wa aiseh,, now got poisoned loh.. need to get both the lx7 and fz200... but dunno which seller can give original panasonic warranty...??? can give suggestions? Thanks ..!

This post has been edited by budgee: Sep 10 2012, 10:19 AM

No lar... surrender keeping up with all the new gears di and my resolution is no more camera gear buying be it compact, lens or whatever.

You wanna tok poison? Meet RX1.. the RX100 big bad brother. Full frame with fixed 35mm f2. Now how badass is that!!

http://www.mirrorlessrumors.com/sony-rx1-i...xed-zeiss-lens/

That seller selling at 1.5k, sounds good

i wonder why making this lx7 vs rx100 instead of lx7 vs ex2f ? ex2f offer quite nice specification also..

Because on paper, everyone has a perception that RX100 is better than LX7. This is because of the sensor size and the mega sized 20 megapixels. But these cameras does not have interchangeable lenses and you have to look at them along with the lens aperture and quality. By using Dxomark and ImaginingResources samples, we can evaluate their performance and compare them. Also I have focused more on image quality (combination of sensor and lens) instead of other factors such as camera size and ergonomics (shooting experience), focal length, etc.

EX2F is very similar to LX7 because they have the same sensor size. So as XZ-1, S100, etc. The most interesting feature it has over LX7 is the flip screen. Unfortunately, they don't get market share and most review sites don't even bother to look at them. Dxomark doesn't even rate ex1 and to be very honest I am not aware of ex1 all these time! ImagingResources doesn't provide image samples for ex2f too. So it is hard to do anything as what I have done with RX100 and LX7. Now dxomark has released score for RX100 (ISO score of 190) which makes the comparison even more easier. If dxomark score of LX7 came out around 195, it will confirm everything I have said.

If you have specific questions about any of the cameras, just ask it here and all of us will be very happy to discuss them.

Can anyone give an opinion on comparisions between LX7 and Sony NEX 5/7 with kit lenses?
I believe the Sony kit lense only have aperture of f3.5.
So under low light conditions or night street scenes which ones would be better?

When using base ISO (80 for LX7 and 100 for NEX 5N) the picture of NEX 5N will always be cleaner. However ISO 80 of LX7 looks very good already and can sustain some post processing too.

At high ISO, they perform the same thanks to LX7 large aperture of 1.4.

I estimate Dxomark ISO score of LX7 to be 180+.
NEX 5N is already rated as 1,079.

NEX has close to 2 2/3 stops advantage in ISO performance.
However, if you are just using kit lens on NEX, at the wide end, LX7 will have 2 2/3 stops advantage (f1.4 vs f3.5) so it offset the NEX ISO advantage by exactly the same amount.
At tele end, LX7 is f2.3 and Nex kit at f5.6, that's also 2 2/3 stops difference, so it again offset the NEX ISO advantage.

So they are the same when come to low light shooting.

However, depth of field is different. You will still get 1 stop more bokeh from NEX in full frame equivalent. What I mean is the bokeh you get is the same as shooting with a full frame camera at f5.25-8.4 (NEX) and f7.14-11.73 (LX7). Since we barely shoot more than f8 with full frame, both setup are not really good at getting bokeh, unless you invest in a f1.8 primes for your NEX camera.

That's why I have sold my Nex 5N to fund this LX7. I can no longer swap lens but I get a smaller camera in return that can do almost the same as the kit lens. I also get more buttons and dials to play with which I really miss with the Nex 5N (However, the new NEX 6 announced today has more buttons and an EVF! But it will cost RM3k+).

LX7 is RM1,500. NEX 5N with kit is around RM2,200. NEX camera has very good grip although the camera is very small. But the lens is just too big for my taste. LX7 is power zoom white NEX is mechanical zoom. Some people don't like the zoom speed of the LX7. I can shoot with primes when I use my SLR so certainly turning the lever to zoom is certainly faster than changing lens.

I understand both cameras quite well, feel free to ask anything you want.

p/s when it come to mirrorless with changeable lenses, I have decided to go for micro four thirds because of the lens choice and for some reason, I just love Panasonic cameras although they don't sell well (have tried Olympus, Sony and Fuji... sold them all).

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Added on September 12, 2012, 4:26 pmIf you calculate the same way, you will be surprise that LX7 will be better in low light comparing to other "kits" such as 600D/60D/7D with kit lens and also GX1/GF1/PEN with kit lens. Of course, those camera can come back to kill LX7 by using primes. Size, weight and compactness is the biggest trade-off here.

This post has been edited by samsungfreak: Sep 12 2012, 04:26 PM

Thanks for your insight.

I'm still using my LX3. Currently, considering upgrading to LX3, RX100 or NEX 7. Not sure whether I can put up with the bulkiness of the NEX + lense.
Sony cameras does seem to have modes like sweep panorama, hand held twilight while the LX7 has build in ND filters.

Do consider NEX 6 as well. To me it looks better than Nex 7 and Nex 5R (replace Nex 5N) because it is "only" 16mp, has a build in EVF & hotshoe, 1 external mode dial + 2 control dials (but not implemented well, hopefully firmware will fix it) and of course, it is cheaper than Nex 7. Unfortunately, the touchscreen feature found in NEX 5N/5R is not available in the 6 and 7 (Really 67... lol)

The tests are good and well in a test environment if done right. But nothing beats a one to one comparison by someone who has both cameras and who has to be objective enough to say it like it is based on real world tests.

