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 DNB and 2nd 5G network: needed or not?

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YoungMan
post Jul 1 2024, 07:51 PM

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QUOTE(NagaK @ Jul 1 2024, 10:23 AM)
Speeds are subjectable. 4G broadband had bad experience among consumers in terms of speed where 5G changed the landscape. Minimum 300mbps

Knowledgeable in India GOVT approved above 2 5G band to deploy. Example Jio deploy 5G Standalone network where Airtel deploy non standalone ( similar to Malaysia DNB )

My opinion more competition gets more better quality network. DNB 5G coverage is good in Klang Valley. They need improve indoor coverages. Also MNO should focus on 4G too
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Since DNB already focus on 5G NSA, the second network should be focussing on 5G SA and match DNB's coverage.

QUOTE(zidane28 @ Jul 1 2024, 10:41 AM)
I have to state a fact that...

If you want coverage, the costs will be freaking high, which means higher price for cust too.

if you want cheap, then there will be limited coverage on rural area due to the costs involved and also on pure business perspective that focus on urban area first.

Remember during COVID the kid climb on the tree to get mobile data to study from home?

In fact gov need to fork out public money to all those MNOs that you all like to fund them to setup network at rural area.

That's what happened when you rely on business driven company to dictate the coverage of the network.

First 4G was launched way back on 2013, but it took about 6 years to just reach that 82%, then after JENDELA funding only push to 97%...

Meanwhile DNB manage to achieve the 80% coverage in under 3 years...Why? Because it focus on coverage regardless of business needs.

Money don't drop from the sky,
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Indeed, hence it would be good if MCMC regulate that all MNOs to allow MOCN. This is so we can fix the need to have multiple sim to cater to availability of cell coverage.
YoungMan
post Jul 2 2024, 02:34 PM

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QUOTE(NagaK @ Jul 1 2024, 09:47 PM)
Very true example Digi Celcom merger since they both one coverage for both network now far better. Hope MCMC and Ministry deploy / force MOCN to get good 4G experience without just adding to many towers
Yes it's time to move on 5G SA network on 2nd network also implement Voiceover NR ( Vo5G)
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This current 5G is a good example, all telco will have 5G at the same location because they use the same infra. Hence with the break up of DNB later, MCMC should also get both DNB1 and DNB2 to continue with this practice.
YoungMan
post Jul 3 2024, 09:10 PM

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QUOTE(zidane28 @ Jul 3 2024, 06:39 PM)
You want to hear a prediction?

DNB - TM and YTL
Entity B - CelcomDigi, Maxis and UMobile
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Quite possible. Entity B will have the largest user base and they better build it to cater for high traffic. They should also allow all telcos to roam on DNB network.

This post has been edited by YoungMan: Jul 3 2024, 09:11 PM
YoungMan
post Jul 14 2024, 03:02 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Jul 14 2024, 01:36 PM)
GSA: 5G Experience June 2024

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Ironically with existence of DNB, telco in Malaysia can "claim" to have one of the fastest 5G speed in the world. Yet seeing the 4G data, our telco is not even close to the top 4 of fastest 4G telco.

So why 4G with more competitive environment fail to gain ranking or speed? I thought competition should driven telco to be better yet it's DNB that carrying telco name to the top of the world.

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Our 4g where got real competition. If telco A already build infra in 1 area, most likely other telcos will not invest in the same area. Hence coverage differ for each telcos.
YoungMan
post Jul 16 2024, 08:17 PM

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[quote=unknown_2,Jul 16 2024, 08:04 PM]
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[/quote]
u know why the original merger between digi & celcom took place?
bcoz experts agree that too many saturated telecom providers in m'sia.
in contrast, USA being a big country by area, with 10x the population of m'sia also has like 3 real bug players only.
now look at smaller country Singapore, technically only 2 real big players, hence the competition is there.
m'sia size & population, ideally u'll want 2-3 big players for competition
DNB, while sounds good & fair on paper, but it totally eliminate any 5G competition whatsoever.
every1 gets the same coverage, the same speed.
we need a 2nd 5G network where telecom players has more control, hence driving competition & innovation.
i'm waiting to see which telco will introduce true SA 5G first.
current DNB NSA 5G is nvr true 5G & always just a stop gap solution.
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[/quote]
Suppose the buyout of Umobile happen, we still have TM and Yes, which is still a good competition for Malaysia. But come to think of the current situation, what can justify Maxis spending over 10 billion to buy out this Uncle Vincent's company?
Same coverage and same speed illiminate the headache of getting multiple line if one is to travel a lot. Unless there is a mandate for roaming across all 4g/5g regardless who own it.

