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 DIY (smart, energy efficient) house building, another house from scratch. DIY style.

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TSpaskal
post Aug 2 2014, 09:23 PM

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wife provides the architectural insight, and i provide the engineering standpoint.
i can understand why architect and engineer fight all the time.

been designing things and building them for a few years now, made that much easier with the advent of sketchup.
it's much easier to use compared to autocad (for 3d design/editing in 3d space), much faster result, less hassle, while retaining much of the precision that you get from a cad software.

some of my past projects designed and fully built with the help of sketchup:
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

all built with less than 1mm error. the precision is there, provided you could accurately follow the design.
project is documented over in lowyat's home entertainment section and hifi4sale's DIY section.

i freakin love sketchup. because i freckin hate autocad. laugh.gif
TSpaskal
post Aug 2 2014, 09:37 PM

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QUOTE(wow1wow2 @ Jul 20 2014, 01:46 AM)
what is the location of this land
*
somewhere in kedah, near the perlis border.
not revealing the exact location.

QUOTE(y00ng @ Jul 21 2014, 04:49 PM)
Hi,
I have a plan for you. You can have a design of a container to transform into a house. You may look according, to the picture inline.

For more details, you can message me or call me. My number is 016-3272143
*
thanks for the offer. i (we) already have a plan that we're comfortable with.

QUOTE(makunouchi @ Jul 21 2014, 05:19 PM)
Hi, ive been reading your thread.
Very impressive project smile.gif

Im very much interested once you ve designed your LED downlights with
Acceptable efficiency..

I recently furnished a studio with individual oem leds units, no idea on the bill yet tongue.gif
*
i've order individual smd chips supposedly from epistar. well the seller says it's from epistar, can't confirm even he's lying.
0.5w chips, from 3 different sellers. 100 pieces each. testing purposes laugh.gif

hopefully i could hit the targeted 100w power usage for overnight lighting.
in no way possible with off the shelf solution.
TSpaskal
post Aug 3 2014, 12:58 PM

armchair commando couch potato
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QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 3 2014, 01:30 AM)
Your space partition look confuse. Seems like a maze.  rclxub.gif  and I would be get lost inside there.  tongue.gif

I not really like sketchup as it difficult to navigate view around. I have to buy a 3d mouse to aid me. Of course autocad is not as attractive as 3d software. But it give better 2d dimensions drawing where builder need it.

I learn that building doesn't require high accuracy. If I follow that high accurate and talk to contractor, I think I will pull my hair and many arguement.  biggrin.gif  My job require precision accuracy of 20micron. That sometime make my outside life difficult.
*
it's not space partition, but internal bracing for the outside walls. it's a subwoofer, a high power at that.
the internal pressure at high output causes the outside walls to flex. so internal bracing is designed to provide more support than is needed, to avoid the flexing issue.

the internal space can't be partitioned as it'll reduce the effective internal area. large opening for the bracing is needed to avoid wind noise when the sub is pressurized.
thus the maze look.
TSpaskal
post Aug 3 2014, 04:14 PM

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roofed.
17 & 19 degrees pitch.

floorplan is relatively unchanged. tho it won't hurt experimenting with 13 feet high walls just to see how that will look like. 13 feet wall would allow us to go with 11.5 feet high ceiling. that will certainly improve ventilation throughout the entire house.

guest outboard deck attached to the living room/guest dining area looks like it'll be nicer if it's extended. shaded of course.

user posted image
user posted image
user posted image
user posted image

TSpaskal
post Aug 3 2014, 04:26 PM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 3 2014, 01:21 PM)
Sorry. I mean your house partition wall design. It look like a lot of wall which look like a maze.
*
user posted image
user posted image
user posted image
the house layout is really straight forward. there's not even a pathway or walkway inside the house.
there's no change to the floorplan when we erected the 3D.

we purposely went with a straightforward design to maximize space.
TSpaskal
post Aug 4 2014, 11:26 AM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 3 2014, 10:55 PM)
Seems ok looking from the top view. Will the family area, living hall and dinning area too dark? It surround by the room etc.
*
no idea if it's gonna be dark. but there's gonna be a large glass opening at the kitchen wall to aid lighting. wife did say that the kitchen area looks like it won't receive much natural lighting as it is. the dry kitchen needs a lot of lighting for cooking.

for family area and living hall i think we're keeping natural light off of those. the house area usually gets too much sun during midday.


QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 3 2014, 10:55 PM)
Another is the ventilation of the house. The roof it totally seal off and no hot air vent out. Are you planning for whole house aircon?
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good question. someone also asked previously, mentioning roof turbine.
user posted image
it's gonna look horrendous spoiling the entire modern outlook of the house.

tho to aid roof ventilation, we're incorporating 3 solution. the first two was mention before this.
first being the outdoor ceiling with opening.
second being the roof insulation with an air gap, supposedly moving air from the roof edges to the top of the structure.

and third, we're incorporating this:
user posted image
user posted image
user posted image

i'm gonna put aluminium louvres on the wall. that will force and channel wind from outside of the house into the roof structure, promoting better ventilation. air will escape at the outside ceiling.

there's a risk that rainwater will be forced into the ceiling together with heavy rain and strong wind.
but if we didn't put up the holes right now, there's no way to cut the walls later on. at the worst case, i could just seal off the louvres at the back if there's too much problem with water.
or change the angle of the fin.
or redesign the louvres.

it's an experiment laugh.gif
TSpaskal
post Aug 4 2014, 12:14 PM

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skinned. materials added.
my son's room will have an attic since he wants a staircase. sorry son mommy and daddy can't afford a double storey house. but your room will have a play area overlooking the nice view.

user posted image
user posted image
user posted image

so with this we're proceeding with negotiations with the contractor(s). house outlook and floorplan is finalized.
TSpaskal
post Aug 9 2014, 09:51 PM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 4 2014, 01:12 PM)
When going oversea, I checked their house design. What important to them. Either western (Oz) or Asia (japan). So far what I can check on this country.

First is the living/hall/family area. This must face garden or scenery area. With large open glass door of whatever that you can see through. I sit down and try to feel it from their hall/living/family area. It is really soothing your eye and relax when sitting in there to enjoy the outside view. Even I watching tv or talking in there, the nice view outside keep disturb my eye. biggrin.gif  Since your house is surround by the rice field scenery, why not try to use this advantage. The natural light is bright enough for your whole hall.

Than the dining area is close to the kitchen. Probably don't 1 walk that far with the dish. biggrin.gif Than the room. If you want the master bedroom face the scenery/garden, than align to it. But all the room door is away or face away from the hall/kitchen/dining area. For toilet, western will put inside the room while Japanese will put outside.

All are max using natural light for the room/hall. So there is no room or hall is hiding or middle and away from natural light.
*
thanks for the pointer. wife did her part 2 in aussie so i hope she's versed with the architecture there.
we do have a large folding door that opens nearly all the entire wall span at the family deck and guest deck area. 12 feet of folding door.

QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 4 2014, 01:56 PM)
From your location and place, it is a large flat padi field area. With occasionally 1-2 small hill like granite. I use to travel there. More toward to perlis.

It is a very hot place. And you have to endure the burning crops of land and field twice or thrice a yrs.  sweat.gif I guess you have to look at the ventilation seriously.

The ventilation have to separate into 2. The roof ventilation and the in house ventilation. If you seal off the roof, the air inside will heat up and no place to go. I m not sure insulate your ceiling will help. Will the heat slowly travel down to the ceiling through conducting. Since the heat no where to go.