Perhaps its better you view the comparison done in link below...

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp...essage=42435318

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Added on September 12, 2012, 7:17 pm
if you don't click at the bottom to see the whole conversation thread, you will miss the pics.. which is found in link below.


http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp...essage=42440005

This post has been edited by budgee: Sep 12 2012, 07:17 PM

same dilemma haha

Trying out my new LX7 tonight ....

please... post some photo.. hehe

A camera that I can bring anywhere compared to a heavy dslr.

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Added on September 15, 2012, 5:37 pmLow lighting in indoor, ( f1.4, 1/60 sec, ISO 320, 5mm or 24mm in 35mm focal length )
adequate if need to print.





a quick shot .. ( f1.4, 1/60sec, iso500, 5mm )




a night shot .. (f1.4, 1/60 sec, iso400, 5 mm)

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Added on September 15, 2012, 10:25 pmWith good light, the camera is excellent. But that goes for most cameras.
Its in low light that this camera makes use of its large aperture of f1.4 to make a difference.


Other things I like is the color reproduction. The reds are accurate, so are the greens and blues.
I also like the feature to change the white balance in steps and you can watch the screen while the changes in warmth or coolness of the scene takes place.
Basically my criteria for getting a camera is one that can help me get the shot. This means that the cam must shoot with minimum shutter delay, sometimes there are scenes where if you miss the moment, its gone forever. It must also have good wide angle lens in order to get the elements into the frame, i rate this very highly as each photo has a story to tell for a walkabout cam. Picture composition will make the difference between a good pic and a so so pic.
The low light capability is another impt one as this will be the difference between a sharp pic and a blurry one, without using the flash. I normally like to shoot with natural lighting. So it depends on what you want the cam to do for you.

But at the high ISOs, there are distinct noise levels. It is OK for me. But for those who pixel peep, you may want to check further. And this is probably due to the small size of its sensor. If you want to snap pics and then do major cropping, the pixelation will start to show. But if you do minimum cropping and with about 8 mpixels, you can print 8 x 10 without issues. That is the most i want. i mostly keep pics for viewing on the screen and create slide shows to play back on the TV.

This post has been edited by budgee: Sep 16 2012, 07:19 AM

Much as DXO marks has made people become very clinical in photography, I still very much stick to "whichever camera that inspires me/make me want to shoot with them" philosophy.

For 1 aspect alone, I'd go for Sony RX100 without second thought, build. The build on LX7 is shallow, plasticky, and hollow in between, the grip area is squeeky, with very strong hint of plastic build. Sony RX100 on the other hand is very packed, grip is good, and cliche I know but it's really very solid.

I understand some people might agree that the advantage of having bigger sensor might be negated but the sub par jpeg engine/sub par lens, but one thing very aparent in the sample pictures you showed above that is lacking: dynamic range. IMO dynamic range of the sensor is the deciding factor od whether or not your photos "look" or "feeL' very compact camera-ish. **check the ceiling light on the first pic.

**note: i'm merely a hobbyist so I may sound ignorant please forgive me if I do. =)

The Sony and the Panasonic are cameras with different specs, so to compare one with the other is not apple to apple.
- the sensor makes a big difference for the Sony, Panny's one is really small
- the lens is another one ( i need the 24mm wide angle, the few mm makes a big diff and the f-stop 1.4 is great )
- the price is also one more to consider - 1500 vs Sony's 2200, approximately

If I had a choice for an ideal compact carry everywhere camera, I would want the Sony's sensor, body size (- although it may be a bit too small to put all the Panny's controls in), the Panasonic's lens, Panny's cam body controls and menu system, macro focusing speed of the Panny..

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

The other thing is the HD video, sometimes i do want to be able to shoot at least 1 hour of video whether its a performance or some presentation attended.
The LX7 is set to a limit of 30 mins or so. I really need to test this to be sure. But the Sony cannot shoot over a certain time as the sensor or battery will overheat and a warning will appear before it will shut down. This is built in to protect the sensitive chips inside and as the design is so compact, there is little room for the heat to escape, i think there are reports that this time is between 10 mins to about 20 before overheating and this will depend on the external room temperature.

The previous LX5 could shoot video until the battery ran out which is about 2 hours plus.. so i will be checking out how to get this on the lx7 too.

This post has been edited by budgee: Sep 17 2012, 06:00 PM

Hmmm, i think i may just get the rx100 to play around, the size is a big advantage. If i do get one, it will be to test it fully and give away as a gift to someone's birthday next month.. Heh heh..

As a compact cam, it does fulfill most of the average teenager's requirements.. High IQ, small pocketable size, point and shoot ease...

statue was lighted up with some spot lights, shot in paradigm mall. f1.8, 1/80 sec, iso160, 8mm, almost all shots are in iAuto.



This post has been edited by budgee: Sep 17 2012, 09:29 PM

That looks rather good even under iA mode.. a bit regret din get but I am waiting for Fujifilm's offer in a way.. since my LX3 still perfectly usable

I'm not a photog so i dont know how to set camera setting manually.

just wondering:
1) this camera is good when set to auto mode? i mean point and shoot without adjusting every parameter
2) is it good in indoor/low-lighting area without using flash?

thanks.