Hi All,

I was thinking of getting AU or SG PR. Actually, both process is underway. Was wondering if any of you have the experience and advise on this.

Heard it is more difficult to get approve for both countries. Another thing is, is the lifestyle certainly better than where we are?

Thanks in advance for all your feedback

I imagine AU is the overall better option. SG is a city state, AU a seriously huge country. More options, can live in town, or countryside, or jungle or desert, close to the beach, or close to the skiresort. Higher quality of life, less stress. and not confined to pigeon hole HBD. Also a bit more free and open society.

I think the pro's for Singapore would be all about the proximity and cultural similarity to Malaysia.

Is difficult question. Better lifestyle is really a very subjective thing and many times reality is different from what we imagine it to be.

I've friends who migrated from Singapore to Melbourne and came back after a few months because kids don't like it. But there are others that like it also. Some times it's difficult to predict how kids will respond. It's common for migrant kids to develop self hate and cannot adapt well and blame their parents for migrating.

My feel is if you're upper middle to upper class, no problems with either country, cos money is not a problem and you and your family can comfortably enjoy the lifestyle aspects.

If you're middle class working professional and more ambitious kind, go SG better, cos easier to find a professional jobs in SG because of cultural similarity. Difficult to "climb" corporate ladder in Aus. Think SG is closer to rest of Asia which is expected to be where all the opportunities are in the next decade or so.

But if you and your family big on lifestyle, certainly Aus has more variety, not necessarily better.

It's getting very very difficult to get Oz pr, as they start closing the door.....

this.. but why would anyone apply for both PRs?? Do you know the first question on PR application is whether you hold or are applying a PR in another country?? You must be some rich lord & an idiot to apply for both concurrently..

And you think Aussie PR application is cheap? Not only are there 100s of pages to fill up, an IELTS you need to sit for, the cost of the PR $4,000AUD if you apply by yourself.. $10k AU if through an agent.. compare this to just a mere $100sgd for Singapore that can be done within an hour..

I've grown up in both countries for extended amount of time. I can safely say that working in SG is better for your career. Asia pacific is heading for boom time in the next 30-40 years and SG is well positioned both geographically and politically stable to benefit from it. You can say the riots in HK actually help push SG as the major player in this region. Everything about SG is about efficiency and proper governance. SG Taxes are minimal and almost every cent given to the government, you can easily get back. Even CPF.

As for aus, jobs are very, very hard to come by, menial and not rewarding both in terms of pay & nature of the work. Add in the high tax rates in Aus and you'll feel like somebody is stealing your wages every month. Things are getting progressively worst & the left leaning government is to blame for it.. Socialism just doesn't work. Universal healthcare just doesn't make sense when there are lines to the moon and back just to see a dentist for a tooth ache.. I rather pay the $1000 AUD than wait that long.. and it costs $1000 AUD because the government has already raised the price through universal healthcare.. same with Uni education too.. the fees are getting more and more expensive because again, the government pays for it first so there is no incentive for prices to drop... It's a broken system that is getting worst and worst every damn year..


You do however benefit from large & open parks with fields and lots of grass, great 4-seasonal weather, the best fresh produce & seafood at great prices. But you see all this makes Aus a great place to visit as a tourist. Working & living there are entirely different altogether. I didn't enjoy the work-life and exorbitant taxes.

SG however is great for ambitious person and your income isn't crippled by taxes.. For holiday wise, just balik kampung over a long weekend or choose one of the many cheap flights to other cities in the region.

Australia better.
Singkie PR if u have kids or intent to have, they will need to join "Khidmat negara".

Singapore is good for the young....but can be unkind to the middle-aged and elderly.....it's relatively easy to get jobs, and the pr comes only with a job....

Australia is good for the long term....your old age, and the next generation....but yes, you will have to pay for that future when you are young...."local experience" is a big thing there, so getting a job from outside is difficult....you can however get a pr without a job....the standard skill based migration is not dependant on having a job....

The main problem now with Australia is, the door is closing....and within the last 2 years, becoming very very difficult to get a pr.....

Found the taxation is theft person. No disagreement that taxes are high, but good public spaces, parks, a welfare net, and the aged pension cost money.

Somehow no one ever talks about curtailing the aged pension. Wonder why......


Australia hasn't had a "left leaning government" for almost 7 years, and but for a brief spell between 2008 - 2013, the last 25 years Australia hasn't had a "left leaning government".



