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 Battle of the +/- rm7k TVs, + Discussion on Sharp UE630X

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AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 11:38 AM

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been playing with the audio functions of sharp ue630x, a summary:

.. all 4 hdmi's used as inputs, hdmi1 not used as arc.
.. optical output set to bitstream.
.. optical output connected to avr as input.


.. netflix - can get dd5.1, good (with hd/4k video).
.. direct usb tv playback give good results - for both dts and dd.
.. same files playback with standalone android/media player audio pass thru- only dd is produced on avr, good; dts downgraded to lpcm, poor.

it is strange why direct tv usb playback can produce dts at optical but not when using hdmi input from another player.


anyone has an explanation?
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 11:48 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 2 2016, 11:29 AM)
Any idea if it is edge lit or back lit?
*
back lit according to this:
http://www.stuff.tv/my/news/sharp-releases...tvs-in-malaysia

should be it is not as thin as some other tv's.

AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 02:57 PM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 2 2016, 02:35 PM)
When you connect your source file via USB, what programme do you use to view the video?
*
the native app "media" on tv launcher where see netflix, manual, sharp...
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 04:23 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 03:26 PM)
TVs normally can't send out 5.1 audio when the source is through HDMI.
Only when the source is the TV itself then it can send out 5.1 audio. Also, most of the time only DD not DTS.
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1. when source is from the tv like netflix, it can send out dd5.1 from optical out.

2. when source is usb direct on tv, it can send out both dd5.1 and dts5.1 from optical out.

3. when source is hdmi input from ext device, it can send out only dd5.1 and not dts from optical out.

i am curious why 3 cannot achieve dts while 2 can for the same files playback.

i guess it is either due to hdmi input like u said or dts licensing is not complete for optical output while dd is.



so... if above is true, it means most tv's having external hdmi input can't do optical out dts to avr?

i am curious about this becos this is the first time i m playing with optical out from tv... never had the need before! biggrin.gif
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 05:18 PM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 2 2016, 04:56 PM)
If you have AVR and external device, you can connect the external device direct to the AVR, you don't need to connect to TV.
*
biggrin.gif of course.

but.. there are exceptional cases... like...

... old avr
... no hmdi input.
... 1 coaxial + 1 optical input
... 4 devices! laugh.gif

so, if TV optical output can do the job for both dd and dts, very handy. just connect all 4 devices to tv via hdmi, optical to avr, viola! tongue.gif
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 06:10 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 05:02 PM)
The Cnet article I linked earlier mentions that DTS never gets passed-through in their testing. They tested with HDMI input to the TV and optical out.

http://www.cnet.com/news/20-tvs-tested-whi...to-a-sound-bar/
*
thanks, good read.

but that's 2013, some tv's have improved! biggrin.gif

QUOTE
If you're looking for a TV that can pass a true 5.1 signal, then based on our results you'd be smart to stick to Sony, Toshiba, and Vizio models. Regardless of cost, all of the televisions from these three manufacturers that we examined were able to pass-through Dolby Digital 5.1 signals via their optical output.

well, the sharp ue630x now can do dd5.1, whether direct usb or ext device hdmi input.

QUOTE
A few things stood our from our testing. One is that DTS signals were downconverted to stereo PCM by every TV. So even in the best case scenario, TVs will downconvert surround sound to stereo for movies that only include a DTS soundtrack.

not entirely true since direct usb on my tv can do dts! laugh.gif

but i will accept it can't do dts for ext devices. smile.gif
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 06:47 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 06:41 PM)
That's the thing, TVs seem able to do DTS with the tuner, built-in apps & USB but not external HDMI.
So many years has passed and support for such basic things are still problematic and improvements seem very incremental.

This is why we need AVRs and separate boxes to get things done but the costs can add-up very quickly.  sad.gif
I was previously very happy with my setup since I can get everything connected to my AVR and do what they are supposed to do. Now, I have to use the TV apps for 4K video and simple things like ARC and DTS don't work. We are not even talking about HD audio or Atmos/DTS X. Audio support has always been dodgy and it continues to be so, just to find a box that supports HD audio pass-through is a pain as there are only a few that are able to do this and they are all buggy with some major weaknesses.
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actually, 4 of my 5 boxes can do HD audio pass thru.

the oldest one is 4 yrs old, an AC Ryan Mini.

the other 3 are himedia androids, 2.5, 2, 1.5 yrs old. the newest one can do dd atmos too. they are excellent for playback, very good for popular apps but not so good for KODI.
AVFAN
post Feb 2 2016, 07:40 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 2 2016, 07:11 PM)
AC Ryan is old already. Those Realtek/Sigma chip devices were good for playing video and audio passthrough but the software has aged and there is no more support. If you go for Android, like the newer Himedias they come with their set of issues as well and most importantly no Netflix HD. Those streaming boxes like Roku can't handle most local files and also don't do HD audio passthrough. There is no perfect solution within reasonable cost and power consumption (rules out HTPCs). Everything is a compromise and will probably continue to be so for the foreseeable future.

