Sorry, all ppl got their own points...
I didn't hope all ppl got same opinion like mine...but keep in mind that seller also a normal human, got emotion, temper etc....

I may forgive ppl who really did wrong to me 1st time...but didn't mean that I must forgive them 2nd time right?

Many examples can be given, beside cars...

Let say you are a boss of a shop, customer break some glass stuffs in your shop, the items are put properly on the rack.
With a sticker "Handle with care. Once break, consider sold!".
The items not too expensive, let say RM80.

What is your(boss) reaction if the customer react this way:

Customer: "Sorry boss, this is my fault that I didn't handle it properly, I will responsible and pay for it."
(Well, settle? Good customer huh?)

the boss said..."it is OK, luckily you didn't hurt yourself. You no need to pay for it".


like a joke? No, I faced this situation before. At last I paid him a lower price as "compensation".

I can't think of what will happen if the scenario like this:
Customer shout to the boss, "hey! why you put glass stuffs like that?"
boss: "sorry, all these stuffs put nicely on the proper rack and we did put a "sticker" on the rack.
customer: "Luckily I didn't get hurt! I am not gonna pay for it as it got no use to me at all! If you want me to pay, I will sue you."

Well boss, what will you react?
I believe not all boss will say ""it is OK, luckily you didn't hurt yourself. You no need to pay for it".

Some issues really can be solved easily, it depends on how we handle it....


In my case, should I just refund to the buyer after all this "non trust" to me? and say " sorry friend, is my fault, I refund you full amount"?

Well, I got too much free time to burn?

Refer to 1st page and you will know that:
I need to answer his questions, I need to pack the proc, I need to rush to pos laju office that is around 10km away, all these need to be done within 1 hour as he want me to comply "must post by 3pm"...
some more does my car running on "water" or what? Did he appreciate all this? No, he sounds that I am the one misleading him and cost him all these trouble!
Walao, I still need to accept all this in silent? (I doubt am I still a human if I do this)
I got the right to defend myself.

I searched all the pm with the buyer and I can't find a single human word like "sorry", "It is my careless" etc!
I only can find sentences sound like "It is your fault, you are wrong" etc.

Well, some friends read through all this dispute thread and MSN me:
" Nothing wrong in your sales thread. you got no obligation to refund, it will just make you look like Ah Beng! (fool)"


Should I be that kind/generous? and say "sorry friend, is my fault, I refund you"?
Put you in my situation, how many of you can be this kind?

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 6 2008, 05:00 AM

Yes, actually all can be discussed/settled easily, except the attitude problem.
That really upset me a lot.

As I said before:
I may forgive ppl who did wrong to me 1st time...but didn't mean that I must forgive them 2nd time right?

Combat bro, I didn't point out he "hope" I can post out by 3pm, only after he bank in at 2pm how come you know?
Yes, actually I can refuse to rush within 1 hour, although I am not that type of "Customer always right", I still trying my best not to let them down!
I explained that not necessary I must post by 3pm, coz Pos Laju office close around 6pm in my area.
All this explanation to him is "argument". (1st mistake to me...before this all seem OK to me)

As long as I post by 4:30pm it is still the same, he will get it next day....then you knew the story after that....
Again he talked big...he used post laju >20 yrs lah, he is older than me lah, he knew pos laju better lah bla bla bla.... (2nd mistake, already make me upset)
(he pm this after I went out or if I read all these before sent out the parcel, I will canceled the deal and refund him straight away, save all these hassle now)

Then you know after sent the parcel, I called him around 3pm...can't get through, then sms him pos tracking number at 3:12pm...no reply... fine...ok for me...
Next day morning 11:51AM something I pm him the pos tracking status base from the web-site:

"EN139054634MY 03-Sep-2008 08:37 Courier is attempting delivery PPL KUALA LUMPUR

you may trace it...parcel already in KL pos Laju office
if still can't reach you by 4pm, call pos laju near yr area.

keep me update."

Follow by sms around 3:45pm and 4pm+ asking whether he got the proc....still no reply till 12AM night!
(I start feeling not so good...really that busy, can't pm nor reply my sms to update me status, phone charges too expensive or what?)

OK, till now did you all find any parts I did wrong as a seller? After post out the proc and follow up with necessary tracking info and some more, concerning whether he receive the proc?.....

