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 Smart Home, Let's discuss

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Zot
post Jan 23 2018, 02:21 PM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Jan 23 2018, 12:48 PM)
Of course 6 connection la if you talk in and out.
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3 Phases in + 1 N in = 4
3 Phases out + 1 N out = 4

So, wouldn't it be 8 rclxub.gif laugh.gif

Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 11:17 AM

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QUOTE(sairay @ Jan 25 2018, 10:38 AM)
Hi All,

I find this thread very interesting. Been following awhile. A lot of technical stuff. Was wondering is there any guide on the step to change my home lighting switch to a smart/wifi enable switch?

I read here about sonoff and agara not sure which one is suitable for my application. Would be good if any sifu could guide me what to buy and how to connect it.

I would like to test out one unit first before expanding it and in future install google home mini or something.

Thanks
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Some people have no problem like just replace the wall switch with the remote one but some have problem not working as it should for perhaps unknown reason.

Anyway, most wall switch in Malaysia has no Neutral wire. So, you are restricted to switch that require no N wire, unless you plan to hack the wall and put the N wire smile.gif

I found these switch interesting also but so far have not try anything laugh.gif blush.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 11:24 AM

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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 11:20 AM)
this one needs neutral

take a look at Aqara line up - https://www.aqara.com/en/ctrl-neutral.html
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I think all US based products need N line. China products for this region don't require N line. So, stick with China brand laugh.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 12:11 PM

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QUOTE(sairay @ Jan 25 2018, 11:39 AM)
zigbee have no RF interference issue? btw, all this RF stuff can go through custom without issue cause no local approval?
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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 11:47 AM)
got interference....I found a few of my sensors are offline due to distance and metal objects in the way but the more zigbee devices you have spread around the better the reception because they work in a mesh environment (correct me if im wrong, just learned it myself)

i ordered mine from gearbest - no problems with taxes and sirim
since postage is free, i just bunch them into orders no more than RM400 each
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zigbee, z-wave, and WiFi are all share same same frequency 2.4GHz (mostly). They interfere among themselves but since they use spread spectrum technology, they still able to mitigate and find the right channel to talk to their device.

Any RF product that has not been approved will require SIRIM approval to be legally brought in. Let say company A want to bring in an RF-based product XYZ model. They need to submit to SIRIM and get it approved to legally bring in. Once the product approved, say another company want to bring in the same product, they do not need to submit for approval again since it was approved before by company A. They just need to apply for AP (import permit). The AP is given based on quantity you want to import in.

For individual buyers like us, probably they just don't bother much and probably the product might have not even been approved yet. Maybe it is because the customs don't have understanding about the product and maybe the officer just closed one eye. By right, you need to apply for import permit (AP) and if the product has not been approved by SIRIM, you need to submit the product to SIRIM to check if it is within our RF regulation. So, basically the customs officer still has the right not to let the product in.

So, if you want less trouble, just buy from local seller. They might be more expensive than direct from Alibaba laugh.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 12:17 PM

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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 11:27 AM)
not really. sonoff is china brand but needs neutral.
i think it has more to do with if it uses wifi - you would need the neutral for power
zigbee and RF all no need neutral
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Maybe it is related to how much power the device need. Without N, the current has to flow through bulb and if the current is too big, the bulb already light on before you ON the switch laugh.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 04:02 PM

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QUOTE(sairay @ Jan 25 2018, 03:52 PM)
Sharing: I think this explain quite well why need a neutral

http://www.vesternet.com/blog/2014/09/why-...ithout-neutral/
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This does not explain why Chinese smart switches do not need Neutral. I read an American based forum discussion how to get power without N line. Then I guys comment that the Chinese has done this for years now laugh.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 04:26 PM

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QUOTE(Kiding @ Jan 25 2018, 04:09 PM)
z-wave frequencies are regional, different country has it own frequency allocation, its frequency range from 865Mhz until 926Mhz, it won't interfere wifi or zigbee frequencies which use 2.4Ghz, but it might interfere GSM 900Mhz if you are not using Malaysia z-wave frequency 919.80 MHz & 921.40 MHz
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My bad blush.gif

I just remember that Z-wave is using ISM band. In the US the 900Mhz follow the international ISM band. That is why cordless phone is using this frequency. Signal interference is not a major issue I think among devices. All these are transmitting small data in burst only. Like WiFi interference, communication still work but will slow down LAN a bit.

zigbee also got some variations in frequency to accommodate local allocations.
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 04:28 PM

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QUOTE(aneip @ Jan 25 2018, 04:22 PM)
This 1 is remote.. not wall switch.
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So the switch itself is remote device and the receiver is located at the lighting point? This way no need to worry about the N wire then smile.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 05:17 PM

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QUOTE(aneip @ Jan 25 2018, 05:13 PM)
Erk.. that’s for remote device. Receiver / main switch is something like this. Replace wall switch.

[attachmentid=9543444]
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shakehead.gif

I've had enough cutting through wall to pull N wire from socket. Last time no hammer tool but now have. Now already painted so lazy sad.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 05:22 PM

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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 05:19 PM)
already said many times, no need neutral... bangwall.gif  biggrin.gif
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What you mean?

The picture showed

N L L1 L2

So, N means NO NEED? laugh.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 05:25 PM)
adoi he said "look something like this" not "this is the switch"  rclxs0.gif
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Where is that Aqara remote is mounted or used then? Cannot understand because the remote looks like wall switch hmm.gif

I see. That picture is for the WiFi one, right?

