Yep, Kagawa didn't have a good game against Spurs (in ANY position). But it is his first time getting a proper run in his favoured position since joining the club. When did Kagawa operate in his best position last season? He has been playing almost exclusively as a left winger since joining, if at all. He has played on the left without complaint, and tried to do well to keep his place in the team (since doing poorly is just asking to be benched). Fact is, he just isn't as good as a winger. Januzaj would be the more exciting choice by far for the LW.

As for Fellaini, he probably gets more stick because he has been doing well for Everton for several years before the transfer. He is familiar with the league and it's style. Probably a case of "why isn't he doing the same for us", eventhough at Everton he was playing as an attacking midfielder whereas for United we have been using him as a CM/DM.

That said, I think they BOTH need more time. People have been so quick to say player X/Y/Z is rubbish and not United quality, it's quite .... brutal. New manager and backroom team are still getting a hand of things, and the piss poor transfer activity in the last window did nobody at the club any favors. I don't agree with Beckham saying "the transition is over" after the Leverkusen result. 1 great result isn't an indicator at all, however welcome it was. It's probably going to be 1-2 seasons before we can really say that Moyes has had time to change the team to suit his vision. Until then, I expect us fans are going to have high blood pressure and a lot of anxiety when supporting and watching the team play.

Giggs probably rested since he played 90mins vs Leverkusen and was a sub vs Cardiff. 40y.o. needs to recover after that.. besides which Spurs have such a muscular midfield, if Giggs played he probably would have struggled too. He tends to do better in Europe and vs clubs with less muscle in CM because he won't get battered.

Moyes is learning, just needs time. Good thing is that his subs this game were all attacking ones (Nani, Hernandez, Young). For me, Young was probably the most iffy of the 3, but he did get a brace vs Spurs previously and some minutes on the pitch would be good for him since late December is going to bring fixture congestion and that's when we will need the entire squad to be able to cope with it well.

What if we sign a creative cm + dm in summer. Then where goes fellaini and cleverley.

kagawa had a good games vs leverkusen.. he deserve a starts. he is quality player and really good when performed

i blame moyes decision to let him continue to be ineffective vs spurs.

in anyone notice there a stat shown before the match a league table of point after a substitution made.. united are 3rd or 4th from the bottom if i'm not mistaken

backup and on loan

wt jones at his side.. i'm confident giggs can do much better. should atleast make the subs if not injured to carry momentum from last match

the subs which is attacking player is good ones but a change so late wont make any much impact. it seem like we are settle for a draw only

Valencia gets playing time because there are no other alternatives other than Nani. Nani's form has been fairly inconsistent, worrying to be honest. Valencia, we all know he is a one trick pony, but he is slowly regaining his confidence, taking on defenders like what he did in the past few weeks. Valencia has another advantage over Nani. Strength. Valencia is stronger, his body size allows him to brush off weaker wingbacks which is an added advantage. Not to mention, Valencia's crossings are pretty decent. Other than Nani, who else is capable of competing for RW? Adnan? For the past few games, seen him operating on the left flank instead and still not capable of playing a high intensity game YET.

Agree on the physical part where Kagawa needs to adapt to. To be honest, there is nothing much Kagawa has done to impress me, well least I'm not the only one on this. Kagawa works best in a formation consisting of one sole forward ahead of him. Our attacks are very much reliant on the wings, which is very different from Dortmund style. Give him one season, no improvement. Fine. Second season, still underperforming, fine. I never asked for Kagawa to be shipped, not to some's assumption (not referring to you), but what I want to see from him is to step up from his game, instead of relying to be played in his favorite position, improve on what he has been asked to. BPL is known for its physical nature, he knows that. But if he keeps getting overrun by opponents, that is something wrong there. Kagawa needs to step up his game.

Fellaini on the other hand, thou it may have been 5 years, he still needs to adapt to the system. He is playing a defensive role for us, unlike his Everton days where he charge forward like a bull. He mainly remains in his own half most of the games that he played in, his passing rates are better than many other CMs in our squad. One of the main thing that I've noticed is, Fellaini cannot play alongside Carrick. It is either Carrick or Fellaini who starts the game. I believe if Afro is given a more attacking position like what he was given at Everton, he can shine.

For now, we need a high workrate midfielder and someone creative enough to open up defense. Noticed how Sandro terrorized our defense last night, how he blocked out the pass most of the time, even had the opportunity to score a thunderbolt? We are missing this type of player. Not many on the market but if they are worth investing, they should be considered.

I don't usually criticize our players but criticism is the best form for improvements. Take Wayne Rooney for instance. Last season, some may claimed that he was off form. Fair. But during those off-form periods, have you watched how he played? He still works harder than anyone on the pitch. Running back and forth, as I've mentioned couple of months ago where some asked for Rooney to sold to Chelsea? I defended Rooney because I like him. His energy, creativity, never say die attitude reminded me of my favorite United player of all time. He hates losing. Ever noticed whenever he makes a mistake he will fight for the ball again? When he is off form, he still played his heart out for the club. Same goes to Welback, forever being criticized because he cannot score goals. He contributes alot of the team, even AVB admitted that Welback posed as a danger to them. Noticed how many off the ball runs he has made to create space for himself? How he beat Dawson to the ball? How he won the penalty? He is a squad player. Natural forward but asked to play in LM, CM or CAM, still worked hard. That is Welback for you.

