Any idea if EPF reduction is auto op in or I have to submit a form to maintain my contribution. I do not wish for them to decrease my EPF contribution.

Thank you.

Ye sir don't know how to invest. No if you know what to invest and can beat EPF returns.

I didn't cause I know how to beat epf returns.

Actually I agree. Those with RM1m in EPF get paid say 2.5% while those RM500k below should get full dividend.

You can't withdraw your EPF until retire.

Its not about being prudent by not touching. It's so that people don't abuse the system. Why do people with RM1m in EPF deserved to be paid a lot?

How many % in EPF have over a million? Remember sg also implement such scheme. They give higher interest for low amount and lower amount the higher one goes.

This is to prevent rich people from using the system to their advantage. Rich people do not need anymore help while people need all the help they can.

Yes I am bias because I am poor.

Let's say some people who only have RM50k inside their EPF, and another person who have RM1M, do you think the one with RM1M should be paid more. Let's assume both never touch their EPF. I think not.

Why? He/she already have RM1M, while the one with RM50k only have RM50K. The guy with RM50k need all the help he/she can get to grow their retirement nest while the RM1M person have more than enough already.

So don't be greedy.

EPF is based off on your salary. So you need to be earning big bucks to have a million inside EPF. Unless you are self employed or doing own business. EPF is based on 11-13% of your pay.

By giving more to the one with lower EPF amount will let them grow their nest egg faster as majority or Malaysian are in the B40 and M40.

By giving say 2.5% for those with over a million ringgit, they would get RM25000/year. Now compare this with say 5% for the rest. The one having only RM50k would received RM2.5k/year.


Easy to say if you are doing private or doing own business. What about those people working earning RM2-3k/month?

How about those grab food or food panda or post man, your local delivery man, grab/taxi driver/farmer?

How about those grab food or food panda or post man, your local delivery man, grab/taxi driver/farmer?

I have seen so many grab food and food panda driver zig zagging and cutting red light so that they can deliver the food faster. When they can deliver the food faster, they get a new order. Hence earning more. Are they not working hard trying to make a living and putting their life at risk?

You think they are not working hard and not saving every penny?

Do you think they deserved to get paid more from their EPF vs a banker sitting in his office earning saying RM20k/month?
I support those grab food or food panda or post man, your local delivery man, grab/taxi driver/farmer

This post has been edited by Ramjade: Mar 1 2021, 11:24 PM

I never used those food delivery cause I always packed my own food. I am saying those people will benefit more than bankers.

Yes agree. That's why by giving more to those with lower EPF, you are helping to build their pie Vs those with a million dollars inside.

Let's say you already have RM1m, why do you need more in retirement account when you can invest money elsewhere?
Why do you need the full 5% when the extra money can be given to those with lower sum? Isn't that greed cause one already have so much and want more?
It's fair. You earn bug bucks, you pay more. That's how it should be. Tax the rich. Like a car. You buy a BMW Vs one with a Kancil. Who have the higher maintenance and petrol? The one with BMW. Now you are saying that's not fair. Yes it's not fair Kancil get lesser maintenance. But then again who asked one to buy a BMW?

I answered your question here.

Let me ask you is it easier for someone with a 2-3k salary Vs one with 20k salary to have a million in their EPF? I think you know the answer.

Remember sg is doing that with their CPF. I support them fully cause rich people cannot abuse the system.

If you can afford big cars be prepared to pay for it. If you can afford big cars don't complaint that your petrol and maintenance is expensive.

I don't like sg CPF as it's more restrictive than ours. The only part I like about theirs is the higher up you go, the lesser you get. Other than that I hope our EPF don't become like theirs.

Actually no. If we go the dividend tiered route. The poor gets their retirement amount faster and rich get a place to park their money risk free. I will say it's a win win for both.

Stock market is your way out. Your own initiative. Everything from govt must be equal so that there's equal chance and not let one person abuse the system.

If you do not help the poor and middle income the poor gets poorer and middle class will forever be trapped.

See the covid recovery? It's a K shape recovery. The rich get richer while the poor gets poorer and get further left behind.

It's a retirement fund. But if you already have say RM inside Vs someone who have RM50k, who needs a bigger retirement fund? I think the answer is simple. Ok maybe 50k is too low. Rm1m Vs some one with RM300k who needs the higher interest more?

True. Buy if you already have RM1m inside EPF chances are one have more at least extra 6-7 figures of cash outside of EPF. Which means one have opportunity to invest outside of EPF which means one got chance to generate more money than EPF.

Now compare that to a person with say RM50k or those B20 people where EPF is their only pot. They have no other avenue to invest cause no money left over.

I don't see people complaining when priority banking give better interest rate on FD and on loans. So people with priority banking already gain on those FD and loans so why complain when EPF is giving more to the B20 and M40 people?

It's like some bank FD. The higher you go up the lower interest rate they give you.

I do use those path provided by EPF.

