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English Clubs Manchester United Street Talks, 9 Aug | Chelsea v Man Utd | 21:55, CH813

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Wan
post Jul 29 2009, 04:29 AM

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Can't wait for thathe game. Valencia!!

Read on another forum, someone got the ticket for the Audi cup only for 30Euro. Get to watch 2 games too.. only need to pay 30Euro. Considering the quality on show, and 2 games back to back, that is cheap!


Added on July 29, 2009, 4:43 am
QUOTE
12:20 – Not only are we sharing the hotel with Boca Juniors, but AC Milan and even the hosts, Bayern Munich, are here as well. In fact, I've just walked past Ronaldinho in the lobby. It's certainly a star-studded affair. Anyway, I've just returned from training where Valencia, Vidic and Cathcart all had their first run-outs with the side. Valencia's crossing looked first-rate during an attackers v defenders drill, but it was Zoran Tosic who really caught my eye. When he signed we were told a lot about his lethal left foot and it seems it's all true: he was rifling shots into the top corners this morning.
Sounds interesting.. need to put Vida as a striker tomorrow. biggrin.gif


Added on July 29, 2009, 4:53 amMU training in Germany.. 14mins long.
http://www.eyep.tv/beitrag/1-bundesliga/vi...h-die-ehre.html

This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 29 2009, 04:53 AM
Wan
post Jul 29 2009, 12:09 PM

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Welbeck scored 2 and got one assists for England U19 I think in the other game.
Wan
post Jul 29 2009, 05:21 PM

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QUOTE(Hevrn @ Jul 29 2009, 03:14 PM)
He's not the run of the mill goal poacher if that's what you're trying to imply. He's a proven goal scorer though, and very much capable of hitting the 20 goals a season mark which he has been doing consistently. He's not the kind to wait in the box hoping to capitalize on a half chance or bury a tap-in, though he's done that alot of times for us in the past. Where he thrives is when he runs at the defenders with his power and pace. Not many players are capable of keeping up with Ronaldo when we are on the counter, but trust Wayne Rooney to be bombing up the pitch whenever theres a turnover. I do hope Fergie keeps to his words this time to play Rooney in the 'hole.' We know Fergie has said that numerous times in the past only to have no choice but to put him on the left wing, but now with a certain winker gone, he'll be our star player. This is his chance to prove to the masses that he is indeed world class, becoz outside the United circle very few ppl actually mention Rooney when it comes to being one of the best. Another potential Ballon D'Or winner in our ranks? I certainly hope so.
*
SAF only said he would play him through the middle, like what he said last season, with Rooney furthest forward. Would be interesting with SAF also saying Berba gonna play as a centre forward more, but to me it would just mean he would spend less time near the middle circle and more around/in the box but still playing behind Rooney. Do remember we had Ronaldo attacking the box last season, and we made use of that and build the team around him somewhat.

QUOTE(mokhzaini @ Jul 29 2009, 03:28 PM)
rooney is there, the left wing for a reason. he defends very well, tracking back when opposition got the ball. cover and back evra up. yes of course playing this way his turbuelence of energy is wasted. but for a very good reason.

and only occasionally he has to be there i.e big games, european campaigns.

i dun know whats with the other midfielders. tosic/ nani cannot attack+defend very well like rooney? why we cant put somebody else there?

real preseason starts with this audi cup. thats for sure.
*
Tosic wasn't ready last season, which is why he was stuck in reserve. Nani was shit. And Park and Ronaldo wasn't always firing.

We only ever used him out wide when we chase the game playing 442 with him out wide and Berba-Tevez upfront or with Giggs behind either one of them, and obviously in a 433 in the big games. Park/Ronaldo-Ronaldo/Berba-Rooney. That's just the way it is. We have better options in the centre, but out wide, not that much(form, readiness etc).

