I know there are many review of suprima out there already but I can't help wanted to write one myself. I'm normalized to my p407 before the test so my judgement may biased towards comparing to p407


tested: suprima s at jb

test condition :
- long straight with 90deg corner n few traffic lights .
- uneven road with few potholes
- 3 occupant

interior
- rough plastic all over.
- uncomfortable sitting position , too high , hard leather seat , wife complain uncomfortable at back seat
- steering is heavy , ladies would complain , but comfortable , looks elegant n upmarket
- sitting inside feel the car is narrow - the feeling , dunno why

exterior
- looks good but prefer preve sedan look

the drive
- pickup good compared to preve from previous test drive
- superb handling , feel solid , suspension is good as the ride is supple over uneven road - first thing came to mind is ' this is better than my 407!'
- accelleration is very good !! I keep on testing the turbo whenever I see a straight road .
- engine is very noisy , not refined. should have put more noise insulation to make it a better car.

summary.
- not recommended for ladies for the heavy steering .
- feels cheap , cheap interior ,looks like QC does not include material quality in checklist .
- noisy engine = noisy cabin
- uncomfortable seat , seating position ,seating position too high, hard leather seat

+ handling
+ power n acceleration
+ looks good
+ sporty steering design.

just for sharing from a person who rarely speed above 110kmj and drives like an uncle.

I don't know about the Suprima S but I own the Preve Turbo so most of the characteristics in handling, steering feel and suspension may be similar. I seem to share most of the observations you have made above. Particularly the comment on the suspension marked in red.

The suspension of the Suprima S/Preve Turbo is certainly commendable. In your remark about the suspension of the Suprima S being better than the Peugeot 407, let me expand a bit. "Better" is a wide term and is subjective. It can be better in some areas but worse in other areas. THough I can relate to your experience, but in my case the Preve Turbo to the Ford Focus Titanium. I find the suspension of the Preve Turbo to be more comfort-tuned than the Focus. When going over imperfections or unnevenness of the roads, the suspension soaks up these irregularities on the roads. The vehicle will be more floaty and bounce more as they soak up the irregularities on the roads, producing a more comfortable ride. With the Focus, all the imperfections, undulations, unevenness of the roads, the suspension of the Focus will transmit all these more effectively into the cabin. The Focus is rock steady and won't bounce up and down like a spring when going over bad or imperfect roads in comparison to vehicles with more "springy" suspension. Good for handling but not so comfortable.

I presume the same when you compared the Suprima S to the Peugeot 407. When you mentioned the suspension of the Suprima S being superior than the Peugeot 407, I wager it's the more solid feel of the suspension that soaks up the unnevenness or imperfections of the roads, potholes etc.

If the steering of the Suprima S is similar to that of the Preve Turbo, I am in agreement that the steering weight of it is heavy. As a matter of fact the steering of the Protons is the significantly heavier than most of the vehicles that I have owned or driven. Not very ideal when driving a lot in town as more effort is needed to turn the steering wheel in comparison to a lighter steering.

Looks is subjective though the sedan looks much better to the Suprima to me.

why does ppl complain heavy steering?
its not a freakin EPS
heavy steering is a GOOD thing

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Nov 5 2013, 11:37 AM

i agreed for heavy steering... but in facts it good for high speed cruising but not for city driving...
the reasons for heavy steering are safety reasons while speeding...

otherwise i think Kia Cerato should be the best option as the steering respond can be light, normal and heavy depend on our preferences...

Hmm....I never quite understood the heavy steering complaint on the Preve/Suprima, it is no heavier than the 1st gen Vios at home and that Vios is driven by my sister

Certainly during test drives the steering weight did not stood out to me as being extraordinarily heavy, and I am used to the Fiesta steering which is one of the lightest steering I have driven (when low speed, it is even lighter than Vios/Myvi). Unless you are expecting something like the latest Accord, which you can spin with 1 finger even when highway cruising.....

how about the audio / gps system? is it good?

never get to try cos wanted to hear how quiet is the cabin with engine noise .

light steering jusy tiring when driving on highway

nowadays people just got pampered with Power steering, when comes to car that dont have it. then they unable to drive already

fixed

It is worse than you thought

sooner we going to have voice command for steering already so that its light or maybe mind control

+99999
i still prefer hydraulic steering over EPS whenever i drive back my BLM
just be honest, proton is the only smart one by not switching to EPS like other company
it ruins the feeling and handling

TS feels that the suprima steering is heavy, its totally fine.
why wanna mocked him as his just being honest about his experience & feeling, dont forget this is his personal review.

i dont see owner of car with no power steering laughing at those with hydraulic power steering, saying they got pampered and nags when given a car without a power steering.

