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 How to get started to invest in property?

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TSsdas86
post Jul 11 2009, 09:58 PM, updated 17y ago

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I am very new to property investment or real estate investment. I am planning to buy a lot of houses and shops to rent out but I do not know how to get started.

1. Normally, how much capital is required to get started? I want to start small, maybe buy a single storey house (RM100k to RM200k) then rent it.
2. Buy houses, shops or lands, which is better?
3. I read books of Robert Kiyosaki and play the Cashflow games. It can buy high value property using very little money of our own. Is that possible? How to do it?

I am very new to this and I hope I can learn before I jump into this investment. Thanks for any help and guidance. smile.gif
Ms.iProp
post Jul 11 2009, 10:13 PM

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Buy at Auction.
As robert ased us to buy below market value.
PM me for more details
I can share you real story
klang-valley
post Jul 12 2009, 11:59 AM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 11 2009, 09:58 PM)
I am very new to property investment or real estate investment. I am planning to buy a lot of houses and shops to rent out but I do not know how to get started.

1. Normally, how much capital is required to get started? I want to start small, maybe buy a single storey house (RM100k to RM200k) then rent it.
2. Buy houses, shops or lands, which is better?
3. I read books of Robert Kiyosaki and play the Cashflow games. It can buy high value property using very little money of our own. Is that possible? How to do it?

I am very new to this and I hope I can learn before I jump into this investment. Thanks for any help and guidance.  smile.gif
*
Buying property for investment is not a bed of roses. You have to analyze the potential of the location, and the return of investment.

PM me if you would like to get a mortgage loan.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 12 2009, 12:21 PM

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QUOTE(Ms.iProp @ Jul 11 2009, 10:13 PM)
Buy at Auction.
As robert ased us to buy below market value.
PM me for more details
I can share you real story
*
Robert did not just say buy below market value.
By just looking at market value itself, Robert would say that is speculating.

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?act=Sear...user&mid=296681
According to your previous post, you are property auction agent.

Robert warn us about people like you.
You will get paid if someone successfully bid the property, not caring if the investor loses money buying from the auction.
Backkom
post Jul 12 2009, 12:38 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 12 2009, 12:21 PM)
Robert did not just say buy below market value.
By just looking at market value itself, Robert would say that is speculating.

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?act=Sear...user&mid=296681
According to your previous post, you are property auction agent.

Robert warn us about people like you.
You will get paid if someone successfully bid the property, not caring if the investor loses money buying from the auction.
*
Well said! rclxms.gif

It's always a love-hate relationship between investors and agents -
On one hand we need them for the information and connections, but on the other hand we just can't tell whether they're giving us the best advice for us or themselves.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 12 2009, 01:24 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 12 2009, 12:38 PM)
Well said!  rclxms.gif

It's always a love-hate relationship between investors and agents -
On one hand we need them for the information and connections, but on the other hand we just can't tell whether they're giving us the best advice for us or themselves.
*
In the world of investing, there are 2 types of agents. Regardless of property, stocks or business.

The one who can put food on both of our table and the one who only put food on their table.
I am glad to meet my agent, they teach me a lot and I thank for their time and knowledge. (paying them better too) whistling.gif
TSsdas86
post Jul 12 2009, 03:04 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 12 2009, 01:24 PM)
In the world of investing, there are 2 types of agents. Regardless of property, stocks or business.

The one who can put food on both of our table and the one who only put food on their table.
I am glad to meet my agent, they teach me a lot and I thank for their time and knowledge. (paying them better too) whistling.gif
*
How to identify whether the agent is good? I have very less knowledge in this and I really not sure how to see they are telling the truth or not. Some agent promote a thing because they want to earn money not helping us.
Ms.iProp
post Jul 12 2009, 03:06 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 12 2009, 12:21 PM)
Robert did not just say buy below market value.
By just looking at market value itself, Robert would say that is speculating.

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?act=Sear...user&mid=296681
According to your previous post, you are property auction agent.

Robert warn us about people like you.
You will get paid if someone successfully bid the property, not caring if the investor loses money buying from the auction.
*
Of course I will get paid if my customer is the successful bidder....
Nothing is free in this world....I should get paid for the job I did
But my service is FOC for my client...the bank will pay me, not my client.... rclxms.gif
Auction property is different from sub sale....in subsale, you might get cheaper if you go direct to owner...
But in Auction...buyer will pay the same amount...
I will not charge a single cents regardless whether my client success or not during the bidding process
I will do my job finding a place, giving basic info about the property i.e market value, rental value
Its up to the client to decide....I'm a property agent...not a financial advisor..
No force is given....

If one feels that an agent is useless and not needed...then go ahead and do the petty-petty things yourself....
You can collect all the auction data yourself, contact the lawyer yourself, contact the auctioneer yourself,
contact the developer/maintenance office yourself.....when you can have someone else do it for you whistling.gif

This post has been edited by Ms.iProp: Jul 12 2009, 03:08 PM
Backkom
post Jul 12 2009, 03:14 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 12 2009, 03:04 PM)
How to identify whether the agent is good? I have very less knowledge in this and I really not sure how to see they are telling the truth or not. Some agent promote a thing because they want to earn money not helping us.
*
Simple - invest your time and effort in doing sufficient homework.
Drive to that area several times at different times of a day, call up various numbers from ads that you can find in newspaper/iProperty etc, read up in forums...

Nothing comes for free - investment is just like any other job/hobby - you need to put in time, effort and money (petrol and toll to drive around?), and properties particularly, you have to be patient as profit generally don't come as fast as other investment vehicles.
eugene jk
post Jul 12 2009, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 12 2009, 03:04 PM)
How to identify whether the agent is good? I have very less knowledge in this and I really not sure how to see they are telling the truth or not. Some agent promote a thing because they want to earn money not helping us.
*
I would recommend Milan Doshi's book (How You Can Become A Multi Millionaire Real Estate Investor). You can get it from MPH.. Spend a little bit as the saying goes "invest in yourself 1st"

The book cover looks like this - How You Can Become A Multi Millionaire Real Estate Investor by Milan Doshi

A book being just a book, you still need to do research on yourself on which prop to go for, the book just help you to kick start..

If you are someone like me who is "giam siap" not willing to pay for property seminars, you can just drop by some property fairs and listen to their talks FOR FREE..

The up coming one is this.. Notice the seminar's invited speakers are Top Guns in real estate.. dont miss it

Iproperty Luxury Collection - KLCC

Good luck wink.gif

This post has been edited by eugene jk: Jul 12 2009, 03:22 PM
Backkom
post Jul 12 2009, 03:27 PM

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QUOTE(eugene jk @ Jul 12 2009, 03:18 PM)
I would recommend Milan Doshi's book (How You Can Become A Multi Millionaire Real Estate Investor). You can get it from MPH.. Spend a little bit as the saying goes "invest in yourself 1st"

The book cover looks like this - How You Can Become A Multi Millionaire Real Estate Investor by Milan Doshi

A book being just a book, you still need to do research on yourself on which prop to go for, the book just help you to kick start..

If you are someone like me who is "giam siap" not willing to pay for property seminars, you can just drop by some property fairs and listen to their talks FOR FREE..

The up coming one is this.. Notice the seminar's invited speakers are Top Guns in real estate.. dont miss it

Iproperty Luxury Collection - KLCC

Good luck  wink.gif
*
Aim to attend: Milan Doshi, Peter Yee, Renesial Leong rclxms.gif
TSsdas86
post Jul 12 2009, 03:27 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 12 2009, 03:14 PM)
Simple - invest your time and effort in doing sufficient homework.
Drive to that area several times at different times of a day, call up various numbers from ads that you can find in newspaper/iProperty etc, read up in forums...

Nothing comes for free - investment is just like any other job/hobby - you need to put in time, effort and money (petrol and toll to drive around?), and properties particularly, you have to be patient as profit generally don't come as fast as other investment vehicles.
*
Thanks for the tips and guidance. It is not easy but it seems to be fun. If let say, I have RM50k to invest, would you recommend me to invest in real estate?


Added on July 12, 2009, 3:31 pm
QUOTE(eugene jk @ Jul 12 2009, 03:18 PM)
I would recommend Milan Doshi's book (How You Can Become A Multi Millionaire Real Estate Investor). You can get it from MPH.. Spend a little bit as the saying goes "invest in yourself 1st"

The book cover looks like this - How You Can Become A Multi Millionaire Real Estate Investor by Milan Doshi

A book being just a book, you still need to do research on yourself on which prop to go for, the book just help you to kick start..