For the in house air flow, as usual, hot air rise and in/out airflow have to consider.
*
yes it's very hot. but even during midday it's naturally windy. sometimes too violent.
and we have to endure this:
user posted image
which causes lots and lots of small insects at night.

then this:
user posted image
user posted image
which causes lots of smoke and flying ash.

there's gonna be 2 harvesting season a year, which will last for a week. so everything have to be considered. we can't have an open plan, or an indoor courtyard without needing some major cleanup during the harvesting season.

QUOTE(ozak @ Aug 4 2014, 03:28 PM)
For the ventilation, I have plan it on my drawing board for a while now. Initially this is how it look from the side for what I have plan on my house. Maybe something you can pick up here from my stupid plan.  biggrin.gif

user posted image

Behind below hatching is a concrete slab. While the roof is front side. Most of the wind is from front side of the house. So I create an air flow for the roof from front and vent out at behind cover with aluminium lourve. The shade rain will help shelve the rain storm. Actually it doesn't really need that shade also. As the lower side is a hot air vent out area. Which is a toilet.

The roof vent is taking care. Now the in house. The hot air raise and air flow will flow up top through the toilet and vent out at the same lourve. I m using the air spray/jet flow theory. If there is an air flow in the roof, it create a vacuum at the hot air vent. That will force the hot air out from inside the house. A + point additional beside the normal hot air out.

Create a middle concrete slab but shade a way by the roof can help reduce the rain storm getting in. You also have a space for water tank and an outdoor aircon unit to place. All this hide away on the roof without damage your exterior house look. Easy maintenance too.
*
thanks for the suggestion.
your idea is the same as mine. tho i have to consider that we're gonna see wind from both direction. so i can't exactly implement the rising hot air movement as wind will force the hot air from rising and move to the bottom of the structure. so in my design the ceiling is sealed from the room to avoid hot air from the ceiling structure being forced into the room during heavy wind.
TSpaskal
post Aug 9 2014, 10:16 PM

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got back a quote.
RM88 per square feet.

which translates to RM320k for the entire structure.
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

IDs and maybe other contractors will say it's gonna cost me another RM600k or at least RM300k more to do the interior. icon_rolleyes.gif
much bloated price IDs charge, eh?
TSpaskal
post Aug 10 2014, 08:08 AM

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QUOTE(Fazab @ Aug 9 2014, 11:02 PM)
Plumbing & electrical?
*
included.
single phase wiring. each room will get a set of basic downlight, one plug point and one ceiling fan. extra item must be paid directly to the electrician assigned to the project. if i'm not satisfied with him, i can appoint my own wireman and the company will pay the wireman for the cost. single metal db.

interior and exterior plumbing is included with the quote. also full house apron with cement drainage. PE septic tank. 4 water closet at all 4 toilet location, can't remember the brand but we are shown our options to choose from. acceptable quality.
the company also agreed to cover the fancy stone tile at the structure beam that my wife wants.

everything will be done in black and white agreement, signed by both parties with a witness present. if should i choose to proceed with them. not just verbal agreement, and valid as evidence in court. laugh.gif

6 years warranty for the paint. 20 year warranty for the house structure.
the owner is also willing to put it in black and white for both warranty. brows.gif

but it's not without downside, right?
the contractor won't proceed with the proposed roof pitch at 17 degrees. he wants 28 minimum. else he won't cover the roof leaking issue. but that would put my roof too high of an angle. and will look terrible.

will try and mod the design to see how it looks with 28 pitch.
TSpaskal
post Aug 10 2014, 08:13 AM

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forgot to mention.
it's a sendirian berhad company. 20 years track record. 3 large hardware shops at 3 different location. 2 main warehouse. they even branched into retail supermarkets, hotels. previously built mosques, shoplots, hotels.
TSpaskal
post Aug 10 2014, 03:07 PM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Aug 10 2014, 09:36 AM)
Main structure shall be lifetime, not with period.
*
and yet i don't see any of the housing development projects giving any warranty after 1-2 years.
this one is willing to cover 20 years if should there's any crack on the wall.

i see lots of housing over here have crack forming on the wall under a year.

