ICAP, traded price higher than NAV
ICAP, traded price higher than NAV
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Sep 20 2015, 07:01 PM
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#81
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
I wonder any of his supporters realize the 10 million plus losses in Parkson?
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Sep 20 2015, 07:17 PM
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#82
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(gark @ Sep 20 2015, 07:05 PM) As long not sold, the losses cannot be charged out... Anyway interest received can cover liao.... I know... not sold means not loss... that's the biggest lie an investor can tell themselves..... cos a share is only worth what the current price.... the investor cannot sell at past prices... and neither can they sell at future prices.... anyway, I saw in his recent annual report... He had 'impaired losses' on MSC.... err... dunno what it means.... ![]() |
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Sep 20 2015, 09:29 PM
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#83
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(nexona88 @ Sep 20 2015, 09:06 PM) |
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Sep 21 2015, 12:11 AM
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#84
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
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Sep 21 2015, 12:13 AM
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#85
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
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Sep 22 2015, 10:54 AM
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#86
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(gark @ Sep 22 2015, 09:27 AM) http://www.thestar.com.my/Business/Busines...tors/?style=bizQUOTE The bulk of the NAV – about 66.52% or RM260mil – is in the form of cash because the fund has not been able to find “value stocks” and has had a bearish view of the markets more than a year ago. bearish view of the markets more than a year ago? lol Pants on FIRE? Waaalalalaaaaaa...... QUOTE icapital.biz’s portfolio comprises Boustead Holdings Bhd, Padini Holdings Bhd, PI Industrial Bhd, Suria Capital Holdings Bhd, Fraser & Neave Holdings Bhd, Malaysian Smelting Corp Bhd, Tong Herr Resources Bhd, Vitrox Corp Bhd and Wellcall Holdings Bhd. Suddenly Parkson not mentioned? Impaired losses? LOL! Now that's good hor... Did he just made a 10 million plus investment loss... vanish in thin air? Even Buffett can't do that. Unless of course it's a typo.... QUOTE In response, the fund had said that a share buyback would destroy value for a close-end fund like icapital.biz. “Cash is raw material for icapital.biz. The more the shares repurchased, the lesser the capital or assets available for investments to generate capital appreciation which would lead to higher NAV growth,” said Tan Teng Boo, the designated person for icapital.biz. LOL! So don't request for share buyback.... it won't happen.... |
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Sep 22 2015, 11:00 AM
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#87
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE Over the years, I have met with many investors, locally and abroad, young and old, retail and institutional, students and CEOs, salaried and very wealthy, educated and uneducated and more. In the course of meeting these people, I have often been asked what my investment philosophy is as a fund manager. When I answered that it is value investing, I get an interesting variety of response. Some seem to understand this time-proven investing style and after a short elaboration, they get it. After lengthy explanations, many, including the educated professionals, the CEOs, and the institutional type, do not seem able to grasp the idea of value. After lengthy explanations on value investing, many would still ask me when is a good time to buy or sell. Short of fainting, I would then patiently find all sorts of examples to make the simple notion of value investing even simpler. After all these efforts, and explaining that Warren Buffett uses value investing, many would still ask apparently innocently, when the next bear market will start or why are you holding so much cash or worse still, accuse me of lacking investment ideas. The concept of value investing is really simple. However, understanding and applying this time-proven investing style consistently is another story altogether. Value investing is about finding the intrinsic value or sustainable earning power of a stock, a business or an asset and then buying it at an attractive price, which is always below the intrinsic value of the stock, business or asset. Doing so provides the buyer a margin of safety, one of the central concepts in value investing. What is margin of safety ? If value investing is hard to understand for some people, margin of safety is even more difficult for them. In this commentary, I hope I can make this key concept clearer. At the time of writing this, icapital.biz Berhad still has a high cash level. The high cash level is a result of the “Bamboo” eclectic value investing philosophy of Capital Dynamics. With the rich valuation of the stock market, it has been difficult to find sound investment ideas at attractive prices. We have plenty of investment ideas but are they at prices that are attractive ? An attractive price would mean that there is built in a margin of safety. This brings us to the central principle that makes value investing such a time-tested and successful investing method. Many of us would have read about the recent cruise ship disaster in the Yangtze River in China where hundreds of passengers died. As a value investor, this tragedy offers precious insights and lessons about margin of safety and risk management. While investigations are being conducted in the capsizing of MV Dong Fang Zhi Xing (Eastern Star), a few points stand out. At around the same time as the