If you are someone like me who is "giam siap" not willing to pay for property seminars, you can just drop by some property fairs and listen to their talks FOR FREE..

The up coming one is this.. Notice the seminar's invited speakers are Top Guns in real estate.. dont miss it

Iproperty Luxury Collection - KLCC

Good luck  wink.gif
*
Thanks for sharing. I read that book when I am looking for investment books in MPH and Popular Bookstore. It is a good book. I will buy it soon. Since I am staying in Kuching, I would not be able to attend the talk in KL. sad.gif



This post has been edited by sdas86: Jul 12 2009, 03:31 PM
Backkom
post Jul 12 2009, 03:39 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 12 2009, 03:27 PM)
Thanks for the tips and guidance. It is not easy but it seems to be fun. If let say, I have RM50k to invest, would you recommend me to invest in real estate?


Added on July 12, 2009, 3:31 pm

Thanks for sharing. I read that book when I am looking for investment books in MPH and Popular Bookstore. It is a good book. I will buy it soon. Since I am staying in Kuching, I would not be able to attend the talk in KL. sad.gif
*
If you have the interest and passion for buildings + patience + capital - go for properties.
The fluctuation in properties are mild compared to stock market - especially if you focus on properties at good locations (near LRT, amenities, not Rawang or PD where heavy speculations come into play).

Just my 2 cents.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 12 2009, 03:44 PM

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Funny, I remember dreaming about this discussion before...

To TS.
It take years to be successful in this business.
Which many people have spent time looking for deals every week.
It's a hard and long journey.

As Robert Kiyosaki would say, why you want to invest?
If you just want to earn more money, the likelihood of failing is high.
First, find your reason why you want to invest.
Take some time to think about, it's about what you want to do with your life.
Once you have a strong reason, no matter how hard the deal gets, you will get through it.

Real estate has both strength and weakness.
The biggest strength, passive cashflow.
You can use this investment vehicle to retire in a few years.


Added on July 12, 2009, 4:16 pm
QUOTE(Ms.iProp @ Jul 12 2009, 03:06 PM)
If one feels that an agent is useless and not needed...then go ahead and do the petty-petty things yourself....
You can collect all the auction data yourself, contact the lawyer yourself, contact the auctioneer yourself,
contact the developer/maintenance office yourself.....when you can have someone else do it for you whistling.gif
*
FYI.
I pay my agent 50% more to help me bid the auction property.

If their normal rate is RM2k, I'll pay RM3k.
Even if the bank pays them commission.

I already know the bank will pay you commission.
I don't like it, especially when deviating what Robert says just so that you get the deal.
That is really unethical.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 12 2009, 04:16 PM
TSsdas86
post Jul 12 2009, 04:41 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 12 2009, 03:39 PM)
If you have the interest and passion for buildings + patience + capital - go for properties.
The fluctuation in properties are mild compared to stock market - especially if you focus on properties at good locations (near LRT, amenities, not Rawang or PD where heavy speculations come into play).

Just my 2 cents.
*
Thanks. thumbup.gif


Added on July 12, 2009, 4:46 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 12 2009, 03:44 PM)
Funny, I remember dreaming about this discussion before...

To TS.
It take years to be successful in this business.
Which many people have spent time looking for deals every week.
It's a hard and long journey.

As Robert Kiyosaki would say, why you want to invest?
If you just want to earn more money, the likelihood of failing is high.
First, find your reason why you want to invest.
Take some time to think about, it's about what you want to do with your life.
Once you have a strong reason, no matter how hard the deal gets, you will get through it.

Real estate has both strength and weakness.
The biggest strength, passive cashflow.
You can use this investment vehicle to retire in a few years.
That is a very good advice. I read books by Robert Kiyosaki and that is what I stress a lot.

My reason:
When I am rich, I want my parents to enjoy their life and I want to give them better life. My aim is to start a real estate management company in Kuching.

I think that my reasons are not strong enough.

What would be your reason?

This post has been edited by sdas86: Jul 12 2009, 04:46 PM
Pai
post Jul 12 2009, 05:27 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 11 2009, 09:58 PM)
1. Normally, how much capital is required to get started? I want to start small, maybe buy a single storey house (RM100k to RM200k) then rent it.
2. Buy houses, shops or lands, which is better?
3. I read books of Robert Kiyosaki and play the Cashflow games. It can buy high value property using very little money of our own. Is that possible? How to do it?
*
1. Normal capital required is approx 15% of the targeted property price. Some use only 3k to buy a 300k condo.

2. Shops, if you have the cash.

3. Its possible, but advise you to get a hold of the basics first before jumping into an advance subject, IMO.

Good luck. smile.gif
aramis888
post Jul 12 2009, 05:33 PM

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Agree with Pai.

Dont just read Robert's book, read more than that. Visit property investment forums, ask questions, learn from the sifu's before you take the plunge.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 12 2009, 05:34 PM

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My reason. I am tired of working. Everyday I have to spent 3-4 hours travelling.
I rather have fun and enjoy it.
The time wasted for travelling is a very good motivator.

My plan is to retire in 5 years time, which started last year.
The aim is to get 10 properties in this time frame.

Since I lost a deal last year, this year I need to get 3 properties.
My first one is in the process, on the 15th there is another auction so my agent will bid on my behalf.

Before I have this 5 years plan, there was another 5 years plan earlier that didn't make it. The reason is because I lack a strong reason. So this is the update what I have now.

BTW, have you got this?
I consider it to be one of the basics, read this first.
From there on, I recommend start doing that 6 steps.
Start doing by looking at 20 properties every week.
Also get Azizi Ali books. They are a great guide for landlords in term of management.

user posted image

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 12 2009, 05:38 PM
TSsdas86
post Jul 12 2009, 05:50 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 12 2009, 05:34 PM)
My reason. I am tired of working. Everyday I have to spent 3-4 hours travelling.
I rather have fun and enjoy it.
The time wasted for travelling is a very good motivator.

My plan is to retire in 5 years time, which started last year.
The aim is to get 10 properties in this time frame.

Since I lost a deal last year, this year I need to get 3 properties.
My first one is in the process, on the 15th there is another auction so my agent will bid on my behalf.

Before I have this 5 years plan, there was another 5 years plan earlier that didn't make it. The reason is because I lack a strong reason. So this is the update what I have now.

BTW, have you got this?
I consider it to be one of the basics, read this first.
From there on, I recommend start doing that 6 steps.
Start doing by looking at 20 properties every week.
Also get Azizi Ali books. They are a great guide for landlords in term of management.

user posted image
*
I haven't got this book. I will try to look for it in MPH. I know there are a lot of books by Azizi Ali. I will buy it and read it too. Thanks a lot for your guidance.

May I know what job are you involve in? And what age do you plan to retire? How many years have you been working?

I am in engineering field and I am not sure how much salary per month for me to get started in real estate. And, how many years of working to be eligible for housing loan?


Added on July 12, 2009, 5:53 pm
QUOTE(aramis888 @ Jul 12 2009, 05:33 PM)
Agree with Pai.

Dont just read Robert's book, read more than that. Visit property investment  forums, ask questions, learn from the sifu's before you take the plunge.
*
Thanks. You are right. I got some books suggestion and I am going to read them soon. smile.gif

This post has been edited by sdas86: Jul 12 2009, 05:53 PM
moonh
post Jul 12 2009, 07:14 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 12 2009, 06:27 PM)
1. Normal capital required is approx 15% of the targeted property price. Some use only 3k to buy a 300k condo.
2. Shops, if you have the cash.
3. Its possible, but advise you to get a hold of the basics first before jumping into an advance subject, IMO.
Good luck.  smile.gif
*


"Some use only 3k to buy a 300k condo."
Is it advisable to do that? i.e. dun have to pay anything initially (borne by developer & bank) & only pay monthly installment. if i can flip this (i know it's a big IF), surely it's good deal? or is there anything that i miss?

and for this period of uncertainty, is it ok if my debt to gross income ratio is 40%? (one apartment + one landed house)
Backkom
post Jul 12 2009, 08:49 PM

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QUOTE(moonh @ Jul 12 2009, 07:14 PM)
"Some use only 3k to buy a 300k condo."
Is it advisable to do that? i.e. dun have to pay anything initially (borne by developer & bank) & only pay monthly installment. if i can flip this (i know it's a big IF), surely it's good deal? or is there anything that i miss?