Dental care is not covered under Medicare. How is "universal healthcare" to blame for "lines to the moon and back just to see a dentist" when it is not even involved in it?

Apparently the free market is supposed to sort it out right since the invisible hand of the market is supposed to allow more dental services to come in and provide better services?



In Malaysia, government doesn't subsidise IPTS'es. Please provide an instance where IPTS fees dropped.

Benefits that Singapore also has, but with no added taxation. And yes, I know that SG is a smaller country and 'easier' to manage.

They can't. It's already an unmitigated disaster. Most aussies live paycheck to paycheck and solely depend on their super for retirement. It's a recipe for disaster.


The Liberal government aren't any much different from the ALP government.. and with an almost even 50/50 seats split in parliament, the "communist" legislation implemented during the ALP Kevin Rudd/Gilliard leadership will remain for many, many years to come..


Fine, poor example. It still doesn't change the fact that it will take you weeks to months before you see a medical professional due to long queues and it costs significantly more because there is a minimum base-rate charge, in the form of 'bulk-billing' every-time you see the doctor.. It's basically free money for the doctors. They have no incentive to operate cheaper because their industry isn't a reasonably free market.

Who cares about Msia.. we are comparing between SG and Aus here..

Singapore has no welfare net, much less a aged pension. It is hardly a comparison.

So please don't migrate to Australia if you don't want an "unmitigated disastrous" aged pension.

Also plenty of people, Singaporeans or otherwise, live paycheque to paycheque, and (in the Singaporean context) their CPF monies not enough.

But because they're "Aussies"............

The Liberal/National governments of the last 25 years:

- Sold off public assets like Telstra, Qantas, CSL
- Introduced voluntary student unionism
- Privatised the Commonwealth Employment Service
- Disbanded the Clean Energy Finance Corporation
- Took away guns from private owners

amongst others

The Labor government between 2008 - 2013, 5 years, when they weren't stabbing each other:

- Founded NBNCo
- Reinstated student unionism fees
- Legislated a mining and resources tax
- Initiated a flood levy
- Plain packaging for tobacco products

The same, really? One can mount a argument on the merits of the individual decisions, but "aren't any much different"?

Also, what "communist" legislation did the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd governments legislate? Is the Liberal/National government so lousy that after 6 years they can't even repeal "communist" legislation? (They didn't have a problem abolishing the Carbon Tax, Mining Tax, Clean Energy Finance Corporation, so hardly hamstrung in reversing decisions of previous governments)

In Singapore with minimal intervention patients either don't have enough money in their MediSave to pay for "medical professional", or in Australia (as you say) to have public payment but "long queues". Pick the poison of choice.

Also, that is not how "bulk billing" works. Bulk billing means that each consultation/Medicare item has a amount that Medicare to pay out. Doctors that "bulk bill" don't charge patients beyond what Medicare pays them. Doctors that don't bulk bill patients pay the difference on top of the Medicare rebate amount. Which is still less than someone who has to pay the full amount (ie. temporary residents: international students, working visa's, contributory parent visa holders) because they don't have access to Medicare.

Queues are dependent on demand. In Australia if one has the financial means they can pay outright to "jump the queue", or if they can't they go into the public waiting list. In Singapore if one has the financial means they can pay outright to "jump the queue", else they draw down on their MediSave and hope it doesn't run out.

Pick the poison of choice.


So why are Singaporean PEI fees higher than NUS and NTU?

Singapore does have a welfare system, for those who absolutely require it.. such as subsidised housing and living, basic allowances and more.. much harder to obtain than Australia centrelink. And let's face some facts here.. centrelink isnt helping the poor rise out of poverty.. the dole is a huge drain on Australian tax payers without any end in sight..

Singapore encourages savings and low tax rates help tremendously in that.

Not true. Singaporeans have one of the highest savings rates in the world. They are savvy savers and you can attribute this down to the world class public housing system, where heavy subsidies and controlled housing prices makes owning a home very achievable and affordable.

Whereas in Australia.. i think there is no need to mention any further how the housing bubble has created another unmitigated disaster for aussies owning and looking to own a home. Australia has the highest average household debt in the world at eye watering level of 200%!.. and now the liberal government wants to cut interest rates further to revive the stalling australian economy..

