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> LYN Christian Fellowship V6 (Group), God Loves you.

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pehkay
post Feb 8 2013, 02:24 PM

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There are two great steps in the manifestation of God in the New Testament: The first step is seen in Christ, and the second step is seen in the church. Christ is the expression of God, but the church also is an expression of God. This does not mean that the church expresses God more than Christ; rather, the church is an enlarged expression of God. Just as Christ expresses God, the church also expresses God. The principle of expression is the same, but the scope of the expression has been enlarged.

1. The Church Being the Mystery of Christ

In addition to saying that Christ is the mystery of God, the Bible also says that the church is the mystery of Christ (Eph. 3:4-6). Whereas Christ is the only begotten Son of God, the church is the many sons of God as the enlargement of Christ. The only begotten Son of God who has been enlarged is the church composed of the sons of God. In brief, the enlarged Christ is the church. All that is of Christ is in the church. Therefore, the church is the mystery of Christ.

Christ also is a mystery. For two thousand years people have talked and preached concerning Christ everywhere, but no one has seen Christ for nearly two thousand years. Christ is a mystery! Some may say that Christ does not exist, because we cannot see Him; however, this is not logical. There are many invisible things that exist. Electricity is one of them. We cannot see electricity, but we can see manifestations of electricity, such as light and heat. In the same way, Christians and the church are expressions of Christ. For nearly two thousand years no one has seen Christ, but people have seen the church. The mystery of Christ, the intricate matters of Christ, the story of Christ, is seen through the church. If we want to know Christ, we must look at the church. The church is the mystery of Christ and the expression of Christ, just as Christ is the mystery of God and the expression of God. Just as all that is of God is in Christ, all that is of Christ is in the church. For nearly four thousand years no one had ever seen God, but Christ revealed Him. In like manner, for nearly two thousand years no one has seen Christ, but the church has revealed Him. First Corinthians 14 says that whenever we meet together and people come among us, they can declare, “Indeed God is among you” (vv. 23-25). We have seen this situation often in our meetings. When God is sensed among us, it is Christ who is being sensed among us. Only the church can manifest the mystery of Christ and express the story of Christ.

2. The Church Being the Body of Christ, the Fullness of Christ, the Surplus of Christ

Just as Christ is the expression of God, the church is the expression of Christ. The church is the Body of Christ, the fullness of Christ, the surplus of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23). Christ is so full and so rich that He overflows with a surplus—the church. The church is His Body, His expression. Our body is also our expression. If we were disembodied souls, would people still be able to recognize us? Could they tell us apart? Could they see us? We appear before others through our body. Our body is our manifestation. Sometimes we see someone’s shadow or see someone walking at a distance, but by his manner, we know who is coming. A person’s body is his best manifestation. Similarly, as the Body of Christ, the church is the best manifestation of Christ. Christ expresses Himself in, by, and through the church.

3. The Church Being the Many Sons of God United with God—God in Christ Being the Substance of the Church, and the Church in the Holy Spirit Being the Expression of God, thus the Church Being a Dwelling Place of God

The church is the Body of Christ, and it is also the many sons of God joined to God to be one (Heb. 2:10-11). God in Christ is the substance of the church, and the church in the Holy Spirit is the expression of God. Thus, the church is a dwelling place of God (Eph. 2:20-21).

On the one hand, the church is the Body to Christ, and on the other hand, the church is the dwelling place to God. On the one hand, we are the many members of Christ, and on the other hand, we are the many sons of God. As the many members of Christ, we express Christ; as the many sons of God, we express God. Of course, these two matters—being the many members of Christ and being the many sons of God—are inseparable; they are the two sides of one matter. In regard to expressing Christ, the emphasis is on being the many members of Christ to be His one Body, and in regard to expressing God, the emphasis is on being the many sons of God to be His house. This house is the dwelling place of God, a place where God is expressed. Both a body and a dwelling are places in which one can rest and express himself. Therefore, both as the Body of Christ and as the house of God, the church is the place in which Christ and God can rest and find expression.

4. The Church Composed of the Many Sons of God Entering into Glory for God to Have a Full Expression—the Manifestation of the New Jerusalem

The church, which is composed of the many sons of God (Heb. 2:10), will enter into the glory of God in the future, just as Christ the firstborn Son of God entered into glory. This will be the time of our rapture and transfiguration. When all of God’s sons enter into God’s glory and are completely transformed, God will gain a complete and full expression. This will be the manifestation of the New Jerusalem. At that time, God will be completely in Christ, and Christ will be completely in the New Jerusalem, that is, in the church. Thus, the church will completely express God in Christ. Revelation 21 says that God will be the light shining in the New Jerusalem while Christ will be the lamp of the light (vv. 11, 22-23). Moreover, the New Jerusalem with its surrounding, transparent wall will be like a great transparent lampshade. God as the light dwelling in Christ as the lamp will shine forth through Christ, and Christ in the New Jerusalem will shine forth through the New Jerusalem. Therefore the glory, the splendor, of the New Jerusalem is God who is being expressed. God in Christ is completely mingled with the church as one, and the church in Christ is completely transformed to be like God; at the same time, God in Christ completely shines out of the church and is expressed through the church. This is God’s ultimate goal.

pehkay
post Feb 14 2013, 03:46 PM

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THE CHURCH’S FUNCTION—TO EXPRESS CHRIST AND TO TESTIFY OF CHRIST

We have seen that God’s eternal intention is to express Himself in Christ. Furthermore, the expression of God has been enlarged to be the church. The church has been produced because the only begotten Son of God, who expressed God, has been enlarged to become the many sons of God. Previously, the Son of God was God’s only begotten Son, but now the only begotten Son has become a corporate son. Previously, the expression of God could be seen only in Christ, but now the expression of God has become a corporate expression. This corporate expression of God is the testimony of the church. If we know the expression of God, we will know the testimony of the church, the function of the church.