and for this period of uncertainty, is it ok if my debt to gross income ratio is 40%? (one apartment + one landed house)
*
I would say that depends on how big your other 60% is? tongue.gif
Bottom line is - can you still sleep soundly at night? If yes, don't see much problem here as long as banks are still willing to lend to you.
aramis888
post Jul 12 2009, 09:12 PM

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QUOTE(moonh @ Jul 12 2009, 07:14 PM)
"Some use only 3k to buy a 300k condo."
Is it advisable to do that? i.e. dun have to pay anything initially (borne by developer & bank) & only pay monthly installment. if i can flip this (i know it's a big IF), surely it's good deal? or is there anything that i miss?

and for this period of uncertainty, is it ok if my debt to gross income ratio is 40%? (one apartment + one landed house)
*
yes, that can be done. you just got to know how. brows.gif
moonh
post Jul 12 2009, 09:43 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 12 2009, 09:49 PM)
I would say that depends on how big your other 60% is?  tongue.gif
Bottom line is - can you still sleep soundly at night? If yes, don't see much problem here as long as banks are still willing to lend to you.
*
QUOTE(aramis888 @ Jul 12 2009, 10:12 PM)
yes, that can be done.  you just got to know how. brows.gif
*
thanks..i did post my query about this, but no reply..guess the location is not so prime then.. wink.gif
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/1091324

this should be very helpful to TS.. smile.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 12 2009, 10:40 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 12 2009, 05:50 PM)
I haven't got this book. I will try to look for it in MPH. I know there are a lot of books by Azizi Ali. I will buy it and read it too. Thanks a lot for your guidance.

May I know what job are you involve in? And what age do you plan to retire? How many years have you been working?

I am in engineering field and I am not sure how much salary per month for me to get started in real estate. And, how many years of working to be eligible for housing loan?


Added on July 12, 2009, 5:53 pm

Thanks. You are right. I got some books suggestion and I am going to read them soon. smile.gif
*
It's not any normal book, I think you can call it an audio book.
I doubt MPH sell these.
Do buy Azizi Ali blue and yellow book.

Same job as you, engineering field. More towards PCB design.
If everything goes according to plan, before the age of 40, but do note that my target cashflow is RM2k.
Since you play cashflow 101 often, you would understand why. Ever notice that different profession with different salary are able to get out of the rat race? rclxms.gif
I start working since Y2k.


Do not let your earning in your day time job stop you from investing part time.
Read the below spoiler first, you may have read it before.
As long as you have a good spending habit, you are "fit" to start.

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Pai
post Jul 13 2009, 11:59 PM

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QUOTE(moonh @ Jul 12 2009, 07:14 PM)
"Some use only 3k to buy a 300k condo."
Is it advisable to do that? i.e. dun have to pay anything initially (borne by developer & bank) & only pay monthly installment. if i can flip this (i know it's a big IF), surely it's good deal? or is there anything that i miss?

and for this period of uncertainty, is it ok if my debt to gross income ratio is 40%? (one apartment + one landed house)
*
My preference is to use as litlle $$$ as possible to acquire an asset.

Flipping is a dangerous game, as it can be a double edge sword. Flipping IMO is only for ppl who have sufficient holding power, ie plenty of back up $$$. Look at MK and KLCC buyers today, the flippers-wanna be are being slaughtered.......

40% DIR IMO is OK....think mine is around there as well smile.gif

SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 08:39 AM

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The flippers are flop. rclxms.gif rclxm9.gif icon_idea.gif nod.gif thumbup.gif
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 09:51 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 08:39 AM)
The flippers are flop.  rclxms.gif  rclxm9.gif  icon_idea.gif  nod.gif  thumbup.gif
*
not necessarily boss. I happen to know a number of flippers who manage to amass 1mil profit from flipping props before they even reach 35.

Thats why I said flipping is not the game for the poor. wink.gif
aramis888
post Jul 14 2009, 10:39 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 08:39 AM)
The flippers are flop.  rclxms.gif  rclxm9.gif  icon_idea.gif  nod.gif  thumbup.gif
*
base on own experience I presume?

This post has been edited by aramis888: Jul 14 2009, 10:41 AM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 10:53 AM

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QUOTE(aramis888 @ Jul 14 2009, 10:39 AM)
base on own experience I presume?
*
Nope, this statement is from Robert Kiyosaki.
He is happy about it and so am I. brows.gif
aramis888
post Jul 14 2009, 10:57 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 10:53 AM)
Nope, this statement is from Robert Kiyosaki.
He is happy about it and so am I.  brows.gif
*
Oh..The infamous guru of property invesment. whistling.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 10:58 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 09:51 AM)
not necessarily boss. I happen to know a number of flippers who manage to amass 1mil profit from flipping props before they even reach 35.

Thats why I said flipping is not the game for the poor.  wink.gif
*
Yup, saw that myself too.
To be a professional flipper, one has to have enough reserve just in case it goes bad.


The way I see it, professional cashflow investor will do well in all market.


Added on July 14, 2009, 11:04 am
QUOTE(aramis888 @ Jul 14 2009, 10:57 AM)
Oh..The infamous guru of property invesment.  whistling.gif
*
Not really.
His wife Kim and friend Ken are much better than him.
His strength is in business.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 14 2009, 11:04 AM
moonh
post Jul 14 2009, 11:29 AM

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QUOTE(aramis888 @ Jul 14 2009, 11:57 AM)
Oh..The infamous guru of property invesment.  whistling.gif
*
tongue-in-cheek i reckon? wink.gif

aramis888
post Jul 14 2009, 11:36 AM

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QUOTE(moonh @ Jul 14 2009, 11:29 AM)
tongue-in-cheek i reckon?  wink.gif
*
spot on. rclxms.gif
Phoeni_142
post Jul 14 2009, 11:39 AM

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everyone is a guru. i don't think we shld specifically idolize one particular guru either. sometimes, their view is awfully skewed to what works for them.

Any method works in all kinds of markets provided u know what u r doing. That also includes flippers.

PS - i don't think i'm biased in my statement, because I'm not a flipper. But i do know a few who do well in any environment.
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:41 AM

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then be an 'unintentional flippper'..

i guess it's prudence to have an exit strategy for any investment..
it's part of the process.. plow, sow, nurture and harvest.

i became an unintentional flipper recently.. as price triggered my exit strategy point.. it exponentially boosted my networth.
it was a good rental unit..

on the contrary.. i don't just believe that one must have alot of capital for flipping alone.. if you take in a lot of loan(leveraging).. it's prudence to provision for capital increase as well.. some superstar property folks of yesteryear were so deep and wide in loan.. that when calamity struck them.. they didn't really know what hit them.

... debt sank them

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 11:46 AM
Phoeni_142
post Jul 14 2009, 11:45 AM

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QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 11:41 AM)
then be an 'unintentional flippper'..

i guess it's prudence to have an exit strategy for any investment..
it's part of the process.. plow, sow, nurture and harvest.

i became an unintentional flipper recently.. as price triggered my exit strategy point.. it exponentially boosted my networth.
*
wow - good for you....amazing....

yeah - my net worth is constantly drying up - i shld learn from you.

This post has been edited by Phoeni_142: Jul 14 2009, 11:45 AM
aramis888
post Jul 14 2009, 11:46 AM

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Some true sifus are speaking now. wink.gif
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:50 AM

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that property that i unintentionally flipped.. was the very one that i mentioned much earlier.. that i got it way below market value and sold way above market/appraised value.. (the buyer has to put forth a huge differential sum to an escrow account to seal that purchase)

renesial/azizi/kiyosaki.. they're all correct.. there're such properties around.. rare.. takes alot of digging/homework to unearth..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 11:52 AM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 12:03 PM

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QUOTE(Phoeni_142 @ Jul 14 2009, 11:45 AM)
wow - good for you....amazing....

yeah - my net worth is constantly drying up - i shld learn from you.
*
Oh, my net worth is also going down.
I'll be borrowing a lot for an auction tomorrow (2nd property to be for this year). rolleyes.gif
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 12:07 PM

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i learnt from my very own dad.. very old school, unsophisticated, but his insight somehow appeared in paraphrased versions in some property books today..

i gathered.. no matter how one toss & turn, slice & dice.. the foundation of value remains the same..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 12:09 PM
moonh
post Jul 14 2009, 12:24 PM