OK, first contact to me after he get the proc is 04 Sept 1:25PM, and he already pointing finger concluded I am wrong!
(If everything went smoothly I am in doubt will I get any reply from him?)

here is his pm:
"Bro, the processor you sell to me is not 478 pin adter i open up and see my customer notebook the pin is different and I check on the internet and found yours is actually 479. Look here http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleID=2008 The processor is not working! You given the wrong info on your post stating it was 478! ! "

...Ok now this is another mistake

He start asking for refund, open dispute thread bla bla bla....

See how he replying me in the 2nd page post#38 in this thread ( I said he didn't update me status, no call/sms replied):
"Think before you speak up. I never promise to answer any of your calls or sms and I am really out of credit at that moment even with credit when I am in working hour, my boss do not allow any of his staff talking to his/her private handphone so I usually off it."


Now I will think this is a attitude problem!

well, all the rest you all knew...by reading this dispute thread....
ppl start jump into conclusion that the "seller's fault! Seller should refund bla bla bla...even before I knew that is a dispute thread against me here!
>10 votes indicated that I should refund...0 voted "No refund"...haha, what a world.. make me laugh/cry?

That's why initially I put "I can't convince myself to refund him"
Till many ppl here "hope" that we can solve this in peace...

Then I said in pg4, post#63

"sorry to "disappointing" many ppl here.
I can't give myself a reason to refund him. Not this time.....


Pls note that since started he is pointing finger to me like "you are wrong"!
As I said I am human too, he really make me angry.....

Unless he apologizes to me here and someone willing help me to test the proc still in good condition as the lappy I used to test this processor just been been sold last week. Then we (seller and buyer) may discuss further...."





Keep in mind that all the descriptions/infos in my sales thread is OK, till now still no one can point out which description is WRONG....

Well, ask yourself before you vote....which part I did wrong as a "seller", mind to point it out?

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 7 2008, 06:14 AM

Well, since buyer still not turning up...nothing much I can do here...

I just got some spare times to read again this whole thread...
Just notice that some ppl blamed me as I didn't inform buyer this is S479....

Well, I never expect that he didn't check his notebook proc spec before buying this proc as the 1st question he asked me is: (refer to pm screenshot)

"Intel 1.86GHz Pentium M Centrino Processor still got?

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopic=719569

i want to know is the picture in your link above the actual processor picture? i mean the processor pin's? pls reply asap."

Common sense, he saw the pin configuration of this processor in my thread photos that I snap from actual item.
The bottom pin photo is sharp and clear, I believe most people will assume he find the right match of proc that he is looking for...now just want to re-confirm does the photos I post is from actual item or web link...right?

Then I start to answer whatever questions he asked me, price nego etc....
Via pm I knew that he is a very experienced technician that installed >1000 notebook/proc.
I've answered all questions he asked and never think of compatibility issue at all.

Well, when he ask about warranty condition, as "habit" I just add in a condition :
make sure your lappy can support this proc as I won't refund if due to compatibility issue... (as a friendly "reminder" for buyer to re-confirm the spec)
He answer "yes, I understand".

I have no intention to hide anything that I knew about this proc.....
After I answered him, he still have 20 hours to find out whatever he is "in doubt" about this proc before he confirm to buy (he bank in next day 2pm).
Keep in mind that I am open to answer whatever questions that buyers ask!

That's all, so for those blaming I didn't mentione the "foreseen compatibility issue" matter, sorry, it is really beyond my knowledge.

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 7 2008, 12:46 AM


Attached thumbnail(s)


Attached image(s)

My actual concern about possibility that he will return is due to damage during shipping, that is why I really spent time to pack this processor nicely.
Base on my postage experience the only possibility to damage my packing is the parcel been stacked by a heavy object >15kg, if this really happen then the "damage outlook" of the parcel can easily be identified and he got the right not to accept the item.

Well, whatever the outcome is, hope this buyer will learn from this experience and start "talk or write" to ppl nicely (if not politely).

Then many issue can be solved in more "peaceful" way.

---

Added on September 7, 2008, 12:55 ambro, your "buyer" and seller" terbalik liau

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 7 2008, 12:55 AM

Thanks bro GTR for your suggestion
Well, I can't say much till buyer appear back here.

But there is a difficulty in testing this proc now as the compatible laptop mobo been sold by my friend to a walk in customer, as I mentioned in previous page.
If really want to test the proc, it need to be sent to a 3rd person that have suitable mobo

hehe, another "well known", previously I will say "I am a small fly here, just got some happy seller/buyer friends in LYN...."
Now seem hard to deny that I've been free upgraded to "well known" grade, due to this "ongbs=bad seller" thread!
This thread appeared in top 10 in Dispute Corner for a few days liau

If continue like this I may consider to change my "ngam-ngam" 4 yrs old nick huh?