The function of the church is to express Christ, to testify of Christ. We have repeatedly said that God expresses Himself through Christ by putting Himself into Christ. In the same way, Christ puts Himself into the church to be expressed through the church. Therefore, the function of the church is to be Christ’s expression. When the church expresses Christ, the church testifies of Christ in the universe. Therefore, the function of the church is to be a testimony expressing Christ.

On the evening before His death, the Lord Jesus told the disciples, “When the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you..., the Spirit of reality,...He will testify concerning Me; and you testify also” (John 15:26-27). The Lord meant that we should outwardly testify of the things that the Spirit has inwardly revealed to us concerning Him. When the Lord was about to ascend to the heavens after His resurrection, the disciples wanted to discuss several matters with Him, but He told them that these matters were of no concern to them. Instead, they were told to wait for the Holy Spirit to come upon them. The Holy Spirit would come to testify concerning the Lord. The Lord said, “You shall receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you, and you shall be My witnesses...unto the uttermost part of the earth” (Acts 1:8). We need to understand that this witnessing is carried out not only by preaching Christ in words but even more by people living out Christ. Moreover, the saved ones should live out Christ, not as individuals but as a corporate entity—the Body, which is the church. To live out Christ in this way is to express Christ, to testify of Christ. This is the function of the church concerning Christ.
pehkay
post Feb 15 2013, 09:47 AM

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GOD’S ETERNAL DESIRE—TO EXPRESS HIMSELF IN THE SON

What is God’s desire in eternity? What is the goal of His desire? If we carefully read the entire Bible, we will come to a conclusion: God’s desire, God’s purpose, from eternity to eternity is to express Himself in His Son.

Those who know God all realize that there is something mysterious about God; that is, He is always hidden. God surely exists, but He is invisible. He is invisible, yet He surely exists. This really is a mystery. This is a characteristic of God; He likes to hide Himself.

However, God also likes to manifest Himself. This is even more amazing. The most hidden thing in this meeting hall is electricity, but electricity is also the most manifested thing. The electricity is invisible, but the meeting hall is full of electric light. This is a perfect illustration. The most hidden One in the universe is God, but at the same time, God also is the most manifested One. Although God is invisible, when we observe the phenomena in the universe, we can see proof of God’s existence everywhere.

Here is an amazing thing. In the beginning of the Bible we see only God’s speaking: “He spoke, and it was; / He commanded, and it stood” (Psa. 33:9). God spoke, but He did not manifest Himself. At the end of the Bible, however, a city is manifested; this city is the New Jerusalem. At the end God will not need to speak. God will be the light in the city, His Son will be the lamp, and the city will be His shining forth. God as the light in His Son as the lamp will shine forth through the city. Therefore, the glory of the city is the glory of God, and the shining of the city is the shining of God, just as the shining of the light bulb is the shining of electricity. At that time, since there will be God’s shining, God’s expression, there will not be a need for Him to speak.

This shows us a principle that when there is a need for God’s work, there is more of God’s speaking; and when more of God’s work is manifested, there is more of God’s expression. God’s speaking can be seen in the beginning of Genesis, but not His expression. God’s expression, however, can be seen at the end of Revelation because He has gained a vessel to express Himself. In the beginning, however, God did not have such a vessel. From eternity to eternity the desire of God is to express Himself so that He, as the hidden God, may be completely expressed through a vessel. This vessel fully depends upon His Son. God intends to express Himself in His Son and through His Son.

I. THE MEANING OF BEING THE SON

We need to see that God’s desire is to have sons. God’s work in the universe is a story of gaining many sons. In John 1 and 3 we can see God’s Son, His only begotten Son. But in Romans 8 the only begotten Son has become the firstborn Son. Since Christ is the firstborn Son of God, then there must be more sons than just the Son; there must be other sons. Hebrews 2:10 speaks of God leading many sons into glory. These many sons are a corporate son, a corporate body composed of many sons.

John 12:24 speaks of a grain of wheat which denotes the only begotten Son of God. This grain of wheat was sown into the ground, and it grew to become many grains, that is, many sons. Originally, it was a grain of wheat, which was the only begotten Son, but it becomes many grains, that is, many sons. Originally, there was just the Son; now this Son has become many sons, a corporate body composed of many sons. Therefore, in John 20:17, the Lord said, “My Father and your Father.” Just as He is the Son of God, we also are sons of God. This is God’s intention in the universe.

