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 Bond kaki lai, DRB HICOM bond coming

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contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 09:39 AM

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Has this ever happened before in Malaysian history? It's a switch-a-roo. We got played!

At the end of the day, Tropicana will get the headlines that it redeemed Tranch 1 of the perpetuals, but only because they forced everyone onto a 4-year IMTN.
contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 10:59 AM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Sep 13 2024, 10:00 AM)
And getting a much cheaper rate than penalty rate for not redeeming, without spectre of failing to call?

But all still depends on institutional vote to gather the 75%.

Looks like they don't intend to redeem no matter what the outcome of the EGM?

I.e. if rejected, will result in penalty rate. That might force them to quickly redeem it from their land sale funds. Or renegotiate a better deal than the proposed conversion, which is not that attractive for a less attractive and more opaque company like Tropicana. Otherwise it will jeopardise their SUKUK program, and the other sukuk issue.

Will vote to reject it. IMO, nothing to lose, more to gain.
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They don't say they will redeem if they lose the EGM, but logically they would cause otherwise they are subject to a higher rate. The thing is, there are provisions for them to defer the coupon payments.

I still think they won't go to that extent, it will be viewed as a credit negative event. So once they get their liquidity in order, they should redeem by March or Sep 2025.

I just wrote in to FSM to demand a reason as to why they are voting YES. They should ask individual bondholders to vote and take the majority decision.

All in all, you learn a new thing every day. We are but small fish in a big pond. The high and mighty have crafty ways to escape things that us little men have no avenue for!
contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 11:13 AM

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Only way is a few FSM bondholders of the Tropicana 7.00% sukuk get together. Individually, we may not be able to do much of anything.
contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 11:30 AM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Sep 13 2024, 11:18 AM)
Sorry you're talking about fsm vote. How big is FSM holding?

Only institutional investors have any influence on the vote.

Think foreign institutions will not like this last minute proposal. They have stricter mandates and any sign of "wayang" proposals like this will not be looked upon kindly.
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Which institutional investors are holding Tropicana perpetuals? Usually perpetuals are not on the radar for institutional investors. Plus this 7.0% was not-rated at the point of launch if I recall correctly.
contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 05:44 PM

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QUOTE(guy3288 @ Sep 13 2024, 05:38 PM)
No lah, our original Bond is much more riskier
this new Sukok is Senior secured, mati mati mesti bayar

our ori Bond if Tropicana plays dirty
tak mahu bayar
defer coupon how? we cant do anything
if AGM failed semua orang hold back old ori bond
Tropicana wont redeem, cant pay 9% coupon
can defer....

fact is Tropicana  still unwilling to fork out RM248 Million to  redeem all
so play this exchange offer now.
if redeem for a few sure ada duit lah....when majority take exchange offer
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The original perpetual is also a SENIOR SECURED. No difference.

Tropicana can defer the coupon indefinitely, but they won't be able to do a lot of things in the mean time with regards to dividend or other capital raising.
contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 07:51 PM

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QUOTE(hksgmy @ Sep 13 2024, 07:02 PM)
Wow. Just finished reading this saga. This is a royal shitstorm in brewing…..
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I spoke to FSM and also have an email from them.

1. This Exhange Offer is a historic first in the Malaysian market.

2. FSM dealer claims that it doesn't matter how they vote. The indication from other sukuk holders during the meeting with Tropicana was that they were favourable of this arrangement, so the 75% threshold will be met either way.

3. The new bond will be listed on Bond Express.

4. They make no promises but will provide liquidity for current holders to exit if there is demand for the bond in the secondary market.

5. FSM reserve the right to vote for Bond Express holders as they act as the principal.

6. Zero fees involved, we get 0.25% from Tropicana as a penalty fee of sorts.

7. There are around RM9mil odd lot holders who purchased via Bond Express

8. Indication is to conclude the Exchange Offer in late Oct 2024

...............

My take is maybe it's not all that bad, just that the principal is tied up for another 4 years.

6.25% is a decent yield. With Fed rate cuts incoming, bond prices generally will rise. So we might still be able to exit at par.

Also MARC has given a A rating with stable outlook for this new issuance.

This post has been edited by contestchris: Sep 13 2024, 07:55 PM
contestchris
post Sep 13 2024, 11:45 PM

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QUOTE(rankiba @ Sep 13 2024, 09:24 PM)
I thought bond subscribers are sophisticated investors?

I worked at GS/JPM/CC and recently thought of retiring back to MY so let me just ask some questions:

Ya'll do know that callable is an OPTION for the ISSUER right?  doh.gif This means Tropicana can choose to call back or not call back the bonds.