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 7 2008, 05:22 AM

Thanks, hope so as ongbs is short form of my real name

bro wodenus, no offense but could you please point out which part of the trade description is "False"?

If Intel really put wrong description on this proc, for sure it will be corrected long time ago as this proc is not new, been produced >4 yrs.

"Intel wasn't selling processors to him."==> I think still sold from Intel indirectly, this proc was from Intel or who else can make this?

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 8 2008, 02:05 PM

What you have a is Pentium M correct ? ===> Yes, Pentium M 750
you took the specs off of the box ? ==> not really get what you mean, pls refer to screeshot attached
and Caspian's customer's notebook had a 478-pin desktop Pentium installed in it ? ==> I don't think it is Desktop processor, still a mobile processor i believe.


Here is the description in my thread:

Description:
Stepping: SL7S9, 1.86GHz
Processor type Intel Pentium M
Processor number 750
Part number RH80536GE0362M
BX80536GE1866FJ
Package type 478-pin Micro-FCPGA
Processor speed (MHz) 1860 / 800
Bus speed (MHz) 533
Clock multiplier 14
L2 cache size (MB) 2
Stepping C0
Manufacturing technology (micron) 0.09
Core voltage (V) 1.26 - 1.356 / 0.988
Case temperature (°C) 100
CPUID 06D8h


This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 8 2008, 02:30 PM


Attached thumbnail(s)

I mentioned this before, this is proc stepping code printed on proc by Intel.
(refer to pic attached, SL7S9 printed on the top right corner)
By using this code, you may find exact detail from Intel site and many other hardware site.

Ok, I just goggle some international parts retailer's link of this proc: (See if you may point out their "false" description as well?)
http://www.laptopking.com/partpicture_LK.a...69&category=cpu
(sorry, 1st link not working, I attached a screenshot instead)
http://www.pcsurplusonline.com/viewprod.cfm?ID=14505
http://www.usereasy.com/product_8049.html
http://www.starmicro.net/detail.aspx?ID=1076
http://www.sparepartswarehouse.com/Toshiba...P000425620.aspx

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 8 2008, 02:56 PM


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Attached image(s)

Is ok, this proc mostly used in laptop

haha, that is why IBM/clone getting more popular ...?

well, even with "good sales are not refundable", some shop still allow you to exchange if you explain to them nicely (after tested the goods still in working order).

Well, ipod casing is much easier to get exchange coz from outlook we can tell if the casing still ok or torn.
Proc is a bit hard coz need further test.
Since buyer is in IT line/ hardware shop, I believe he still able to sell that proc with higher price than sell it back in LYN.

Thanks bro K.I.T.T,

Wow, dah lama saya tak guna bahasa secara bertulis, harap apa yang saya tulis ini anda faham


"saya pun kerja teknikal jugak.dan ada kedai sendiri.sebelum saya jual apa-apa memang saya akan soal siasat pembeli"
=>kalau saya jual untuk pengguna biasa memang akan saya tanya tujuannya, tapi pembeli ini dah 15 tahun dalam bidang teknikal, memang pengalamannya lebih "kukuh" dari saya, dari mula hingga pembeli membuat keputusan saya tak pernah meragui pembeli dari segi teknikal.

"memang ongbs akan hilang satu pelanggan...tapi tengok la betul-betul pelanggan yang hilang tu regular atau new? lepas tu orang yang jenis ni senang nak deal ke atau jenis kelamkabut?"
==> Tujuan saya dalam LYN bukan untuk mencari keuntungan, saya bukan berniaga di LYN juga...
yang penting ialah LYN memang tempat saya belajar dan bertukar pendapat dengan member-member lain...
Dah kena ramai member dalam masa beberapa tahun ni, ada yang selalu berhubung melalui telefon selain email dan MSN.
Pasal customers, well, i should say no matter how good a seller/businessman is, still got ppl complaint about their service/company. Impossible to find a company that all customers give them 100% right? Include those giant company like Microsoft, Intel, Benz etc.