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question for sifus:

say i have little money at the mo (just enough to cover 6 mths of my mthly exps), but i can get 100% loan and all other fees are borne by developer & bank. pay nothing until completion. i could rent this f/h landed prop, but will get -ve cf, confirmed.
can i buy this for flipping? or is it too dangerous?
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 12:48 PM

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i took more than 5 years of learning on an asset class before i make my first purchase.. that's my "plowing" process.

yes, i'm a slow learner here.. so i don't deserve the attention of sifus/sifools/seafood/etc.. but i can highlight to you this;

you've yet to fully understand the meaning of "profits are made when you buy, not at when you sell".. stop short of being philosophical, this phrase encapsulate myriads other important lessons in regards to investment.

it took me 2 years to understand this phrase above.. i believe you've a reasonable intelligence given to you and you may grapple the meaning within 2 weeks and arrive to an answer to your own question above..


btw, "monthly expenses" is not a 1-size-fits-all.. thingy. i realized that, there're levels within that "monthly expenses" that can be further tweaked.. perhaps looking at the elasticity of that expenses in question.

some expenses are elastic..and hence can be taken out of the equations should the dire need arise.. if the majority of your 6mth expenses are full of such elastic expenses.. considered yourself great!!

on the other hand, some expenses are very inelastic.. failing to meet such expenses will immediately jeopardize a person's solvency.. which is one measurement of how 'free' are you financially? if a bulk of your 6mth expenses fall within this category.. you're walking a financial tightrope and wearing a shoe that says "financial fubar"

so, just lamenting that you've enough fuel to travel 6 months down the road is as good as superficially not saying much..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 12:54 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 01:24 PM

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QUOTE(moonh @ Jul 14 2009, 12:24 PM)
question for sifus:

say i have little money at the mo (just enough to cover 6 mths of my mthly exps), but i can get 100% loan and all other fees are borne by developer & bank. pay nothing until completion. i could rent this f/h landed prop, but will get -ve cf, confirmed.
can i buy this for flipping? or is it too dangerous?
*
Then my question to you is, why you want to buy and flip?

Also, which is faster to flip?
Buy an under developing house, with the risk of abandon project, high vacancy due to it's in a newly develop area with very little amnesties etc?

Or buy a property which is run down in a good neighbourhood, fix it up and sell off?


Flipping is not investing, Rich dad call it rolling the wheel barrow.
You keep on rolling it and it gets bigger but gets you no where.
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 01:37 PM

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one thing i like about investment is.. there's no limit to it's creativeness..
the destination is one.. but the roads that lead to it.. are many.

and the same road you took last time, may not necessarily work again.. it's a continuous journey.

on this context.. to say that flipping is not investing is limiting. stop short of judging others on which road to travel, be it sustainable/legit/efficient/costly or otherwise.. there's a good saying

"you can do anything.. but not everything you do, brings good"

for example.. some of the investment maneuvers that you guys are adopting, frightens me.. but it may simply work for you (probably, i'm just too stupid to notice gua*lol*).. how long will it remains working for you.. that's another question about sustainability...

you're reading thing critically.. perhaps you're absorbing it wholesale? i did such silly wholesale absorption many times.. but learning is fun when i slowly apply a sense of understanding to it.

read critically.. it helps. there're lots of noises out there..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 01:45 PM
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 03:17 PM

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QUOTE(Phoeni_142 @ Jul 14 2009, 11:39 AM)
Any method works in all kinds of markets provided u know what u r doing
*
so true smile.gif


Added on July 14, 2009, 3:26 pm
QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 11:41 AM)
i became an unintentional flipper recently.. as price triggered my exit strategy point.. it exponentially boosted my networth.
it was a good rental unit..
*
err.....actually in this particular scenario you dont have to flip to boost your net worth. In fact your networth remains the same before or after you sell.

The only thing that changes after you sell the prop is your liquidity level.....

This post has been edited by Pai: Jul 14 2009, 03:26 PM
aramis888
post Jul 14 2009, 03:37 PM

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Pai, got one question for you. For banks to access your affordability, do they normally use 40% or 33% DIR?
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 03:41 PM

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QUOTE(moonh @ Jul 14 2009, 12:24 PM)
question for sifus:

say i have little money at the mo (just enough to cover 6 mths of my mthly exps), but i can get 100% loan and all other fees are borne by developer & bank. pay nothing until completion. i could rent this f/h landed prop, but will get -ve cf, confirmed.
can i buy this for flipping? or is it too dangerous?
*
Under a difficult circumstances, you'll get killed.

For any flippers wannabe, ask yourself this :

Assuming you will get zero rental income, can you afford to keep the property for a minimum 2 years WITHOUT touching your reserve funds?

If the answer is YES, then by all means flip and gamble. But if you cant afford it, suggest you play the safe man's game. Honestly, I couldnt flip bcoz I couldnt afford my own rule. Suppose this explains why I never sold any of my properties to date.

wink.gif


lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 03:44 PM

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my networth is measured.. not in 'promised' money.. but liquid and deployable fund. and i no longer need to periodically mark to market..

i can see your creative accounting there.. but i can't fool myself, can i?
i get a feeling that you're smart.. but not wise.

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 03:46 PM
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 03:48 PM

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QUOTE(aramis888 @ Jul 14 2009, 03:37 PM)
Pai, got one question for you. For banks to access your affordability, do they normally use 40% or 33% DIR?
*
my fav bank use 60% DIR. tongue.gif I dont know about all banks, but I know few major mortgage players use 40%-50% DIR as a gauge.

On this subject, not all banks recognizes rent income as part of DIR calculation. So to be on the safeside, just use your gross salary to calculate DIR.

On this DIR subject, think Phoeni should be more qualified to advise....... smile.gif
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 03:53 PM

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aww.. both of you are just like skid and mudflap.. *lol*

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 04:03 PM
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 04:24 PM

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QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 03:44 PM)
my networth is measured.. not in 'promised' money.. but liquid and deployable fund.  and i no longer need to periodically mark to market..

i can see your creative accounting there.. but i can't fool myself, can i?
i get a feeling that you're smart.. but not wise.
*
Theres no creative accounting, not being smart or wise either. Its the basic definition. For those who dont know the real definition of net worth :

Definition of net worth --> Net Worth




Hence why I said, your networth never changes when you sell a property, but your liquidity level does wink.gif




lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 04:28 PM

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if i didn't sell.. i wouldn't have knew how high a price it can go, would i?
we're not talking about normal appraised value here, skid.. it goes beyond board.

to some extend, i do enjoy your differing views.. no offense, but most often time, i sense that you worked within a predictable parameters.. so when i've acted on something that goes beyond your operating parameters, you have difficulties grasping it.. (asking for prove this la, prove that la.. if i show you my transacted numbers/percentage.. you might choke.. that's why i refrain from doing so)

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 04:33 PM
moonh
post Jul 14 2009, 04:40 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 04:41 PM)
Under a difficult circumstances, you'll get killed. 
For any flippers wannabe, ask yourself this :
Assuming you will get zero rental income, can you afford to keep the property for a minimum 2 years WITHOUT touching your reserve funds?
If the answer is YES, then by all means flip and gamble. But if you cant afford it, suggest you play the safe man's game. Honestly, I couldnt flip bcoz I couldnt afford my own rule. Suppose this explains why I never sold any of my properties to date.  wink.gif
*
thanks for all the advice, really appreciate it.
i can maintain <30% DIR and should not touch my reserve funds, IF within the nxt 2 yrs:
-my salary stays the same; can still hang on to my job
-my apartment can at least cover mthly installment (projected to be higher)
-we don't need another car

still a risky move, as i think these 3 can easily be on the wrong side.
thanks again.
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 04:54 PM

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this doesn't solely applies to flippers..

this goes the same way about leveraging.. treat it with a mentality as though it's an entitlement and perpetuate to unlimited level of wealth.. one needs only to take a reflective pondering of what's written by yourself.

your d.i.r also enforces the idea that leveraging is not a given, but to be treated with cautious and respect.

QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 03:41 PM)
Assuming you will get zero rental income, can you afford to keep the property for a minimum 2 years WITHOUT touching your reserve funds?
*
This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 04:56 PM
TSsdas86
post Jul 14 2009, 05:47 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 12 2009, 10:40 PM)
It's not any normal book, I think you can call it an audio book.
I doubt MPH sell these.
Do buy Azizi Ali blue and yellow book.