Unemployment is creeping up and Australia are definitely heading for a technical recession. Australias economy, to put it in laymans term, it's screwd up..

The threat of return to ALP is always there.. infact, ALP won more seats outright in the recent 2019 federal elections.. 68 parliamentary seats vs Liberal Party 67 numbers... Liberal are only in power because of the nationals backing their coalition..


Like i have said.. there is a minimum base rate that shouldnt even be there if not for the bulk billing practice.. you will see prices drop on the basic costs of medical checkup, getting medicine, & etc, if it was a true free and open market..


In terms of healthcare, there isnt much difference between sg and aus. Only difference is that SG has achieved their standard without forcing everyone to pay high taxes.. if you make 90k gross in aus vs 90k gross in sg, you'll have way more disposal income in Singapore. Without a doubt..


I dont know why.. that's their choice and emphasise on degree holder is way higher in sg.

Whatever it is, their system works way better than Australias, at a cheaper cost to you..

Like I've said, SG is better for the individual person. But if you want to live a life on wealthfare state, go to australia.

eh...on the contrary, the medicare "bulk bill" rate controls price, forcing doctors to bulk bill to be competitive and cap prices...

spore on the other hand, removed their schedule of fees 10 years ago, and doctors professional fees ballooned out, without the control....

in an environment of limited supply market, the "free market" forces does the opposite once control is removed....very clearly shown in spore's case....

no, "flooding the market" ala msia doesn't help....it encourages supply driven over consumption, and lowers quality of care....just look at msia at the moment....

No man.. you've got it all wrong.. I've done an mri scan in sg for under sg300 on my shoulder.. i just walked in and did the scan myself. No doctor referral letter even required. Afterwards, i took the scan and visited a consultant to get a proper diagnosis and subsequent treatment.. Again, all at a minimal charge. The best part was I claimed it all back on my Malaysian private medical insurance. Which you can buy plans from AIA for under 2k rm/year and fully covers treatments in Singapore.. imagine that..

a similar mri scan in aus would be about that price. But first.. you'd have to seek a referral from a specialist.. who also had to be referred by a GP.. add to that the amount of unnecessary wait time, multiple visits to multiple doctors, the costs, and things quickly add up.. it doesn't even matter that universal healthcare is paying for it all.. its BLOODY inefficient and ineffective.. the way I see it, it's just another form of every doctor getting a cut of the pie. And who's paying for this stupidity? YOU, the tax payer!

Why do you pay so much tax for such an inefficient system and at the same price as a singapore doctor.. it's even cheaper if you did it in malaysia.. a mere hour border crossing into JB, as a malaysian, would save you alot of time and money on healthcare expenses. This is something you can also consider if you are based in SG.. you've got access to two countries medical facilities.

It's much harder to do that if you are based in Aus..

Anyways, it's not even a discussion.. cost wise for healthcare, SG and Aus are almost the same. But you are paying shit load more in the form of aussie taxes.. and aussie bureaucracy is a pain in the ass to deal with, especially when you want to cut corners and save critical time... Imagine you have cancer and time is of critical importance (which my father coincidently did, and was getting treatment from Peter MacCallum, one of the best cancer focus hospitals in aus). And let me tell you.. it wasnt nice and a really stressful time waiting to access the oncologists at peter mac..

He subsequently died of the cancer. Whether or not he would've been better off seeking treatment in Malaysia, we would never know.. and before you shoot malaysia.. I would much rather get treatment at any of the private hospitals in malaysia than over a public hospitial in aus. 100%. Our msian doctors are mostly world class and have no issues with them. They are experienced and pretty good enough for me.

I now have first hand experience in all the 3 countries and I rank australia as the worst.. based solely on my father cancer treatment.

When shit hits the fan and you have cancer and you have urgent needs, you cannot depend at all on the public healthcare system in any country to rescue you.. so why are you paying so much tax on a failed system?? When you can use that tax to get yourself a private medical plan and unlock the best healthcare professionals out there quickly..

This post has been edited by Liamness: Oct 30 2019, 11:36 PM

it is NOT possible to have a radiological investigation in spore WITHOUT a doctor's request....

and you cannot judge a system on a sample size of n=1....

Isn't this essentially the US? I don't think they've got it so good either.

Even for the locals Oz, they aren't having it good. Wages are also depressed now and stagnated. Businesses hire cheaper and hungrier migrants of which a newly minted PR will go for.

