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 The Zerg Strategy v1.0, Cheer for the overmind!

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quest_5692
post Oct 13 2011, 08:22 PM

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lol, so many imbalosus.

against archon just make roaches.
quest_5692
post Oct 15 2011, 04:56 PM

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i dun use hydra too sad.gif especially zvt

in zvp i still see myself pop down the hydra den once in a while. the problem is to end the game b4 collosus is out. sometimes in reaction of their stargate pressure, i'll just throw down hydra den. then most of the time upgrade drops to transport them around.
quest_5692
post Nov 13 2011, 08:57 AM

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if you see them go spire, just roach all in him.

however if he is nestea, his muta will reach just in time to clear ur all in lol..make sure to do it fast the timing is very small.
quest_5692
post Nov 14 2011, 06:42 AM

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i tot its 4 sec nwo


Added on November 14, 2011, 6:42 ami tot its 4 sec nwo

This post has been edited by quest_5692: Nov 14 2011, 06:42 AM
quest_5692
post Nov 15 2011, 04:38 PM

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QUOTE(A-Note @ Nov 15 2011, 11:42 AM)
is 12 pool a cheese? LOL


Added on November 15, 2011, 12:30 pmis 12 pool a viable opening? >.< cos i always do a 12pool den 3 pair of zergling charge straight towards his base =/
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why u sked other ppl say u cheese?
quest_5692
post Nov 15 2011, 06:59 PM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 15 2011, 06:47 PM)
I do 10 pool and that is not a cheese. 3 pair lings could not kill without speed upgrade. Their just bugs disturbing the enemy base to slow his build temporary. If you got speedling upgrade then its a win, but by that time they would already wall off.
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u syaing zvz?
quest_5692
post Nov 15 2011, 08:13 PM

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QUOTE(yuvster @ Nov 15 2011, 07:13 PM)
anything 10 and above is not cheese.. it's just their fault for not scouting.. that is all
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why bother defining?
quest_5692
post Nov 16 2011, 07:38 AM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 16 2011, 12:53 AM)
Z vs all .. I use zergling for scout and harass better than drone. Waste to let a drone look for base, better they mine or become building.
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i can see that work for ZvP as protoss likes to F FE but a 12 pool against terran will make you behind in economy severely, no? normally zergs can get away with 15 hatch other than massive cheese.
quest_5692
post Nov 16 2011, 08:18 PM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 16 2011, 07:09 PM)
Zerg will never have its economy slow as worker creation is faster than the 2 race. Remember, zerg dont que in-line. As long as there is larva and minerals, you can create XX amount of worker. Even early ling rush, Zerg still can recover from it but that depend on the player to multi task as well.


Added on November 16, 2011, 7:24 pm

Only if you play 2v2 or 3v3, i get a lot of people ask their friend to defend their base while they go early muta or thor/ ghost nuke or dark templar.
Total muta on 1v1 either ZvT or ZvP is totally giving a win to your enemy. But you have a chance to win in ZvZ.
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but after an early ling rush that will do nothing against a wall in-ed terran, you are already behind and need to play a catch up game from then so why make ur life harder? zvz and zvp they dont usually wall in and they cant repair so i can see how your point stands. just wondering yo smile.gif new concept to learn from :3

quest_5692
post Nov 16 2011, 09:31 PM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 16 2011, 09:07 PM)
Doing early ling rush is a 50/50 chance,i use this just to "test the water", terren wall in means most likely he is going to tech up to air or early CC so Zergling scout for expansion and kill wandering marines or SVC. But zerg can tech up to lair and morph one overlord to overseer. Use this as an advantage to scout and infiltrate the enemy base. By the time they make air or other you should be able to see what are they up to. Make sure have a lot of larva to stand-by. I usually make 2 hatchery main base + 1 expansion base and spray it. Zerg can easily muster any counter. All you need is information on what they have. 
If you fail a rush using lings, dont push it. Just make some for defence and get roach and tech up.   

ZvP. If you dont wall-in thats ok but you will be paying a hefty price. If you move your army out of the base to defend another expansion i can just bring my speedling in your base to your mineral line killing all your probes. 10 pair speedling is enough actually to just run in and kill probes and 2 cannon. I cant use lings to take out your army but it can damage your economy or slow you down drasticly. When your army return to defend your main base.. i could already muster another set of lings to go attack your expansion.  
So by this, some protoss player makes drastic choice defend and build back economy which drags the game or counter attack which could win provide with enough army but stalkers vs roach .. Roach will win. 

ZvZ how ever, a few baneling and speedling is enough to defend against mass speedlings at the mineral line so wall in for zerg is not nessasary. Banelings hurt speedling baddly.
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then why not 14 pool? you can achieve the same goal without cuting on drone. if you get what i mean. you need to stop making drone in order to throw down the pool. and terran wall in can be alot of things. reactor hellion expand and 1 rax FE is the most common in TvZ. at least in my ladder games. and they dont make the CC outside so that you can snipe it. make in base, fly out, move wif a bunch of marine and make new bunker wall........right?

and you cant judge that its an all in or in base 1 rax FE econ game. if you see reactor factory as wall, it might be a CC behind, it might be 2 more rax hiding marauders for hellion marauder all in.

if its a 1 rax, it might be cloak shee or just a simple 2 rax 1 fact siege contain.

maybe you meant a 12 pool into 18 hatch? then off 2 base you can catch up wif earlier queen for inject. but then early 2 base expo wif queens normally means a later lair. when your overseer went in to scout, it might be abit too late for a few timings.