Same job as you, engineering field. More towards PCB design.
If everything goes according to plan, before the age of 40, but do note that my target cashflow is RM2k.
Since you play cashflow 101 often, you would understand why. Ever notice that different profession with different salary are able to get out of the rat race?  rclxms.gif
I start working since Y2k.
Do not let your earning in your day time job stop you from investing part time.
Read the below spoiler first, you may have read it before.
As long as you have a good spending habit, you are "fit" to start.
You are right. I always play CashFlow 101 and I notice that no matter what job we are in, we can get out of rat race with proper investment and loan.

I am in Electronic Engineering too but I am still a student. I am in my final year now and I am going to find a job soon. smile.gif

Thanks for the long spoiler. I read it and I think I already read about it.

I can't find the audio book. How do you get it? rclxub.gif


Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 05:47 PM

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QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 04:28 PM)
if i didn't sell.. i wouldn't have knew how high a price it can go, would i?
we're not talking about normal appraised value here, skid.. it goes beyond board.

to some extend, i do enjoy your differing views.. no offense, but most often time, i sense that you worked within a predictable parameters.. so when i've acted on something that goes beyond your operating parameters, you have difficulties grasping it.. (asking for prove this la, prove that la.. if i show you my transacted numbers/percentage.. you might choke.. that's why i refrain from doing so)

*
If you didnt sell, then median valuations (minus 10%) becomes your prop value. Anyway, the doubt the diff between the median valuation and transacted price is gonna make significant diff to your total networth (unless your networth is dem small lah).

Look, we all have "thought parameters", and its only normal for one to be curious and starts asking questions when we see something that goes beyond "normal". Plus, it was never the issue of "grasping", its a question of "believing". Its hard to believe you when you claimed to bought something 30% below market value and manage to rent/sell way above market value when you cant even provide :

1. Development name
2. Purchase price (approx will do if you need to maintain your identity)
3. Selling/Rental price (approx will do)

Chief, I've personally know ppl who have made conservatively 2mil profit solely from properties before he reached 35. A fren who's starts from nothing 5 years ago and made conservatively 0.5mil from properties, and he's only 27. Having fren's with guys like these, lets see if you can still make me "choke"? rolleyes.gif

Perhaps you should expect a chuckle instead......... wink.gif


Backkom
post Jul 14 2009, 05:53 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 05:47 PM)
If you didnt sell, then median valuations (minus 10%) becomes your prop value. Anyway, the doubt the diff between the median valuation and transacted price is gonna make significant diff to your total networth (unless your networth is dem small lah).

Look, we all have "thought parameters", and its only normal for one to be curious and starts asking questions when we see something that goes beyond "normal". Plus, it was never the issue of "grasping", its a question of "believing". Its hard to believe you when you claimed to bought something 30% below market value and manage to rent/sell way above market value when you cant even provide :

1. Development name
2. Purchase price (approx will do if you need to maintain your identity)
3. Selling/Rental price (approx will do)

Chief, I've personally know ppl who have made conservatively 2mil profit solely from properties before he reached 35. A fren who's starts from nothing 5 years ago and made conservatively 0.5mil from properties, and he's only 27. Having fren's with guys like these, lets see if you can still make me "choke"? rolleyes.gif

Perhaps you should expect a chuckle instead......... wink.gif
*
Pai kor - notworthy.gif
Anyway I doubt that we'll get choked that easily - especially after wondering around in this forum for some time, seeing the same names appearing in many many threads (they practically parang everything that they find good), and having friend who's only 28, quit his job cause he has several properties in Aussie making him thousands of Aussie dollars a month + he's venturing into development in Aussie...

Anyway educational debates are welcomed - we all have plenty to learn. But let's just try not to get too emotional with our achievements.

By the way, the whole point of this forum is to share - so why don't you share with us which development helped you to make that good profit? rclxms.gif

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 14 2009, 06:01 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 06:05 PM

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i can identify with that accounting perspective and that's why i said.. you're probably smart, but you're not wise.. which is way better than me (i'm neither smart nor wise)

put it this way, you probably don't talk/mingle around with people who "cari makan" in the properties' business, agents, etc. (very much a diy person)

otherwise.. you'd know.

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 06:15 PM
Phoeni_142
post Jul 14 2009, 07:37 PM

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I am not interested in taking sides. However, I believe in talking frankly and accurately about specific investments made.

1. lwb - if u find something 30% below market - and manage to sell it at market price - your net worth doesn't change. Only your liquidity levels. It's a fact, and we're not hiding behind accounting rules either.

2. If u manage to sell the same mentioned property - 30% above market - then your net worth will change. Simple as that.

3. Congrats if u have managed to do so. Having said that, would be great if u shared which development, and some of the figures, considering it's already a done deal? This forum is about us learning from each other - so please share your success as an ideal case study. Unlike some of our esteemed guests here, I have no issues with choking.

4. I have no qualms sharing some of my own specific deals and figures as well. And I believe some of us have before anyway.

5. In response to a question raised by another gentleman earlier - With regards to the LRR or DIR ratio - banks are even willing to go higher than 100% for deviation cases. In general - 70 to 80% is the norm for most banks. However, please do not take what I hv mentioned as a fundamental law. For the sake of prudence - i'd like to humbly suggest maintaining a DIR ratio of 50% or less when u go into properties.

This post has been edited by Phoeni_142: Jul 14 2009, 07:42 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 09:21 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 14 2009, 05:47 PM)
You are right. I always play CashFlow 101 and I notice that no matter what job we are in, we can get out of rat race with proper investment and loan.

I am in Electronic Engineering too but I am still a student. I am in my final year now and I am going to find a job soon. smile.gif

Thanks for the long spoiler. I read it and I think I already read about it.

I can't find the audio book. How do you get it?  rclxub.gif
*
You may need to check with success resource or visit richdad.com.
It's not going to be cheap. sweat.gif

Remember to take your time, don't rush into it as it may burn you out.
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 09:34 PM

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yes, it's a done deal.. did the spa in june..

i met this agent about 4 years ago that knew this specific area and property like it's in the back of her hand.. this agent helped me dug out this unit and has almost 8 years dealing with this property alone.
after completing own due diligence, i concurred with alot of her beliefs..

on occasions, we talked about the area(golden triangle) and any policy changes that may impact development (be it price, cost of doing business, or the general rental market). it turned out that she's very pragmatic (with a faint hint of pessimism)..

she's not an ordinary agent, she manages(some as proxies) to a few dozens units there. she only turned owner cum agent recently. we're amongst the pro-tem committee of this said property.. i'm more like a ponteng figure due to work and all that.. but we fought hard to wrestle management rights' control from the developer's appointed team. it was an eye-opening lesson, i'd say.

this year(2009) was a very odd year. she was overly pessimist about the rental rates.. that's a bone of discontention i'll always have when it comes to rental.. she pitched $2.2, and i disagreed.. to cut the long story short.. i found a willing tennant at $2.5

the selling wasn't intentional although i kept my exit strategy in view all the time and bounce it off with my agent once in a while.. initially she laughed at that price. even my good 'ol agent didn't think it was possible to sell above certain price range.. even if that price was back to the original developer's price (that's how pessimistic it is)

i did alot of convincing at pitching to a potential buyer.. (i just didn't know that i can do sales *lol*) i made a risky proposition to go way above appraised rate and stated my points objectively.. it was a calculated risk i would say, because i noticed a huge spike in the equities market earlier and i set my senses on the horde of money coming into properties.. it's easier to sell when you know what's going on and have an idea of the 'flow of money'. the deal was seal and i look forward to collecting my 90% cheque in 2 months' time?

i've yet to tell my good 'ol agent.. i'd like to surprise her.. soon. i didn't want to reveal anything because i have a gut feeling that.. i may have an opportunity to get back into this particular condo again. i'm just gearing up for an re-entry(price) and toying with the numbers..