A. The Son Being the One Who Expresses the Father

In the Bible a son expresses or declares the father. John 1:18 says, “No one has ever seen God; the only begotten Son, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has declared Him.” This shows that the Lord Jesus, as the Son of God, expresses God. All of us, including sisters, are sons of God. Therefore, we all should express God. The son always expresses the father. When we see the son, it is not hard to imagine what the father looks like. In the same way, we express God as sons of God.

B. The Son Being the Image of God

The Son manifests the Father because the Son is the image of the Father. The Chinese refer to a person who does not honor his father as being “non-alike,” that is, a person who is not like his father. This implies that anyone who is not like his father dishonors his father. A man honors his father by being like his father; only a man who is like his father can be considered a dutiful son. A son should look like his father and behave like his father because a son is the expression of the father.

The Son is the image of the Father (Col. 1:15); this is true not only with the only begotten Son but also with the many sons. Romans 8 tells us that God chose us and predestinated us to be conformed to the image of His Son. God did this so that we would express Him with His Son. I hope that God’s children would see the New Testament concept that a son is the expression of the father because a son is the image of the father.

C. The Son Being the Effulgence of God’s Glory and the Impress of His Substance

The Son expresses God not only because He is the image of God but also because He is the effulgence of God’s glory and the impress of His substance (Heb. 1:3). From eternity to eternity God’s desire is to express Himself. God expresses Himself through His nature which is in His Son. This enables His Son to express Him. Originally, His Son was the only begotten Son, but now His Son is identified with many sons, a corporate body composed of sons. He has put His very nature into these sons (2 Pet. 1:4), and these sons have become His expression. When there was merely the only begotten Son, there was not such a thing as the church, but when many sons were produced, the church was also produced. Furthermore, these many sons are not scattered but joined together; they are not individual sons but a corporate son. This corporate son is the church. Therefore, the church is His expression—the effulgence of His glory and the impress of His substance. May the Lord have mercy on us so that we may fully see that God’s eternal purpose is to gain a corporate Body composed of many sons for His expression, which is the church.
pehkay
post Feb 18 2013, 09:21 AM

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I. THE MEANING OF BEING A TESTIMONY—SPEAKING FORTH GOD, DECLARING GOD, AND EXPRESSING GOD

According to the Bible, being God’s testimony involves speaking forth God, declaring God, and expressing God. Even if no humans were serving in this manner, there would be some things or some words that would testify of Him. Whether there are certain words, certain matters, or certain individuals or groups of individuals, whoever or whatever speaks forth God, declares God, and expresses God is a testimony of God. This is the meaning of testimony in the Bible.

II. ADAM, THE PATRIARCHS, THE TABERNACLE, THE TEMPLE, THE PROPHETS, AND ALL THE MEN OF GOD IN THE OLD TESTAMENT BEING TESTIMONIES OF GOD


Adam, the patriarchs, the tabernacle and the temple among the children of Israel, the prophets, and all the men of God in the Old Testament were expressions of God. Since they were expressions of God, they were also testimonies of God. Adam was a testimony of God, as was Abel, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and all the positive persons and things among the children of Israel. Since these people and things expressed God to a lesser or greater degree, they were part of the testimony of God.

III. THE LAW BEING THE TESTIMONY OF GOD


A. The Law Being Called “the Testimony”

In Exodus 25:16, 21, and 40:20, God told Moses to put the law into the Ark, but the Hebrew word used in these verses is actually the word for testimony. This shows that in God’s eyes the law was His testimony. Therefore, He called the law “the testimony.”

According to the context of Psalms 19:7, 78:5, and 119:2 testimony and testimonies also denote the law. In these verses the law is also called “the testimony” or “testimonies.”

B. The Tablets of the Law Being Called “the Tablets of the Testimony”

The law—the Ten Commandments—was written on two tablets. In Exodus 31:18 the Hebrew text actually refers to “the two tablets of the testimony.” Since the law is the testimony, the two tablets on which the law was written were called “the tablets of the testimony.”

C. The Ark Being Called “the Ark of the Testimony”

The Ark in Exodus 40:21 is actually called “the Ark of the Testimony” according to the Hebrew text. This is because the law of God was in the Ark. Since the law was the testimony, the Ark was called “the Ark of the Testimony.”

D. The Law Being a Testimony of God in That It Reveals the Attributes of God and Explains the Kind of God He Is

The law is a testimony of God because the law reveals the attributes of God and explains the kind of God He is. When we read the law, the Ten Commandments, we see that the God who enacted the law is so holy, full of light, loving, and righteous. The Ten Commandments show us the attributes of God, enabling us to know God’s nature. Since the law explains God and reveals His attributes, it is a testimony of God.

If a person is wasteful and unruly, he will surely make laws that are lax and wild. If a person is serious and righteous, he will make laws that are strict and just. When we look at a law, we can know the kind of person who enacted it, because a law always shows the character of the law-giver. In the same way, the laws of the Old Testament are holy, full of light, compassionate, and righteous because this is the character of the God who enacted them. Since the law testifies of God, the law is the testimony of God.

