I had been offered with several position of engineer posts, however, their starting paid are slightly lower then my expectation rate, One is in Melaka, starting paid is RM2k, another in Johor also Rm2k, and the third one is slightly higher, located at johor also, for RM2.2k.

However for these three company, 6 month probation period then onli will increase salary (10%), meanwhile, during the probation period, cant enjoy any allowance claim, OT can, but from the range of RM5/hr - RM40/4hr.

Here are my questions, because during talking with HR ppls, they keep emphasizing that the salry rate they offered is quite high since I am a fresh graduate, and they even said that some fresh graduate only able to get RM1.8k for their starting paid, so I should be grateful that i got RM2k for starting. I was wondering since I had done sum research and found out that for fresh grad (2nd upper), normally salary range should be RM2.2k - RM2.5k, did "market price" change so fast ?

And may i know is it every company got their own policy on salary for fresh graduate ? cos when i try to negotiate with them regard the salary (since if i work there, i need to rent house,extra misc fee will included), they keep mentioned that is their company policy. I remember clearly that i stated my salary is more then they offered, if got company policy, then y they still call me ? try to ask for discount from me ?

Now i was in chaos on whether should I accept those offer or not, cos the job that i most interested on (penang,kl) still havnt go through the interview, I afraid that once i went through the interview, if they dun wan hire me, end up that either place (KL,JB,melaka,penang) cant find job at all. If want to postponed to accept their offer, should I tell them that i need to think abt it until end of month ? cos they keep urge me to make decision, stated that they need manpower and want me to give response in at least one week time.

Is it I demand for too much or are they trying to cheat us fresh graduate, since we dunno the actual market trend ?

Well nowadays the starting salary is not that good for fresh grad but like what you say if you don't take this offer and did not get the next offer you will be jobless at that time

yeah... u should be grateful to get first time job of salary 2k...
mine about 4 years agor was only 1.55k...
i'm engineering basic also and not complaining...
just think of other that jobless rite now...

wat lar u.. u dun say which field u r in... or mayb i miss it?

If you can get a better offer elsewhere, go ahead... what's stopping you? You don't need to take an offer that you don't like.

May I know what research you have done to find out the market rate for second upper class graduate? If you asked around, you would find out that different companies will have different policy and different pay scale. It is up to the individual company to decide how much they want to give you.

And how come you have so many offers at hand when you have not attended some of the interviews yet? Personally, I think it is decent enough for a fresh grad, but you are most welcome to wait for other offers (or risk being jobless and losing RM 2k X number of months jobless + no gurantee the offer you may get will be how good) if you are not happy with what you are offered

that y i need to ask that whether it is a trend that the starting paid is in this range, if yes, then i will put them in my consideration list, else I will straight away kick them out from my list, cos from my point of view, if a company that unwilling to treasure the worker, unwilling to pay the reasonable amount for hiring talented person to help them earn money, i doubt that there will have more oppurtunity for me in that company.

4yr ago, living expense are still not as higher as nowadays, if want to compare like your way of thinking, then I should be grateful to accept a job at RM1k, becos this salry is "damn high" during my dad times .

what companies offer you a job already? i know in penang, engineers can get more than that...

If you considering Electronic Engineer then Penang is the best place. Alot of MNC Electronics company here and pay is quite attractive. Range about 2.4k-2.8k. Some of them even give relocation fees... help you settle down.

Emm, most application that i applied are mostly toward testing, validation ,design and R & D, and I am from pure electronic background, not EE.

research that i had done ? Internet, forum, fren, uni-mates, lecturer, job agency, is it enough ? did i miss out any other source ?

Emm, ok, i had applied most of these job in one month ago, and recently most of them had schedule interviews for me, i had attend sum of the interview before(JB,melaka), and the next few one is schedule on next week (Penang,KL), cos I didn't expect they are eagerly want to confirm with me in such a short time,

The price offered depends on the location, experience and job responsibility.
You are offered 2.2k, which I think it's good (you don't expect to save much a month for a start), you may start from there.

Second class upper: 2.5 to 2.6k

First class: 2.8k to 2.9k

Intel pays RM 500 for permanent and RM 3000 for GT as relocation benefit.

Privacy issues, cant disclosed more about the info.

This is what I plan initially, however, since my relative are located mostly in melaka, johor, my parents keep urge me to go for there since they will be more relieved their worries. However, after knowing that those company offer, i was start to think go Penang and try luck.

If you are applying from online source/agent, your price MIGHT be marked down a little.

2.5k is the average for MNC in Penang.

And you think you're a talented person?

