There's quite a good number here. It's just what you want and the budget.

Urm... 0? Because it shouldn't be calculated by the pages? But if you're quoting by the pages, shouldn't you already know what pages you're going to have do?

Honestly, this is quite offensive. It's like saying because the doctor is a medical graduate, it's a simple task for him too. Hence, the price wouldn't be expensive.

Anyway, there isn't an average price. It's who you approach, who you feel confident in, who makes your gut feeling say "this person is what I'm looking for". Design isn't governed by any standard or organization to say it should only costs this much.

Estimate the time required for development and testing. Then, from there you determine if your estimated total may be high or not.

Wordpress itself was built to be SEO friendly. It's just how you activate it and extend it with plugins like All in one SEO pack, Google sitemaps etc.

A company can start with a template, but they'll need someone later to customize the design so it better represents the brand and image of the company.

Since the client's site is Wordpress driven, its better for them to take charge of their own updates. However, this would mean the provider has to provide training and/or a manual on how to maintain the website content.

Client wins in saving cost and time by doing themselves except they've to learn. Designer/developer wins cause less work but less recurring revenue coz you don't get to charge stuff like "only can update 2 photos etc" to the client.

Malaysia has a growing community of Wordpress designer/developers. It all depends on your budget and who d'you feel comfortable working with.

I'd advise by looking here: http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1365687

Though I've to tell the TS to remove Simpleet's (my company) since advertising in LYN isn't the right market for us. LOL!

P.S.: Any WP designers/developers who are reading this. Please PM weirdguy and not post here. Keep this thread clean.

If you're a company servicing a client, the 1st year is kinda like a complimentary offer to get clients to host with you. However, in some circumstances you don't mind adding a little more value by paying on behalf of the client.

Your question has 2 different answers and should be answered by this question.

Who is hosting the client?

If you're hosting the client, then you should manage the billing.

If you're hosting the client at a 3rd party provider, you should still manage the billing.

If you've briefed the client you're using a 3rd party, ask if they'd like you to manage or they'd prefer to manage personally. Difference? They'd not have to pay you a servicing fee for managing the billing when you pay on their behalf.

And if you think about the risks, it's measured against a customer service value. Imagine what if you renewed the domain for 5 years (at client's request) but the client doesn't pay you for it after 30 days and suddenly, they close shop.

Therefore, it's really up to you and the process you put in place to manage this scenario.

It should be okay. But better to ask as some companies have stricter policies.

It's respectful to ask for permission. And prepare a document for signing for formality. Just note in the document you're using it to promote your wok however will duly note, project information provided was done by your company and you were part of it.

Don't want to the company suing you when their clients question them.

Very important point to note.

That's why most preferred website design companies either host in a server of their own or with a vendor they already recognize which has this compatibility.

What the above is recommending is to become an account/project manager.

If you wish to do it this way, come clean with the client by telling them you'd like to help however would be more comfortable referring his project to a professional friend you know.

If he asks why, let him know you're still learning and don't wish to experiment with his corporate website. Unless he wants you to. LOL!

But then again, if you plan to refer someone to this job. Don't think after introducing it's done. Because your client might not understand why his/her cost is more than what he was expecting be delivered from you. Therefore, this is the catch when you try to become a freelance account/project manager. You are selling a person's services/products.

If you'd like to handle this on your own, I'd advice charging from anywhere between a RM10-50 hour rate. Think:
1. On average how long you'll need to complete the project.
2. Adjust the rate
3. Buffer for negotiation
4. Win it!

A freelance website designer starts somewhere. It's scary to handle your first job and you don't want to f*ck it up. And you don't want to be the monkey receiving peanuts too. Therefore, ask yourself when you've your figure:

Am I worth this much for my experience and quality of work now?

Well, good luck and let us know how it goes.

This post has been edited by etsuko: May 12 2010, 01:58 PM

A friend is still a client. Charge accordingly. It's your personal value of your services. If you undercharge and your friend tells his friend you did his work for X price, imagine the future implications. Therefore, charge your friends or family like any other client.

