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 STOCK MARKET DISCUSSION V150

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Barricade
post Jun 21 2022, 01:56 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 01:54 PM)
any comment on BAT?
*
I work with BAT and I won't even touch my own company shares.
bcombat
post Jun 21 2022, 01:57 PM

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QUOTE(Barricade @ Jun 21 2022, 01:56 PM)
I work with BAT and I won't even touch my own company shares.
*
they pay good dividend in the past.
Barricade
post Jun 21 2022, 02:00 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 01:57 PM)
they pay good dividend in the past.
*
How about now?

This post has been edited by Barricade: Jun 21 2022, 02:01 PM
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:02 PM

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QUOTE(Barricade @ Jun 21 2022, 01:50 PM)
I still trust in old folks. Chinese bank especially.  cool2.gif

user posted image
user posted image
*
laugh.gif

Neither for me... smile.gif (I hope that choice is acceptable... tongue.gif)

Comparison, time scale not same... tongue.gif

here's the more accurate picture...

user posted image

The one in red is whacking the living daylights out of the blue one.................. sweat.gif



yea... but then .... you know la.... some would argue... past performance does not guarantee future performance. biggrin.gif
Barricade
post Jun 21 2022, 02:06 PM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Jun 21 2022, 02:02 PM)
laugh.gif

Neither for me... smile.gif  (I hope that choice is acceptable... tongue.gif)

Comparison, time scale not same... tongue.gif

here's the more accurate picture...

user posted image

The one in red is whacking the living daylights out of the blue one..................  sweat.gif
yea... but then .... you know la.... some would argue... past performance does not guarantee future performance.  biggrin.gif
*
I would be pissed if i invested 20 year in the blue one and the capital gain is nowhere to be seen. (No matter how high the dividend)
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:06 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 01:57 PM)
they pay good dividend in the past.
*
The issue of dividends is so overblown....

here's why.... dividends is not constant. It can go up but it can also go down.



well, there's this stock... for its fy 2019, it paid out 100 sen in dividends. Most recent fiscal year, it paid out only 40 sen.

Guess what happened to the stock?

wink.gif







bcombat
post Jun 21 2022, 02:08 PM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Jun 21 2022, 02:06 PM)
The issue of dividends is so overblown....

here's why.... dividends is not constant. It can go up but it can also go down.
well, there's this stock... for its fy 2019, it paid out 100 sen in dividends. Most recent fiscal year, it paid out only 40 sen.

Guess what happened to the stock?

wink.gif
*
last quarter earning was below expectation. Shall monitor next quarter…

user posted image
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:09 PM

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QUOTE(Barricade @ Jun 21 2022, 02:06 PM)
I would be pissed if i invested 20 year in the blue one and the capital gain is nowhere to be seen. (No matter how high the dividend)
*
Well, that's exactly the one MASSIVE issue about dividends.

They will preach that you need to be invested in the stock for many, many years....

and after holding on to the stock, for many, many, many years.... they find that it did not work out as imagined. They are either losing money (YES! it can happen or the returns is exactly peanuts - even underperforming KWSP! ( let me see if I can dig out exampleS!)

Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:10 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 02:08 PM)
last quarter earning was below expectation. Shall monitor next quarter…

user posted image
*
Don't use that site la....

DPS matters more than DY!
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:11 PM

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p/s hang on... let me dig up my longgggggggggg posting on BAT. smile.gif
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:21 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 02:08 PM)
last quarter earning was below expectation. Shall monitor next quarter…

user posted image
*
Here's this posting made on June 29th 2020.

QUOTE(Boon3 @ Jun 29 2020, 10:21 AM)
Simpan BAT posting here..... tongue.gif
Since 2015, BAT dividends totals...

user posted image

2015 -- 312.00
2016 -- 278.00
2017 -- 169.00
2018 -- 155.00
2019 -- 118.00
2020 -- 50.00 **

** BAT dividend for 2020 so far is half year. Assuming same rate of payout, we are looking at total dividend of only 100.00 **
** clearly the dividends is declining like hell! **

from 2015 to currently, BAT has paid 1082.00 in dividend (ie rm10,820.00 per 1,000 shares)

.....
Price of BAT today is 10.76.

if one purchase or invested in BAT for its dividends about 5 years ago, the price of BAT on 23rd June 2015 is 60.80.

dividends collected is 1082
price today is 10.76

which means one is looking at a holding a loss of 39.22 (60.82-10.82-10.76) !!!!!