... (the emoticon is for you BTW)

Sure GT gets 3k relo?

what is GT btw?

I'm sure he is or he wouldn't have so many offers, rite?

Anyway, "market rate" is not quite the same between various parts of Malaysia. To some parts, 2k is low whereas other parts it may be high. IMO, 2k is probably considered to be good in KL for a fresh graduate but considered not good when compared to Penang.

So if your preference is purely pay and nothing else, you should probably move to Penang. Since there are several potential interviews, I'm pretty sure that talented people such as yourself will definitely breeze through it and it is probably not a very bad idea to turn down the offers that you have now. I doubt the companies offering you 2k will give you 2.5-3k even if you try to negotiate with them.

it's good to hear that you have been offered with jobs to choose. i shld said: "congrat!" but ur attitude seam to worry me (more if i were ur employer to be)

yes most company (especailly mnc) will have thier policy on salary offer. of course, in ur (and most fresh grad) case, urs will be at lower end of range, and it's mostly the entry level/grade.

u would also wanted to consider the job nature, what it's job desc, and more, not only the salary. ur targeted field like testing is quite common nowaday in penang (coz lots of mnc hav it). but there is 2 majority. one direct support on manufacturing, one is on development. both will have thier own benefit if u r in. validation ,design and R & D (R&D term is actually a bit too wide to be defined) will be straight forward, but will mostly limit ur future advancement.

One bird in hand is better then 2 birds in bush, enough said.

Young people should seek for experience, once you got your quality and experience, then only you climb higher.

RM2k? I think it is reasonable enough, but it is up to you to decide. 10% increment or not i think it is mostly based on your supervisor appraiser letter, if you boss think you are good, you will get more then 10%.

It can be considered 3 birds in hand coz he is talented. Talented people will never have trouble finding jobs and don't need to comply with market rates. My company for example, want to find talented people also so difficult

Hey dude,

3 years ago, I used to have a RM3 dinner. Today, I am having the same RM3 dinner. 3 years ago, I am driving a Kenari. Today, the same Kenari cost the same. 3 years ago, I am paying RM150 monthly for insurance. Today, I am paying the same.

So whats the difference?? RM2K for a fresh grad is quite a lot, because you dont have any experience at all. Try to work for at least 6 months, before you go into salary negotiation.

Dun you know anything about the inflation? back to y2k, one magie mee cost u 35cents or 40cents, today it costs u bout 50 or 55 cents, that time 1 teh ice was rm0.80, now? RM1 consider cheap or pay for RM1.20 for it.. how much do you pay for a movie treat tat time? RM6-7? or make it 8... now? RM9 even is on weekday n expecting RM10 for weekend show... whats more.... petrol? how much u pay for it during y2k? RM1.33/litre? how bout now? its dam RM1.92/litre tat sucking my blood off.. dun u see the economic crisis here?? n now u tell me wats the difference??
u say u still paying RM3 for the same dinner, oh yea.. i'm paying same RM1.50 for a stick of 4pcs taiwanese sausage at "lok lok" stall, n now i still pay for RM1.50.. guess wat?? Now they made it into 3 1/2 pcs per stick!! Think about it...
no offense, but to remind u the facts..

back to topic, RM2k is consider good to start wif, if u're live in Johor n not worry of paying rental, utilities n so on, this is consider a good one.. y not?
as said earlier by them, work for at least 6 months before u demand for more..
cheers~

I think i help u guys with this statistic.....

A real statistic but i need to remind all, it is still a guidance not use as reality benchmark....

hope this will help..mostly IT and engineering salary...


Attached File(s)
 kellysalaryguidemy.pdf ( 316.96k ) Number of downloads: 94

My friends are GTs at Intel.

Graduate Trainee.

My point exactly.

R & D is probably one of the most misused acronyms in this country.

Been there, done that. I got RM300 only.

When you joined as GT?

A long long time ago...
I did hear that the relo pkg was increased but dont think that much.

without handful and useful exp, u r way far from "talented" in worklife. u cld be talented in some way back in uni time, but study and work is totally a diff things. oh man... what happen to nowaday's fresh grad...? yeah, probably u r 1 of special n most talented fresh grad out there. but with odd kind of attitude, ur talent will not be fully appreciated... think!


GT has limited benefit compare to regular employee, and more, they have a 1 year contract!! after that, the supervisor will decide to convert it to regular or kick.

hahaha... industrial trainee is diff from graduate trainee!! anyway, how many years back u got that 300 bucks?

This post has been edited by WhatCanIdo: Aug 8 2006, 03:20 PM

How true.

I'm guessing you and me work in the same company (hello to you then). It was 2 years back. Just before the mad hiring craze.

