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 Steering Rack Lifespan and Failure Experiences

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ZeneticX
post May 31 2023, 08:10 PM

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QUOTE(constant_weight @ May 31 2023, 08:04 PM)
Haven't you scare the hell out of SA during test drive?
ESP flashes? TC restrict the engine power corner exist?

No, then you are different group of consumers.

True FC, RV buyers will consider the Golf TSI and Civic, Corolla etc.
Enthusiastic buyer without 200k+ budget is forced to consider only Civic, dreaming to own Golf GTi or the likes one day.

Civic seems to sit between the sweet spot of value buy and passion buy.
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For me now I just want something comfortable, practical, and handles decently with good fuel economy

Driving like an enthuasiast now scares me with the amount of cars and crazy motorcyclist on the roads. And its not like i visit Genting or Ulu Yam every weekends

Hence it's down to the Civic and Corolla Cross (hybrid) for me. If this is me in my single years I would've gone for Civic without a doubt, but with a family now the Corolla Cross is starting to tick the boxes


QUOTE(Quazacolt @ May 31 2023, 08:10 PM)
In traffic (mostly Melaka, a lot of full stops and traffic lights, in a way worse than KL ) 10-11KM/L
If no regards to FC then between 9-10

If smoother traffic or highways, you can have it to up between 15-22KM/L.
yes that's hybrid level of FC.

Please use KM/L or L/100km instead of the archaic full tank ya lol.
The above figures can mean between 350 to 600+ km in a tank, huge difference oh.
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Got it. The traffic figure is what I'm concerned about mostly since I spend most of my time in KL anyways

Traffic is really crazy now even during weekends after MCO

This post has been edited by ZeneticX: May 31 2023, 08:15 PM
constant_weight
post May 31 2023, 08:26 PM

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QUOTE(ZeneticX @ May 31 2023, 08:10 PM)
Got it. The traffic figure is what I'm concerned about mostly since I spend most of my time in KL anyways

Traffic is really crazy now even during weekends after MCO
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Top up more info. It is common to have high deviation FC for turbo, depends on how one drive.

My 2.0T PHEV mileage too can range from 250km-850km. FC from 20km/l combined usage to pity 5km/l if drive like maniac.

1.5L with 2 bar boost = squueze 3L of atmospheric air into 1.5L volume. O2 is same a 3L car, fuel is scale accordingly.

Turbo is very fuel efficient for low load, small throttle where the boost pressure is just enough to breakeven the pumping vacuum during intake stroke.

New 5th gen Prius Prime PHEV seems like a very good package, but gotta be expensive.

Corolla Cross has exact same power unit in some countries.

This post has been edited by constant_weight: May 31 2023, 08:31 PM
ZeneticX
post May 31 2023, 08:34 PM

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QUOTE(constant_weight @ May 31 2023, 08:26 PM)
Top up more info. It is common to have high deviation FC for turbo, depends on how one drive.

My 2.0T PHEV mileage too can range from 250km-850km. FC from 20km/l combined usage to pity 5km/l if drive like maniac.

1.5L with 2 bar boost = squueze 3L of atmospheric air into 1.5L volume. O2 is same a 3L car, fuel is scale accordingly.

Turbo is very fuel efficient for low load, small throttle where the boost pressure is just enough to breakeven the pumping vacuum during intake stroke.

New 5th gen Prius Prime PHEV seems like a very good package, but gotta be expensive.