It is not mockery (well at least I wasn't mocking the TS), just a very general observation + my personal opinion about Proton's steering setup.

Hope this clears up any misunderstanding.

next year potong switching to EPS, beginning with the GSC (Global small car)

so proton is becoming stupid next year?

proton didn't switch to EPS because of lotus handling
EPS and lotus handling = 0
with = without

pelanciao proton bikin also bolo 1

like SS and Preve been implemented with ESP but sure got people going to say "got use meh"?

ESC memang bo use mah. That is why Toyota dint put in their Camry, Previa and the almighty OMFG Vios...

put edi waste resources only.

the heavy steering is not really a big issue la , last time my waja also heavy , p407 is also heavy , not a deal breaker anyway .Other parts like engine noise is . ...cos too loud leh.....press minyak , powerful n laju but jet engine sound also .....I was hoping it to be more refined....

You pussies complaining about the power steering might as well get a driver to drive for you.

Pg84, no offense but I could buy a Preve/Suprima, modify it till it's 99% as insulated and comfortable as the p407 (or maybe even more), and yet still have enough money to buy another cheap car. Or well, still have many thousands still in my pocket.

Only difference is, your logo is Peugeot. Mine is Proton. Malaysian Kiasu-ism aside, the logo is least of my concern

But if mod then warranty void. How?

I rike!

Asc/vsa/esp .. All marketing purpose!! Drive 15 years accident twice still alive why need those shxt?
Im some case airbag also lebih! Drive carefully okay d..
Ppl drive 15 year accident twice no air bag also alive! Infact some people grandpa grandma drive for 40-50years without those still alive!
And I dun agree acceleration good.. According to professor jayraptor, the turbine is off until 2k rpm.. Only the power come! (its off not spooling up).. And the timing belt in the suprima s will cause slip causing the vvti not effecient!

suprima memang gila lah , speedy gila . .

kalau ada duit saya pun nak beli sama dia

what has EPS got to do with lotus handling?

facepalm.com.my

theres a reason why supercars/hypercars still uses hydraulic instead of EPS

u better go and get the statement re-checked...

ESP does not help in handling.. it save ur arse when u lost control ..
thats why kcng ask u why ESP link to handling

Focus ST, Golf Mk7 GTI, Fiesta ST, Megane RS, GT86 etc. etc. all uses EPS and every one of them is in a different league when it comes to handling, compared to Suprima / Preve.

You don't need HPS to make a car handle well. You just need to know how to tune an EPS system to work with a properly set up chassis and suspension.

This post has been edited by dares: Nov 5 2013, 10:13 PM

EPS la, not ESP

Pondan drive hydraulic power steering also no complain,

Soli .. my bad .. blur blur read wrongly .. ignore my post ..

Not as expert as Jay ..

u need the 50kg bar to be expert...

r35 , 991 911 and new M3/M4 , all switched to EPS
1 button can switch to lighter or heavy feel

This post has been edited by nzh0920: Nov 6 2013, 01:16 AM

no need super car that have a few modes for steering
cerato also have

cerato's version is shit. period.

even in the supposedly "sports" mode, u still feel nothing on the steering....

No wonder RM15k more expensib than Fortetek

I dun understand who will buy cerato lo..
Forte 1.6 4 speed bestest ..
Its the legend NA tat can produce 90% on wheel usable torque at 2000 rpm! Beat that..
And the timing chain makes the dvvt so effecient

this

Lol never tired before although my colleague owned 1

Its definitely heavy and tiring when u are at a place to find parking and have to corner a lot.. However at high speeds its OK,

eps still depends on tuning. dont forget that current renault megane use eps and still one of the best hot hatch around. i dont think megane is more 'stupid' than a proton using hydraulics.
eps stuff same as torsion beam (megane also use tb setup). it's all about tuning and r&d.

latest pug model use hydraulics or eps?