E. Every Requirement on Man, according to What God Is, Being a Law to Man

Although the law is the testimony of God, it is still a law to man. The law consists of all the requirements that God places upon man according to what He is. On one hand, these requirements are a testimony of God, revealing what God is, and on the other hand, they are a law to man, requiring man to do certain things. For example, God is a jealous God; thus, He commands man to not make idols and to not worship idols (20:3-5). Because God is also absolutely loving and pure, He commands man to not kill and to not commit adultery (vv. 13-14). Furthermore, God is absolutely true and honest; for this reason, He commands man to not testify with false testimony, that is, to not lie (v. 16). Therefore, on one hand, these laws declare what kind of God He is, and on the other hand, they require man to conduct himself according to what God is. Since these laws are the explanation of God, they are a testimony of God; since they place requirements on man, they are the law to man.

F. Only God Himself Being Able to Satisfy the Requirements of the Law, Which Are for Man to Have the Divine Attributes and Be Like God

The law requires man to have the divine attributes and be like God. Therefore, the Scriptures say, “I am Jehovah your God. Sanctify yourselves therefore, and be holy, for I am holy” (Lev. 11:44). God requires man to be like Him. This is the law. In this respect, however, there is no way for man to fulfill the requirements of the law. Indeed, man has absolutely no power to keep the law of God; only God Himself can keep the law and fulfill the law. This is because the law of God requires man to have the divine attributes and be like God.

G. Man Being Able to Spontaneously Fulfill the Requirements of the Law, If He Touches God and What God Is, but Attempting to Keep the Law
Because of the Requirements of the Law Being in Vain

Some may ask why God would give such requirements if it is impossible for man to meet the requirements of the law. God gave these requirements for three reasons. First, they show us the kind of God He is. Second, we will see that we have absolutely no power and no way to fulfill the requirements. We are unable to fulfill the requirements of God, and there is no way we can fulfill them by ourselves; only He can fulfill them, and only He has a way to fulfill them. With man this is impossible, but with God it is possible. Only He can meet His requirements. This points to the third reason. He wants to be received into us, and by contacting and touching Him, we allow Him to fulfill His requirements within us and through us.

The requirements of the law of God compel man to receive God. If man could fulfill the requirements of God, man would have no need to trust in God and no need to receive the Lord as Savior. Since man cannot meet the requirements of the law, however, he needs to seek refuge in God and receive God. When God comes into man and becomes the power of life within man and which passes through man, He meets the requirements of His law. Romans 8:4 speaks of the Spirit of life fulfilling the righteous requirement of the law in those who walk according to the spirit.

Therefore, the reality, the substance, of the law is God Himself. If a person touches God Himself, if he touches God’s being, then he is able to spontaneously fulfill the requirements of the law of God. However, if a man wants to keep the ordinances of the law merely because of the requirements of the law, his efforts will be in vain.

The Old Testament saints who wrote the Psalms were godly men who lived in God’s presence. As such, they touched God and God’s being and, therefore, spontaneously lived according to the law. It was easy for them to keep the law because they touched the reality, the substance, of the law, which is God Himself. Others, however, did not live in God’s presence, and, in New Testament terminology, they were not in fellowship with God. They tried instead to keep the law by their own effort. Since God gave them commandments and requirements, they felt that they could fulfill them. They accepted God’s requirements and tried to keep them as laws, but they could not. On the contrary, they broke every law. If anyone tries to keep the law as a set of regulations apart from God, his efforts will be to no avail. If a person has seen that the law is a testimony of God and that the reality of the law is God Himself and if he contacts God often, touching God Himself and living before God, it will result in an ability to fulfill the requirements of the law. This applies especially to those who are in the New Testament age. Although we are not under the law, if we live in God, we will spontaneously fulfill the requirements of the law, because the law is a testimony of God, and the reality, the substance, of the law is God Himself.
pehkay
post Feb 19 2013, 02:39 PM

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THE ENTIRE BIBLE BEING THE TESTIMONY OF GOD

Just as the law is the word of God, the entire Bible is the word of God.

A. As the Testimony of Christ, the Bible also Being the Testimony of God

In John 5:39 the Lord said that the Scriptures testify concerning Him. Since the Scriptures are a testimony of Christ, they are also a testimony of God. If we really touch the spiritual meaning in the Bible when we read it, we cannot help but see Christ. Furthermore, once we see Christ, we cannot help but see God, because the entire Bible is a testimony of God.

B. As the Word of God, the Bible Revealing What God Is and Therefore Being the Testimony of God

All Scripture is a testimony of God because all Scripture is the word of God, revealing the kind of God He is. Just as the law reveals God, the Scriptures fully reveal God. Therefore, the Scriptures are the real and full testimony of God. The reality, the substance, of the Scriptures is God Himself, just as it is with the law.

C. One Needing to Touch God to Be Able to Touch the Reality of the Scriptures; Otherwise, the Scriptures Being Dead Letters or Vain Doctrines

When a person comes to read the Bible, he needs to contact God to be able to touch the reality and the substance of the Bible. If he reads the Bible apart from God, the Bible will be either dead letters or vain doctrines to him. This is really true. If we do not read the Bible while touching God and being in God, the Bible will be merely dead letters or vain doctrines.