When ya'll bought the perp bond, the maturity date is 2119, 100 years from 2019, you know you basically agreed to borrow money to Tropicana for 100 years, right?  doh.gif

If ya'll already know and prepared to borrow money to Tropicana for 100 years why some people are saying things like "We are but small fish in a big pond. The high and mighty have crafty ways to escape things that us little men have no avenue for!" when YOU MADE YOUR OWN DECISIONS? There is no invisible hand or power at play here. Issuer is within their rights to not call back the bond at all.

This exchange offer isn't that bad at all from what I read, more protection (senior sukuk), lower interest (which benefits Tropicana but hurt old owners), yes the callable is few more years down the road, but remember what I said? Callable means that it's an option for issuer, not an obligation, their obligation is to redeem the bonds by YEAR 2119.
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Obviously the call on the 5th year is optional, it already is a PERPETUAL bond. But the incentive to redeem it is there, due to the step-up penalty.

Even if they choose not to redeem, the way I see it, I rather stick with the perpetual bond and earn the higher interest. It jumps to 9% in Y6, then 10% in Y7, increasing 1% each year until it caps out at 15%. Either that, or just hand me the principal back.

Now Tropicana could also then choose to defer payment of the higher interest, but that will be to their detriment. They will not be able to pay dividends nor perform any capital transactions. It will be viewed as credit negative by the rating agency and the banks who loan them.

The switch-a-roo to the 6.25% 4-yr bond seems far too convenient for Tropicana at the expense of sukuk holders. It is unprecedented in the Malaysian environment, such a binding Exchange Offer has simply never happened!

By the way, you are wrong that there is more protection - the original 7.00% sukuk was also a senior secured sukuk. There is no changes in that regard.
contestchris
post Sep 14 2024, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Sep 14 2024, 03:15 PM)
Question re: 9% step up in year 6.

If the proposal is approved, will the 6.25% coupon be backdated to 26 September? Or will it accrue at 9% until the new sukuk is issued?
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It will accrue at 9% but it will just be a month or two
contestchris
post Sep 14 2024, 11:19 PM

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QUOTE(guy3288 @ Sep 14 2024, 07:36 PM)
can see your disappointment
expectation for windfall cash 25.9.24 is gone.
think again 
may be not gone at all.

take the new sukok and sell
get back same RM250k, no?
plus some extras also...

if continue with the  old Perpetual bond
lagi susah to sell methinks..
you see it as Tropicana win we lose
sure angry lah

to me is ok Tropicana win lah
did i lose?.. i think no
compared to those who abandoned ship
sold at RM99 i think we are better off.

for those who bought lelong at RM93.50 or so,
the profit of some 17% return remains
got redemption no redemption sama tu!
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What's the market buying the 7% perps at? On FSM they are no longer offering to buy.

Any idea about the other IMTN due in 2028, what's the going price in the market? Not sure if the transactions via BPAM are accurate.
contestchris
post Sep 17 2024, 03:27 AM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Sep 16 2024, 10:52 PM)
Re: Tropicana 7% Bond Exchange proposal.

The existing Sukuk has a Security Cover requirement of 2.0x, whereas the new Sukuk 's Security Cover is stated at 1.5x (Exchange Offer Memo Sect. 2.2), unless I misread it.

Is the weakening of the security cover acceptable to you guys?  hmm.gif
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No the exiting perpetual also has a security cover of 1.5x. It had a security cover of 2.0x initially when it was unrated, which subsequently lowered to 1.5x when it got rated.
contestchris
post Oct 1 2024, 09:38 AM

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https://www.bixmalaysia.com/learning-center...perpetual-bonds
contestchris
post Oct 14 2024, 06:10 PM

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FSM is gone bonkers. I just got this email. What does it mean?

Dear Valued Client,

Thank you for investing through FSMOne.

We are writing this email regarding the extension notice of Tropicana Exchange Offer.

Please be informed that the extraordinary resolution voting conducted during the EGM on 8 October 2024 was not carried, investors who have abstained or rejected will not be exchanging to the new Sukuk and will continue to hold onto the existing Perpetual Sukuk.

The Issuer has decided to extend the Exchange Offer to all Sukukholders who have abstained or rejected the Exchange Offer until 18 October 2024. As such, we are reaching out to you again to seek your final decision on the Exchange Offer.

If you do decide to change your mind and accept the Exchange Offer, you will be:

- Exchanging your Perpetual Sukuk for the New Sukuk,
- Receive a consent fee of 0.25% of the principal amount in cash and,
- Accrued interest from the Existing Perpetual Sukuk.

Kindly respond to this email if you intend to accept the Exchange Offer by 3pm, 15 October 2024 (Wednesday). If we do not get a response from you, we will consider your previous actions as final.

For clients who have already voted to accept the Exchange Offer previously, there is no action required from you.

For more information, please refer to attached document.

Please feel free to contact us should you need further assistance.

------------

FSM already told me the voted on behalf of all Bond Express bondholders in favour of the resolution. They said we cannot vote individually. So why am I getting this email? Anyone knows? Also, looks like Tropicana is not giving up, they want another 3% acceptance to hit the 75% threshold. Seems kinda desperate, I wonder why.