** if one purchase on 23rd June 2015, one collected less 176.00 in dividends, since these dividends were paid before June 2015!! **
so do be careful, do not simply invest just because of dividends !!!  Dividend investing has its fair share of risk!!!!
invested ~ 60k... for dividends... now losing 39k cos the share price has collapsed!!!
*
let me do some quick update..

2020 -- 83.00 (instead of 50.00)
2021 -- 93.00
2022 -- 17.00 ** only 1 dividend so far**

So updated dividends collected is 1225.00

Price on 23rd June 2015 is 60.80.

Price today is 11.38

And the loss for the investment is _________________ !!!



rclxub.gif
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 02:29 PM

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» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


Waaa..... the Edge also follow and mentions the receivables issue...

https://pnews.theedgemarkets.com/article/te...-raise-eyebrows

hmm.gif

Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 03:14 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 02:08 PM)
last quarter earning was below expectation. Shall monitor next quarter…

user posted image
*
and Davidtcf too...

I looked again at the snapshot from that website of BAT.

For BAT, they are using 11.62 as the reference price to calculate the DY.

In actual fact, for BAT, say in 23rd June 2015, it was trading at a price of 60.80.

So to calculate the DY, which reference price is more accurate? Based on the actual trading price in 2015 or use the reference price of 11.62?

wink.gif

Using actual traded price in 2015, investors then were looking at yield of around 5% if they had invested in BAT in 2015.
But if use this 11.62 as reference price, the DY shows the incredible yield of around 24% shocking.gif


Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 03:17 PM

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.... and oh yea....

past performance does not guarantee future performance.




bcombat
post Jun 21 2022, 03:35 PM

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QUOTE(Boon3 @ Jun 21 2022, 03:14 PM)
and Davidtcf too...

I looked again at the snapshot from that website of BAT.

For BAT, they are using 11.62 as the reference price to calculate the DY.

In actual fact, for BAT, say in 23rd June 2015, it was trading at a price of 60.80.

So to calculate the DY, which reference price is more accurate? Based on the actual trading price in 2015 or use the reference price of 11.62?

wink.gif

Using actual traded price in 2015, investors then were looking at yield of around 5% if they had invested in BAT in 2015.
But if use this 11.62 as reference price, the DY shows the incredible yield of around 24%  shocking.gif
*
Ok. Think I will give it a pass.

Thanks
Boon3
post Jun 21 2022, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 03:35 PM)
Ok. Think I will give it a pass.

Thanks
*
The 'trend' of the dividends is more important than just looking at the yield.

If dividends keep declining, the stock will decline too.

if you look again at BAT...

2015 -- 312.00
2016 -- 278.00
2017 -- 169.00
2018 -- 155.00
2019 -- 118.00
2020 -- 83.00
2021 -- 93.00

clearly the stock price declined as BAT dividends decline.

so unless, there is a change in BAT fortunes (ie profit increase and their dividends increase too).......................................
SUSEurochem
post Jun 23 2022, 10:06 AM

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QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 21 2022, 01:57 PM)
they pay good dividend in the past.
*
QUOTE(Barricade @ Jun 21 2022, 01:56 PM)
I work with BAT and I won't even touch my own company shares.
*
world trending towards no smoke and no alcohol.
sin stocks, except gambling cannot even consider now
bcombat
post Jun 23 2022, 11:19 AM

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QUOTE(Eurochem @ Jun 23 2022, 10:06 AM)
world trending towards no smoke and no alcohol.
sin stocks, except gambling cannot even consider now
*
illegal cigarette in black market have take away substantial portion of their sales.
Barricade
post Jun 23 2022, 11:40 AM

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QUOTE(Eurochem @ Jun 23 2022, 10:06 AM)
world trending towards no smoke and no alcohol.
sin stocks, except gambling cannot even consider now
*
Yeah that's the idea but smoking/drinking is also an addiction. Hard to stop.
icemanfx
post Jun 23 2022, 05:25 PM

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QUOTE(Eurochem @ Jun 23 2022, 10:06 AM)
world trending towards no smoke and no alcohol.
sin stocks, except gambling cannot even consider now
*
Sin tax is a major source of tax revenue. Knowing it is impossible to eliminate, smart gomen would maximize tax revenue.

QUOTE(bcombat @ Jun 23 2022, 11:19 AM)
illegal cigarette in black market have take away substantial portion of their sales.
*
Similarly for alcohol. Excessive tax drove consumption to black market, gomen collect less tax and still burden with health care. A loss and loss scenario for gomen.


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