When we read the Bible, we need to touch God, meet God, and live in God; only then can we touch the reality and the substance of the Bible. Otherwise, we will feel that the Bible is tasteless, having only dead letters or vain doctrines. We have often said that some read the Bible and find only dead teachings, such as being humble, patient, meek, and peaceful. But can we really be humble? Can we be patient? Is it possible for us to be meek or peaceful? The more we try to be humble, the prouder we become; the more we try to be patient, the quicker we are provoked; the more we try to be peaceful, the more contentious we become; the more we try to be meek, the hotter is our temper. As a result, we see that such teachings are simply dead letters and vain doctrines which are completely useless. But when we contact God in the Scriptures, the reality of humility will be worked into us and the power of being meek will operate in us. We do not need to decide to be humble, nor do we need to determine to be meek. The reality of humility which causes us to be spontaneously humble is within us; the power which enables us to be spontaneously meek is within us. The Scriptures are living and real because God Himself is the reality of the Scriptures; the Scriptures testify of God. Those who have not touched God can touch only the letter in the Scriptures. At the most they can touch only the doctrines in the Scriptures, but they cannot meet the God of reality, concerning whom the Scriptures testify. We must see that the Bible does not consist of doctrines. Rather, the Bible is a testimony; it is the testimony of God, and God Himself is the reality of the Bible.

(short one) ....
pehkay
post Feb 19 2013, 05:30 PM

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eh ... What does that mean?
pehkay
post Feb 20 2013, 11:35 AM

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CHRIST BEING THE TESTIMONY OF GOD

A. As the Living Word of God, Christ Revealing God and Being the Testimony of God in Reality

Revelation 1:5 and 3:14 show us that Christ is the testimony, that is, the testimony of God. Christ is the testimony of God because He is the Word of the living God. Whereas the Bible is the written word of God, Christ is the living word of God. John 1:1 says that in the beginning was the Word and that the Word was God. One day the Word became flesh and tabernacled among men so that men were able to behold the glory of God. This Word is Christ, who is the declaration of God, the expression of God. Therefore, Christ is the testimony of God.

B. Man Not Being Able to Know God outside of Christ; Man Being Able to Touch God Only through Christ

All the fullness of the Godhead dwells in Christ bodily. When Christ lived on the earth, He lived out God. Hence, Christ is the living testimony of God. Apart from Christ, man can neither know God nor find God. God is in Christ, and Christ is the embodiment of God, the testimony of God.

John 14:6-11 shows us this matter. Philip said to the Lord Jesus, “Lord, show us the Father and it is sufficient for us.” The Lord was surprised and said to Philip, “Have I been so long a time with you, and you have not known Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father” (vv. 8-9). In other words, the Lord was saying, “When I live before you, God is living before you; I am the living out of God.” In verse 6 He said, “No one comes to the Father except through Me.” This could be translated as, “No one can reach the Father except through Me.” This means that no one can contact God or touch God except through Him. In order for man to contact God, to touch God, and to reach God, he needs to do it through Christ and in Christ, because Christ is the embodiment of God, the testimony of God expressed.

THE HOLY SPIRIT BEING THE TESTIMONY OF CHRIST

The Holy Spirit is also the testimony of Christ.

A. The Holy Spirit, as the Transfiguration of Christ through His Death, Resurrection, Ascension, and Descension, Declaring All the Things of Christ to Men and Glorifying Christ as the Testimony of Christ

John 16:5-7 and 14:16-18 show us that after the Lord Jesus passed through death, resurrection, and ascension into the heavens, He would descend as the Spirit. Just as He is the incarnation of God, the Spirit is the transfiguration of Christ. God is in Christ, and Christ is in the Spirit. After His ascension, He came as the Spirit with all His elements. These elements include all that He is, all that He has, all that He has accomplished, and all that He has experienced; all of these elements are in the Spirit. Therefore, John 16:13-15 tells us that when the Spirit comes, He will declare Christ to us and glorify Christ. Furthermore, John 15:26 also says that when the Spirit comes, He will testify concerning Christ.

