both. bugima

both. bugima

we r Malaysian~

in Malaysia, bugis is considered Malay.

Najib is bugis.

Bukit Mertajam MP Khairy Khir Johari is also a Malay.
Obviously u do not read/understand Malaysia constitution.

in malaysia, islam is malayla. bugis ke tak bugis takde apa punya. worst is those non-muzzies that marry muzzy women then somehow their kids become bumiputra

kpop

kuda ping :3

in malaysia, islam is malayla. bugis ke tak bugis takde apa punya. worst is those non-muzzies that marry muzzy women then somehow their kids become bumiputra

both. bugima

let me clear it up alittle bit more, bugis is one of the people considered malay among others.

the second statement is abit inaccurate, some muslims in malaysia are not bumiputeras, like muslim-indians (mamak)  and sabah sarawak got non muslim bumiputras.

This is all very confusing if you live in Indonesia and are used to how Indonesians identify ethnic groups.

In Indonesia you would say that Malaysian Prime Minister Najib is  a  a orang Bugis.   At no time would the Indonesians say that he is a orang Melayu or even orang keturunan Melayu because his ancestors hail from Sulawesi, not Riau or a small part of Kalimantan that is home to orang Melayu in Indonesia.

Yet in Malaysia, Najib is head of the United Malays National Organization, or Umno, that is the main coalition partner in Malaysia. The organization champions Malay rights and such interesting concepts such as ketuanan Melayu (Malay superiority).

So please help me out: Is Najib a Bugis or a Malay? Or a Gowan (if such a word exists and its not Scottish for a yellowish flower).

Bugis is one of many Malay sub-ethnic

Meles, Bugis, Mamak, Batak semua serumpun

Bugis ppl don't consider themselves Malays, but strangely enough all Malays insist on considering Bugis as part of the Malay race.

the irony when original bugis/jawa did not claim themselves as malay....

Bugis ppl don't consider themselves Malays, but strangely enough all Malays insist on considering Bugis as part of the Malay race.

Only Malay in Malaysia that consider Bugis as Malay or Malay in Indonesia also consider Bugis as part of Malay race?

International academics. Bugis like Perakian, Kelantanese, etc just a subgroup.

Unless you are talking about NEP/3M Malay. That is local.

Bugis is one of many Malay sub-ethnic

Only in Malaysia bugis is sub etnic..in realiti Kat Indonesia there is malay race...which differ from sunda,jawa,acheh,bugis,banjar,minang

International? You sure? Is there such thing as sub ethnic in Indonesia? In Indonesia, Malay is also a sub ethnic like Javanese,Sundanese,Balinese and Minangkabau right?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_Indonesia

Or are you telling me Malay is a sub ethnic to Malay? Tak masuk akal ni.

Only in Malaysia bugis is sub etnic..in realiti Kat Indonesia there is malay race...which differ from sunda,jawa,acheh,bugis,banjar,minang

Malay in Indonesia refers to those from Semenanjung? I don't think they care if you are Perakian, Kelantanese, or Kedahan etc.

That's what I thought as well when I look at list of Indonesian ethnic group in wiki.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_groups_in_Indonesia

Malay is ethnic group as much as Bugis. No such thing as sub ethnic group in Indonesia it seems. Unless you are telling me Malay in Indonesia is sub ethnic group to Malay which doesn't make any sense.

Malay in Indonesia refers to those from Semenanjung? I don't think they care if you are Perakian, Kelantanese, or Kedahan etc.

The real bumi. Jangan persoal.

bugis and malay is the same shit no?
just like cantone and hokkien, both are cina

No, I think they mean Malay in Indonesia. Or are you telling me Malay in Indonesia =/= Malay in Malaysia?

Is there such thing as sub ethnic group in Indonesia in the first place?

Sub ethic group in inodnesia all got their own language..bugis language,jawa,banjar and malay language...

Cantonese and Hokkien are language classification, not ethnic. Both Cantonese and Hokkien are ethnic Han.