Corolla Cross has exact same power unit in some countries.
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its gonna be enough for me if UMW would even bring in the normal HEV variant

2.0T PHEV? is that a 330e?

constant_weight
post May 31 2023, 09:54 PM

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QUOTE(ZeneticX @ May 31 2023, 08:34 PM)
its gonna be enough for me if UMW would even bring in the normal HEV variant

2.0T PHEV? is that a 330e?
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OrangeGrove
post May 31 2023, 10:20 PM

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QUOTE(ZeneticX @ May 31 2023, 05:54 PM)
cannot expect anything advanced or new from UMW bread and butter models lah

UMW understands our market well, the reason people buy Toyota within the price range is for - Comfort, Reliability and RV, that's it, everything else is optional

and people who mostly buy those models (eg: Vios, Corolla) tend to service their cars outside once the warranty period is over, the dinosaur 1.5L and 1.8L NA engines are perfect for this case since almost every ah beng workshop under the tree is familiar with it

that being said, putting aside powertrain. UMW Toyota models nowadays are actually pretty well spec'ed especially when it comes to safety. I still prefer Toyota Safety Sense compared to Honda Sensing or Mazda iActive Sense. And for some reason Honda in SEA market is still keeping Lanewatch instead of regular BSM + RCTA like other markets. 

my only gripe with UMW is their OEM infotainment and the way they integrate it into the dashboard aka CRT TV
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Yup.. I would prefer Toyota keep it that way for local market. Enthusiast is still minority and majority buyers still look for value for money with the low cost of ownership. Toyota will be #1 passenger car sales this year even without going the turbo route.. Their offering and packing are one of the best, but like you said infotainment is still not the best here..
For those need a little bit more excitement, there are always Honda, Mazda and Subaru to choose from..

gobiomani
post Jun 2 2023, 02:19 PM

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QUOTE(SportyHandling @ May 29 2023, 05:17 PM)
A recent failure of the steering rack on my car has somewhat caused be to be phobic about another imminent failure. I'll try to cut a long story short. Basically I am curious to know if anyone has had experiences with the failure of the steering rack in your vehicle. If yes, is your vehicle running on electric power steering and at what mileage did the steering rack fail.

From my conversation with an experienced mechanic, I was made to understand that the steering rack failure is common with all vehicles which operate on Electric Power Steering, and the lifespan is about 8 to 10 years. He mentioned that vehicles with hydraulic power steering rarely have steering rack failures. Is this true?

The recent failure of the steering rack in my vehicle has also suggested that a half-cut steering rack is not a wise option for the replacement of the faulty or broken steering rack as in my experience, it does not last long. The steering rack of my vehicle a Ford Focus mk3 malfunctioned last year when it was 8 years old with mileage 70,000+ km. During that time, the steering rack could not be turned when the engine was started and the error message came up on the display, it was towed to the workshop for the replacement of the steering rack. However, just after 8 months, the (half-cut) steering rack failed again this year and this time, it was much dangerous. It happened when I was driving the car on the road, and the message suddenly came up and the steering wheel cannot be turned! This was when the car was moving at speed on the road and the steering wheel became very stiff and cannot be turned easily. I have to use all my energy to steer the vehicle to the emergency lane. This is extremely dangerous and can cause an accident. If it's a senior citizen, he/she might not have the energy to steer the vehicle to the emergency lane due to the very stiff steering wheel, and the vehicle might need to stop in the middle of the road or highway.

I am not sure if this is an inherent issue with the Ford Focus mk3 in that the steering rack fails rather early, in my case going into the 8th year with low mileage. I was made to understand that all other Focus mk3 also has this same problem and some owners experienced even earlier failure in their 3rd or 4th year. So back to the question. Does anyone here experience a steering rack failure in your vehicle, and how was the situation like? In my case it was a dangerous experience. Does this happen in all vehicles which come with EPS? Some checks on the internet revealed that the steering rack has a lifespan and will somehow fail at some point of time, and the average lifespan is around 160,000 km depending on usage pattern.

Perhaps I made a mistake of going with half-cut steering racks which have a short lifespan. A new steering rack will likely have a longer lifespan but it's fairly costly (RM13k at service centre for the Focus mk3), lower price at outside workshops.
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Steering rack failure is one of several issues with the Focus MK3 which happens to almost every single unit.
The other issues are TCM failure, clutch plate issue (this was fixed with a redesigned clutch plate) and a few others that I can't recall.