QUOTE(edgeff @ Jul 29 2009, 03:34 PM)
I do hope Fergie keeps to his words this time to play Rooney in the 'hole.'
yeah, indeed that's what i meant...his best position is to play in the 'hole', just behind the main striker.that's why i said, as far as i remember watching rooney played, i rate his best performance during euro2004 in portugal. where he played really well in the hole, just behind owen. but when he moved to MU, i don't really remember SAF given him chances to excel in that position.
if this season, SAF decided to play 4-4-2 (the last 2 season2 we play 4-3-3 most of the time), then i think that's the best oppurtunity for SAF to give rooney more time as a support-striker rather than winger. for me, his best quality is passing and vision rather than finishing.
*
Since Keano left:
Normal(which is majority) games(Spurs, Newcastle, Sunderland, you get the picture) = 442
Big games(CL, Arsenal, Chelsea, Liverpool, Barca) = 433
Of course we sometimes use 442 for the big games/433 for the normal games.. but for the most part, we setup like what I wrote above.

06/07= Rooney-Saha
07/08= Rooney with Tevez behind him
08/09= Rooney with Berba(or occasionally Tevez) behind him

Seriously.. where do these "Majority of games=433" or "Rooney=majority out wide" stuff comes from? I watched a lot of our games, either something must be wrong with my eyes, or Astro/stream stuff sabotaged me and showed me different games to the ones you saw.

Sure Ronaldo had somewhat of a free role, and had less defensive duty, be he still play out wide, with license to cut in and attack the box at all opportunity. Doesn't mean he played upfront in a 433.

Rooney have been our furthest striker since Tevez came here. He played behind Berba last season. Even when Saha was here, SAF sometimes played Rooney ahead of Saha. The pace, power, movement to run behind defenders etc, he's our best option there. SAF sees him in that way currently, although we would never know what he has on his mind. Maybe he just wants Rooney to develop that part of his game and be more deadlier in the future. He's already great playing in the hole, but he is hot and cold in front of goal. SAF way of fine tuning Rooney to become a complete striker, able do to anything..

This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 29 2009, 05:23 PM
Wan
post Jul 29 2009, 06:11 PM

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QUOTE(edgeff @ Jul 29 2009, 05:53 PM)
when i said we play 4-3-3, it is during the game, not what the formation show at the beginning of the match. maybe i watch different MU games though tongue.gif. but for me, the last 2 seasons (not 3 seasons), we play 4-3-3 more than 4-2-2. rooney most of the time on the left but during 07/08 season, rooney-tevez-ronaldo always rotated their position during the games. so it doesn't matter if rooney start in the middle of on the left, but during the game, they will rotate their position.
*
Not really. We've played basically the same formation for the last 3 and a half season, except for the last two Ronaldo had greater freedom. We've always had players interchange throughout games, that's how we play, but one thing is certain when Rooney is not played out wide, is that he's the one furthest forward with Berba/Tevez behind him. He's certainly not played out wide next to Berba with Ronaldo on the other side. It was Berba behind Rooney and Ronaldo and someone out wide. Did you think Park or Nani played in the centre of midfield then? It was obvious in games one of them would play out wide with Ronaldo on the other side. Why not call it 424? Really it's 442.. variants of it.

Ronaldo-Carrick-Scoles-Giggs
Rooney-Saha

Ronaldo-Carrick-Someone-Nani
Rooney-Tevez

Ronaldo-Carrick-Fletcher-Park
Rooney-Berba

Last 3 seasons, that's the main one.

It seems when Ronaldo started scoring, everyone view him as someone that played upfront..


Added on July 29, 2009, 6:18 pmDo you view Berba as an AM then because he certainly wasn't always in the centre forward position most of the time.
If you view it like this..
-----------Carrick-Fletcher-------
---------------Berba--------------
Ronaldo--Emptyspaces--Rooney

Where would you put Park then?