Let me give an illustration, even though it is not completely adequate. Sulfur is often present in the waters of a hot spring. The water is like the Spirit, and the sulfur in the water is like Christ in the Spirit. Before the sulfur was present in the water, there was no element of sulfur in it. But when sulfur is added to the spring water, the water has an element of sulfur in it. Thus, wherever the water flows, sulfur also flows. In like manner, the Spirit now contains all the elements of Christ. The various elements of Christ—all that He is, all that He has, all that He has accomplished, and all that He has experienced—are contained in the Spirit. For example, because He is God, He has the element of divinity; because He became a man, He has the element of humanity; because He passed through incarnation, He has the element of incarnation; and because He passed through death, He has the element of death; He resurrected and thus has the element of resurrection; He ascended and was exalted, so He also has the elements of ascension and exaltation. All of His elements are in the Spirit. When the Spirit with all these elements comes into us, the element of God comes, the element of uplifted humanity comes, and the elements of incarnation, death, resurrection, ascension, and exaltation all come into us. Therefore, we are united with God, and we have died, resurrected, ascended, and been exalted with Christ. This is similar to drinking a glass of grape juice. When we drink the juice, all of the elements of the juice come into us. It contains the element of grapes, the element of sugar, and various other elements. Once the juice comes into us, all of the elements in the juice come into us. In like manner, because the Spirit has all the elements of Christ, when the Spirit comes into us, He brings all the elements of Christ into us and testifies concerning Christ within us, letting us know the kind of person Christ is. When the Spirit comes into us and touches us within, we “taste” Christ. If there is sugar in water, we will taste the sweetness of sugar when our tongue touches the sugar in the water. In like manner, when the Spirit enters into us and touches us within, we feel glorious, holy, bright, and transcendent. What are these elements? They are Christ, because Christ is glorious, holy, bright, and transcendent. People may ask us, “What kind of person is Christ?” We can say, “Although I cannot explain, I have tasted Him within me.” People may ask, “Where is Christ?” We can say, “Although I cannot show you, there is a taste within me. I have definitely touched Christ. But I do not need to go to heaven to touch Him; He came down from heaven and He touched me within in the Spirit.” The Spirit, as Christ’s transfiguration, reveals Him within us. Therefore, as the testimony of Christ, the Spirit glorifies Christ.

B. Apart from the Holy Spirit, Man Being Unable to Know Christ; Man Needing to Be in the Holy Spirit to Be Able to Touch Christ

Apart from the Holy Spirit, there is no way for man to know Christ. Man must be in the Holy Spirit to be able to touch Christ. First Corinthians 12:3 says, “No one can say, Jesus is Lord! except in the Holy Spirit.” Those of us who are saved truly have this experience. Often when we touch the Holy Spirit within through fellowship or prayer, we spontaneously say, “Jesus is Lord! Jesus is the Lord of all!” When we say this, we feel glorious, bright, sweet, and peaceful. This indicates that we have touched Christ in the Holy Spirit. Once we are in the Holy Spirit, we touch Christ, because the Holy Spirit is the transfiguration of Christ and the testimony of Christ.
pehkay
post Feb 20 2013, 04:39 PM

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QUOTE(unknown warrior @ Feb 20 2013, 03:48 PM)
copy pasta from Atheist website?

http://www.atheismresource.com/2010/jesus-...-existed-at-all

http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/rob...ce/fiction.html

Tak payah la. Kalau Aku jawap pun, bukan nya ko paham.

Already state that Nazareth exist, you just copy this line as a reply?

Ni mcm reply kat robot.

BTW Christianity is not just about texts. Try and brain that if you understand.
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biggrin.gif If he have google it in wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazareth

The evidences are all there tongue.gif
pehkay
post Feb 20 2013, 05:02 PM

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QUOTE(highlowyat @ Feb 20 2013, 04:49 PM)
The earliest mention of Nazareth in ancient sources is the 4th century AD - that is also about the time the Bible was organized into a religious document.
Nazareth is not mentioned in any ancient texts other than the Bible. There were 63 towns listed in Galilee in the Talmud. Nazareth is not one of them.
Josephus mentioned 45 cities in Galilee, Nazareth was not one of them.
There is a cemetery under the Church of the Annunciation. A cemetery was never located in a Jewish village, it was prohibited by the Torah. Those tombs date to around 70ad - the time that the canonical gospels were being written and redacted.
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Haha ... actually the the earliest reference to Nazareth outside the Christian gospels, by Sextus Julius Africanus (c. 200 AD), speaks of “Nazara” as a village in "Judea" and locates it near an as-yet unidentified “Cochaba.”

Nazareth is so small at that time .... probably uninhabited ... why would it mentioned as one of the big towns ..... go figures smile.gif E. Meyers & J. Strange, of his book, Archaeology, the Rabbis, & Early Christianity estimates only 480 .... small kampunglar!!
pehkay
post Feb 20 2013, 05:15 PM

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QUOTE(highlowyat @ Feb 20 2013, 05:09 PM)
The bible describes an earth that is a dome covered flat and stationary island-like surface that is the center of the universe in which it is magically suspended.
You want me to believe that?

Who is the father of Joseph? Jacob or Heli?

MAT 1:16 And Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

LUK 3:23 And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli.
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Haha ...

Here the genealogy says that "Jacob begot Joseph," but Luke 3:23 says, "Joseph, the son of Heli." Luke's record was "according to law" (a literal translation of "so it was thought" in Luke 3:23), indicating that Joseph was not actually the son of Heli but was reckoned his son according to the law. Joseph was the son-in-law of Heli, Mary's father. This may be a case according to Num. 27:1-8 and 36:1-12, in which a regulation was made by God that if any parents had only daughters as heirs, the inheritance would go to the daughters, who would then have to marry a man of their own tribe in order to keep their inheritance within that tribe. Even such a regulation in the Old Testament is related to the genealogy of Christ, showing that all Scripture is a record of Christ.

Research ... research ...