Cantonese and Hokkien are language classification, not ethnic. Both Cantonese and Hokkien are ethnic Han.

No such thing as Cantonese ethnic group.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ethnic_groups_in_China

For this I believe we can call as Polynesian group...

lets say before the qin unification, i believe we were separated.

No, I think they mean Malay in Indonesia. Or are you telling me Malay in Indonesia =/= Malay in Malaysia?

Is there such thing as sub ethnic group in Indonesia in the first place?

Most likely different definitions.

Things can be classified. Just that different people might classify it differently.

Indonesians did believe in Pan-Malay (or whatever it is called) Nusantara. At least during pre-Merdeka and Konfrontasi era.

Malay race, a racial category used in the late 19th and early 20th century to describe Austronesian peoples
Ethnic Malays, the ethnic group located primarily in the Malay peninsula, and parts of Sumatra and Borneo

Screw history. Let just talk about modern day definition. If we talk about history all human is from Africa.

What is this Pan Malay Nusantara? Is it a supra ethnic or sub ethnic?

I notice Malay can mean Malay race and Malay ethnic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malay

Wikipedia here correct or not?

Is this Pan-Malay a supra ethnic/large group similar concept to Polynesian group as mention by gm_18300.

Pan-Malay Nusantara,Malay race and Malay ethnic, these three things same concept or not?

Is it same like Italian, British, French and German subgroup of European race?

Malay race =  Malay sub ethnic, Bugis sub ethnic, Javanese sub ethnic, Balinese ethnic sub

European race =  Italian sub ethnic, British sub ethnic, French sub ethnic, German sub ethnic

Mongoloid race =  Han sub ethnic, Japanese sub ethnic, Korean sub ethnic, Mongolian sub ethnic, Manchu sub ethnic

Do I get it correct?

^ mah point exactly, i agree to this.

The concept of a Malay race was originally proposed by the German scientist Johann Friedrich Blumenbach (1752–1840), and classified as the brown race.[1]

In his 1775 doctoral dissertation titled De generis humani varietate nativa (On the Natural Varieties of Mankind), Blumenbach outlined four main human races by skin color, namely Caucasian (white), Negroid (black), Native American (red), and Mongolian (yellow).

By 1795, Blumenbach added another race called 'Malay' which he considered a subcategory of both the Ethiopian and Mongoloid races. The Malay race belonged to those of a "brown color: from olive and a clear mahogany to the darkest clove or chestnut brown." Blumenbach expanded the term "Malay" to include the native inhabitants of the Marianas, the Philippines, the Malukus, Sundas, Indochina, as well as Pacific Islands like the Tahitians. He considered a Tahitian skull he had received to be the missing link; showing the transition between the "primary" race, the Caucasians, and the "degenerate" race, the Negroids.

Blumenbach writes:

Malay variety. Tawny-coloured; hair black, soft, curly, thick and plentiful; head moderately narrowed; forehead slightly swelling; nose full, rather wide, as it were diffuse, end thick; mouth large, upper jaw somewhat prominent with parts of the face when seen in profile, sufficiently prominent and distinct from each other. This last variety includes the islanders of the Pacific Ocean, together with the inhabitants of the Mariannas, the Philippine, the Molucca and the Sunda Islands, and of the Malayan peninsula. I wish to call it the Malay, because the majority of the men of this variety, especially those who inhabit the Indian islands close to the Malacca peninsula, as well as the Sandwich, the Society, and the Friendly Islanders, and also the Malambi of Madagascar down to the inhabitants of Easter Island, use the Malay idiom.[9]

both. bugima

both. bugima

both. bugima

both. bugima

both. bugima

What is this Pan Malay Nusantara? Is it a supra ethnic or sub ethnic?

I notice Malay can mean Malay race and Malay ethnic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malay

Wikipedia here correct or not?

Is this Pan-Malay a supra ethnic/large group similar concept to Polynesian group as mention by gm_18300.

