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 Anticipation is the key, sam ke ting case

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keyibukeyi
post Apr 15 2022, 09:59 PM

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berbukit sedikit u mean man bobot
TSbani_prime
post Apr 15 2022, 09:59 PM

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QUOTE(pandah @ Apr 15 2022, 09:56 PM)
if i drive on a road, i would anticipate may be there are lubang or may be there are branches from roadside tree or even breakdown cars etc, but budak nyamuk is not something that i am supposed to anticipate.

like the highway construction material drop and kill the driver case, will you say hey itu driver sepatutnya anticipate benda nak jatuh, so driver tu salah dan patut dipenjara kalau dia tak mati?

and for the umpteenth times, the MIROS has already determined that she was not speeding.
*
She's not speeding... True. But she should reduce her speed because she is approaching risky or dangerous area
cse.my
post Apr 15 2022, 10:00 PM

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Judge tokok own drive like macam safe.. lol
frost99
post Apr 15 2022, 10:00 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Apr 15 2022, 09:29 PM)
Here i try to understand the basis of reasoning from the judge on why the judge decided that unfortunate driver is guilty
Several key point i want to highlighted from the report i read

"... makhamah bicara terkhilaf apabila menerima pembelaan Responden yang tidak mengetahui adanya aktiviti basikal lajak pada malam kejadian sebagai alasan untuk memandu keretanya secara merbahaya sehingga mengorbankan mangsa yang dinyatakan dalam pertuduhan. Responden seharusnya  memandu kereta dengan lebih berhati - hati dan bukannya memandu dengan laju sehingga menyebabkan kemalangan tersebut."

"...Responden yang memandu keretanya secara merbahaya mengambil kira keadaan jalan yang berselekohj dan berbukit sedikit"

In my personal opinon, i think what the judge trying to highlight, as a good driver, we must anticipate any possible danger . So whenever we encounter a location that has potential danger like reduce our visibility, down the hill, crowded place, and so we must able to take necessary step to reduce the risk.
For example if we goes into school area, we must reduce our car speed, in anticipating possible danger that kid will run across the road from no where. We cant just say, eh aku tak nampak ada budak lari" 

A dangerous driving will be like, even u know u are in school area, u continue to speed and somehow hit a kid. This is what considered a dangerous driving. Because u fail to anticipate n do what necessary. Same thinglah if  u drive during raining too

In this case, obviously the driver not only she was approaching a dangerous location. She goes down hill and approaching the corner and its dark. A good driver usually able to anticipate the risk of danger n reduce the speed,. Unfortunately, in this case, there is no preventive measure taken during this risk location. For this the judge said " Responden seharusnya  memandu kereta dengan lebih berhati - hati dan bukannya memandu dengan laju sehingga menyebabkan kemalangan tersebut. " (esp in the hilly area, at the corner and dark location)
The presence of the boys on the road is also wrong. But does it change anything if we replace the boys with ordinarly motorcycle, ordinary pedestrian, or romobongan orang? or TNB replace bulp There is no law saying that these people cant be presence on the road or the corner of highway. So a responsible driver must always able to anticipate dangerous location n do what is necessary , whatever preventive measure to prevent accident. This is in my personal opinion, the basis of the judge reasoning on the case (or course tambah dengan statement inconsistentcies like tiba2 ada new version of another car hit the kid)
*
You make some interesting points, which I believe actually help to highlight the real issue here.

Absolutely agree that as a good driver, there is many behaviour and also law that we should follow. Follow speed limit, don't drive when mabuk or on drugs, don't play handphone, drive carefully, don't simply change lane suddenly, drive more carefully during raining, switch on headlamp at night, ensure car well maintained, tire and brake in good condition, valid road tax and license etc etc. This is the responsibility of all motorist on the road.

Now, everything else you mentioned, should be the responsibility of the other party.

Let's say school area. Actually it is the responsibility of the school and town council that approved the development, that necessary safety measure is in place. For example, speed bumps, school warning sign, very low speed limit, have school guard/warden to help control traffic, proper waiting area for student (not stand on road side). The most important objective is protect safety of school children.

Let's say TNB replace lampu. It is the responsibility of TNB or contractor to ensure proper health safety procedure are following. Example again, get approvals to do it, put warning signs and warning light far in advance, block off the lane if needed with proper diversion, have people or robot to wave the flag to warn oncoming traffic, etc etc. The most important objective is protect safety of TNB worker.