Yeap ... that's why Intel is compensating in term of relocation benefits for non-adjacents states. RM500 vs RM 3000. See the difference.

Damn. Should have joined later... got only RM300 from non-adjacent state.

hahaha... but u must take it as GT, and prepare to be kicked out 1 year later (bcoz u only care about that 3k)... just kidding!!! they r not that cruel, i think

wow!! if u dig deeper to get more info, u will find out what u have miss in the 1 year life as a GT compare to that 2.5k diff.

anyway, that is not my point. do think on what u wanna get for urself in long term other then monetary. worklife exp is more useful then the number when u advance further. and dont get me wrong on the GT, nothing really bad to be a GT. in fact, it could be a stepping stone to advance.

If you do not have any others offer, I suggest you to take the job. Later you may find another which satisfied you. Meanwhile, take this few months to learn more things. This should be the proper way to plan out you career instead of thinking to get better pay.

> 2k is quite good actually for fresh grads..if its an internation company, you might get > 2.5k...for small or medium size company, usually they'll pay you only about 1.8 k...

too bad Intel now in midst of layoff. i hear there's only one engineering job still available. can't remember what it was...

back when i started out, i also think 2k gud enough. now, i know that many companies still looking for grads and starting pay is quite high (penang especially). i started with 2.5k but so far, i know other companies pay higher. also, i think it's better to work in MNC as starter coz got more chance for growth and more options available to you both now and in the future.

is quite a big surprise that my thread got so many reply in such a short time. First to all, I should apologies to those that think that my altitude got problem on search job (i assume that ppls think that I'm arrogant and picky on job, money minded, rite ?).Is my bad that I didn't stated clear about the scenario and the job offered.

1st case, The melaka company (company M), I got a fren's fren (called it Mr. A) work in there, Mr. A also a fresh graduate, however, he had work in another company for 2 month then only join the company M, and they offered him a salary of RM2.4k with OT allowance of RM50/3hr. The position he work is non-related to technical (related to project management,process,dealing with customer,etc). However for the position that I being offered is 80% technical (as told from the interviewer), but the salary I being offered are merely RM2k. So for sure, not matter how your own mentality are, once you know that there got another ppl in similar situation with you, however the salary being offered are different, what will you think about it ?

2nd case, come to another case of RM2k in johor, that company is offered me as a test Engineer, that one no any allowance can be claim except for OT, however the rate is RM5/hr. And the job scope seem scary, cos it will giving me an individual project to go on, I need to be on my own and settle everything by myself, no asistance will be given, and the project scope seem impossible for a freshbie to handle (cant disclose much, cos ppls will be easy to guess on which company is it), so in my mind, i was thinking, giving me a freshbie on such a big project, either they are trust on my skill on handling, or they are trying to squeeze as mush as possible for me, use me as a slave untill i exhaust --> project succes = they earn it, cos hiring a cheap labour for hard task ; project fail = they didn't lost at all, cos the $$$ they paid is cheap, can easily get another one to continue it. Ppl might think that, since a project being given to you ,you should be grateful on it, you can learn a lot, y you still picky on it ? the problem now is the altitude of the manager, keep emphasize on I need to be alone on dealing with all the problem no asist will be given, if you were me, don't you feel sumthing fishy ?

3rd case, the 2.2k post in johor, ok, this one so far i can said that is qutie reasonable, R & D Engineer, no allowance except OT (RM25/3hr). But problem is the job scope, even is R & D, but I need to handling 50% technical and 50% for non technical, such as deal with customer, operator, production line, testing,blablabla, (i cant remember all), initially I was shocked on the job scope, however they explained to me that it for my own benefit, cos i can learn more, one thing i remember clearly is that they said: "without those exp, wat if u develop sth that cant be put into production line to be manufacture, then it will be a problem to you", emm, sound reasonable to me. However after seeking advice from my lecturer, he told me that I shouldn't divide my attention on so many aspect, if want to go into R & D, I should emphasize on it, to gain deeper knowledge on certain technology. Tats y I also headache.

However thanks for your guys advice, now I'm preparing for my next week interview, hopefully I won't mess up with it, and thanks for your guys reminder, i should looking more toward career prospect. However in my mind, i still believe there are sum company are trying to squeezing us freshbie on salary, esp that statement they make: "nowadays RM2k considered high, sum ppls even get RM1.8k". I believe there are ppls getting 1.8k, however there should be other allowance to be claim for their benefit. I believe as a fresh graduate in engineering field , as long as we know what we had learn in the past, and our mentality and personlity should be in the right way,then shouldnt be a problem for us to find job, don't you all think so ?