Not sure, but it is surely lighter than the Suprima. Even my grandpa old Innova also have lighter steering than suprima

Proton lost a huge chunk of market share when they try to make every single car of them handle like a sport car but without the performance of a sports car. Focus too much on handling but not much improvement in engine refinement. IMO, the only proton that worth considering is the inspira.

what to do? Lotus never produce any comfort oriented car. mostly based on handling, simplicity and lightweight(but current proton lineup is heavy lol). plus til now lotus still 'borrow' engine from toyota (numbers of toyota haters from p1's fans is too damn high).

Proton own Lotus not the other way round. What will happen if one day DRB decided to sell their Lotus brand or what if Lotus no longer support them with their "handling"?

Proton lost their market share due to cronyism and complacency, and the resulting poor quality cars. It has nothing to do with their focus on handling or whatnot.


You think Proton still send their cars to Lotus to do chassis and suspension tuning meh?

They learned from Lotus and do their own tuning and design now, the "Lotus R&H" is just a brand name and gimmick to associate themselves with a sports car brand. When Preve was launched, they reverted to the "Proton R&H" label. Then Suprima came along and they used back the Lotus brand name....tader confidence kot

Even if tomorrow DRB sells Lotus away, new Proton models won't suddenly handle like a boat.

This post has been edited by dares: Nov 7 2013, 05:29 PM

I mean i dont see much improvement from their engine refinement, engine is the soul of a car. If the engine isnt good, i wouldnt even consider buying it. Anyway, i still give credit to proton for overall interior quality and their design in the suprima and preve, just doesnt quite like the noisy engine.

Im pretty sure that the mass market doesnt need a sedan that handle like a sports car, they just want a car that is easy to move around and dont handle like a boat. Proton should find a balance in between, thats just my 2sen.

This post has been edited by psycho1: Nov 7 2013, 05:42 PM

Nowadays I won't say Proton is not moving forward, good example is they took the trouble to improve the CVT gearbox from the Preve to the Suprima, and it's not just a software update....the internals and mounting are different and improved upon. Yea the Campro is due for a replacement, and there have been strong signs that a new engine is forthcoming.

Proton handles like a sports car meh Anyway, I can't say I complain about the comfort in the Preve and Suprima. They could do a lot worse, but then they could do a lot better as well.

Balance in between is an easy words to say but hard to accomplish.

Wanna fast phone sure battery can last much longer
Wanna comfortable ride cannot get good handling.
Wanna go fast sure cannot safe fuel.
Wanna a car that has everything sure it won't be cheap.

Anyway I think, proton had mention they are not doing the electric steering thinngy because they are unfamiliar with it, it maybe because of cost too. Or they had try but could not fine tune it enough to be good.

With the budget that proton has, they would probably never get to be able to built a fuel efficient,quiet,refine engine like the other big manufacturer can. So they pull a lotus. Make a turbo sport sedan. People will be more forgiving for high noise/fuel consumption, lack of refinement in a cheap sport sedan.

Noisy is due to his turbo, that one I can accept, but one thing I really cant accept is the quality~~~Haiz...

The noisy part, I think Proton should put more emphasize on the NVH especially the cabin noise..Its been more pleasure to sit on the quite car tbh. regarding the quality, proton is still the same,u buy, then u come repeatedly to service center to claim warranty.So tiring, but, that's they way they do their business. just proton only offer extended warranty for their car,did not see their true effort to improve the QC parts.

What u said is correct, bcoz what I feel that buying a proton car is like gamble, if u very lucky, then u get least problem, for me, I owned Proton saga CVT, what I feel that the NVH is really not good. If Proton can improve NVH as what u said, I think I will cont buying Proton instead of other type of car~~~

Proton just doing their business with quantity, and the cheaper as they can "offer"~

Dun believe that proton still need lotus for handling... proton never learned anything from lotus...???

Hi,
About the rumors of DRB selling their proton shares to other people, is there anywhere I can read about it? DRB selling majority share or just a portion? just wondering

What is your definition of a good NVH?

How can a car costs at least 20-30k less than other car should have better NVH? Let's not even bring about tax because it is not related.