It's easier to educate the ones closest to you as compared to a stranger who doesn't know you. So, educate them of the effort required for you to fulfill their requests. And quote them accordingly.

Based on what you've explained, here's a list you could start and consider:
1. CMS (installation/customization)
2. Forum (installation/customization)
3. Design?
4. Training?
5. Misc. fees for traveling and printing (if providing manual)

And take into consideration some of the stuff Deadlock brought up, especially support and etc.

Whether it's Joomla, Wordpress, Drupal, ExpressionEngine or whatever CMS you choose, select it based on what you're comfortable developing and what the client will feel comfortable using. For example; if the staff isn't very IT-savvy, you'll either have to be a damn good teacher or you could develop on a CMS which is easier for layman to understand.

So remember, business is business.

My Dad asked me once and never asked again since he realized my rates isn't what he was expecting. ROFL! He's still my Dad.

I can't remember the last time I used this phrase.



Seriously. It's what I did when I started. I gave to my parents, brothers, uncles, aunties and friends. You need to get the word out to the people you know about your services. If you rely on the web, you'd better have a damn good strategy to do it.

So, have you given everyone your business cards yet?

After that, think who're your customers and start thinking how d'you reach them.

If you're able to use SimpleViewer, my guess is you're not even building a page. It's more like a slideshow. There are plenty of slideshows out there. It's a Google away and for you to experiment. Plus, it's whether or not you want to pay for something or want it free.

Well, you could always start by being honest to the client. Inform her there was a miscommunication and after you've seen the work requested, it's more than what you had quoted. If she doesn't back down, then it's a lesson you'll have to take. Unless you're prepared to beg her - which I'd not advise doing.

I don't charge per page. But yes, it can be different. Because a page is most likely to be static. A gallery means it's a requirement out of the norm. However, you have to be more specific when mentioning picture gallery. Is it a Javascript driven gallery or a Flash gallery?

Difference: Flash has been perceived to cost more.

You could always ask her to sign it, scan it and return it to you. Or, you could attach the B&W in the email of your T&C then officiate everything in a formal email. Something like, please reply with your full name, IC with the sentence "I _____ bla bla bla bla".

You could also put the T&C on your website with the [ ] I agree bla bla bla then they've to fill in their full name and IC. Make sure this is stored with an accurate date and time it was submitted.

The B&W is more than just payment terms. It's to protect you and the client from aspects of conflict and legal implications too.

If all you want is to state payment/delivery terms, this can be noted in the invoice when you bill them. But consider heavily on preparing a B&W if you're aiming to freelance. At least most clients you deal with will take you more seriously and professionally.

P.S.: Can't believe you went through all the pages. ROFL!

RM5/hour rates. I think RM300-500 should be a fair amount for a static website or with very minimal Flash work like a 'useless' Flash banner.

Maintenance depends on what you're quoting the client.

Yes, that's what I'd do. But everyone has their methods of charging. Like some still charge per page. End of the day, you've to ask yourself which creates a win-win for you and the client.

If you do a monthly maintenance contract, you'll have to:
1. Set an expectation limit = how many pages etc.
2. Set a default delivery date = how many days to complete if given materials.
3. Set extended expectations = what happens if client requests more work.

Personally, I find limiting the client isn't a win already. Plus, as much as it's win for us to get free money every month irregardless if there's any update (depending how you draft the contract), again it's not a win for the client as much as it's the 'norm'.

Then, you'll have to define in the contract what constitutes as an update. Like what if a client requests for a slideshow. Would this be considered images? Or, what about video?

There are too many possible scenarios for an update and it's difficult covering all of this in the contract. That's why I personally prefer hourly maintenance - until we(Simpleet) can finally give a win-win contract to both sides.

1. Nope. And today, there's more than only the 2. There are front-end designers/developers etc. Generally, a web designer/developer has the abilities to create a static website. But the next answer I'm giving is more valid.

2. Position doesn't matter. Portfolio matters. Hire someone you have trust in and feel good working with.

3. Well, I won't laugh but never think it's an idea not created. Maybe it could be that you didn't look hard enough to see if someone else has done it or very similar to it.