YoungMan
post Jul 17 2024, 04:48 PM

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QUOTE(NagaK @ Jul 16 2024, 11:26 PM)
Instead of acquiring one to one brand why not Telco can't joint hands with MCMC to deploy MOCN too all their customers. You get profit by sharing infra to others Telco also getting satisfying network to consumers..
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Probably from the telcos point of view, it is one way to kill off their rival. If Telco A dominate in certain area, then ppl who frequent that place will have no choice but to subscribe to them. If All the telcos have the same coverage, only thing they can do is see who can throw price. It benefits the consumer but not the telcos.
Same thing happen to our national HSBB infra, whereby if you want to subscribe other fibre provider riding on HSBB, there is always the excuse of no port. But if you subscribe to the main fibre provider, suddently from no port someone will come and add additional port for you.
QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Jul 17 2024, 01:17 PM)
You argue that we will never found out yet the data from Opensignal already show you the answer.

You said if 4G is SWN, it will be worse, but again, where is the data that said Malaysia has one of the fast 4G network in the world?

Yet the worse 5G "monopoly" easily in the top 5 of 5G speed global ranking.
But the "competitions" you said mean the killing of small telco networks while keeping the duopoly which doesn't improve our experience or improve the price of the 4G plan itself.

Even @tropik is aware of this problem, cellular infrastructure is not like the typical product in supermarket where the more option is better. The network need to be activated at all times and if there is no customer, no MNOs will survive to maintain it.

With CelcomDigi already merging and with rumors of Maxis - Umobile merging, do you think the theory of "competitions" work in cellular industry? The merging doesn't stop in Malaysia, it is happening around the world.

Telco is struggling to maintain the network and the "competitions" you been talking about will be gone sooner or later eventually. Malaysia goverment is literally being proactive by helping telco survive because the telco themselves will be bleeding money to death just trying to invest in 5G infrastructure. This is not even my word, but from the expert itself.
user posted image
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/asia/malays...-berhad-4271661

If you think private telco duopoly is good enough for "competitions", you can ask Thailand people themselves.
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https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/economy/40036133
5G NSA (Option 3x) is chosen also because eMBB is what the majority of of the consumer gonna get. The 5G core which is cloud dependent solution is also still a new concept in cellular infrastructure and not matured yet.
While URLCC and mMTC still has unknown real world usage and no MNO in the world know how to take advantages of it.

Telco will "duke" out 5G yet 4G fail the rural people so much that goverment literally need to create JENDELA just to push telco for coverage? What about the congestion? 4G has been in the decade yet call problem and congestion still happening. Is this the result of "competition"?
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I support another merger, be it Maxis-Umobile or Umobile-Unifi or Yes-whatever. After merger we still have Tm and a few more telcos, perhaps one of the MVNO can finally come out to be MNO.
YoungMan
post Jul 19 2024, 08:54 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Jul 17 2024, 11:34 PM)
Having affordable price is wrong now?

All that extra money will go towards the shareholder. The MNOs couldn't care less about improving their services.
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No one said it's wrong. If possible everyone of us would be happy when all telcos give rm10 unlimited 4g and 5g no capped no FUP no hotspot limit, can download 20tb a month. But whether we like it or not, there also comes business consideration along the line. When telco got to pay DNB for how many gb of usage, they also will think of how to cut cost, for example provide 5g with speed limit, make 4g less reliable so that people pay more for 5g plan. Any problem with this single 5g, can just push the blame to DNB.
There has to be second 5g, SA or NSA, but definitely not 3rd, 4th and 5th 5g network to saturate the market.
YoungMan
post Jul 21 2024, 04:01 PM

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QUOTE(JLA @ Jul 21 2024, 01:42 PM)
celcom digi maxis TM are friendly long time ago
celcom axiata itself is TM demerger. ex ceo chairman from tm
During 3G era celcom digi maxis TM start sharing each others tower
tower fiber backhaul by TM. Not to be confused with TM fiber HSSB
then celcom digi maxis sharing fiber backhaul

the first peninsular MOCN tower is bukit selambau.  this news become viral
Then JENDELA MOCN tower. mostly celcom-digi-maxis. Umobile for whatever reason not joint MOCN club

sarawak MOCN is another story
“Ada tower, tak ada kuali” problem in rural, remote areas in Sarawak
Built tower but no telco using the tower. Kuali refer to satelite or microwave backhaul
https://dayakdaily.com/ada-tower-tak-ada-ku...eas-in-sarawak/
RM116 mln to power 600 Sarawak telco towers with world’s first 6-way network technology
six-way MOCN technology, facilitating connectivity services from CelcomDigi, Maxis, U Mobile, YTL, and Sarawak Rural Broadband Network (MySRBN), is touted as the world’s first implementation of its kind.