Just to add, just because your Himedias can passthrough HD audio you shouldn't consider it as normal. Most android boxes including the famed Minix X8 don't completely support DD TrueHD and DTS HDMA passthrough. The Himedias are the exception rather than the norm. And the Himedia's have very little global support coz most of the info available are in Chinese and it is also not complete. Check out Iboum.com and you will see what I mean. So many boxes and there are still so many shortcomings.
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Yep, I get you.

There is simply no magic box for everything and future proof.

So, we just make use of whatever we have, at lowest possible cost for maximum benefits. laugh.gif
AVFAN
post Feb 3 2016, 11:52 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 3 2016, 10:50 AM)
Btw what video format can the UE630X read? I tried BDISO 40+GB file it could not detect.
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it can read all common formats incl m2ts.

the reader/player is slow and sensitive - need to switch on/off tv, try a couple of times to get it.

as with other players, cannot expect the tv to read it like a bd player will read bluray disc with full menu, etc.

zipped iso i have not tried, but it will read the unzipped m2ts files.

and u need to find the right main m2ts file!

with optical output, dd truehd->dd, dts hdma->dts.

the video quality is good, as good as other standalone players.

but navigation for audio tracks, subs is clumsy.
AVFAN
post Feb 3 2016, 06:17 PM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 3 2016, 01:23 PM)
Aiyoo.. that's the sad part no wonder it could not detect some files. Thanks for your suggestion.
*
an alternative is to install vlc from playstore.
u can then play via es file explorer, with vlc.
es file explorer can read the usb drive better than the native player.
can also use vlc direct to play but it is not as neat as es file explorer.

es/vlc can read m2ts, mkv, etc. can play dd and dts files but optical out, both will be lpcm.

no need to try mx player - this one cannot read dts files properly.
i have not tried plex.

in summary, for just video, es/vlc is good.
if u want dd/dts, use native player.

i think i hv tested enough the usb and optical output functions of the ue630x. i will not use them much. maybe for photos on a pendrive. for usb video playback, i just use my android box which can handle all video and audio nicely. wink.gif

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Feb 3 2016, 06:21 PM
AVFAN
post Feb 3 2016, 07:40 PM

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QUOTE(jdgobio @ Feb 3 2016, 07:18 PM)
Which android box are you using now and how happy are you with it?
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himedia Q16.

good for 3d, bdmv, iso, dts hdma, dd truehd.

and dd atmos but my avr can't do. laugh.gif

Video Format : RM, FLV, MOV, AVI, MKV, TS, MP4, ISO, TP, TRP, RMVB , WMV, ASF , VOB, MPG, MPEG, DAT, SWF, 3D MVC

Video Codec : H.265, H.264, MPEG1/2/4, VC1, WMV, REALVIDEO8/9/10




i m very happy with this himedia q16 and the sharp ue630x.

what tv, box or device u using? so that we know where u r coming from.

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Feb 3 2016, 08:10 PM
AVFAN
post Feb 4 2016, 04:30 PM

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QUOTE(voncrane @ Feb 4 2016, 04:19 PM)
You r welcome.. Seems like only a decent HTPC can improve your current setup.. So you essentially answered your question..  smile.gif
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actually, i was thinking of venturing into htpc last year.

considering all the $ i already spent on the several boxes (in various locations of the house), portable hdd's.... plus the new $ required.... i decided no.

decided to spend on new 4k tv, just make full use of whatever hardware i have now with unifi30.

one cannot keep spending money trying to keep up! laugh.gif
AVFAN
post Feb 4 2016, 09:06 PM

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QUOTE(voncrane @ Feb 4 2016, 04:49 PM)
Yeah.. Keeping up is a pain... That's why I've begun saving & refused to trade up to a 4K TV just yet... IMO, an ideal setup includes a lovely 70" 4K Smart TV + regular Android OS apps support or Android TV + access to regular android apps, a custom HTPC (hardware upgradeable), a decent NAS system & router to boot. The icing on the cake being Google's 1Gbps gigabit Internet + TV service.. brows.gif
*
that will come! biggrin.gif

if one is to start from scratch, say... rm20k?

assuming home theater 4k, dd atmos capable already in place.