This post has been edited by contestchris: Oct 14 2024, 06:12 PM
contestchris
post Oct 14 2024, 07:24 PM

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QUOTE(guy3288 @ Oct 14 2024, 06:33 PM)
you voted for it?, you dont need do anything now

you voted against it, FSM say reconsider...

tried to  pursuade you lah go for it.
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But FSM says they voted for us. Since we are holding odd lots on FSM, they said we can't vote. So I never voted before, they voted "yes" for me already. So pelik
contestchris
post Nov 13 2024, 05:49 PM

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QUOTE(guy3288 @ Nov 12 2024, 11:55 PM)
converted today, tomorrow New sukok would be issued.

if can get below RM100 at FSM  i plan to buy
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Means? I'm kinda pissed with FSM cause they're keeping odd lot bondsholders out of the loop. They should explain what's going on. So far I don't see anything about any exchange happening. 2 weeks back they told me no news yet.
contestchris
post Nov 15 2024, 12:29 AM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Nov 14 2024, 09:42 PM)
Yesterday (13th) my CIMB account was credited with 3,645.55 with some reference numbers and description "CIMB Bank Investment". I assume it has something to do with Tropicana bond, the amount seems to be roughly the 0.25% consent fee plus 9% accrued profit (25/9-13/11?) on 250k bond lot, tho I have not calculated it exactly. We untung due to the delay in the issuance of the new sukuk :thumbsup:

Did anyone else receive such a credit, and verified the calculations?
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Yes correct.

{[(49 / 365) * 9% ] + 0.25%} * RM250,000 = RM3 645.55

This post has been edited by contestchris: Nov 15 2024, 12:29 AM
contestchris
post Nov 18 2024, 10:01 AM

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FSM has effected the exchange offer however I didn't receive the accrued coupon for the 9% bond or sweetener of 0.25%. Anyone else got it?
contestchris
post Nov 22 2024, 11:26 AM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Nov 22 2024, 10:06 AM)
To buy and sell, we can only key in at the asking and bid prices, respectively, i.e. it is for immediate matching? We cannot queue at other prices, e.g. if we wish to "park" to buy lower (unlike stocks)?

And can we key in an amount that is higher that what the asking volume is?

If there are no bid/offer prices, we also cannot key in orders?
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Yes I already shared that the FSM Bond Express exchange is a scam bond exchange. There are no market bids/asks, merely bid/asks from FSM at their own predetermined prices. If there is no volume on offer by FSM, you cannot buy or sell - this is the case for 90% of their Bond Express bonds.
contestchris
post Nov 22 2024, 11:56 AM

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I'm surprised no one has filed a lawsuit against FSM for the disingenuous marketing of their Bond Express platform.
contestchris
post Nov 22 2024, 02:07 PM

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QUOTE(guy3288 @ Nov 22 2024, 01:48 PM)
buy bond yes, you can key in lower price
but need  put cash in Account
7days no stocks, you claim back money
all the time cant get it, waste time and effort only
Sell i never tried
Not scam lah
willing buyer willing seller
we dont like we dont take it

is all open and transparent
you get what you see, nothing hidden.
can win meh if you really bring lawsuit?

i think sure lose
reasons:
1)make money in the open not wrong, price as stated
dong forget to get there u got to click agree agree.. so
how to win?

2)FSm buy from seller got risk
cant sell FSM sendiri tanggung
is not like FSM cant sell it off can go  ask seller to take back
and return money to FSM
but i support what you asked for
real live trade, we buy direct at the price client sell
but this is not the case now because

FSM team told me they are trying to get approval for that
if can  let buyer and seller deal direct ,
then FSM no need take risk sure cheaper lah

For now what we see  there for sale is
what FSM has bought up and paid to clients already
cannot sell FSM sendiri  tanggung!
so want to make 1.50 nothing wrong there
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Dude I'm talking about the Bond Express exchange.

user posted image

This post has been edited by contestchris: Nov 22 2024, 02:09 PM
contestchris
post Oct 16 2025, 12:06 PM

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QUOTE(BWassup @ Oct 15 2025, 10:41 PM)
I wonder why Tropicana is not settling the sukuk, or refinancing, instead choosing to pay very high coupon rates, at a time when interest rates have dropped? It's not a huge amount. After all, they have repaid at least one bond this year.

Do you think it's a good buy (subject to availability) for the high yield, since they continue to pay the coupon? They can't afford to default. Sooner or later they will have to redeem no, given the step up coupon each year?
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I cannot brain it as well and it is definitely worth a buy.

My gut tells me their insiders/cronies are holding this sukuk (they didn't accept the offer to switch to the other bond) and are laughing to the bank.

There doesn't seem to be any legitimate reason to keep it in the market and pay the step up rates.

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