Cleverley can backup. But fellaini, for 27m

2 consecutive draws say bye champions league and hi to europa league next season guys

Cleverly is shockingly average. Usually midfielders have 1 or 2 outstanding qualities like passing, scoring, tackling, reading of the game, dribbling, setpieces anything. Even Gibson who is supposedly inferior could score a screamer every 50 games or so and right now I'd rather have him in the team if he was still with us. Cleverley's 1 quality of keeping possession is not about keeping control of the game but due to a total lack of ambition.

becks was fairly ordinary too until he became freekickking

agreed on nani's part, apart from his inconsistency (doesn't help with d injuries he had on & not given a run for few games to build up his confidence), he lacked of defensive capability caused him his playin time. personally i dont think valencia crosses better than nani thou, most of d time he will just stop, then push d ball few yards ahead then whipped it low or cross it high & expect our forwards get d balls. while for nani he is better in pickup up his target but he tends to take on fullbacks or have it a go sometimes by cuttin in, so mathematically he attempted less cross than valencia. it's d case of quantity vs quality which unfortunately lead to consistent vs inconsistent. from what i see so far it's better for Nani move on should someone comes knockin coz valencia will still be d preferred choice (due to his defensive quality). player of his standard shouldn't stayed as a backup option & should be playin week in & week out.

to get d best outta Kagawa we need more mobile players, sad to say that but nowadays our football is kinda static (bar Rooney who has d freedom or was told to roam around). whenever Kagawa play he always make himself available for d next pass, but most of d time d players whom he passed d balls to will just make a back pass or push d balls wide. Clev used to be very mobile but i can't see much in him this season. something goes wrong somewhere, dip of form/confidence or izit becoz of tactical change?

yes, it's a diff role Fellaini is playin for us vs his old days in everton, but he's been clamin that he sees himself as a DM (& wanna try to emulate what Roy Keane did for us). but ask yaself what we have seen from him so far? i see him as someone who is clumsy when makin a challenge & when he is playin ok he didn't offer anything more. yes he need times but i'd prefer he get his minutes when d games already killed (comes to think of it this kinda scenario is kinda rare this season). no way he can get his chance as AM as that would mean we would sacrifice one of RVP/Rooney combo to accommodate him. some more we have Januzaj whose can easily play better than him and Kagawa whose perform best in this position. if he really wanna end up as DM for us he need to improve on his discipline (not foulin opponents as frequent as he is now) & improve on his positionin. so far i see Jones did better job for us as DM & mind you that's not his preferred role.

creative & high work rate in one package is too much to ask for IMO. there are such players but they already end up elsewhere & well settled in their current team. i'd be happy if our players like Fellaini/Clev regained their old form instead of tryin to be both but fail.

no doubt welbeck is a workhorse but it's always his final piece - be it an assistin pass/goal that frustrate some fans (i admit i'm one of 'em). he is good as squad player but there are better alternatives when every point matters. not entirely his fault thou coz Moyes should share some blames on playin him on difficult times.

This post has been edited by ah_khoo: Dec 2 2013, 02:27 PM

everytime when we had the chance to catch up with the reds, when the reds lose....the boys didn't take the opportunity to close the gap. Damn.

I used to rate Cleverley as one of the emerging talents coming through the ranks, even rated him to be the next Paul Scholes. But lately his form has dipped to an all time low, kinda surprised by that too. If I am not mistaken, Clevz used to play a more attacking role, something like CAM, but recently he has been playing CM?

Jones is one of the most versatile player for United after Rooney. He excels in RB, CB, CM and CDM. SAF proved it last season when he deployed Jones in several positions and he excelled in those. At only 21, he is going to become a huge coup, knowingly he cost 18mil for a young talent from Blackburn. We need a player similar to Yaya Toure, such a pity he chose money which is why he went to *cough* City. Vidal is one of the most consistent CM I've seen to date, Axel Witsel is another. Not to say that we should sign them but these players are the heartbeat of midfield that teams rely on.

How many tackles did wellbeck thrown in ..or he just running like a headless chicken in the name of defending....

We missed Carrick ..and putting Kagawa on the left flank is not a good choice.

Thursday 5th December 2013
Man Utd v Everton 3:45 am

Saturday 7th December 2013
Man Utd v Newcastle 8:45 pm

kagawa didnt perform well becoz he rarely get ball from midfield as midfield always pass ball back to defender rather than pass ball to attacker...no support from underperforming midfield.....n yet u guyz said he is overhyped n wellbeck is good.....hmmm....lets share your weed with me...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/...d-premiere.html



http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/man-unit...atch-video-gif/





This post has been edited by alien2003: Dec 2 2013, 09:45 PM

Coming from someone who has been posting trash for the past weeks, I guess that person is the one who is smoking weed. Kagawa isn't judged by 1 game only mind you, since the day he joined the club. The irony when someone who cannot distinguish the difference between a squad player and a single role player. Ouch.