This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 29 2009, 06:18 PM
Wan
post Jul 29 2009, 11:08 PM

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QUOTE(alien2003 @ Jul 29 2009, 07:30 PM)
Hargreaves comeback put in doubt

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/t...utd/8155610.stm

Hargreaves blow for United

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_5459236,00.html
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Wasn't it always around October Hargreaves was supposed to get back? They sure know how to blow things up to make it interesting..
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 12:28 AM

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For tomorrow's game?
VDS
Wes-Rio-Evans-Evra
Nani-Fletcher-Giggs-Tosic
Berba-Owen

Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 01:29 AM

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Valencia didn't really understand his positional play yet with us(because this is his first time training with the team and playing), and that goal was quite lucky, but whenever he attack the defenders, he was fantastic. Always beat his man, and his crosses always get through. That cross to Rooney was great! Now we know why SAF was so interested in him. He's like Ronaldo the winger(before he turn into a goal machine) without the skills.


Added on July 30, 2009, 1:30 amAnd Anderson took a really great freekick. I thought he would sky it rugby style!

This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 30 2009, 01:30 AM
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 01:35 AM

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QUOTE(shortleg88 @ Jul 30 2009, 01:01 AM)
i thought he said he'll run naked around the field if he score, dissapointed la  sad.gif
*
This one doesn't count. It's a friendly! Watch him do it at OT in a competitive game. biggrin.gif

Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 02:41 AM

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Rooney was on one of his off days. Nothing worked for him. Heavy touch, wrong/weak/too strong pass..
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 10:47 AM

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QUOTE(Reimao @ Jul 30 2009, 10:45 AM)
With all due respect, fletch's a good player and all, but at times he seems pretty cluless whistling.gif

Hargo FTW!
*
Hargo is more clueless.. biggrin.gif
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 11:47 AM

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QUOTE(Reimao @ Jul 30 2009, 10:59 AM)
Carrick > Fletcher!

I don't care.  grumble.gif
*
They're both ahead of Hargreaves. biggrin.gif
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 12:16 PM

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QUOTE(rekrazie @ Jul 30 2009, 12:01 PM)
Fletcher (On Form) > Carrick & Hargreaves
Carrick (On Form) > Hargreaves & Fletcher
Hargreaves (On Form) > Fletcher & Carrick
*
In a two CM setup, Hargreaves wouldn't get ahead of anyone. He should reinvent himself into a right winger, and when the big games come up and if Fletcher is not available, he can play in the centre as part of 3 CMs.
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 12:31 PM

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Even without him they were crap. Italian football is weak now.



This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 30 2009, 12:40 PM
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 06:55 PM

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QUOTE(edgeff @ Jul 30 2009, 05:53 PM)
hi mr. wan....
thank you for your "INDEPTH" analysis of MU's tactic....
but i think, everybody is entitled to his/her opinion. and the thing is, i am not on the same page with ur analysis.
but i respect it bcoz it's ur analysis, ur opinion.
i bet, i can find a lot of people who would disagree with ur ANALYSIS.
btw, yes, some people call it 424 when u play with 2 striker and 2 wingers (not right/left midfielder).
but some other will call 442 with different variations.
so it is up to us. you can read any football magazine and find out ppl have a lot of other different views and opinions on the same matter.

" Ronaldo-Carrick-Scoles-Giggs
  Rooney-Saha

  Ronaldo-Carrick-Someone-Nani
  Rooney-Tevez

  Ronaldo-Carrick-Fletcher-Park
  Rooney-Berba

  Last 3 seasons, that's the main one. "


that's line up is only on paper, bro.
when the game started, u can't see them stick that formation.
it will more likely like this

fletcher/anderson/park-carrick-anderson/giggs
ronaldo-tevez-rooney
*
Only on paper? Whats the different thing then between a 433 and 442 if in games it doesn't look different. Obviously they are different. And what ESPN showed before the game starts or about to start showing the formation shit, they get it wrong anyway. I don't judge what we play on that. I judge how we play on the pitch, and if you compare how we play Barca to how we play Newcastle, it would be really obvious they're differnet formations, 433 for Barca and 442 for the normal games. Rooney obviously didn't play on the wing for the majority of the games we play. Be it with Tevez, Berba and Saha, he played in front the former two, and behind the latter. Park/Nani/Giggs obviously played on the opposite side of where Ronaldo plays. Of course they interchange their positions all the time, that's been a feature of us last few seasons.