RM 2k is still considered OK. If less than that, then it might be not sufficient.

RM2K is minimum for fresh grad and for survival.
RM1.8K is very low ... possible that company will be closed down in 6 months or so. Unless you are still depending on family ... RM1.8K per month ... sigh possible you have to dig up money from your bank account to cover your monthly expenses.

good to hear u r not everything $$$ person.

i could only partly agreed on ur 3 scenarios/cases. hahaha... the 2nd case sound familiar!! hav ur lecturer been worked in a factory or design a product that could sell to market?? if not, then he/she probably dont really understand how important manufacturing tech? a basic understanding of that is always good. btw, did they say wanted to offer the job to u already? or they just ask if you can accept the salary offered? remember, it's not done deal until u get the letter. that's people called "art of interviewing"

yup, right mentality and personality plus ur technical talent, u will build up ur value quicker then average. but be minded, engineering graduate not a guarantee of getting a job. competition is always tough

good luck to ur interview in pg.

oh ya... to add: 1.8k is really low nowadays for an average engineering background freshie folks. maybe u r too screw up with the interview and the company still offer u but with that low salary. still... engineering doesn't guarantee u a job!

This post has been edited by WhatCanIdo: Aug 8 2006, 08:35 PM

Well said!

However I'm not sure people will agree with me on the following:

1. You don't necessarily apply what you learn in uni despite the excellent grades.
2. One of the important criteria to ask as a freshie is what you can learn (to decorate your resume), and not so much on squeezing employer for a few hundred bucks.
3. Yes, there shouldn't be a problem to find job. However, some people may not be as fortunate as you.

Speaking from a former employer point of view, I usually start negotiating with other candidates once a fresh grad starts playing hardball with salary. To me, there are plenty of fresh grad that may take up the offer and if there's nothing special with the candidate that is playing hardball, I'll usually move on to the next person.

Sometimes salary is not only the thing to look at. It's easier for salary to go up then to change a policy regarding other benefits. Sometimes the company that give you RM 200 less, gives RM 400 for vision benefits, or RM 500 for dental yearly (and may be extended to your family) so I guess you must look at the overall package.

depends on your luck oso..some fresh grad cant find job, some can find 3k salary job..
for fresh grad, better find a small or medium size company to start, gain more experience first, then u jump to big company, u will get more..

I am sorry to say that... but I spend exactly RM2k a month, living a comfortable life, which includes paying loan for a Kenari, life insurance, rent a room, Streamyx + phone, handphone, food, etc... and I am staying in Petaling Jaya.

So... who said RM1.8k is not sufficient? Unless you going out for supper every nite, ciggy + booze, clubbing every weekend, change handphone every couple months, every weekend go for Japanese buffet, movie every week, drive a Honda Civic, etc...

i think your lecturer is quite right. and it depends on whether you want to branch out or not. MNC usually lets you specialize in your given job whereas smaller companies might need you to work in other areas as well (not enough headcount to cover). But one thing I do know, if you start at smaller company, it's nearly impossible to make the jump to MNC but it's easier the other way round.

No prob. Guess you're not a snob after all.

Some ppl believe that handling people/ability to communicate is the most difficult job in the world, that's why PR folks can get quite a good pay.

I actually think it's good that you get 50:50 coverage on both the technical and non-technical aspects. Dealing with the production line and operators will give you a feel of how things work on the grassroots level.

One thing about lecturers dispensing advice is that many of them have never worked outside the academic circle so they might not have the 'real world' experience to actually give usable advice. But this is just my point-of-view, as almost all my lecturers went straight to teach after grad.

This post has been edited by cks2k2: Aug 9 2006, 07:46 AM

Your car doesn't need maintenance? You do not need to fill up petrol for your car? Parking is free everywhere? No entertainment at all? No need to pay for EPF? No need to pay electricity bill? How about emergency funds? You do not need to buy groceries (toothpaste, shampoo, magazine, etc)? ...

You said you spent exactly 2K ... that means salary = RM 2K (before EPF and SOCSO) is not enough ... my statement is correct.

My senior is earning more than RM5K, and he is not having a car. We actually did some calculation, and find out that if you manage to take taxi, it is actually much cheaper than owning a car, although it might not be convenient.

My RM2K is all inclusive, meaning I dun need financial help from others. If you are not paying any car loan, and driving ur mama's car, then you can deduct about RM500 out of it.

And to all the freshie out there, just remember... You cannot demand a comfortable life when u just start working. That is the truth. You need time to build up ur experience, reputation, before your company is willing to pay you good. You have nothing but just a certificate. Mind you, a first class student will worth nothing if what he does is only reading from books.