I was considering to buy a used Focus MK3/MK3.5 but after some research decided not to.
When it comes to Ford, when there is an issue it is usually a very prevalent one that affects almost all units.
I have a Ford Fiesta and all the issues I've had with the car are issues that impact almost all units (TCM, Clutch plate, door latch).

TSSportyHandling
post Jun 2 2023, 05:04 PM

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QUOTE(gobiomani @ Jun 2 2023, 02:19 PM)
Steering rack failure is one of several issues with the Focus MK3 which happens to almost every single unit.
The other issues are TCM failure, clutch plate issue (this was fixed with a redesigned clutch plate) and a few others that I can't recall.

I was considering to buy a used Focus MK3/MK3.5 but after some research decided not to.
When it comes to Ford, when there is an issue it is usually a very prevalent one that affects almost all units.
I have a Ford Fiesta and all the issues I've had with the car are issues that impact almost all units (TCM, Clutch plate, door latch).
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I thought the Ford Focus mk3 is the only vehicle which has this steering rack failure but apparently Honda cars such as City and Civic also have this which is surprising. I am not aware of any Honda owners who encountered this steering wheel lockup issue like the Ford Focus mk3. Since there are so many Honda cars on the roads, I suppose these should be complaints if the vehicle also has the steering wheel lockup problem where Focus mk3 owners are experiencing. It's a serious situation if it happens.

It's good to know that the Ford Fiesta does not have this steering rack issue which causes the steering wheel to lock up when the vehicle is still moving on the road. It's an extremely dangerous situation to me.
TSSportyHandling
post Jun 2 2023, 05:09 PM

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Forgot to mention that the TCM, door latch and clutch issues with the Fiesta are also affecting the Focus mk3. I've got the TCM replaced within the 10 year warranty period once, door latch also replaced all about 2 years ago. The clutch issue has been resolved after Ford came up with an improved design, and the latest clutch is now more durable, no more jerking issues for the past 4 or 5 years since I last replaced it at the workshop under warranty.

The most serious issue is surely the steering rack failure to me as safety is severely compromised when it fails.
gobiomani
post Jun 2 2023, 06:13 PM

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QUOTE(SportyHandling @ Jun 2 2023, 05:04 PM)
I thought the Ford Focus mk3 is the only vehicle which has this steering rack failure but apparently Honda cars such as City and Civic also have this which is surprising. I am not aware of any Honda owners who encountered this steering wheel lockup issue like the Ford Focus mk3. Since there are so many Honda cars on the roads, I suppose these should be complaints if the vehicle also has the steering wheel lockup problem where Focus mk3 owners are experiencing. It's a serious situation if it happens.

It's good to know that the Ford Fiesta does not have this steering rack issue which causes the steering wheel to lock up when the vehicle is still moving on the road. It's an extremely dangerous situation to me.
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Steering rack issues are quite common for most models but only very prevalent for some models like the Focus, Civic and City that you mentioned and also for BMW F30 where all the units also will kena one.
Other cars also have this issue but usually got symptoms before it creates a safety issue like your case. I think in your case the mistake is that you got a recon unit without warranty, which is a big red flag coz they probably already know that it is not gonna spoil soon. This probably played a role in the situation ending up so scary like you experienced.

Another thing, Honda cars are full of issues but people still like to buy them and claim it is reliable and good just coz the RV is good. Malaysia car market is really rclxub.gif



dev/numb
post Jun 2 2023, 08:00 PM

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QUOTE(gobiomani @ Jun 2 2023, 06:13 PM)

Another thing, Honda cars are full of issues but people still like to buy them and claim it is reliable and good just coz the RV is good. Malaysia car market is really  rclxub.gif
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Anecdotal, but I’ve owned 4 Hondas throughout my adult life – 3 MY-CKD & 1 JPN-CBU between 1998 to 2016 – and aside from a small power window motor issue with one of them (fixed under warranty), I experienced a grand total of zero issues. Could be that I just never kept a car long enough for issues to appear.