a separate memorandum of understanding (MoU) for Domestic Roaming (DR) for SMART600 was inked between Maxis and TM Technology Services Sdn Bhd, aiming to provide TM customers with cellular services at all SMART600 sites,
https://dayakdaily.com/rm116-mln-to-power-6...ork-technology/
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Sarawak's case is they build those tower, but not any telcos willing to provide service in rural area. MOCN has to be the way otherwise it's going to be even more costly to provide services. Idk if those tower that build by the state government is 5g ready, mostly only for 4g.
YoungMan
post Jul 27 2024, 08:46 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Jul 27 2024, 01:00 PM)
Ironically even Thailand people struggle with 5G duopoly. People just need to realize that 5G investment is not the same like 4G. It is more extreme and all the merger happening doesn't benefits the customers at all unless you are the CEO of the company itself.

Either way, I'm still gonna hold some of the people here voices that said that with DWN, we will get "cheaper" AND "better" performance 5G than DNB. If later what happen is otherwise, I hope you have a response ready.

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https://x.com/kln_nurv/status/1816731043367706916
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If duopoly is not good neither is monopoly good. Just look at Astro, cannot compete with other pay tv because they lack innovation due to monopoly.
YoungMan
post Jul 28 2024, 11:41 AM

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QUOTE(prosibu @ Jul 28 2024, 10:28 AM)
https://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/...ternet-veteran/
He also highlighted that RM900 million might be written off due to unused equipment designated for the current frequency, which would now be allocated to the second network.
Mohamed stressed the importance of ensuring fair competition at all levels for the benefit of end-users and service providers, as this would ultimately improve the quality of services and lower prices.
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<b>However, if a second operator is established, Mohamed said it should share existing and new passive infrastructure with DNB to reduce costs and expand coverage.</b>
This part is true, gov through MCMC should regulate this. But as for what KJ have said about the write off equipment, it can still be planned ahead to prevent or minimise wastage. No one in the previous government would agree with second network, this issue will keep being politicise by politician.
YoungMan
post Jul 28 2024, 06:56 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Jul 28 2024, 01:48 PM)
But isn't that because Astro control the whole "ecosystem"?

I don't think DNB is competing with telco like how TM provide HSSB, DNB literally provide the services and it's up to the MNOs on how they want to innovate in the technology.

Umobile and Yes has proven that they can offer affordable 5G pricing using the same services that all Malaysia MNOs use. So why Malaysian doesn't switch network and instead being loyal to one MNO and then complain why the MNO doesn't care about their complain?
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Malaysian doesn't switch network because they are smart. Just look at our 5g indoor coverage. If you switch and there is no Umobile/Yes 4g, you cannot even make and receive calls.
If you stay in Klang/KL then it make sense to use Yes.
YoungMan
post Jul 29 2024, 03:27 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Jul 29 2024, 11:56 AM)
Based on this response, Umobile seems to have the best balance between coverage and affordability, so what is Malaysian problem in not switching?

What is the point of having the biggest coverage when it is useless when we needed them the most?

Also, isn't it ironic that MNOs can subscribe to CelcomDigi 2G network as MOCN yet there is no problem? I thought CelcomDigi monopolize the 2G must be bad in theory right yet it seems a couple decades later, the MNOs seems fine?

What makes CelcomDigi 2G MOCN difference from DNB 5G MOCN?

I mean, during earlier 2G and 4G implementation, I'm sure the indoor coverage is bad as well but that is because it still new, decades later, 5G will follow suit as well like how 3G and 4G have deep coverage indoor inside currently.
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Having bigger coverage is important if you travel. If Umobile get to a point where the customer base is as large as Celcom Digi, do you not think their network will get congested as well? They will experience the same slowness
YoungMan
post Aug 19 2024, 07:43 PM

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QUOTE(lurkingaround @ Aug 19 2024, 05:00 PM)
.
Latest news: .......

https://www.lowyat.net/2024/329511/four-mno...2nd-5g-network/ - CelcomDigi, Maxis, TM, And U  Mobile Submit Bids To Develop Second 5G Network
A decision by MCMC is expected to be made within the year.
BY HEIRUL KAMEL AUGUST 16, 2024

.
.

https://www.lowyat.net/2024/329164/celcomdi...ure-in-sarawak/ - CelcomDigi, U Mobile, And ZTE Set Up 5G-A Infrastructure In Sarawak
Ahead of the upcoming SUKMA 2024 games.
BY JOHN LAW AUGUST 13, 2024 


= AFAIK, 5G-A(dvanced) is based on 5G SA, unlike DNB1's 5G NSA. Does this mean the Sarawak and Sabah  state governments will soon deploy their own 2nd 5G SA network by CelcomDigi and U Mobile, to compete with DNB1, ie no DNB2 in Sabah and Sarawak.?
.
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No way. Deploying 5G SA would be very costly for both Sabah and Sarawak due to geography challenges. I believe both telcos just temporary deploy it at certain Sukma event for 5G showcase.
YoungMan
post Aug 24 2024, 04:14 PM

