Depends on whose interpretation you want to hear. LOL.

Sacraments are instituted by Christ Himself.

I'll agree with you on the part no one can justify himself. No where did I say man can justify himself. Saying to turn away from the 10 Commandments won't help either. "Thy righteousness is an everlasting righteousness, and thy law is the truth." (Ps 119:142).

The Law is that what defines what is good and what is evil, what is righteousness and what is sin. Therefore, the law itself is good, but our sinful nature, since it finds out what is sinful wants to practice sin and thus, sin uses the Law as an opportunity. That is what St Paul means.

Do you know why you only use verses from St Paul to justify your position, just as Luther used only St Paul but denounced St James? Remember the story of St Paul how before he became a Christian he was Saul, the fiercest denouncer of Christians and a high ranking Pharisee. It was because he was trying to follow the Old Covenant laws entirely, both moral, ritual, and judicial. And I maintain that the moral laws remain (and even higher standard since the coming of Christ) but the ritual and judicial laws of Moses has been abrogated as they have all been fulfilled in Christ. Nowhere does it say the commandments of God are to be forgotten. Victory over the sinful nature is possible only in Jesus Christ and only through faith in Him, repenting and asking Him for forgiveness for all our sins and inherit eternal life with all the saints. In the Catholic Church, the way to do that is via the sacraments instituted by Him, beginning with baptism which is the first sarament of faith in Christ, Confession (after we have fallen into sins committed after baptism), Holy Eucharist (receiving His Body and Blood), and so on.

I'll let the CCC explain to you your warped understanding of original sin and human nature below:

God created man in his image and established him in his friendship. A spiritual creature, man can live this friendship only in free submission to God. The prohibition against eating "of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil" spells this out: "for in the day that you eat of it, you shall die." The "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" symbolically evokes the insurmountable limits that man, being a creature, must freely recognize and respect with trust. Man is dependent on his Creator, and subject to the laws of creation and to the moral norms that govern the use of freedom.

Man, tempted by the devil, let his trust in his Creator die in his heart and, abusing his freedom, disobeyed God's command. This is what man's first sin consisted of. All subsequent sin would be disobedience toward God and lack of trust in his goodness.

Scripture portrays the tragic consequences of this first disobedience. Adam and Eve immediately lose the grace of original holiness. They become afraid of the God of whom they have conceived a distorted image - that of a God jealous of his prerogatives.

The harmony in which they had found themselves, thanks to original justice, is now destroyed: the control of the soul's spiritual faculties over the body is shattered; the union of man and woman becomes subject to tensions, their relations henceforth marked by lust and domination. Harmony with creation is broken: visible creation has become alien and hostile to man.Because of man, creation is now subject "to its bondage to decay".Finally, the consequence explicitly foretold for this disobedience will come true: man will "return to the ground",for out of it he was taken. Death makes its entrance into human history.

After that first sin, the world is virtually inundated by sin There is Cain's murder of his brother Abel and the universal corruption which follows in the wake of sin. Likewise, sin frequently manifests itself in the history of Israel, especially as infidelity to the God of the Covenant and as transgression of the Law of Moses. And even after Christ's atonement, sin raises its head in countless ways among Christians.

After his fall, man was not abandoned by God. On the contrary, God calls him and in a mysterious way heralds the coming victory over evil and his restoration from his fall. This passage in Genesis is called the Protoevangelium ("first gospel"): the first announcement of the Messiah and Redeemer, of a battle between the serpent and the Woman, and of the final victory of a descendant of hers.

The Christian tradition sees in this passage an announcement of the "New Adam" who, because he "became obedient unto death, even death on a cross", makes amends superabundantly for the disobedience, of Adam.305 Furthermore many Fathers and Doctors of the Church have seen the woman announced in the Protoevangelium as Mary, the mother of Christ, the "new Eve". Mary benefited first of all and uniquely from Christ's victory over sin: she was preserved from all stain of original sin and by a special grace of God committed no sin of any kind during her whole earthly life.