Eastern Star capsized, the captains of at least two other ships on the same section of the Yangtze River chose to anchor their ships on that night after the local maritime bureau sent warnings to expect heavy rain and thunderstorms. The passenger vessel, Yangtze Sightseer No. 6, anchored at around 9:10 pm, six miles away from the disaster. The car carrier, Changhang Jiangning, dropped anchor in order to wait out the storm. It was clear that the weather conditions in the Yangtze River were rough and dangerous. A safe approach, that is, an approach with a margin of safety, was to anchor and wait for the adverse weather conditions to pass. The same principle applies when investing in the stock markets. Like the captains of the two other ships, we know that the prevailing economic and investment landscape is stormy. With the valuations of the stock market high and based on forever zero interest rate, and the US monetary policy badly handled, investing now would be like the tragic Eastern Star that did not anchor. In not anchoring, the captain of Eastern Star made the ship vulnerable to nasty surprises as he ignored the safety margin principle. Holding a high level of cash is like anchoring our ship and patiently waiting. We do not know when the weather conditions will get better but what we know is that sailing in such adverse weather conditions is dangerous. A highly valued stock market, like a ship in turbulent weather conditions, can be easily capsized by any adverse event. I also fainted................................................. That was taken from last quarterly report. |
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Sep 22 2015, 11:01 AM
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#88
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
**** double posting ******
This post has been edited by Boon3: Sep 22 2015, 11:05 AM |
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Sep 22 2015, 11:32 AM
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#89
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
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Sep 22 2015, 12:01 PM
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#90
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(tnang @ Sep 22 2015, 11:50 AM) Gaji buta?Any of the shareholders make bang bang sound at agm on this matter? See page 35, post #692 See the table how much money he collects since 2009.... |
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Sep 22 2015, 12:20 PM
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#91
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
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Sep 22 2015, 01:00 PM
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#92
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(tnang @ Sep 22 2015, 12:25 PM) Total fees for 2009 is 3,495,212 This is where the shareholders have to wake up.Total fees for 2010 is 4,037,100 Total fees for 2012 is 5,789,726 Total fees for 2013 is 6,179,782 Total fees for 2014 is 6,218,982 Total fees for 2015 is 6,318,354 Current total of all fees collected since 2009:32,095,510. just collected fees without work, 1 day money will kosong and all go to his pocket. hidup icap, hidup TTB. mati investors. A fund manager HAS to make money for the fund. The manager cannot sit and claim no value stocks in the market for him to buy every single year and claim millions in fees from the fund. This is daylight robbery!!! They better wake up and understand what is happening. |
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Sep 22 2015, 01:12 PM
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#93
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
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Sep 22 2015, 01:27 PM
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#94
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(nexona88 @ Sep 22 2015, 01:16 PM) seriously what the shareholder thinking? they should at least make some noise or reject all the board members re-appointments. This is cos they see him as grandmaster sifu....I heard 75% supported Sifu never do no wrong one .... If one looks and studies the portfolio.... One can clearly see that his success lied on 'perfect timing'... The fund started in a period where stocks were simply cheap all across the board. There was nothing special..... Also two of his mega losses... One was Axiata... Tent Boo did not want to subscribe to the rights issue... Fund ended up with a 12 million loss (if not mistaken).... Irony...if he had subscribed to the rights issue, Icap would have a mega winner....at least a four bagger!!!! Next....Parkson....last I saw... Unrealised losses were more than 10 million.... Based on these 2 examples.... Would I rate Teng Boo as a smart fund manager? Would you? |
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Oct 28 2015, 07:42 PM
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#95
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(Boon3 @ Sep 22 2015, 01:27 PM) This is cos they see him as grandmaster sifu.... iCap just took a 10.4 million impairment loss on Parkson. Sifu never do no wrong one .... If one looks and studies the portfolio.... One can clearly see that his success lied on 'perfect timing'... The fund started in a period where stocks were simply cheap all across the board. There was nothing special..... Also two of his mega losses... One was Axiata... Tent Boo did not want to subscribe to the rights issue... Fund ended up with a 12 million loss (if not mistaken).... Irony...if he had subscribed to the rights issue, Icap would have a mega winner....at least a four bagger!!!! Next....Parkson....last I saw... Unrealised losses were more than 10 million.... Based on these 2 examples.... Would I rate Teng Boo as a smart fund manager? Would you? |
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Sep 20 2016, 08:59 AM
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#96
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
LOL! No more fansi?