This post has been edited by Zot: Jan 25 2018, 05:31 PM
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 05:40 PM

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QUOTE(sairay @ Jan 25 2018, 05:33 PM)
lol i'm also confused  rclxub.gif . if only there is a wiring diagram to show the whole eco system then easier to see  biggrin.gif
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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 05:37 PM)
you can stick it on the wall and use it as a two way switch. for example, you put this next to your bedside like in hotels. imagine you dont need wires so just stick anywhere to control any lights (that has the aqara switch) or just use like a TV remote, free standing, use it to control the lights from your sofa
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Ok. I'm reading this first. Need to get ready to go home thumbsup.gif

https://www.lelong.com.my/xiaomi-aqara-smar...ASAAEgJje_D_BwE

Tomorrow need to move my workplace. Company is doing renovation. doh.gif
Zot
post Jan 25 2018, 08:11 PM

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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 06:37 PM)
Ok you see in your diagram the wall switch in white? That’s the retrofit for your existing wall switch. The bulbs all are your existing lights.

Okay let’s try again.

There are two versions of wall switches and two variants. One requires Neutral and one that don’t. Then there are the single and double gang variants. They look exactly alike other that the extra terminal point for Neutral. You need to ask the seller to be sure if it’s not written. Most of the sellers don’t know which is which.

Now this wall switch directly replaces your existing ones. Once you connect them to Xiaomi Gateway, you can turn them on off from anywhere in the world using your smartphone. Of course you can also turn it on or off by clicking the switch itself

Now what happens when you want to turn it on or off without a smartphone and not having to go to the switch location? Example say you are in bed. You too lazy to turn off the living room lights and your phone no battery liao. That’s where the wireless switch comes in. This wireless switch also has two variants- single and double gang. They can be set to control one of your wall switches. They can also control other Xiaomi things like vacuum robot or air purifier (I haven’t tested). You don’t need the wireless switch in order for your wall switch to work. It’s just an additional method to do the same thing

To further complicate things, there are two other wireless switches that looks like buttons. I’m sure they can work the same way too. I’m using one of these smaller buttons as my doorbell push switch
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How many devices this wireless switch can address?

I also saw zigbee word. Does this mean the gateway to smart switches is using zigbee or using IP address?
Zot
post Jan 26 2018, 03:52 PM

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QUOTE(idoblu @ Jan 25 2018, 08:24 PM)
you can use one gang to control all  switches also but one press of the switch will trigger all actions simultaneously. its up to you to set in the app
yes zigbee devices will talk to the gateway via zigbee.

watch this 4 parts video that explains it much better than I can
If it doesnt continue to part 2,3,4 go to youtube instead -

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Quick question. What is the difference between model with and without Neutral? One with N is using WiFi and one with no N is using zigbee?
Zot
post Jan 26 2018, 04:31 PM

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QUOTE(Kiding @ Jan 26 2018, 04:23 PM)
So many people confused with this aqara switch, simply put, AFAIK, it only has three versions

Aqara wireless switch -> actually it should call Aqara wireless button, it is just a remote control using zigbee wireless to control aqara zigbee switches, this switch doesn't have live/neutral wire connector.

Aqara zigbee switch (requires live and neutral wires)-> it has 1, 2 gang version

Aqara zigbee switch (requires live wires only)-> it also has 1, 2 gang version

Is there a WIFI version of aqara wireless switch? I don't think so...
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OK. I was thinking WiFi version because idoblu mentioned about zigbee doesn't need N. smile.gif
Zot
post Jan 26 2018, 10:22 PM

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QUOTE(Kiding @ Jan 26 2018, 08:30 PM)
No, I use Aqara zigbee switch with neutral line, I don't know how the AC/DC conversion circuit in the smart switch without neutral line to complete the circuit, but I heard this kind of smart switch without neutral wire is not reliable, and I had a non working broadlink TC2 switch which doesn't require neutral wire only last less than a year.
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So, you pull N wire to each switch? It is a lot of work unless new house during renovation smile.gif

I've been thinking about how this work and I think I know. The switch require very small current to work. So, when installing the switch, it is already like you switch on the light but the current is so small that the bulb flow very low current in it. However, it is so low that the bulb looks as it is OFF.

This is why the switch with no N wire have min and maximum wattage for the load to operate properly.
Zot
post Jan 27 2018, 08:19 PM

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QUOTE(luvox @ Jan 27 2018, 06:54 PM)
Ya, u get the idea d. This kina no neutral line switch wont work with small wattage lights & some LED strip. I tried it on my LED strip in L box, it flickering when turn on
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That is why for low power LED, a bypass capacitor is shorted between load.
Zot
post Feb 1 2018, 10:25 AM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Feb 1 2018, 09:45 AM)
Check my fridge, setting at Eco mode,

Idle at 10W
Compressor running - 70W

http://hitachiconsumer.com.my/products/ref...n/r-e6800m.html
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So, is there any stated power usage in manual? I cannot download manual because need to register laugh.gif

Zot
post Feb 1 2018, 10:46 AM

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QUOTE(alexander3133 @ Feb 1 2018, 10:40 AM)
Nothing stated about power consumption in the user manual
Zot
post Feb 1 2018, 11:32 AM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Feb 1 2018, 11:21 AM)
I think the manual didn't write the usage.

Here. Or you can go to  [Home Appliances] Refrigerator side. I got do review.

user posted image

Now I notice that the fridge serial 000060. 1st production of 60unit that I brought.  dry.gif
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So not many people buy laugh.gif

Perhaps the export unit SN. I guess all the vacuum type unit is made in Japan.

So, I would assume the 192W when just compressor kick in base on 0.8A rated current?

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