The thing that makes me avoid Honda these days is the quality gap between JPN-CBU/JDM and our local CKD. It really is huge. Once I experienced a JPN-CBU model (Odyssey), all the CKD versions felt like rattling junk. I would say the CBU-to-CKD gap is wider for Honda than any other car brand I’ve owned. I wonder if it’s the same for Thai or Indo CBU models sold here?


Quazacolt
post Jun 2 2023, 10:03 PM

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QUOTE(dev/numb @ Jun 2 2023, 08:00 PM)
The thing that makes me avoid Honda these days is the quality gap between JPN-CBU/JDM and our local CKD. It really is huge. Once I experienced a JPN-CBU model (Odyssey), all the CKD versions felt like rattling junk. I would say the CBU-to-CKD gap is wider for Honda than any other car brand I’ve owned.
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For this thread topic anyways - The steering rack issue is global, nothing to do with CBU or CKD.

muhrica is pursuing official recall. Honda not responding in kind so far.
HalseyFrangipane
post Nov 14 2023, 08:23 PM

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For my e46, I have changed 3 halfcut steering racks. Rebuilt 2 different units with 2 different mechanics.

1st rebuild is my own mechanic who advised against it but I told him to proceed for me to experiment the longevity of it. Lasted 554 days and 37k km before it started leaking.

2nd rebuild is by D S Auto Enterprise in Sungai Buloh on a non-leaking halfcut rack because I wanted to fix the deadzone. Currently at 183 days and 11k km and it has already started leaking. I'm still awaiting their reply but I think the warranty is only for 3 months.

Any other suggestions to fix this steering rack issue? Looking for a brand new rack for this particular model costs at least 12k+ excluding shipping lol.
TSSportyHandling
post Nov 14 2023, 10:10 PM

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QUOTE(HalseyFrangipane @ Nov 14 2023, 08:23 PM)
For my e46, I have changed 3 halfcut steering racks. Rebuilt 2 different units with 2 different mechanics.

1st rebuild is my own mechanic who advised against it but I told him to proceed for me to experiment the longevity of it. Lasted 554 days and 37k km before it started leaking.

2nd rebuild is by D S Auto Enterprise in Sungai Buloh on a non-leaking halfcut rack because I wanted to fix the deadzone. Currently at 183 days and 11k km and it has already started leaking. I'm still awaiting their reply but I think the warranty is only for 3 months.

Any other suggestions to fix this steering rack issue? Looking for a brand new rack for this particular model costs at least 12k+ excluding shipping lol.
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Thanks for the information. You can't get the steering rack for your vehicle locally and need to ship it at RM12k excluding shipping? If you add shipping and labour it will be a lot higher as the steering rack installation is complicated and quite labour intensive. A brand new steering rack for my Ford Focus used to cost RM9.8k everything in quoted by the local workshop in Klang Valley. The price has now dropped to below RM8k, still expensive.

In my view, if you still love the car and wish to drive it for few more years, I'd suggest to get a new one since you have now experienced premature failure(leaking) with your rebuild steering racks. I'm not sure about your car but with my vehicle, there is no rebuild service. It is either replace with 2nd hand or new one. 2nd hand steering rack is a matter of luck and no warranty, it's a time bomb as you wouldn't know when it will fail again. Get new one for peace of mind.

The other best option is to sell the car and get a, new vehicle.

At least you only experience leaking with your steering rack, and I presume the car can still be driven without much issue? With the Ford Focus you will just get a message on your screen on the steering system failure and at that moment you can't drive the car already as the steering wheel will become very stiff and lock up
prdkancil
post Dec 6 2023, 11:21 AM

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QUOTE(HalseyFrangipane @ Nov 14 2023, 08:23 PM)
For my e46, I have changed 3 halfcut steering racks. Rebuilt 2 different units with 2 different mechanics.