But why did God not prevent the first man from sinning? St. Leo the Great responds, "Christ's inexpressible grace gave us blessings better than those the demon's envy had taken away."And St. Thomas Aquinas wrote, "There is nothing to prevent human nature's being raised up to something greater, even after sin; God permits evil in order to draw forth some greater good. Thus St. Paul says, 'Where sin increased, grace abounded all the more'; and the Exsultet sings, 'O happy fault,. . . which gained for us so great a Redeemer!'"

The Council of Trent teaches : If anyone says that man is justified before God by his own works (whether done through the teaching of human nature or the law) without the grace of God through Jesus Christ, let him be anathema.

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 11:37 AM

Now they (adults) are disposed unto the said justice, when, excited and assisted by divine grace, conceiving faith by hearing, they are freely moved towards God, believing those things to be true which God has revealed and promised,-and this especially, that God justifies the impious by His grace, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus; and when, understanding themselves to be sinners, they, by turning themselves, from the fear of divine justice whereby they are profitably agitated, to consider the mercy of God, are raised unto hope, confiding that God will be propitious to them for Christ's sake; and they begin to love Him as the fountain of all justice; and are therefore moved against sins by a certain hatred and detestation, to wit, by that penitence which must be performed before baptism: lastly, when they purpose to receive baptism, to begin a new life, and to keep the commandments of God. Concerning this disposition it is written; He that cometh to God, must believe that he is, and is a rewarder to them that seek him; and, Be of good faith, son, thy sins are forgiven thee; and, The fear of the Lord driveth out sin; and, Do penance, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of your sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost; and, Going, therefore, teach ye all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost; finally, Prepare your hearts unto the Lord.

And what did Christ told the woman caught in adultery? "Go and sin no more!"

Is adultery a sin or not?

It's very relevant because it will indicate one's position. Simple question.

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 11:58 AM

Your conclusion is what's incorrect from what I read. Again, is adultery sin or not? What does it mean by sin no more?

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 01:22 PM

Of turning away from the Commandments.

What does look away mean then?

Is adultery a sin?

Does the 10 Commandments causes you to sin?

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 01:44 PM

It's the same meaning. Does the 10 Commandments causes you to sin?

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 01:50 PM

So you are saying it means different thing?

That's why I asked the simple questions which you are evading because I want to know the practical aspect of this statement.

1) Are the 10 Commandments irrelevant now?
2) Does the 10 commandments causes you to sin?

Supposing that we both agree God is the one who grants grace to the believer, I'm still waiting for your answers to the above.

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 01:59 PM

Yes I agree you didn't ask Christians to sin. But the practical aspect of your teaching is exactly that. Just believe (mental assent) and boom....That's why I'm asking those simple questions.

You do know that "hell is paved with good intentions" right?

If you're triggered by that and want to use that to avoid answering, nvm then.

You win liao la since you are the moderator.

Not helped further when the simple questions are evaded.

Hebrew for the Old Testament, Greek for the New Testament. Even if the Bible remained only in those languages, there is bound to be different interpretations by different people reading it.

Most biblical scholars adhere to the view that the Greek text of the New Testament is the original version.[10] However, there does exist an alternative view which maintains that it is a translation from an Aramaic original, a position known as Peshitta Primacy (also known in primarily non-scholarly circles as "Aramaic primacy"). Although this view has its adherents, the vast majority of scholars dispute this position citing linguistic, historical, and textual inconsistencies.[11] At any rate, since most of the texts are written by diaspora Jews such as Paul the Apostle and his possibly Gentile companion, Luke, and to a large extent addressed directly to Christian communities in Greek-speaking cities (often communities consisting largely of Paul's converts, which appear to have been non-Jewish in the majority), and since the style of their Greek is impeccable,[12] a Greek original is more probable than a translation.

For the gospels, probably you are right.

This post has been edited by yeeck: Oct 10 2019, 04:17 PM