There is a lot of promise and dream in an Australia PR. Promise of skills shortage, high wages... Etc... In Singapore, the PR is a lot more pragmatic. You get a job, you stay there for a while, you get a PR and U continue from there. In Oz, U spend loads of money, pursue a dream, pass the point system and pack your bags and U may get the shock of your life after looking for jobs.

It is happening to Singapore also, but Australia is having a much more painful time staying competitive. It is used to making tons of money digging from the ground. Now that demand has slowed, it needs to compete with the rest of the world.... Otherwise it becomes selling properties to each other and selling latte to each other..

Singapore on the hand, need to survive without much resources since day 1.

I was an Aus PR (didn't finish the 2 years and left the country)
Now I'm working in Singapore (closer to home)

Regarding lifestyle it depends on yourself, maybe one suits you better or maybe actually none.

I find it easier to fit in Singapore than in Aus for work as a Malaysian

Ultimately, it really depends on your adaptability when it comes to working overseas (especially Aus imo) and well with PR then it's more about making this previously overseas to become your new home

I am currently an Australian PR and I have lived in Sydney and Melbourne for the past 5 years. I was previously working in Singapore.

As far as work culture and career progression is concerned, I think I belong to the minority - I have found the right job and a rewarding career as a financial modelling professional (it helps since financial modelling market and industry is one of the most advanced in the world, second to UK and it is pretty niche in the financial world). In addition, the working hours are comparatively more accommodating compared to Malaysia and Singapore (that is Australia for you). In short, I am definitely enjoying the best of both worlds. But getting to this point haven't been straightforward I have to say because I have definitely encountered a lot of cultural shocks and adjustments along the way.

Here is my take - to save money so that you can afford to buy a nice house and accumulate your retirement fund, Singapore is a better choice because of low tax and generally easier to get a job... depending on your skillsets and the industry as times have changed but I think being Malaysian there is a still some advantage especially if you are highly educated. You can do the same in Australia but taxes will eat up 30 to 40% of your earnings. However, you can still accumulate decent retirement funds and retire in Msia because u can withdraw your Super early if you decided to leave Australia permanently.

Work culture wise however, I personally think Australia is way better than Singapore because people are generally more tolerant and reasonable in terms of job commitment and hours. I believe working in Australia enabled me to become a more confident person because i learned how to be more expressive and I actually get along with local Aussies pretty well (I came from a relatively traditional Msia Chinese background and only learned English when i was in college so this is a big step for me). So if you asked me to go back to Msia or Singapore to work again I believe I will struggle because it is a completely different work culture because you literally have to bent backwards for your superiors there, in general. If work opportunities and right to live in another country is a consideration, then Australian PR has an added advantage - you can work and live in NZ too with Australia PR.

I also agree that the the public healthcare system in Msia is actually not as bad as it was generally perceived - in fact it was reported that Msia has one of the best healthcare system in the region and I genuinely believed it since one of my family members went through the process and it surprised me in a very positive way. The only problem I have with Msia is just that it is extremely difficult to save enough for retirement by merely earning wages and the more u know about the world and what opportunities are available around the world, you wouldn't be contented with just staying in Msia for career progression, if you are ambitious that is.

If you have a family, then there is a whole different equation to consider - schools in Singapore are definitely way better than Msia and Australia but it is also more stressful for your kids. Australian school system may not prepare your kids that well academically but it cultivates them in a different way - that is being more expressive. So it really depends on what you want. If you really want a more wholesome family lifestyle and IF you can afford it, pick Australia any time. But if you want your kids to be an elite, then Singapore is the way. Either way, there is no guarantee because what a parents can do is just provide them the opportunity.


Once again, if you are rich, then it really doesn't matter because you can go anywhere anyway. I think the more appropriate way to think of this is how the foreign exposure would change you to become a better person - since the condition and living standards of a country can change over time, what skills and knowledge you acquire is more relevant and timeless.

Asian lifestyle and wanna climb ladder = Singapore
Western lifestyle without fear of guns but maintain status quo (2nd rate citizen) = Australia

Be prepared to be looked over for promotion cuz you don't talk like an Aussie. If you're doing your job well then "good on ya mate". They don't like fixing what isn't broken

Brilliant analysis mate! Kudos!

Please check your PMs.