Bond)

Liability
PTPTN = 20,000 (have not start paying)

Have just started working ard Sep 2011.
Usually the remaining of the salary will be deposit into saving acc on top of the monthly 700 or spend on feel good.

Planning to buy a house by 26 yrs old. Ard 300k-400k.
Hoping to diversify and also put more of my savings into investment.
Any advice here?


This post has been edited by BabySteps: Mar 24 2012, 04:33 PM
wKkaY
post Mar 25 2012, 02:36 AM

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If you took a zero-interest study loan - is there any good reason to pay more than the minimum every month?
NJJ
post Mar 25 2012, 12:59 PM

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[QUOTE]
QUOTE(BabySteps @ Mar 24 2012, 04:29 PM)
Age : 24
Income in RM:
Monthly Salary = 2700 after all deduction
Variable Side Income = 0 - 600

Expenses in RM:
Food = 600
Transport = 50 (Touch n Go & Parking)
Entertainment = 100
Phone Bills = 100
Parents = 300
Groceries = 100

Monthly saving into savings acc: 700 (Pay yourself first)

Asset
Saving = 6,000
Fixed Deposit = 30,000
Unit Trust = 2,000 (AmDynamic Bond)

Liability
PTPTN = 20,000 (have not start paying)

Have just started working ard Sep 2011.
Usually the remaining of the salary will be deposit into saving acc on top of the monthly 700 or spend on feel good.

Planning to buy a house by 26 yrs old. Ard 300k-400k.
Hoping to diversify and also put more of my savings into investment.
Any advice here?
*




Good plan... but i notice all is abt investment( all abt making money). i think u lack of protecting ur wealth..

This post has been edited by NJJ: Mar 25 2012, 01:04 PM
kinwing
post Mar 25 2012, 01:18 PM

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QUOTE(va1kyr13 @ Mar 23 2012, 02:17 PM)
speaking of the risk, i also aware of that. But in this program, the risk are low cause of the plan made by the company CEO. It secure even the world economic are bad. Maybe this is kind of new investment product that you never come across before. Well if you really want to know, you can meet with me.  I want you just hear or know what the plan made so far. And give you opinion after hearing one of our seminar.
*
No sales man talk here please.

"It secure even the world economic are bad" which mean the product involves derivatives or it is hedge fund type. If you really want to introduce the product, please bump in the fund management thread and show us what is the product there.

If you do not know how to introduce the financial product in words, this indicates you yourself are not knowing what you are investing. Or just ask the CEO to give you the product brochure and scan it to show us. Secret PM or meeting are not welcome here as this indicates the so-called low risk high return product is not genuine.

By the way, you claim the product generates 15% pa so can double the wealth of the investors in every "7 years", I think you are wrong as 15% pa will provide more than double the wealth to investors in 7 years. In view of this, I do not trust your words here with your poor understanding over the invetment return.


Added on March 25, 2012, 1:20 pmIn addition, you have a new ID just talk about the financial product, and this is another red flag to me also

This post has been edited by kinwing: Mar 25 2012, 01:20 PM
SlowCiken
post Mar 25 2012, 03:56 PM

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Age: 26
Income: 4k

Parent: 700
Rent House: 550
Food: 1k (married dats y so high)
Bill (astro+streamyx+phone+electric+water):400
Petrol: 150
Other Items (sabun+syampoo+etc): 250
Insurance: 250

FD rollover monthly (dividen 3.2): 10k
insert FD monthy: 500 (me 250 n wife 250)

Income annually increment: 100

TARGET: buy house around 350-400k with deposit 50k for next 4 year

pls advice how to achieve my target. thanks
wongmunkeong
post Mar 25 2012, 06:29 PM

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QUOTE(NJJ @ Mar 25 2012, 12:59 PM)
[QUOTE]
Good plan... but i notice all  is abt investment( all abt making money). i think u lack of protecting ur wealth..
*
Protecting yr wealth? Interesting.. i really hope U mean something else other than insurance, which i personally think is more managing life's risks rather than $.
Can share?

This post has been edited by wongmunkeong: Mar 25 2012, 06:31 PM

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