This post has been edited by quest_5692: Nov 16 2011, 09:33 PM
quest_5692
post Nov 16 2011, 10:51 PM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 16 2011, 10:12 PM)
You say 14 pool.. i go 10 pool 3 pair lings and all drone to 18 as my start. Wall in can be a lot of things, true but the lings is also use to scout what type of wall-ins as well. Factory wall in so helion can go harass the zerg mineral lines. 
I wonder which part you didnt read .. the overseer or the infiltrator ? Common Zerg people mistake that they never tech up to lair first before muster roach. Know this, Terren going for factory is equavelent of Zerg lair upgrade. Why i want to muster something that i know what is the next terren move? Even making 2 rax with reactor require time and gas so if terren can get 2 rax and reactor mean they use 400m/100g. Lair first get overseer since it cost 50m/50g. i doubt terren early rush since i have speedlings to defend.   
i usually make 2 worker and 1 speedlings every 3 larva spawn. Zerg is heavy gas user so chepo is minerals.
 

My build is different .. i dont follow the 12 pool or 14 pool or think much about getting fast minerals at the start of the game. Spawning pool open up all tech so if i go 12 or 14 pool, the time to build is the one holding me back. Getting mineral is not cause you only have 3 larva to change so if worker it cost only 150m which can be farm faster. If a Zelot comes in my base and i have only drone with a half done spawing pool.. i would lose a lot on economy cause of drone and after pool complete, need time to build lings .. By this time my drone is either all dead or just have less. Same thing as protoss cannon cheese, i saw protoss player try to cheese me but i have lings to take out his pylon and probe, he cant finish the cannon cause he is waiting for the forge. So after that i rush him cause i calculate that he need 2 pylon, 1 forge and at least 150m for cannon to start the cheese which i can get 5 pair of lings equal to 1 cannon and 1 pylon.
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do you use it in every game as a standard opening? and so far had worked wonder for you? i'll definitely experiment it later.
quest_5692
post Nov 17 2011, 12:05 AM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 16 2011, 11:34 PM)
Yup, i owes use this to prevent cheeser and also get early ground control. Especially terren early fly by to rich mineral strats.
Which now some terren player are using it. If you do 14 pool, its  already too late since a lot SCV can kill 6~8 lings.


Added on November 16, 2011, 11:51 pmHow about your opener for terren and protoss ? i really need to learn this since im uber noob at this 2 race.
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i believe that diff build works for diff leagues and i rarely play anymore lol, derank like f*** now, my builds are probably not suitable anymore...maybe we can play some custom games together some day...

there are alot of build orders in liquipedia, just copy them down and stick to timings perfectly.
quest_5692
post Nov 17 2011, 07:23 AM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 17 2011, 01:53 AM)
Of course, just add since not much people play. Play leagues  seems like no one since auto search seems like a long time before finding any people at net. I like to play custom, 1v1, 2v2 and 3v3. But 3v3 is more challenging since they will mass units on you and you need to defend.
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lol
quest_5692
post Nov 17 2011, 01:21 PM

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QUOTE(SiewKaiz @ Nov 17 2011, 08:21 AM)
invite me to obs~ when u 2 fight tongue.gif
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i shy la /blush/ let pro watch my game
quest_5692
post Nov 21 2011, 12:32 PM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 20 2011, 02:06 AM)
I dont know .. ask quest then. sweat.gif


Added on November 20, 2011, 7:11 pmI is sadding. So hard to kill terren with Zerg, fast build ups. Super micro manage, even attack also micro manage while micro the base. sad.gif
I can win 4/10 gameplay. Any tips?
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tips, play with standard build orders the korean pros use.

against a terran 15 hatch 15 gas 15 pool, get ling speed and bane to defend while teching to muta play. use muta to expand to 4 base +.
quest_5692
post Nov 21 2011, 07:36 PM

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make more units.....
quest_5692
post Nov 21 2011, 10:34 PM

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ZvT is abit harder for insane AI mode thx to Marine marauder. but for very hard should be an easy cruise if you expand and make ling banes to secure 3rd. i'll upload a replay whenever im free if it matters.
quest_5692
post Nov 21 2011, 11:31 PM

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QUOTE(TruthHurts @ Nov 21 2011, 10:11 PM)
Forgot to tell you all, i vs A.I Very Hard mode. blush.gif
If early ling rush with bane can win. But in 10 min run in the game die ler.

Got advice for this?
*
http://sc2rep.com/replays/%28Z%29FoxeR_vs_...9Player+2/15950

just uploaded a replay, i underestimated 1 of the push and he killed my nat, but later i used my limited muta and lings to harrass his scv line and muster up to 3 base. very bad play overall but still its a win against very hard AI biggrin.gif maybe i'll do insane AI tomorrow night.
quest_5692
post Nov 25 2011, 05:29 PM

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http://sc2rep.com/replays/%28Z%29FoxeR_vs_...9Player+2/16042

again vs very hard ai, this time i purposely dun go early muta so that i wont abuse the ai. with good macro, upgraded lings > anything they throw to you
quest_5692
post Nov 26 2011, 07:38 AM

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greentea = greenwood + nestea?

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