There's more to it that just formation of course. Tactics, movement of players, positioning etc, but there must be a set formation they base it on. SAF and Capello have been banging on and on about Rooney should conserve his energy and play more like a striker leaving the chasing stuff etc to the others so that he would be ready upfront.. and that's just what he did last season for us, sitting quietly by his standards playing in the normal strikers position.

Didn't mean to sound harsh or anything, just I don't agree with whoever that mentions we played Rooney out wide consistently which wasn't the case. It has always been a Berba/Tevez playing between the midfield 4 and Rooney. And if we see how we attack, most times Berba would hang outside the box rather than attacking it to meet crosses.. does that mean he plays as an AM leaving that empty space between Rooney and Ronaldo who plays out wide in a '433'?


This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 30 2009, 07:13 PM
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 09:40 PM

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Genius at work. Spend whole of last summer trying to get some midfielder in and wanted to sell of that player, but in the end nothing happens because can't agree with the wanted player's club, and then tried to sign that player again this summer, but that player saw $$ in Manchester.. now he's about to lose his star midfielder last season, and rumours are that his partner too want out. Heh heh heh heh..

Cathcart look good huh last night? Hope we'll see more of him. Keep him for the first 6 months and play him in the cup games, then in January hope some EPL club will take a chance on him.
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 10:32 PM

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Spurs are crazy. They still want Huntelaar according to Harry..
Keane, Defoe, Crouch, Palychenko(?)
+ Bent(Sunderland bound)..

Wonder what they would do with all those strikers. Should never have brought back Keane..
Wan
post Jul 30 2009, 10:57 PM

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Me. Anderson to score another goal? Yes please. Open goal this time. That would be sweet. And hope Fabio and Valencia will play a part again, as subs at least. Really like the look of Valencia.. just do it kind of way.
Wan
post Jul 31 2009, 01:37 AM

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QUOTE(maxizanc @ Jul 31 2009, 01:25 AM)
If Heinze didn't go to Real Madrid i am definitely sure that he will be doing well here in United, SAF would be getting more headache between him and Evra, the moment he chose Real Madrid i knew already his career will be in dark cloud. And one thing for sure is, most of Real player will not last long there. Laugh my ass off at Heinze but still i wish him good luck in France.,
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I wouldn't be so sure of that. Evra is twice the player Heinze is. Better defensively, faster, and is far far better going forward. Heinze while never really been great forward, but he was good defensively at first before he suffered that injury.. came back never the same and lost his place to the ever improving Evra.
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post Jul 31 2009, 02:30 AM

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Van der Sar
Fletcher Ferdinand Evans Evra
Gibson Giggs Scholes Nani
Berbatov Owen

Giggs when he came on last night went to the left wing right?
Wan
post Jul 31 2009, 03:20 PM

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Valencia is awesome. That is all!
biggrin.gif

And Cathcart looks quite good too.


Added on July 31, 2009, 3:27 pm
QUOTE(onepack @ Jul 31 2009, 11:06 AM)
gibson playing right midfield? fletcher as DR?
another gamble n experiment.. 
should try it on asia tour rather than audi cup final.. vs bayern?  hmm.gif
*
It's not a gamble. Because O'Shea and Fabio already played the day before, they weren't going to start another game a day after that. And with Wes Brown injured, we had no other choice at RB. That's why Fletcher started at RB. And in the case of Gibson, he's far more ready for first team action, expecially against a side like Bayern compared to our other 'available for start on the night', Tosic. Park and Valencia already played the day before, Giggs is utilised in the centre of midfield, and Tosic is far down the pecking order.

It's not really a must win game anyway. We just wanted as many players as possible to get starts/game time for the season ahead. And judging by SAF comments about our penalty and freekick takers in which Tosic wasn't mention at all even though that's one of his main weapon, it seems he won't play much this coming season.

This post has been edited by Wan: Jul 31 2009, 03:27 PM

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