Pan-Malay Nusantara,Malay race and Malay ethnic, these three things same concept or not?

Is it same like Italian, British, French and German subgroup of European race?

Malay race =  Malay sub ethnic, Bugis sub ethnic, Javanese sub ethnic, Balinese ethnic sub

European race =  Italian sub ethnic, British sub ethnic, French sub ethnic, German sub ethnic

Mongoloid race =  Han sub ethnic, Japanese sub ethnic, Korean sub ethnic, Mongolian sub ethnic, Manchu sub ethnic

Do I get it correct?

I'm not sure I have been using race and ethnic correctly. Hmm...

Another definition (only for Malaysia) is Malay as defined in the constitution. Eg. Malays (as race or ethnic) can be Christians, Hindus, etc. but in Malaysia Malays (by law/in constitution) is a Muslim.

As for Brits... Please read the link.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/1288231.stm

I think Malay is more like Han. Malay have Bugis, Jawanese, etc. while Han have Cantonese, Hokkien, etc.

In Malaysia, the early colonial censuses listed separate ethnic groups, such as "Malays, Boyanese, Achinese, Javanese, Bugis, Manilamen (Filipino) and Siamese". The 1891 census merged these ethnic groups into the three racial categories used in modern Malaysia—Chinese, ‘Tamils and other natives of India’, and ‘Malays and other Natives of the Archipelago’. This was based upon the European view at the time that race was a biologically based scientific category. For the 1901 census, the government advised the word "race" should replace "nationality" wherever it occurs.[10]

After a period of generations of being classified in these groups, individual identities formed around the concept of bangsa Melayu (Malay race). For younger generations of people, they saw it as providing unity and solidarity against colonial powers, and non-Malay immigrants. The Malaysian nation was later formed with the bangsa Melayu having the central and defining position within the country.[10]

One thing I found interesting about this Malay race is that this term/concept is originally proposed by German scientist Johann Friedrich Blumenbach.

Aren't we all from 1?

But Cantonese and Hokkien are not even ethnic/race concept you know. They are just language classification.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malay_race#Malaysian_context

Does this help us in understanding the Malay race and ethnic? Does  Boyanese, Achinese, Javanese, Bugis, Manilamen (Filipino) and Siamese got assimilated into Malay or what? Or are they under 'other Natives of Archipelago' category?

Simple answer. Depends on how you define race/ehtnic. Can be political/cultural/genetic.

Cantonese Hokkien etc have different culture.

for 'malay'...they call anyone from malaysia and indonesia even bangla and arab as malay...

That's why they can't differentiate chinese malaysian with chinese prc Chinese hk and taiwan etc....

Inb4 mana indian again?

Cantonese and Hokkien have different culture? Really? Even in China, there's no Cantonese and Hokkien ethnicity you know.

Bugis is a sub ethic in Malay race.

I think someone need to be educate about the Malay race.

Malay race not only in Malaysia and we need to open our mind into more horizon.

Dont limit yourself and and "pemikiran" that when the term Malay used first thing in your mind are Melayu in Malaysia.

Malay race is a big race. and Melayu in Malaysia is a sub ethnic of Malay.
Pinoy also considered themselves as Malay and they proud of "brown race" blood in them. Manny "Pacman" Pacquiao the world boxer look really like the Malay and very strong fighting (dominant strong blood).

http://thediplomat.com/2013/02/are-filipinos-malays/

If asked about their race, most Filipinos would identify as being Malay. Filipinos are taught in schools to be proud of their Malay heritage and encouraged to strengthen their ties with other Malays in Southeast Asia.

But Filipinos wishing to migrate in Singapore have to deny this fundamental identification because the Singapore government rejects the classification of Filipinos as Malay. But if Filipinos are not Malay, what ethnicity are they? Officially, Singapore recognizes immigrants from the neighboring Philippines as part of the racial category referred to as “Other.”.