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 09:46 PM
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 09:44 PM

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see lwb, a lot ppl wish to learn to learn from you. Still recall sometime back when I humbly PMed you to learn but got shot down instead tongue.gif

Anyway, the above sounds like BTS? and that lady agent of yours, think I've meet her before, small world...... smile.gif

This post has been edited by Pai: Jul 14 2009, 09:49 PM
TSsdas86
post Jul 14 2009, 09:47 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 09:21 PM)
You may need to check with success resource or visit richdad.com.
It's not going to be cheap. sweat.gif

Remember to take your time, don't rush into it as it may burn you out.
*
Thanks. I find the richdad website and I manage to find the audio book. It is quite expensive at price USD$140.00. I am not going to buy it now ecause I do not have much money. I am going to buy Azizi Ali's books 1st. smile.gif

Thanks a lot for your help. notworthy.gif
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 09:52 PM

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rich dad is rich because of the tremendous support from you guys..
if you're adamant to read about kiyosaki.. consider only 2 of his writings
1. rich dad, poor dad
2. cashflow quadrant

i've read more than 10 of his books (free reading, borrowed from company's library back then).. the rest are similarly evolving around the theme from these 2 books..

i respect this guy for his shrew marketing techniques.. creating derivatives out of his core products and sell them like ramly burgers!!

i only purchased that 2 books mentioned above.. becareful of how you read them.. and you may have to read them more than once to see a different perspective. read critically.

and yes.. don't forget.. the yellow and blue; 2 books *lol* i really like that one! rclxms.gif

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 10:01 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 09:55 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 14 2009, 09:47 PM)
Thanks. I find the richdad website and I manage to find the audio book. It is quite expensive at price USD$140.00. I am not going to buy it now ecause I do not have much money. I am going to buy Azizi Ali's books 1st.  smile.gif

Thanks a lot for your help.  notworthy.gif
*
Or you can download other free audio book, the link it's at the end of Rich Dad Poor Dad book, Cashflow Quadrant and Guide to Investing..
I learn a lot after listening to it many times.
Example www.richdadbook1.com


BTW, Robert and Kim have 1400 small green house to date, this year his target to get 500 more.
He first started to flip properties when he is in Hawaii, not until Rich Dad pull him aside.
Warning him about flipping properties.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 14 2009, 10:01 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 09:59 PM

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i don't considered myself a property expert.. am just thankful that my dealings where lots of hands-on, sweat and have an open mind to listen.. property is just less than 15% of my portfolio (oh, i forgot.. we leverage right? *lol*). the key to that selling opportunity is spelled out in bold above.. i'm sure it's no secret, i just acted upon it.

no, it's not bts (don't know what it means).. i don't know if you've met her.. but she doesn't do mayland stuff.
i don't recalled your pm.. and i guess it's pointless to bring up old score.. if you just want to level 'em.

QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 09:44 PM)
see lwb, a lot ppl wish to learn to learn from you. Still recall sometime back when I humbly PMed you to learn but got shot down instead tongue.gif

Anyway, the above sounds like BTS? and that lady agent of yours, think I've meet her before, small world...... smile.gif
*
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 10:02 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 09:44 PM)
see lwb, a lot ppl wish to learn to learn from you. Still recall sometime back when I humbly PMed you to learn but got shot down instead tongue.gif

Anyway, the above sounds like BTS? and that lady agent of yours, think I've meet her before, small world...... smile.gif
*
BTS = Bian Tai Sicko? shocking.gif
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 10:08 PM

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sometimes the best advices you'll encounter comes from direct human contact..

go out and talk to property agents, befriend them (not necessarily for the sake of buying from them), go have a drink with them.. i believe they do appreciate a cordial client and a pair of ears to their.. sometimes difficult life.

you'd probably have to meet a/several dozen agents before you stumble upon a good one.. there're agents who're good at selling/buying.. and there're agents who're good at renting (the rare ones are good at both)

it's a networking game.. kiyosaki can't help you that.

QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 14 2009, 09:47 PM)
Thanks. I find the richdad website and I manage to find the audio book. It is quite expensive at price USD$140.00. I am not going to buy it now ecause I do not have much money. I am going to buy Azizi Ali's books 1st.  smile.gif

Thanks a lot for your help.  notworthy.gif
*
Pai
post Jul 14 2009, 10:08 PM

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BTS--> Berjaya Times Square.

lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 10:09 PM

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+1 rclxms.gif
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 10:02 PM)
BTS = Bian Tai Sicko? shocking.gif
*
TSsdas86
post Jul 14 2009, 10:09 PM

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QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 09:52 PM)
rich dad is rich because of the tremendous support from you guys..
if you're adamant to read about kiyosaki.. consider only 2 of his writings
1. rich dad, poor dad
2. cashflow quadrant

i've read more than 10 of his books (free reading, borrowed from company's library back then).. the rest are similarly evolving around the theme from these 2 books..

i respect this guy for his shrew marketing techniques.. creating derivatives out of his core products and sell them like ramly burgers!!

i only purchased that 2 books mentioned above.. becareful of how you read them.. and you may have to read them more than once to see a different perspective. read critically.

and yes.. don't forget.. the yellow and blue; 2 books *lol* i really like that one!  rclxms.gif
*
I have the cash flow quadrant and rich dad poor dad. I have several other of his books too. I already read several times and everytime I read, I find myself improve a bit and getting more understanding. smile.gif

I will surely get Azizi Ali's books.


Added on July 14, 2009, 10:10 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 09:55 PM)
Or you can download other free audio book, the link it's at the end of Rich Dad Poor Dad book, Cashflow Quadrant and Guide to Investing..
I learn a lot after listening to it many times.
Example www.richdadbook1.com
BTW, Robert and Kim have 1400 small green house to date, this year his target to get 500 more.
He first started to flip properties when he is in Hawaii, not until Rich Dad pull him aside.
Warning him about flipping properties.
*
Thanks for the link but it is not working. I am not going to flip properties. I want to buy and rent them. I want to earn the rent and live free.

This post has been edited by sdas86: Jul 14 2009, 10:10 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 10:13 PM

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good for you.. at least your success probability rate improves (not just by having the book la... but reading.. and understanding them)

there was once i stood for almost 3 hours at popular book store to read renesial leong's stuff.. her books are tad too expensive.

i placed a little "smart" bookmark at the page, went for a quick lunch and return to reading till i completed them.. there's an advantage if you're a fast reader.


Added on July 14, 2009, 10:20 pm
i sincerely doubt kiyosaki is making money from his properties now.. however, his major money making machine is at the educational & training/franchising business..

but he's using his past properties successful ventures as a leverage in his educational & training/franchising business..

if i read the numbers from the states.. properties are fubar-ed there. he would've made a killing if he has sold way earlier last year and vulture around to pick them up later.. if he's still holding them, the taxes will kill his margin.

property-rich people are always in a risky position.. look at trump.. loud and full of display.. but i guess the level of leveraging he took.. puts him in a precarious position.

oh yeah.. property is always a lagging indicator to other asset. so don't merely be so 'sei pan' and read only about properties.. it's akin to having a tunnel syndrome.. read widely as possible.. nobody says that being an investor is easy. it can be like a full time job..

cashflow don't always have to come from rentals.. since properties can't move around.. be prepared and make plans for an exit strategy.. some places DO becomes a cowboy town and demographics DO shift around.. know when to harvest and start the whole process again..

the trouble is.. it's easy to get sentimental.. especially on your first purchase.. the rest, slowly becomes.. statistics.


This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 10:36 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 10:21 PM

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afraid not..

QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 14 2009, 10:08 PM)
BTS--> Berjaya Times Square.
*
Backkom
post Jul 14 2009, 10:40 PM

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QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 10:21 PM)
afraid not..
*
I guess lwb is totally against spoon-feeding or the deal is just simply TOO good to be shared to strangers like you and me... hmm.gif

Anyway thanks for the Kiyosaki books recommendation. Personally I think the only book from Azizi Ali that's worth buying is the RM 19.90 "How to Pay Off Your House Loan in Five Years or Less" - great book for beginners like me to understand how housing loans work within the shortest time tongue.gif

lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 10:46 PM

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.. eerr, actually both. i don't mind sharing if i know you in person.. i only planned to tell my dad about this deal on september (do you think i would tell you now?)

paying off loan in 5 years? if it's a rental.. the better book is still the 'yellow and blue' books.. land-lording is no chicken feet.

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post Jul 14 2009, 10:48 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 14 2009, 10:40 PM)
I guess lwb is totally against spoon-feeding or the deal is just simply TOO good to be shared to strangers like you and me...  hmm.gif

Anyway thanks for the Kiyosaki books recommendation. Personally I think the only book from Azizi Ali that's worth buying is the RM 19.90 "How to Pay Off Your House Loan in Five Years or Less" - great book for beginners like me to understand how housing loans work within the shortest time  tongue.gif
*
Oh, that book.
I won't be buying that one.

It's for people who want to save money, not for those who want to be rich.

The rich control their property but they don't own it.
They take out the money from it's equity and re-invest it.
Phoeni_142
post Jul 14 2009, 10:54 PM

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Backkom - it's always more fulfilling to share your knowledge. It also pays to be generous and charitable, particularly in knowledge.