Like the old Cantonese saying, "Everything will be difficult at the beginning". If you are given a good start, then u will not appreciate what you have, and you will always demand for more and more.

is RM200 such a big difference? After deduction it'd be RM178x and 16xx, so it's about 100+ difference. Maybe cut down on some other form of luxuries can.

Thx for your guys reply, appreciated the feedback from those ppls with work exp, it act as a reminder to us - fresh graduate.

Sum ppls might think abt, y we fresh graduate so chosy abt the RM200+ difference,since we are fresh graduate , which mean we dun have any saving in the past (unless ur parents dun mind to sponsor you a bit when starting, or you got work part time in the past before), and summore, sum of us are bond with the PTPTN Loan/bank loan. Plus like other expense that other forumer had mentioned, this is also need to be take into consideration also.

And one things for sure, if i stay back in my home (let said found job in KL), even 1.8k also ok for me as long as the job scope can learn the thing i want, cos stay with family member together is different then rent house outside, there will be sum hidden cost can be exempted.

maybe different ppls got their own way to spent money, however for my case, for 2k+work in outstation(without any allowance such as accomodation provided, subsidies) is hard for me to survive. However my dad had mentioned that even get paid for RM800 for trainee, he also dun mind to continue sponsor me to work there initially, as long as the job is what i want, and can learn thing. However this is the last resort that i will go for it, cos to me, after graduated, I won't allowed me to take any financial asistance from my family anymore, i will feel guilty abt it, cos by right, I should be the one who give them money, not the other way round.

ok, back to the topic, from the experience that i deal with those interviewer, i got the kind of feeling that they are trying to exploit on us (certain company i mean, not all), ok, i understand that we fresh graduate, we cant demand more, but shouldnt that we can enjoy other allowance which same with other ppls? with a 2k basic and no other allowance/subsisdies and work for half yr probation period then onli increase 10%, imagine after one yr, how mush can we get ? RM2.4k ? RM2.6k ?

ok, maybe from their point of view, they just wan cheap labour, cos once after one yr, those "freshbie" with one yr exp with jump to other company, so they will re-hiring again for freshbie, then re-exploit again, they dun appreciate those ppls, cos they want is a senior operator that can help do those miscellaneous job. Doesnt mean that work in those small MNC cant learn things, is just that the manager mentality make me afraid of being used by them as a slave, i dun want end up mumbling for everyday work.

and another is the transparencies, while interviewed, I had fill in the expected salary, and they had look at it already, while if they got their own company policy, they should said it initially, instead of try to "bargain" when offer me the job. Maybe ppls will said that the salary they offered are based on my interview performance, then I would said, my performance are not so worst yet, cos most of the interivewer had tested my personality and technical thing, and so far, most question are still in my scope of knowledge. Maybe problem is my personality, maybe they boh song me? if yes, then y still wan hire me ?

However, now i had put those offer in the last on my list, I will now preparing more toward the interview in KL/penang, and hope that can get a job that i wanted soon. And also, those fresh graduate who searching for job currently, don't be panic, be patient, as long as you be yourself and prepard for the interview, it shouldnt be a problem for us to find job.

I hope that won't kena bashed by other forumer, i just express out wat had in my mind, if I'm wrong, kindly point out my fault.

I had asked about other allowance/benefit that i can have, however, they stated, all these benefit/allowance onli can be claim once we pass the probation period. meanwhile during probation, we cant claim anything, and OT rate is lower then a permanet stuff.

I had explained clearly my difficulties and abt the salary that i stated initially for the job, becos i need to rent house outside, extra expense will be needed, unless accomodation provided by company. and i had told them clearly that i need to pay for my PTPTN loan monthly. Is not that i greedy on asking more on it, I just ask for RM2.2k-RM2.4k range, end up offered me RM2k. If company policy then tell me clearly, instead of asking me to spent my time/money to go from selangor to johor for interview.

However It is a nice trip to johor, as i learn a lot during those interview, is worth for the trip. Is just that i feel very boh song, after 4 yr studies, all the hardwork and effort, end up getting this kind of reply, ok, fresh graduate, no exp, so give u low salary no matter who you are. Using current unemployed fresh graduate issues as excuse, come on, in that categories, how many percentage is engineering sector ?Maybe is my luck ... nvm, i still can going on trying, i dun believe I cant find a suitable company with a reasonable salary.
My lecturer previously worked in a reputable MNC I****, and based on what he told me that, the choice i got is like double edge sword, it "might" help me or limit me in future, tat y he want me to consider clearly abt it.