Jadi kalau ada pilihan, saya akan abaikan customer yang "mungkin" menimbulkan masalah dari segi sikap (susah nak "communicate"), dan juga customers yang "fussy", kan barang terpakai? Ada yang bayar 30% - 50% harga tapi nak benda tu macam baru....99% baru, kalau tidak lepas beli memang dia complaint banyak


"kepada ongbs jangan refund.jika refund U akan rugi kerana kes ni ialah processor. "
==> Pasal kerugian, ini bukan masalah yang saya cuba elakan, walaupun miskin, tapi proc ini RM160, bukan RM1600.
Dah banyak "old stuffs" rugi lagi teruk tapi masih kat tempat saya (belum jual lagi ), lebih atau kurang satu proc pun tak banyak beza

Kalau kita sendiri silap beli barang kat kedai, nak minta tukar tunjuklah sopan sikit, tak akan pergi bising-bising, betul tak?

This post has been edited by ongbs: Sep 9 2008, 06:39 AM

Yes, it had been a week since TS MIA, I will contact mod for further advice on this issue by tomorrow.

Thanks.

hehe thx bro, nothing much i can do now as TS MIA liau....

Welcome back good story maker
I can't understand why you need to go cyber to get online?
You said you are a computer technician with >15 years of experience...you repair PC without even have internet access in you place?
Seem like your biz really good till you got no time to go online over 1 month

Well, after our deal I still manage to sell over 10 items in LYN, no complaint or whatever, amount >2k.
You just browse my sales thread, just the mission drivers alone >10 pcs, no complaint, return/faulty or whatever story....
All deals they just bank in to me before actually see or test my items coz all from outstation
Those deal before with me will know that I am a serious seller, never have complaint/return for last 10 years deal in forum.


Look like you have serious attitude problem and you never learned how to talk bro.....
Once again you jumped into your own "conclusion" too fast, see what you wrote the 1st day you re-appear here, after 1mth+ MIA:


"This "ongbs" is a very bad person and he is a joybidder who bid and never paid in lelong.com.my people like him always comes out with excuses. Everyone in lelong.com.my knows him pretty well as a joybidder even the administrator blacklisted him there. Support him as you would but I already fed-up with this cheater."

My account been suspended automatically by the system, not "blacklisted" by admin like what you concluded.
Lelong system will suspend user account automatically upon 3 non-paying bid, even it was sellers' fault...as long as they left you 3 non-paying bid then your account will be suspended.

As joy bidder issue in lelong, I have no plan to clear my "suspended" status at this moment, you may check with the lelong admin did I call them to clear my status?
Why? Plenty of issue over there now....lelong not like few years back...now plenty of trade issue...lelong protect too much on sellers side...sigh...

Why my account been suspended in lelong? Well, coz got 3 none paying bid that I won...

1st one I can't even remember as I emailed that seller but didn't get any reply from him (back in 2006).
2nd and 3rd non-paying bid was given by the seller with different id in lelong: (on 19-8-2008)
Seller: jiafei and khaixiny (same seller with different lelong id)

I won 4 items from them in few days, 1st 2 items I paid within 3 days but many issues happened,
1st item they sent after 10 days (from the date I bank in), some more wrong item, I need to post back to get exchange, I paid extra RM15 courier charges and still need to wait for 2 weeks plus...my buyer can't wait so I need to refund. The deal took around 1 month to close!

2nd item I get it 2 weeks after I bank in and received in faulty condition, again I bare RM15 courier fees and waited for another 2 more weeks to get it exchanged.
Again, it took another 1 month+ to close the deal.
I 've to refunded my customers coz not fair for them to wait 1 month+ for the items, that 2 items still with me till now.

Well, if you were me will you still deal with them?

Here is the link of bad comments I given to the sellers:
http://www.lelong.com.my/Auc/Feedback/User...ings#ViewRating
http://www.lelong.com.my/Auc/Feedback/User...ings#ViewRating

You may write whatever you want here, actually many ppl pm me asking your detail to make sure they won't deal with you in future.
Look like it is time for you to register new LYN account...or maybe you already got many LYN accounts, who know....

"Go ahead take my Rm160 it's not a very big deal, just consider it a donations from me for your grave "ongbs"
wah...good one...you got more to "donate"?



That is all I gonna say. Not going to deal with you anymore.

---

Added on October 21, 2008, 4:30 pmYes, that is me as I mentioned it before in this thread.

This post has been edited by ongbs: Oct 22 2008, 02:52 AM


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Will he MIA again for few more weeks then come back here again and post:
"hey, ongbs, the proc you sold me missing 2 pins...bad seller!"

This post has been edited by ongbs: Oct 22 2008, 02:35 AM