Suprima's NVH is pretty good for an 80k.. for a performance/sport/family sedan .. it is quite an all-rounder car

Probably because of the noisy engine and cvt noise that intrudes the cabin too much, other cars I can barely hear the engine and gearbox noise even around 100km/h, only wind and tyre noise..

Yes, but we are talking about Renault. The company that has made the hottest of hatchbacks. That knows how to make cars. Most EPS systems are not very good, IMHO. Not as good as a good old hydraulic one.

What do u mean ?
I thought EPS can reduce a bit stress to engine...
EPS also can make the steering heavy when drive at high speed, more stable...

Most EPS numbs feedback from the wheels to the steering wheel.

Some EPS are so light even at high speed they are tiresome if not dangerous to drive.

If not implemented correctly, there may be noticable delay to steering weight change according to speed, ie: when decelerating from high speed, the steering weight does not lighten up accordingly, or conversely if you suddenly accelerate to high speed, the steering does not become heavier until a few seconds later. If you like to brake hard and accelerate hard, the steering weight becomes unpredictable.

However, most of the downsides may only matter if you always FnF. Like it or not EPS will replace all hydraulic power steering soon (word is the new Proton B-hatch aka GSC will be the first Proton car to use EPS), except for those hardcore sport cars, for example the Alfa Romeo 4C that doesn't even have power steering.

This post has been edited by dares: Feb 4 2014, 04:10 AM

EPS is more efficient, yes. I believe it only assists (uses power) when you are actually needing it. HPS on the other hand always needs the engine to drive the hydraulic system (IINM), so the fuel consumption is higher.

Heavier steering at speed though? HPS can do that too. And usually HPS is more... involving IMHO. It just feels nicer, more direct, there is better feedback. There _are_ some EPS systems that work really well too, but they are rare, and it seems to be hard to get it right. I haven't driven any EPS car that I'd prefer over our HPS Citroen.

Sport sedan maa.
No engine and turbo sound cannot call sport car.

I think I see one top gear review where clarkson point out that the BMW he drive put fake engine sound from the speaker.

Don't think can compare proton with kimchi nor sushi car, as they are more tune towards comfort, city riding and good fuel economy.

Do check out this review on forte coupe. A comfortable, slow, mushy suspension, light steering make for a fail sport inspired car.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9EBpqif4a24

including golf gti...Peugeot rcz thp200.

like i said before..it depends on tuning. but mostly still shitty compared to hydraulics in terms of feedback and spirited driving.

regarding EPS & HPS

EPS, jazz petrol ckd
HPS, gen2

the EPS setting on jazz is nice, less heavy than gen2's HPS.

the EPS sometimes feel like Game Racing Steering Wheel (Logitech G27).

on long journey, the EPS need more attention(?).
(ok, i dunno whether this is due to Lotus handling or the steering system itself. on gen2, while moving, the steering is sturdy, while in jazz, the steering will move a bit a bit, then it need more attention in controlling the steering. at 1sttime, i found this to be tiring.)

can the EPS swap with playstation controller? hahahaha

i concerning on the safety & reliability of the EPS rather than talk about FC and weight...
will steering wheel will jammed & unmovable at all due to the failure of EPS motor? it is important especially while driving at road...

EPS can be heavy too as the feedback will create virtually from the motor...

Cerato supported to change driving mode (Normal, Sport and Comfort) depend on user preference...
but unsure whether support automatic mode or not depend on car speed...
http://www.nazakia.com.my/models/cerato/#D-Features

this is i cannot comment.

my observation is, in jazzs' EPS u cannot turn the steering unless the engine is ignited, while in gen2's HPS u can move the steering hardly without the engine is ignited.

as for most electrical systems, Redundancy precaution must be there.

emm..since it's EPS, no Hydraulic Oil for Steering.

if redundancy wont be cheap, it should consisted of the motor, electric board, wire, sensor, space consumed, etc...
The reason going for EPS is light weight, space saving (no hydraulic system), cost reduction and capabilities of changes driving mode changes...

but still sometime analog (passive) based still wise choices if talk about safety...
if every devices changed to electronic (active) based are not a good idea AMO...
just like "chicken or egg" story...

then "cross-finger" la..ahhaha