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QUOTE(lurkingaround @ Aug 24 2024, 12:30 PM)
.
Latest news: .......

https://www.thestar.com.my/business/busines...ssa-termination - TM stands firm in advancing Malaysia's digital infrastructure post-SSA termination
Friday, 23 Aug 2024


= TM Unifi Mobile won't be a shareholder of DNB1 and will likely also not be a shareholder of DNB2.  OTOH, TM has clout in West Malaysia because both DNBs need to buy 5G backhaul Fibre connections (to the Internet) for all their 5G cell towers and small-cells from TM HSBB Fibre Wholesale.
.
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That's true. No matter what, can't run away from TM.
YoungMan
post Aug 28 2024, 01:47 PM

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QUOTE(JLA @ Aug 28 2024, 11:37 AM)
TM Net and TM Wholesale is different company with their own fiber cable

Got any news unifi fiber down, telco tower also down because of TM HSBB fiber cut ?

TM’s High Speed Broadband (HSBB) cabel cut not effected 4G 5G site
https://soyacincau.com/2021/09/06/tm-unifi-...-cable-cut-xrs/

TM fibre-optic cables for bank and gov not link to High Speed Broadband (HSBB) network either
https://www.astroawani.com/berita-malaysia/...n-outage-254119

Same as TM fibre-optic cables for DUKE
https://soyacincau.com/2022/12/17/duke-spe-...allet-down-xrs/

DNB using TM Wholesale fibre cable network not  TM High Speed Broadband (HSBB)
https://www.tm.com.my/news/tm-agreement-dnb...-5g-development
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It's a smart move from TM.
YoungMan
post Oct 3 2024, 07:36 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Oct 3 2024, 05:56 PM)
https://www.opensignal.com/2024/10/5g-globa...nce-awards-2024

During 4G days, does any Malaysia telco manage to win or receive any awards from international bodies? DNB has been winning award since they first rollout their 5G yet I still don't see any data from MNOs bootlicker about how competitive 4G has one of the fastest 4G speed in the world.

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We as ordinary citizens don't care so much on what awards they get. We only want good 5g and ensure monopoly doesn't kill competition.
YoungMan
post Oct 4 2024, 07:32 PM

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QUOTE(OfficiallyAhmad @ Oct 4 2024, 12:50 PM)
Of course ordinary people like you won't care because the data already ruined your narrative. DNB already prove in such short time to be global leader.

My questions remain the same. During 4G days. Does Malaysia 4G speed is one of the fastest in the world or not?

And btw, why is Digi being bought out by Celcom, I thought competition will not drive monopoly?
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What answer do you expect to get? I have seen this question many time in this topic.
Just because our 4g is not the best in the world and our 5g win some award, does this mean a single DNB monopoly is good all the time? Digi being bought out by celcom does not make us having a single telco.
Please read up, both SWN and DWN have pros and cons.

This post has been edited by YoungMan: Oct 4 2024, 07:36 PM
YoungMan
post Nov 1 2024, 08:06 PM

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U Mobile to build Malaysia’s Second 5G network.
https://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/...ond-5g-network/
YoungMan
post Nov 1 2024, 09:40 PM

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QUOTE(lurkingaround @ Nov 1 2024, 09:05 PM)
.
U Mobile chosen to implement second 5G network
FMT Reporters
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01 Nov 2024, 08:01 PM
The company, which has tycoon Vincent Tan as its chairman, will be allowed to work with other mobile network operators in rolling out the second 5G network.


= DNB2 owned by U Mobile with Maxis and YES as equal partner shareholders.?

DNB1 which has a huge debt (RM12 billion.?), owned by CelcomDigi and TM Unifi Mobile because both are "bail-out"able GLCs.?
.

The BIG question now is how will MCMC allot the 5G frequency bands to DNB2, equally or unequally wrt DNB1.?
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There is also possibility U mobile will collaborate with Celcomdigi, extending previous MOCN agreement. If that happen DNB 2 will have very huge subscriber base.
YoungMan
post Nov 2 2024, 10:21 AM

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QUOTE(JLA @ Nov 2 2024, 07:48 AM)
DNB1 : yes + maxis + TM
DNB2 : berjaya umobile + axiata edotco + axiata celcomdigi + berjaya redone

since no news of the new 5G spectrum,  so DNB1 and DNB2 using the same 5G band

DNB under  Digital Minister Gobind Singh Deo. so dont attack Fahmi
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I also see it that way. During SUKMA U Mobile, CDB, and ZTE collaborated for 5G broadcast.

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