So it is clear what the gap is in this situation. Legally, the above 2 case the courts may argue whether or not a driver who bang schoolkid or TNB worker should be penalize or not, to be honest I don't really care. But, it is very clear that all parties have responsibility to ensure safety for all concern. In this case, it seem greatly overlook about the safety of our young children, which should really be the important. They had absolutely no right to be in that situation, but the car and driver had every right to be.

As you said, you can be on the road for some reason. Like if your car breakdown middle of highway, you are stuck there obviously, but better not to stand on the emergency lane, so many case kena bang and died. The basikal lajak kids also have responsibility as well, to practice good and safe behaviour when on a road, but they quite literally did everything they possibly could, in the most wrong and dangerous way.....


desmond2020
post Apr 15 2022, 10:01 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Apr 15 2022, 09:59 PM)
She's not speeding... True. But she should reduce her speed because she is approaching risky or dangerous area
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how she know it is risky and dangerous place?

she is not yuri
k!nex
post Apr 15 2022, 10:01 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Apr 15 2022, 09:58 PM)
Tak kisah.... The issue here is anticipation. Even u are below speed limit, if it was raining heavily n u have poor vision, even driving fast n even bow speed limit considered dangerous driving
*
So next time u langgar lembu or chicken on kampung road at night, you ok to be jailed 6 years ya since you are not anticipating and careful in driving.
syndromedown1
post Apr 15 2022, 10:02 PM

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parking tered seiji self destruction tis gon b gud
ToGMochi
post Apr 15 2022, 10:02 PM

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So next time I drive car horr, if my road traffic light is green which means I can go then suddenly got bike or basikal lajak kids from opposite road langgar their traffic light and I bang into them, they die. That means I'm at fault too. Coz hakim say, I have to anticipate kids with bikes will coming and must brake in time. But because I cannot brake in time, I'm considered driving recklessly although I'm right.

ladies and gentleman, basikal lajak is the new king of the road. They can be anywhere anytime in whatever situation it's their road thus you must always anticipate and respect their presence.
e-lite
post Apr 15 2022, 10:02 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Apr 15 2022, 09:29 PM)
Here i try to understand the basis of reasoning from the judge on why the judge decided that unfortunate driver is guilty
Several key point i want to highlighted from the report i read

"... makhamah bicara terkhilaf apabila menerima pembelaan Responden yang tidak mengetahui adanya aktiviti basikal lajak pada malam kejadian sebagai alasan untuk memandu keretanya secara merbahaya sehingga mengorbankan mangsa yang dinyatakan dalam pertuduhan. Responden seharusnya  memandu kereta dengan lebih berhati - hati dan bukannya memandu dengan laju sehingga menyebabkan kemalangan tersebut."

"...Responden yang memandu keretanya secara merbahaya mengambil kira keadaan jalan yang berselekohj dan berbukit sedikit"

In my personal opinon, i think what the judge trying to highlight, as a good driver, we must anticipate any possible danger . So whenever we encounter a location that has potential danger like reduce our visibility, down the hill, crowded place, and so we must able to take necessary step to reduce the risk.
For example if we goes into school area, we must reduce our car speed, in anticipating possible danger that kid will run across the road from no where. We cant just say, eh aku tak nampak ada budak lari" 

A dangerous driving will be like, even u know u are in school area, u continue to speed and somehow hit a kid. This is what considered a dangerous driving. Because u fail to anticipate n do what necessary. Same thinglah if  u drive during raining too

In this case, obviously the driver not only she was approaching a dangerous location. She goes down hill and approaching the corner and its dark. A good driver usually able to anticipate the risk of danger n reduce the speed,. Unfortunately, in this case, there is no preventive measure taken during this risk location. For this the judge said " Responden seharusnya  memandu kereta dengan lebih berhati - hati dan bukannya memandu dengan laju sehingga menyebabkan kemalangan tersebut. " (esp in the hilly area, at the corner and dark location)
The presence of the boys on the road is also wrong. But does it change anything if we replace the boys with ordinarly motorcycle, ordinary pedestrian, or romobongan orang? or TNB replace bulp There is no law saying that these people cant be presence on the road or the corner of highway. So a responsible driver must always able to anticipate dangerous location n do what is necessary , whatever preventive measure to prevent accident. This is in my personal opinion, the basis of the judge reasoning on the case (or course tambah dengan statement inconsistentcies like tiba2 ada new version of another car hit the kid)
*
Baik letak speed limit 30 kmph dekat highway ja. Sebab takut ada kanak-kanak dan bas sekolah berhenti di sana