1st rebuild is my own mechanic who advised against it but I told him to proceed for me to experiment the longevity of it. Lasted 554 days and 37k km before it started leaking.

2nd rebuild is by D S Auto Enterprise in Sungai Buloh on a non-leaking halfcut rack because I wanted to fix the deadzone. Currently at 183 days and 11k km and it has already started leaking. I'm still awaiting their reply but I think the warranty is only for 3 months.

Any other suggestions to fix this steering rack issue? Looking for a brand new rack for this particular model costs at least 12k+ excluding shipping lol.
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May i know how much D S Auto Enterprise charge u to repair / recond steering rack?
HalseyFrangipane
post Dec 6 2023, 11:29 PM

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QUOTE(prdkancil @ Dec 6 2023, 11:21 AM)
May i know how much D S Auto Enterprise charge u to repair / recond steering rack?
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1st rebuild was RM800. Brought my own rack in and installed at my own shop.

2nd rebuild was RM600. This time I just brought my car to check. This includes labour and power steering fluid.
littlefire
post Dec 7 2023, 08:44 AM

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QUOTE(HalseyFrangipane @ Dec 7 2023, 12:29 AM)
1st rebuild was RM800. Brought my own rack in and installed at my own shop.

2nd rebuild was RM600. This time I just brought my car to check. This includes labour and power steering fluid.
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Bro, if you go for the new 12k did you estimate how many years it will last compare to the fix/rebuilt cost?

Besides that, did you change your sport rim, wider wheels or done any modification to your suspension system (lowering the ride) and also driving attitude (A lot of owners tent to max the turning point on steering rack especially standstill, this is damn worse straining the steering components - Dry Steering) A lot of times, my mechanic told me is due to modification or driver attitude but they prefer not to tell the owner as it might hurt their feelings and also their earnings. laugh.gif


This post has been edited by littlefire: Dec 7 2023, 08:47 AM
alexei
post Dec 7 2023, 12:56 PM

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Proton Exora 135k km, 10 years old, rack leaking on right side
Change to 17 inch rim in front less than 10k km ago
cfa28
post Dec 7 2023, 07:56 PM

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proton waja CPS - 15 Years and 300k km. no phone with Steering Rack so far
HalseyFrangipane
post Dec 7 2023, 09:35 PM

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QUOTE(littlefire @ Dec 7 2023, 08:44 AM)
Bro, if you go for the new 12k did you estimate how many years it will last compare to the fix/rebuilt cost?

Besides that, did you change your sport rim, wider wheels or done any modification to your suspension system (lowering the ride) and also driving attitude (A lot of owners tent to max the turning point on steering rack especially standstill, this is damn worse straining the steering components - Dry Steering) A lot of times, my mechanic told me is due to modification or driver attitude but they prefer not to tell the owner as it might hurt their feelings and also their earnings.  laugh.gif
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Nope, didn't bother calculating the feasibility for getting a brand new rack because I'm pretty sure it won't last from the amount of abuse I put this car through hahahaha... sweat.gif

Wheels are genuine BMW, and within specification too (there are several options, in different sizes, with different offsets for E46). All my suspension parts are either genuine or OE, not even OEM or aftermarket.

Definitely not from max turning point while stationary, let alone moving.

My mechanic abuses me quite often, telling me to stop abusing the car and stop wasting money, and to drive slower. So you get the idea sweat.gif
Quazacolt
post Dec 9 2023, 03:30 PM

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QUOTE(HalseyFrangipane @ Dec 7 2023, 09:35 PM)
My mechanic abuses me quite often, telling me to stop abusing the car and stop wasting money, and to drive slower. So you get the idea  sweat.gif
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Sounds like my friend Kent Toh (KTS https://maps.app.goo.gl/DzF6SYf8ANiRnDhW7 )

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