Did I dictate how they invest their money? I didn't say anything. If I am in their shoes with say a million in EPF, I will just capped max a million in EPF as there's no additional benefit if there's a tiered dividend. If they like to dump all into EPF be my guest.

It's a free choice whether I support them. It's like I choose not to buy Starbucks as it's overpriced piece of coffee. I use example of gig worker Vs bankers. I can use farmer, fisherman, delivery man, post man, cleaners. It's the same. If I use say post man will you say it's hypocrite? Since you want to talk about hypocrite let's replace my example of gig worker with farmer, fisherman, delivery man, post man, cleaners then. They are definitely in the B40 and M40 region.

If you see my post I compare people with say rm50k vs Rm1m Vs RM300k. I am saying those with a million inside EPF wanting more is greedy when majority of people don't even have a million in EPF.

Are they taxed twice? I don't think so. In my example anything below Rm1m gets full 5% while anything above gets 2.5%. It's fair like driving a big car example. You pay more for petrol, road tax, maintenance. One can keep RM999,999.99 inside EPF and get full 5% and use the dividend next year to invest into unit trust.

Let's not forget rich gets better loan rates which means they are paying lesser already.

If you are a salaried man/woman, amount of EPF ties to your amount you have because it's 11-13% of your salary + whatever you want to put in extra. Which means low EPF amount means they are earning less and vice versa. Because how much can you put in if you are earning RM2-3k month? One cant afford the RM60k/year. Even those with earning RM5k also can't put in max RM60k. This is different if one is earning say RM10-20k/month.This does not apply if one is having their own business/self employed.

Universal income don't work. But using asset efficiently works.

Exactly. Even with full earnings the interest/dividend of earned is too little Vs those with big amount. That's why I don't see any harm giving people with less more and those with more less.

It still doesn't change my stand. I support if EPF goes the CPF way and give less with more and more with less.

If my example with salaried people and EPF doesn't show you proof that amount you have inside EPF = how much you are earning so be it which means one have decided to ignore the facts. You cannot denied the truth that how much one have inside EPF is indirectly related to how much one earns. Like I said it does not applied if you are self employed or doing own business but majority of it is true.

And yes that's mistake on my part. But I still stand by what I said. Those with more in EPF get paid less while those with less get paid more.

If one does not like EPF returns in the event of tiered dividend no need to max out RM60k/year.

Divert the RM60k elsewhere. So many place giving way better return than EPF if one only need to look and take the time to learn.

I am more Rob da hood. I vote for tax the rich and give the poor but not tax the rich and keep for themselves that's why I was cheering the retail investor on during the GME saga. They are robbing the rich in plain broad daylight.

This post has been edited by Ramjade: Mar 2 2021, 11:31 AM

Some good funds are performing EPF for years. I took opportunity to cash from EPF and invest myself and making 2-3x what EPF can give me.

Agreed. But fun to watch Big hedge fund losing money.

Finally we agree on one thing.

Dividend paying stocks. My stocks was tried and tested last year. All didn't cut dividends but actually increase it.

If you want 5-6%p.a with yearly increasing dividends without fail here are my selection
CKI HK
HK land
Frasers logistics trust
Canadian ultilities
WP Carey
United hamisphere REIT 8-9%p.a dividend
Elite commercial REIT 7%p.a (tenant is British govt -something like their EPF related with finding jobs for people)

If you don't care much about dividends
Parkway life REIT (owned by Khazanh not sure if they sold off already)
Fortis
Canadian National railway
LSE PLC/Nasdaq Inc/Intercontinental exchange
Visa
Nvidia/AMD
Prologis
Microsoft
Google

If you don't know how to invest, split RM60k into
ARKK/ARKW/ARKF

If you want to use unit trust
Principal Asia Pacific Dynamic Income
Affin Hwang Select Opportunity
Affin Hwang AIIMAN Asia Ex Japan Growth Fund

If my family member ask me for option
ARKK/ARKW/ARKF

If me myself, buy 100 stocks that I want to hold long term and start selling options on it to generate min 20% return.

Hope that help. Thank you.

This post has been edited by Ramjade: Mar 2 2021, 04:47 PM

You are right. But I have been though, taper trantrum, trade wars nonsense, Europe/Greek crisis, and others.

As long as you got holding power and company is fundamental sound, nothing to be scared off. A crash is a opportunity to build your wealth. Is wealth transfer. Transfer of asset from weak hands to those with strong hands.

The last year crash was too fast. Prefer a slow steady crash. That way will shake out all the ones with weak hands. Red days are my favourite days as it's shopping time. I was drooling so much last year. Too much discount to ignore. Buy until no money. Now waiting for the next one.

I quote an investor from SG


This post has been edited by Ramjade: Mar 2 2021, 06:34 PM

It matters cause govt toying with idea of tier dividend. The more you have the lesser you get and the lesser you have the more % you get.

Whether it will come true another is another thing. For now it's just in discussion mode.

For me personally I feel it's a good idea. So people cannot exploit it.

Well I will be the happy ones as I have less than a million inside EPF.
You can't please everyone.