Sebab "anticipation"

Bani ini khilaf
ToGMochi
post Apr 15 2022, 10:03 PM

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So next time I drive car horr, if my road traffic light is green which means I can go then suddenly got bike or basikal lajak kids from opposite road langgar their traffic light and I bang into them, they die. That means I'm at fault too. Coz hakim say, I have to anticipate kids with bikes will coming and must brake in time. But because I cannot brake in time, I'm considered driving recklessly although I'm right.

ladies and gentleman, basikal lajak is the new king of the road. They can be anywhere anytime in whatever situation it's their road thus you must always anticipate and respect their presence.
desmond2020
post Apr 15 2022, 10:04 PM

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QUOTE(ToGMochi @ Apr 15 2022, 10:03 PM)
So next time I drive car horr, if my road traffic light is green which means I can go then suddenly got bike or basikal lajak kids from opposite road langgar their traffic light and I bang into them, they die. That means I'm at fault too. Coz hakim say, I have to anticipate kids with bikes will coming and must brake in time. But because I cannot brake in time, I'm considered driving recklessly although I'm right.

ladies and gentleman, basikal lajak is the new king of the road. They can be anywhere anytime in whatever situation it's their road thus you must always anticipate and respect their presence.
*
it is up to you to be more careful
cursetheroad01
post Apr 15 2022, 10:04 PM

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QUOTE(pwncake @ Apr 15 2022, 09:55 PM)
I'd say your parents aborting you 20 years after you are born is a pretty good precedent at this point.
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Heh.
Your statement are not even relevant as here i am not being aborted.
Learn to actually make a sound argument instead of throwing bad insults like dumbass.

Supporting a road abuser.
You are no different than a mat rempit.
Guna jalan macam bapak kau punya.
kopiride
post Apr 15 2022, 10:05 PM

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If Jkom have logical brain, Malaysia would be a better place already. So far all jkom only proves to have no logic.
Wrong become right.
Right become wrong.
TSbani_prime
post Apr 15 2022, 10:06 PM

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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Apr 15 2022, 10:01 PM)
how she know it is risky and dangerous place?

she is not yuri
*
When u approaching, corner, dark n hilly area, that considered risk area lah
pandah
post Apr 15 2022, 10:06 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Apr 15 2022, 09:59 PM)
She's not speeding... True. But she should reduce her speed because she is approaching risky or dangerous area
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how much reduce is considered reduce?

if the road is stipulated to be save at 50, and she was determined not over 50, how much you want her to slow down?

40 can kill, 30 also can, a 5km/h car can kill too.

if you consider the case of lawan arus, the one who lawan arus memang salah, but can you say the one who are on the right way salah because he never slow down and anticipate a lawan arus car?

it is absolutely absurd to argue like that.
desmond2020
post Apr 15 2022, 10:08 PM

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QUOTE(bani_prime @ Apr 15 2022, 10:06 PM)
When u approaching, corner, dark n hilly area, that considered risk area lah
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kesian, kejap say straight road, bright and well lit road

kejap say dangerous must slow down

eh, keep story straight lah
katijar
post Apr 15 2022, 10:08 PM

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50 kph is slow in highway

It is not normal taman road
WaCKy-Angel
post Apr 15 2022, 10:08 PM

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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Apr 15 2022, 09:45 PM)
any of these will drive against traffic?  shakehead.gif
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About that. So whoever that crash into vehicle driving against traffic is actually salah coz not anticipating got car driving against ttaffic lah?
ToGMochi
post Apr 15 2022, 10:09 PM

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QUOTE(desmond2020 @ Apr 15 2022, 10:04 PM)
it is up to you to be more careful
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Sorry lah. No matter how careful I am. Sometimes accident will still happen due to other people's irresponsible and reckless behaviour.
desmond2020
post Apr 15 2022, 10:09 PM

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QUOTE(WaCKy-Angel @ Apr 15 2022, 10:08 PM)
About that. So whoever that crash into vehicle driving against traffic is actually salah coz not anticipating got car driving against ttaffic lah?
*
this case would be a good precedence for those lawan arus dude to claim innocent

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