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Feb 4 2016, 09:07 PM
AVFAN
post Feb 8 2016, 12:41 PM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 8 2016, 10:05 AM)
At the moment I'm using 2.4.. Will try out 5.0, thanks for your suggestions.

* found the problem. I used an old 10/100 switch to add more ports and plugged in the ethernet cable from the tv to the switch, restricting it's bandwidth. Looks like that needs to be upgraded. I unplugged the cable and connected it direct to the router and voila no more stuttering.
*
what audio did you get with plex streaming wifi dtshdma files?

u are doing optical out from tv to avr, right?
AVFAN
post Feb 8 2016, 12:50 PM

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for sharp ue630x users...

been trying all kinds pf picture settings.

i finally settle for this:

.. turn on eco1.
.. standard - use default reset.
.. movie - use default reset.

tv android apps (incc netflix, iflix), android box, acryan, bd player, - use movie.

hypptv - use standard (this one is ough becos diff channels come out diff video brightness, colors, sharpness).

since a standard or movie setting applies to all hdmi inputs and can't do individual variations, so it's either std or movie. there are also game, pc, dynamic settings which are irrelevant to me.

diff eyes see diff things.... please share yr settings, i can try them! biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Feb 9 2016, 09:30 AM
AVFAN
post Feb 9 2016, 03:04 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 9 2016, 02:58 AM)
I still can get 5.1 but not dts ma, mainly due to limitation of the optical cable.
*
quite ok if dts 5.1 with optical out.

think should be same if using hdmi1/arc.

the tv hardware can't do hd audio, i would think.

AVFAN
post Feb 10 2016, 01:33 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 9 2016, 08:32 PM)
Where to find eco 1 setting?
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under settings, control.
AVFAN
post Feb 10 2016, 11:18 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 10 2016, 09:13 AM)
When I click tv setup there are 3 categories
1) picture
2) audio
3) general

But no control under these 3 settings. Could it be your options are different?
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no, not under tv setup.

on the tv launcher, go to the bottom.

settings, then control.

the same page where u access apps - the self installed apps.

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Feb 10 2016, 11:18 AM
AVFAN
post Feb 11 2016, 10:43 AM

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QUOTE(DannyOP @ Feb 11 2016, 08:00 AM)
I already have an avr which support DTS MA and truehd, the limiting factor is the TV doesn't support those formats, and I haven't seen one that does. Best way to get those support now is add an Android box which does.
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yes. some years ago, smart tv's can ony do dd, can't even give audio with dts files!

those that can now do dd and dts incl arc/optical out are quite good already. biggrin.gif

i think it is not only cost of hardware but the licensing of the codecs - all that add to costs. tv makers rightly should focus on video, not audio.


about android box that can pass thru dtshdma/dd truehd/dd atmos, jdgobio commented in a previous post that this feature is an exception rather than the norm. so, do check carefully if buying one of them.
AVFAN
post Feb 11 2016, 06:58 PM

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QUOTE(voncrane @ Feb 11 2016, 04:12 PM)
Very rarely do they bother about sound since TV speakers don't cut it anyway. I think the only way they'll all budge, is if it's made an international standard/requirement that all TVs (@ least Mid-range & above) be able to play and passthrough (HDMI) the latest codecs onto a supporting AVR/HT. That just might do it...  smile.gif
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right... from a tv mfg biz perspective, there is little incentive to incorporate more peripherals as it will cost more, customers may not like it.

sharp once had a model that incl a bluray disc player. it died very quickly. biggrin.gif

androids already in, better audio maybe possible. the android i have on my sharp 4k tv is quite good. in fact, it is better than my android box in some ways, e.g. that it is certified by neflix, can get uhd videos.

that tells me if the big corps have it their way, they will do it if the demand is such - say, if no more DVD's just BDs with hd audio and IPTVs provide mostly HD audio... TV makers will have HD audio codecs, ready to go into AVRs, expanded UI to cater to other apps. they will surely do that if they can sell the TV at a higher price/margin.

a matter of $ and cents...

This post has been edited by AVFAN: Feb 11 2016, 07:01 PM

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