QUOTE(-oc-gassa @ Aug 10 2014, 12:24 PM)
red brick advantages vs cost? any comment if using cheaper alternative?
*
some people say red clay brick have better insulation against heat by sunshine. better cooling effect.

wife says red clay bricks have better heat retention ability, thus frequently used in western countries. they absorb heat during the day, making the house cooler during the day but they excrete the stored heat during the night. thus heating the walls making it warmer. a welcomed trait for western countries where night time is very cold and it would reduce the heating costs.
not exactly an appealing proposition for the weather here.

anyway we're planning for AAC bricks for the west facing walls to improve the insulation. it's only ~60 feet of walls that face the evening sunshine. and the rest of the house probably the normal cement bricks. undecided yet.
TSpaskal
post Aug 10 2014, 06:19 PM

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thanks for the pointer guys.
will make more info available once we receive more reply from the contractors.
TSpaskal
post Aug 11 2014, 10:41 AM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Aug 10 2014, 08:10 PM)
Wall break the roof won't really collapse, but pillar breaks, you know what I mean.
BTW, I think I never ask you is the land flat and stable land or reclaim land?
*
it's previously a paddy field.
user posted image

QUOTE(ShadowR1 @ Aug 11 2014, 02:20 AM)
I agree to this... the west wall.
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if AAC is cheaper i might just go with AAC blocks just for the west wall.
if not have to consider double bricking that wall as i did to the HT room.

if even that is too expensive i just consider double bricking the master bedroom wall. but seeing that we have lots of 7'x7' windows, brick cost can't be that much anyway.
TSpaskal
post Aug 14 2014, 09:23 PM

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predicting that there's gonna be quite a problem with the room size.
room mode distribution is nice, distributed evenly throughout the spectrum. giving me this:
user posted image

but room simulation shows that the interaction between the walls and the planned listening position ~6 feet from the back, there's gonna be a null at 100hz in all listening position. and another null at 145hz. probably because of interaction from the back wall.
user posted image
should be able to take care of these by minidsp and arc, but the null directly at 100hz is worrying.
these nulls happen even though i had good distribution of the room modes. really perfect for the length. don't think you could get much better than that first graph.

anyway simulation shows that 14' 9" is gonna be better in all listening position:
user posted image

14' won't do much:
user posted image

increasing the ceiling to 9.5' is even worse:
user posted image

10' is the worst. not planning for a ceiling higher than 10' for the ht room, otherwise i'm gonna need more subs to pressurize it.
user posted image

have to consider increasing the ht room by another 9 inch. 14.5' looks better than the planned 13' 9":
user posted image

but that will reduce the porch length to 17 feet.
3 feet overhang from the roof, i should still get ~20 feet cover at the porch. hopefully my wife agrees haha. tongue.gif
TSpaskal
post Aug 14 2014, 09:50 PM

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confirmed interaction with the rear wall. changing the crossover frequency also didn't do shit:
100hz xover
user posted image
90hz xover
user posted image

meanwhile changing xover freq for 14.5' did wonders:
user posted image
user posted image

also did wonders to 14' 9":
user posted image
user posted image

pretty much confirmed my fears. the planned size is gonna pose a problem with that huge null at 100hz. it doesn't happen at the middle of the room, but interaction with the rear wall at the listening position causes that huge null that's gonna be hard to correct with EQ.

not gonna risk it. ht room will be widen by 9 inch to 14' 6".
room mode distribution isn't as nice as 13.8', but the freq response at the LP is the absolute priority.

turns out you can't just design a room based on the mode distribution huh.
TSpaskal
post Aug 14 2014, 10:32 PM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Aug 11 2014, 11:14 AM)
Solid or not? That's more important.
*
solid.