If one wants to share knowledge - don't share apple pie hunky dory stuff. I can get that by reading "Chicken Soup for the Soul"

Basically - I am not the most intelligent person here.

I am however an investor who knows my stuff, and yet is humble enough to learn or to ask for help or share my knowledge (AND I DO SO SPECIFICALLY)

I smell BS a mile away. And I know who to differentiate who is genuine and who's not. I think u guys know how to smell BS too. Enuf said.


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post Jul 14 2009, 10:56 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 14 2009, 10:09 PM)


Thanks for the link but it is not working. I am not going to flip properties. I want to buy and rent them. I want to earn the rent and live free.
*
Hmmm...

www.richdadbook1.com
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 10:57 PM

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+1 rclxms.gif a dangerously smart person indeed

yes, control is the key.. not ownership (took me a couple of years to relent to this idea). it's actually dangerous/risky to own alot of properties held privately.. maybe we can start a syndicate?

a lot of key lessons can be learnt from the corporate world..


QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 10:48 PM)
Oh, that book.
I won't be buying that one.

It's for people who want to save money, not for those who want to be rich.

The rich control their property but they don't own it.
They take out the money from it's equity and re-invest it.
*
aramis888
post Jul 14 2009, 11:02 PM

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QUOTE(Phoeni_142 @ Jul 14 2009, 10:54 PM)
Backkom - it's always more fulfilling to share your knowledge.  It also pays to be generous and charitable, particularly in knowledge.

If one wants to share knowledge - don't share apple pie hunky dory stuff.  I can get that by reading "Chicken Soup for the Soul"

Basically - I am not the most intelligent person here. 

I am however an investor who knows my stuff, and yet is humble enough to learn or to ask for help or share my knowledge (AND I DO SO SPECIFICALLY)

I smell BS a mile away. And I know who to differentiate who is genuine and who's not.  I think u guys know how to smell BS too.  Enuf said.
*
+1 rclxms.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 11:06 PM

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A book I just bought today, RM36.90 poorer:

You can become rich in property
by Peter Yee.
user posted image

Pai.
This book has some details in putting properties in a company.
I have not read that chapter yet.
You may like to browse through in a book store.
Backkom
post Jul 14 2009, 11:10 PM

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I was dumb enough to read his reproduction of "property jewel" then to find out that it was a waste of time...

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 14 2009, 11:14 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:11 PM

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got tax rebate ma.. why want to "kgam kgam cham cham"?

Backkom
post Jul 14 2009, 11:13 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 11:06 PM)
A book I just bought today, RM36.90 poorer:

You can become rich in property
by Peter Yee.
user posted image

Pai.
This book has some details in putting properties in a company.
I have not read that chapter yet.
You may like to browse through in a book store.
*
I bought and read this book too.
From my point of view - I kinda like the portfolio with "seasons" thingy, though its very hard for newbie like me to figure out when are springs and winters...

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 14 2009, 11:15 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:15 PM

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aiyaa.. i'm also a great fault in this BS department.

sometimes tired from a long day's at work.. i find myself ridiculous to be taken seriously.

that's why i advocate sourcing real info from elsewhere than this forum.. (yes, don't have to blame no one.. i stand up to be counted) but it's good to know that you guys read.. books +1 to that rclxms.gif

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 11:17 PM
Phoeni_142
post Jul 14 2009, 11:18 PM

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erm - i am not too sure what people mentioned in the posts before, and i'm not going to bother deciphering it out.

I agree with u Backkom. There are gems u can get from everybook you read. And I despise people who say certain books are dumb. No point being condesceding. At least the bugger is smart enought to write a book, right?

I like Azizi's "How to be a Millionaire Landlord". He's not the best author I've read, but I learned some stuff from him.
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:19 PM

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"At least the bugger is smart enought to write a book, right?"... not just that.. write, market and sell it, and profit from the sales!
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 11:22 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 14 2009, 11:13 PM)
I bought and read this book too.
From my point of view - I kinda like the portfolio with "seasons" thingy, though its very hard for newbie like me to figure out when are springs and winters...
*
I read 8 chapters and most of the things was repeated on other study material.
Yet I also learn something new too.

It's a bit harder for newbie, that is why I recommend Rich Dad 6 steps, it's the basics. thumbup.gif
Backkom
post Jul 14 2009, 11:23 PM

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QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 14 2009, 11:15 PM)
aiyaa.. i'm also a great fault in this BS department.

sometimes tired from a long day's at work.. i find myself ridiculous to be taken seriously.

that's why i advocate sourcing real info from elsewhere than this forum.. (yes, don't have to blame no one.. i stand up to be counted) but it's good to know that you guys read.. books +1 to that  rclxms.gif
*
Hmm, just to let you guys know, I'm just a beginner in forums, and I'm very grateful for all the taikors and sifus who shared their precious info here. And thanks to them, I managed to get a unit in TS rclxms.gif notworthy.gif
(I don't dare to say that TS is definitely gonna make money for us, but at least I'm very very happy to get a unit there.)

Just to share - the power of forums...

There are people who are here to share sincerely - of course the aim, let's all make money together-gether!


Added on July 14, 2009, 11:28 pm
QUOTE(Phoeni_142 @ Jul 14 2009, 11:18 PM)
erm - i am not too sure what people mentioned in the posts before, and i'm not going to bother deciphering it out.

I agree with u Backkom.  There are gems u can get from everybook you read.  And I despise people who say certain books are dumb.  No point being condesceding. At least the bugger is smart enought to write a book, right?

I like Azizi's "How to be a Millionaire Landlord".  He's not the best author I've read, but I learned some stuff from him.
*
I think it's good sharing here - helps everyone to save some time on books as many books have repetitive content rclxms.gif
I bet Azizi's landlord book has similar content to Renesial's tenant book?

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 14 2009, 11:28 PM
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:31 PM

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am happy for you.. don't have to reveal what "ts" is.. education is to help you discern and protect yourself (from forseeable eventualities).. if that includes protecting proprietary information.. i must say, you've done a good job! +1 to you Backkom rclxms.gif

yeah.. both books (rl and aa) are similar in nature.. only difference is.. one's heavier and the other's cheaper

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 11:33 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 14 2009, 11:45 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 14 2009, 11:23 PM)


I think it's good sharing here - helps everyone to save some time on books as many books have repetitive content  rclxms.gif
I bet Azizi's landlord book has similar content to Renesial's tenant book?
*
Err, nope.
There are both similiarities and differences.
lwb
post Jul 14 2009, 11:52 PM

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it's either you're tying so hard to be a smart alec or you just failed to see that.. in all possible manner.. no two producers would want, not even a tiniest bit.. that their products are similar!!

for the 40 odd products that kiyosaki has produce.. he still fervently rejecting the notion that much of it are paraphrasing and recycled stuff.. so that you guys can continue to scout for the minute differences and paying a premium along the way.

of course there're differences la.. it's tantamount to plagiarism to claim they're the same.. but do you have to dig into nitpicking the micro details to proof that you've proof read them?!?

that's so lame!

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 14 2009, 11:53 PM
Pai
post Jul 15 2009, 12:38 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 14 2009, 11:23 PM)
Hmm, just to let you guys know, I'm just a beginner in forums, and I'm very grateful for all the taikors and sifus who shared their precious info here. And thanks to them, I managed to get a unit in TS  rclxms.gif  notworthy.gif
(I don't dare to say that TS is definitely gonna make money for us, but at least I'm very very happy to get a unit there.)

Just to share - the power of forums...

There are people who are here to share sincerely - of course the aim, let's all make money together-gether!

*
My exact thoughts smile.gif

I feel that in good forums (like the one you visited), we get to learn real stuff. Im forever grateful to the taikors and sifus from forums who guide me into property investment 4 years ago and I learnt more from these guy's real life experience VS books. At the end of the day, nothing beats experience and these guys were kind enuff to teach me stuff and learn from their mistakes and profits. This I believe has considerably shorten my learning curve.

Without forums, no TS, or even Maytower for me............... wink.gif

One word of caution here, there's always gonna be good sifus, and bad ones. Use your own judgement to evaluate the advise you get.


aramis888
post Jul 15 2009, 01:05 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 15 2009, 12:38 AM)
My exact thoughts  smile.gif

I feel that in good forums (like the one you visited), we get to learn real stuff. Im forever grateful to the taikors and sifus from forums who guide me into property investment 4 years ago and I learnt more from these guy's real life experience VS books. At the end of the day, nothing beats experience and these guys were kind enuff to teach me stuff and learn from their mistakes and profits. This I believe has considerably shorten my learning curve.