This post has been edited by pehkay: Feb 20 2013, 05:16 PM
pehkay
post Feb 21 2013, 02:02 PM

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QUOTE(unknown warrior @ Feb 21 2013, 12:50 AM)
...
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If I may ... it is neither transubstatiation nor symbolic tongue.gif tongue.gif

The Word of God tells us that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of reality, and that He will lead us into all reality. Anything which can separate us from the leading of the Spirit is not reality. God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship Him in spirit. Outside the sphere of the Spirit, which is the sphere of God, there is no reality. Only that which is spiritual is real, and spiritual things can only subsist in the realm of the Spirit. If something is separated from the Spirit, it is dead. If we are to be brought into any spiritual reality, it can only be through our dependence on the Spirit of reality. Whatever we can arrive at by thought and study, by the seeing of the eyes and the hearing of the ears, is outside the realm of eternal verity; it is not the truth. There are three different viewpoints regarding these: the materialistic viewpoint, the intellectual viewpoint, and the spiritual viewpoint. In other words, we might refer to these viewpoints as Romish, Reformist, and Christian.

THE MATERIALISTIC VIEWPOINT

The materialist notes the word, "This is My body" (Matt. 26:26), and looking at the material bread, he insists that a change must take place in the bread so that it may be truly called Christ's body, because the Word is true. The result is the Romish doctrine of transubstantiation.

THE INTELLECTUAL VIEWPOINT

The reformist says, "This represents the Lord's body; it is a symbol of His body." But the Word of God speaks of nothing concerning representation or symbolism; it speaks of literal fact. It says, "This is My body."

THE SPIRITUAL VIEWPOINT

Our Lord's own words regarding the bread and the wine leave no room for the Romish theory of transubstantiation or for the Reformist theory of symbolism. Concerning the bread He said, "This is My body," and of the wine He said, "This is My blood." When He referred to it as His blood, He also referred to it as the fruit of the vine. At the same time it is His blood and it is the fruit of the vine. No transubstantiation has taken place. This fruit of the vine is His blood. The one is the other. There is not the type and the anti-type, the representation and the real; there is only the real.

But we need spiritual eyes to be open to see. We can only be brought into the reality of the Lord's supper by the Spirit of reality. Paul quoted our Lord, who said, "This cup is the new covenant established in My blood" (1 Cor. 11:25). It is the cup of wine, but it is still the blood. Paul also said, "Seeing that there is one bread, we who are many are one Body" (10:17). It is readily admitted that "we" refers to literal persons. How then can the "one bread" be figurative? Literal and figurative language cannot be combined in one phrase. "We who are many" is literal; "one bread" is also literal. "We who are many" is a fact; "one bread" is no less of a fact. For those who have touched spiritual reality in the Lord's table, there is no thought of type or doctrine as we behold the bread and wine. We see only the broken body and the shed blood. For those who have seen the ultimate, the doctrine is the reality and the type is the reality. There is only the reality in the Spirit.
pehkay
post Feb 21 2013, 02:25 PM

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QUOTE(unknown warrior @ Feb 20 2013, 10:38 PM)
Nice list of resource you got there ... smile.gif
pehkay
post Feb 22 2013, 04:01 PM

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Oh why are you arrested in the first place?
pehkay
post Feb 25 2013, 01:31 PM

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Twofoldness of the truth smile.gif

Faith and works are inseparable; they are two sides of one thing. What is called faith in Hebrews is called works in James. Works are the evidence of faith, whereas faith is the source of works. If one says he has faith yet does not have the works of faith, his faith is dead. Therefore, where there is justification by faith, there must also be justification by works.

James 2:26 says, “For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.” From James 2:14 onward, the relationship between faith and works is discussed. There is a kind of faith that is without works, vain, superficial, and dead. However, there is another kind of faith that has works and is living. Works prove and perfect faith. James used the cases of Abraham and Rahab as evidence to prove this point. Finally, he used one illustration: “For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.” A living faith must have works, because faith without works is dead just as the body without the spirit is dead.

To be justified by faith is for the receiving of the divine life (Rom. 5:18); to be justified by works is through living the divine life. Since the living is the issue of life, to be justified by works is the issue of being justified by faith. Abraham's offering of Isaac and Rahab's receiving of the messengers and sending them out are works that issued from their living faith. A living tree surely brings forth fruit. Being justified by works is not inconsistent with being justified by faith. The latter is the cause, bringing forth the former; the former is the effect, the outcome and proof, of the latter.

wink.gif

This post has been edited by pehkay: Feb 25 2013, 01:31 PM
pehkay
post Feb 27 2013, 04:17 PM

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innocent.gif
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post Feb 28 2013, 09:37 AM

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QUOTE(OlgaC4 @ Feb 28 2013, 09:27 AM)
A total of 120 people in the upper room. Do you think all the 120 people are very very holy when they received the Holy Spirit?
The gift of speaking in tongues is for everybody. Just that some church is less charismatic.

John 4:24 NIV
God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth.
Just my 2cents. Please don't shoot me ok
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Erm ... smile.gif John 4:24 should not be used here smile.gif the meaning of that verse in its context .... way another level ....

I agree it is for everyone but according to the light in 1 Corinthians 14, it is not very useful for the building up of the Body.