QUOTE(CoffeeDude @ Aug 12 2014, 04:31 PM)
whoa I'm tracking this topic biggrin.gif

My target is to build a 3000sq ft single storey house in 5-10 years time biggrin.gif

Did you hire architect?
Do you need specialized contractor to do the HT room?
*
nope. we suka suka draw draw and give it to the contractor for estimation.
nope. not gonna hire a dedicated contractor for the ht room. it's diy, remember? biggrin.gif

QUOTE(supersound @ Aug 14 2014, 09:30 PM)
Tapped horn should able to solve your problems.
*
care to explain why a horn setup will solve this null?
TSpaskal
post Aug 15 2014, 10:34 AM

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QUOTE(supersound @ Aug 15 2014, 01:23 AM)
Tapped horn are used to make a small woofer sound big. Like a 10" can sound like 15" with this concept.
Simulation won't be accurate most of the time.
Have to know that, music are dynamic, so I won't trust simulation most of the time, trust your ears.
*
a tapped horn will be even worse in this room. tapped horn have a fundamental null at 100hz-150hz. it's not suggested for rooms where freq above 100hz are required from the sub.

simulation is pretty accurate when it comes to soundwave. even tapped horn design process are heavily dependent on the hornresp predicted responses.
user posted image
see that null? it's not gonna improve the room null that's already there.

room response could be accurately predicted. refer the paper "Subwoofers: Optimum Number and Locations" by Todd Welti, Research Acoustician, Harman International Industries, Inc.
my own testing shows the room simulation could predict actual responses to a high degree of precision. findings are posted before in the audiophiles subforum.

can't trust my own ears as the room have yet to be built. so it's all simulation to avoid building a problematic room.
TSpaskal
post Aug 15 2014, 03:08 PM

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QUOTE(CoffeeDude @ Aug 14 2014, 11:24 PM)
Wow you did all the drawings yourself?  shocking.gif

But for contractors don't they need the drawings for the internal wirings, water piping, air-con piping?

How about security - CCTV, alarm?
*
not by myself. me and my wife.
the first, initial drawing and planning started last year so it's been a year.

there's no electrical and plumbing drawing yet. it's a work in progress. have to finalize the walls and structure first before drawing the electrical and plumbing route. there's a proposed lighting arrangement though. posted before.

QUOTE(supersound @ Aug 15 2014, 12:06 PM)
If in this world all speakers having the same spec, sound same, all human ear are same then I'll agree with you on this.
Sound wave are travelling in wave form, so the placement of the microphone plays an important role. Not to mention is that microphone calibrated or not hmm.gif
*
calibrated mics could be bought for ~RM300. tho i have to agree that preference plays a major part.
but it's been a few years since i've started with audio measurement and i could judge my preferences from the graph.
if you did enough measurement, for long enough time, you know what's your preference from a brief look at the room response.

here's my previous experience with the simulated response:
predicted:
user posted image

measured:
user posted image

overlaid:
user posted image
see how accurate that is? pretty darn accurate that made me a believer. google for 'rew room simulation accuracy'.
TSpaskal
post Aug 15 2014, 03:38 PM

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anyway... contractor appointed.
RM32 psft

user posted image

basic structure.
piling.
main structure beam as per JKR spec.
y12 steel with r6 link throughout.
13 feet wall.
16 inch high main structure beam.
effective ~20 inch raised floor from the ground.
cement brick.
concrete support block for all windows and door. dunno the exact term.
concrete overhang for all windows as shown in the drawing. 30cm x 5 cm.
no roof.
no windows.
inclusive indoor plumbing.
inclusive outdoor drainage.
inclusive outdoor apron with cement gutter.
2 septic tanks for toilets, separated for family area and guestroom.
1 septic tank for greywater discharge.
no wiring.

RM115k for 3621 sqft (indoor + outdoor area).


now my wife wanna add another toilet next to the laudry area. sweat.gif
5 toilets for 4 people? what for need so many toilets ah?
initially she wants the toilet inside my garage. saying the garage is too big for me. doh.gif

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