4. There's an affordable way and a 'i want it like [insert website]' way. Affordable means you get the proof of concept working. Forget about the cool 'I want' stuff and have the 'I need' stuff first. If your idea were that good, it doesn't need the 'she-bang' coz the core of it is what'll sell.

If you told a credible designer/developer/company 'I want it like [insert website]', you'll get a much higher quote because you're asking someone to design/build the existing right now. Not to mention, a good designer/developer will continue to ask you; what do you want?

For example; Lelong wasn't like what it was 5 years ago. It's evolved. Asking about the price of it now and previously is like asking, why oil prices now and 5 years ago is different? Prices change based on life - culture, politics, economy etc.

And honestly, anyone who's asked me to quote 'i want it like [insert website]'. I just throw them back a ballpark of what the venture costs now. So if you told me you wanted to build Facebook, I'll just tell you it'll cost $ million/billion.

Why? Because you don't know what you want so I'm quoting what it's worth and not what it would cost.

To anyone who's asking a designer/developer to create their idea.
1. Be specific. What's your idea - really?
2. Know what you want. What features you need, not want?
3. Meet the designer/developer. How's their portfolio?
4. Evaluate your options. Who's got the right skillset and mindset?
5. Consider and go!

P.S.: goldfires, you know I know why he/she did it. so...

This post has been edited by etsuko: May 28 2010, 10:07 AM

You're not designing a PHP website. You're converting an existing website.

If you don't have to rebuild the structure, then charge the client based on the pages need work done.

In addition, charge for the other functionality he had in ASP but needs to be done in PHP now.

I recall seeing a topic from you. If it's custom, there's no market price.

You can get an el cheapo person from any part of the world for half-*ssed work or get a proper person who'll do it properly.

However, I'd say a suitable budget would be about RM 8-10k (including local payment gateway integration). Then, you'll have less problem finding someone to develop a similar website for you.

It's never too late. It only depends how committed and eager you want to do it.

Even if you're not really doing any design work, there's always the development costs and time you're putting into the project. Thus, you're charging for this time.

Telling the client about how it works - plugin and etc, can play both ways. You'll get some who listens and notes is as an educational matter. Some who'll debate with you, saying you didn't do much work therefore why are your rates $ amount. When this happens, you've a choice to either drop the price or explain again to the client. If they don't budge, then it's your decision whether or not you want to start this business relationship with them.

I'm not a legal advisor. So I can't give you the right sentence to include.

It could be an easy phrase you normally read when you've to agree to a T&C. The ones which says..



The rate is defined by the person/company. There's no right or wrong. Some charge cheap coz they're gunning for the business. Some charge more cause they're more experienced.

And you can't just quote by saying "a simple static website" because what is defined simple? Is designing and developing for 50 static pages simple?

So, think about it from the time you'll spend VS the experience you currently have PLUS the target market you're looking at. If these are the cheapos, then you'll know you can't price high. Though note, some cheapos just need education and the correct push to understand why instead it costs $ amount.

Try to get in touch with http://www.dream-design.net (Bel Koo)

There isn't 1 available because everyone has their own self-worth and experience - from 0 to er...hero?

Charge for the time and effort you need to put in. If you knew your hourly rate, this would be a lot less cumbersome.

From what I see here, you should factor in the time required for data entry - your dreaded bullet list.

And though I would say you shouldn't charge a commercial client higher, I would advise you to mark-up your original price a little because:
1. Room for negotiation.
2. Buffer for unforeseen resources required - maybe they dump more data entry onto you.

Don't just price higher because you can or want to, do it because you've good reason. That's an etiquette for being professional.

Even if it was my family or friends who approach me, business is still business.

Technically wrong place to be posting this but, tried the Job Enlistment board? http://forum.lowyat.net/JobEnlistments

If cost is the issue, request for a template designed website and don't expect the bells and whistles of features.

Not the right place to post this. Should have been posted here: http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1365687

yo makhluk..I rarely take freelance projects nowadays. Most of my time committed to my own company's work.

But if you're interested to work with us, drop me a PM describing your requirements and we'll see how we can help you out.

Easiest place to start is here. You can find people seeking these expertise in this forum or the job forum.