Berita hari ni... QUOTE “Cash is the most precious call option. There is a report done by Harvard that share buybacks are not good for the market and the economy,” he said. Source: http://www.thestar.com.my/business/busines...d-to-the-board/ Damn! Damn Geng! Dare he use that report to justify his pathetic current sleazy position? Source 1 2015: https://hbr.org/2015/03/gms-stock-buyback-i...and-the-company This was a harvard business report that cried out loud that GM stock buyback is bad for gm and america. I agree. But we have to understand that this was for GM and it should not be used by icap not to do share buyback (since the fund is NOT putting the fund's extra cash into any proper use except to pay for his fat yearly fees!) GM as a company WAS struggling. The buybacks did not good execpt as an exercise to boost share price to the favour of its shareholders. As the report argued, what about the caompany and it's workers? There was another report in 2014: https://hbr.org/2014/09/profits-without-prosperity What was the report arguing about? The excess money (and in mant case - money was even borrowed to pay more dividends!) instead of merely boosting shareholders, could have been used in a much better way such as reinvesting for the company's' future prospect. It argued that what the corporates were doing were mainly extracting value instead of creating value. To cut it even shorter.... Are we comparing APPLES with APPLES here? The Harvard reports were based on corporate America. What's the difference between it and icap? icap is a blardy closed end fund - it is not a corporate. to blatantly compare that harvard report with the fund is so disgusting. what's a fund objective? to make money for the fund!!!! and if the fund manager has been clueless the last 5 years on what to invest, then no need to ask Ah Chee and Ah Kou, the fund needs to blardy well dissolved and return excess money to shareholders. habis cerita. to carry on like this means.... the ONE and ONLY one getting richer is the fund manager!!! repost: QUOTE Total fees for 2009 is 3,495,212 belum count 2016 figures in somemore!!Total fees for 2010 is 4,037,100 Total fees for 2012 is 5,789,726 Total fees for 2013 is 6,179,782 Total fees for 2014 is 6,218,982 Total fees for 2015 is 6,318,354 Current total of all fees collected since 2009:32,095,510. |
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Sep 20 2016, 09:06 AM
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#97
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
And more the record: http://www.thestar.com.my/business/busines...kl-market-seen/
QUOTE PETALING JAYA: Fund manager Tan Teng Boo believes that the FBM KLCI will stay muted for the rest of the year due to the lack of a clear direction on the future interest rate hike by the US Federal Reserve. Muted KL market.... LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! The morning market comics. |
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Sep 20 2016, 09:27 AM
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#98
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
Update:
Total fees for 2009 is 3,495,212 Total fees for 2010 is 4,037,100 Total fees for 2012 is 5,789,726 Total fees for 2013 is 6,179,782 Total fees for 2014 is 6,218,982 Total fees for 2015 is 6,318,354 Total fees for 2016 is 6,150,684 Current total of all fees collected since 2009: 38,246,194. Wow! Wow! Well done Teng Boo! The annual growth in fees has finally stopped! Total fees collected for 2016 has PLUMMETED ... from 6.318 million to 6.150 million! my hero! ps pg 49: As at 31 May 2016, impairment loss on investment in Parkson Holdings Berhad was RM12,506,585 due to decline in market value of Parkson Holdings. The market value as at 31 May 2016 was RM 8,696,146 and the cost was RM 21,202,731. This is considered significant under FRSIC issued Consensus 14 – Impairment of Investment in Equity Instrument categorised as Available-for-Sale Financial Asset. A decline in fair value below the original cost of the equity instrument that had persisted for more than 9 to 12 months would generally be considered as “Prolonged” and hence, be impaired. *As at 19 July 2016, the net unrealised loss for Parkson Holdings Berhad was RM306,923 together with the impairment loss of RM12,506,585 recognised as at 31 May 2016, giving the total unrealised loss of RM12,813,508. |
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Sep 20 2016, 07:41 PM
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#99
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(Boon3 @ Sep 20 2016, 09:06 AM) And more the record: http://www.thestar.com.my/business/busines...kl-market-seen/ Another BRILLIANT statement to make.QUOTE Despite media reports and financial pundits’ analyses on the possible downturn awaiting the Chinese economy, Tan believes otherwise. China, which enjoys commendable political stability and strong policies, is expected to weather the impact of global economic sluggishness and maintain its performance. “I am bullish on China’s performance even for the next 50 to 70 years to come.[U] Why is it BRILLIANT? Would Teng Boo be around in the next 50 to 70 years? Would we be around to tell him his statement is spot on or utterly wrong? Conclusion? This is how one makes a statement to make himself looks smart. I saw his damn ugly face on couple of buses again....... Ok what. Bising what? the cost of advertising is paid by the stock shareholders. |
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Sep 20 2016, 10:58 PM
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#100
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All Stars
15,942 posts Joined: Jun 2008 |
QUOTE(aspartame @ Sep 20 2016, 10:31 PM) As far as I understand, of the total fees, half is management and half is consultancy fees. I would like to ask is this the first fund in the world where the fund needs to pay the fund manager research and consultancy fees on top of management fees? Yes. If you read earlier pages, I seperated the fees but to make it an easier read, I summed it up as total fees.It's this a norm practice in other funds? Sorry but I have no idea. |
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