Also, the “tongues” spoken in 2:4 were dialects (vv. 6, 8). The disciples were Galileans (v. 7), yet they spoke the different foreign dialects of the attendants who came from various parts of the world. This is strong proof that tongue-speaking must be an understandable language, not merely a voice or sound uttered by the tongue. The Greek word rendered “speak out” in verse 4 is “a peculiar word, and purposely chosen to denote the clear, loud utterance” (Vincent).

In verses 5 through 8 say, “Now there were Jews dwelling in Jerusalem, devout men from every nation under heaven. And when this sound occurred, the multitude came together and were confounded, because each one heard them speaking in his own dialect. And they were all amazed and marveled, saying, Look, are not all these who are speaking Galileans? And how is it that we each hear them in our own dialect in which we were born?” The Jews in verse 5 were devout Jews who came from their dispersion to Jerusalem to keep the feast of Pentecost. Verse 10 speaks of proselytes, Gentiles who were converted to Judaism (6:5; 13:43). The word “dialect” in verses 6 and 8 is synonymous with “tongues” in verse 4.

According to verse 11, the people exclaimed, “We hear them speaking in our own tongues the great things of God.” The Greek word for “tongues” here is glossa (that's where glossary comes from). In this chapter glossa is used for two things: the speaking organ (v. 3) and dialects (vv. 4, 11), referring to the dialects in verses 6 and 8. This evidence affords no ground to say that tongue-speaking may be merely a voice or sound uttered by the tongue, the speaking organ. Rather, tongue-speaking must be a dialect, because what the disciples spoke in tongues were all different dialects. In this sense, tongues and dialects are synonyms, interchangeably used in these verses.

So, if I am suddenly speaking German, you know I am really speaking in tongue icon_rolleyes.gif
pehkay
post Feb 28 2013, 05:18 PM

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Testimomy of Jesus

God’s goal in His creation of man was to have a corporate expression of Himself. According to this goal, man was made in the image of God in order to be His testimony (Gen. 1:26). This means that man was destined to be the expression of God. Because Adam failed God in this respect, Jesus came as the second man (1 Cor. 15:47b) to take the position and function of Adam. Thus, the living person of Jesus is the expression, image, and testimony of God (Col. 1:15). In the same way, the church today is the testimony of Jesus, that is, His expression. In the first chapter of the Bible, man is in the image of God to express God, and in the last two chapters of the Bible there is a building, the New Jerusalem, to express God. According to the book of Revelation, God on His throne has the appearance of jasper, and the New Jerusalem also has the appearance of jasper (4:2-3; 21:11, 18). This means that the entire city is God’s expression in His image. By this we can see the consistency of the Bible from the beginning to the end.

No doubt, there is the matter of our personal salvation in the Bible. We were all lost, and we must believe in the Lord Jesus to be saved. To a certain extent, we also need to seek the Lord to improve our living and conduct. However, this is not God’s consistent goal. God’s consistent goal is to have a unique expression of Himself. Neither the sun by day nor the moon by night can express God. Even the myriads of angels are not qualified or destined to express God; they are simply His servants (Heb. 1:13-14). In the whole universe, only man has the destiny to express God. The meaning of man is that he is to be the expression of God. Man was created not merely to be saved, to go to heaven, or to be a good person with good behavior. Simply to be saved and have a certain behavior are far off from God’s consistent goal. We were all created in the image of God with the destiny of expressing God.

Moreover, the expression of God according to His consistent goal is not individualistic but corporate and collective. We may claim to be expressing God, but it may be in an individual way, not in a corporate way. From the first page to the last, the Bible reveals that what God desires as His expression is corporate. God commanded the Israelites to build only one tabernacle. At that time over a million people were traveling in the wilderness, and that small tabernacle was only thirty cubits long and ten cubits wide, smaller than a common meeting hall (Exo. 26:15-16, 18, 20, 22-23). Nevertheless, that small tabernacle was the unique center for the worship of God. As such, it was the unique expression of God. Since God is one, He did not want to have more than one tabernacle among His people. God is omnipresent, but He does not desire to be omnipresent in that way. We can never divide God’s expression. God is uniquely one, so His expression must also be uniquely one. Similarly, there was only one temple of God in the ancient times. Since there were twelve tribes, it seems logical that each tribe should have had one temple, just as in modern times the United States has fifty states, each with its own legislature. However, our modern wisdom is not superior to God’s wisdom. All the twelve tribes had only one temple, because God’s expression is unique.

Likewise in the New Testament, there is only one church, because there is only one Christ. In the Old Testament there were three unique things: one God, one tabernacle, and one temple. In the New Testament there are also three unique things: one Christ, one church, and one holy city, the New Jerusalem.
pehkay
post Mar 1 2013, 10:28 AM

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biggrin.gif ahaha .... it can get kinda hot smile.gif
pehkay
post Mar 1 2013, 11:56 AM

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Hmmm .... biggrin.gif what's the topic now?
pehkay
post Mar 1 2013, 12:01 PM

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QUOTE(skydrake @ Mar 1 2013, 11:57 AM)
tongue.gif

add-on: Only God is good, said Jesus.
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biggrin.gif So, anything other than God is evil tongue.gif

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(it's true)

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