Without forums, no TS, or even Maytower for me...............  wink.gif

One word of caution here, there's always gonna be good sifus, and bad ones. Use your own judgement to evaluate the advise you get.
*
+1 nuf said. smile.gif
babana
post Jul 15 2009, 08:55 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 15 2009, 12:38 AM)
My exact thoughts  smile.gif

I feel that in good forums (like the one you visited), we get to learn real stuff. Im forever grateful to the taikors and sifus from forums who guide me into property investment 4 years ago and I learnt more from these guy's real life experience VS books. At the end of the day, nothing beats experience and these guys were kind enuff to teach me stuff and learn from their mistakes and profits. This I believe has considerably shorten my learning curve.

Without forums, no TS, or even Maytower for me...............  wink.gif

One word of caution here, there's always gonna be good sifus, and bad ones. Use your own judgement to evaluate the advise you get.
*
+2 here biggrin.gif
Pai
post Jul 15 2009, 10:51 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 11:06 PM)
A book I just bought today, RM36.90 poorer:

Pai.
This book has some details in putting properties in a company.
I have not read that chapter yet.
You may like to browse through in a book store.
*
thanks boss notworthy.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 15 2009, 10:52 AM

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Just got good news from my agent.
My 2nd property this year is confirmed.
Auction at RM109.4k and market rate is at RM142k. biggrin.gif
Pai
post Jul 15 2009, 10:53 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 10:52 AM)
Just got good news from my agent.
My 2nd property this year is confirmed.
Auction at RM109.4k and market rate is at RM142k. biggrin.gif
*
woahh........congrats!!!

Jason is a tycoon in the making. notworthy.gif

btw, how much can you rent this out?
Backkom
post Jul 15 2009, 11:06 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 10:52 AM)
Just got good news from my agent.
My 2nd property this year is confirmed.
Auction at RM109.4k and market rate is at RM142k. biggrin.gif
*
Which area? Congrats rclxms.gif
suiteng
post Jul 15 2009, 11:30 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 15 2009, 12:38 AM)
My exact thoughts  smile.gif

I feel that in good forums (like the one you visited), we get to learn real stuff. Im forever grateful to the taikors and sifus from forums who guide me into property investment 4 years ago and I learnt more from these guy's real life experience VS books. At the end of the day, nothing beats experience and these guys were kind enuff to teach me stuff and learn from their mistakes and profits. This I believe has considerably shorten my learning curve.

Without forums, no TS, or even Maytower for me...............  wink.gif

One word of caution here, there's always gonna be good sifus, and bad ones. Use your own judgement to evaluate the advise you get.
*
Free advice is always the most expensive advice wink.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 15 2009, 01:03 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 15 2009, 10:53 AM)
woahh........congrats!!!

Jason is a tycoon in the making. notworthy.gif 

btw, how much can you rent this out?
*
Ahem.
I still have a lot to learn from you, phoeni and others. wink.gif

Let's see, RM750 per month non furnish. Partly furnish can push it to RM950.
Maintenance RM132.

Since my sis will be paying the 10% and acquisition cost.
I am not required to put anything down.
Technically my ROI is infinite.
The condition is she own half of the property plus the initial fund she put in, I collect the cashflow and pay the mortgage.
Only need to pay her back when re-finance or sell it off. cool.gif


Added on July 15, 2009, 1:04 pm
QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 15 2009, 11:06 AM)
Which area? Congrats  rclxms.gif
*
It's in JB, near Iskandar area.
The exact location hint: See ongkl blog. ;D

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 15 2009, 01:04 PM
Backkom
post Jul 15 2009, 02:54 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 01:03 PM)


It's in JB, near Iskandar area.
The exact location hint: See ongkl blog. ;D
*
KIP Park?
babana
post Jul 15 2009, 03:11 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 01:03 PM)
Ahem.
I still have a lot to learn from you, phoeni and others. wink.gif

Let's see, RM750 per month non furnish. Partly furnish can push it to RM950.
Maintenance RM132.

Since my sis will be paying the 10% and acquisition cost.
I am not required to put anything down.
Technically my ROI is infinite.
The condition is she own half of the property plus the initial fund she put in, I collect the cashflow and pay the mortgage.
Only need to pay her back when re-finance or sell it off.  cool.gif


Added on July 15, 2009, 1:04 pm

It's in JB, near Iskandar area.
The exact location hint: See ongkl blog. ;D
*
jason, assuming ur sis took 90% loan (abt RM98k), ur repayment works out to abt RM443 a mth (based on BLR-2.0, 30 yr tenure). add maintenance fee of RM132 in and it'll set u back RM575 a mth. assuming mthly rental of RM900 fully furnished (conservative abit la...hehe). ur mthly cash inflow is RM325, which works out to RM3900 a yr. if u n ur sis decides to sell the hse after 5 yrs, u would've gotten RM20k in rental yield + cap gains whereas ur sis would only receive the cap gains + her equivalent of d/p back although she paid the d/p upfront!

hmmm...this agreement seems to be loopsided to u la, ur sis is losing out!! tongue.gif

This post has been edited by babana: Jul 15 2009, 03:13 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 15 2009, 03:15 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 15 2009, 02:54 PM)
KIP Park?
*
Hehe. rclxms.gif


Added on July 15, 2009, 3:23 pm
QUOTE(babana @ Jul 15 2009, 03:11 PM)
jason, assuming ur sis took 90% loan (abt RM98k), ur repayment works out to abt RM443 a mth (based on BLR-2.0, 30 yr tenure). add maintenance fee of RM132 in and it'll set u back RM575 a mth. assuming mthly rental of RM900 fully furnished (conservative abit la...hehe). ur mthly cash inflow is RM325, which works out to RM3900 a yr. if u n ur sis decides to sell the hse after 5 yrs, u would've gotten RM20k in rental yield + cap gains whereas ur sis would only receive the cap gains + her equivalent of d/p back although she paid the d/p upfront!

hmmm...this agreement seems to be loopsided to u la, ur sis is losing out!! tongue.gif
*
I see it as a win-win situation.
If we sell after 5 years, with some slight modification to the numbers.

Cost RM110k.
DP RM11k.
Cost of acquisition RM8k.
Sell at market RM142k.
Amortization is ignore at the moment.

Get back cash of RM142k - RM110k + RM11k = RM43k

Return to sis RM19k, balance RM24k.
Sis gets profit of RM12k after 5 years by investing RM19k.
Not bad for getting 13% return on investment every year.
She only needs to fork out the money and I get all the work done, including the mortgage.

Not to forget we have some equity in the armortization. wink.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 15 2009, 03:23 PM
Backkom
post Jul 15 2009, 03:31 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 03:15 PM)
Hehe. rclxms.gif

*
Hehe not bad... biggrin.gif
babana
post Jul 15 2009, 03:34 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 03:15 PM)
I see it as a win-win situation.
If we sell after 5 years, with some slight modification to the numbers.

Cost RM110k.
DP RM11k.
Cost of acquisition RM8k.
Sell at market RM142k.
Amortization is ignore at the moment.

Get back cash of RM142k - RM110k + RM11k = RM43k

Return to sis RM19k, balance RM24k.
Sis gets profit of RM12k after 5 years by investing RM19k.
Not bad for getting 13% return on investment every year.
She only needs to fork out the money and I get all the work done, including the mortgage.

Not to forget we have some equity in the armortization.  wink.gif
*
haha, well analysed and said rclxms.gif
i have a question though - the cost of acquisition RM8k...what would this payment be for? legal fees, s&p, etc or fees relating to processing for an auction property?

have never dabbled in any auction properties before but RM8k seems pretty steep, considering the property in question is only RM110k.
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post Jul 15 2009, 04:08 PM

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QUOTE(babana @ Jul 15 2009, 03:34 PM)
haha, well analysed and said  rclxms.gif
i have a question though - the cost of acquisition RM8k...what would this payment be for? legal fees, s&p, etc or fees relating to processing for an auction property?

have never dabbled in any auction properties before but RM8k seems pretty steep, considering the property in question is only RM110k.
*
RM8k is an estimation, it should be around 7~8k.

The break down:

Agent RM3k
Lawyer + tax RM4k
Miscellaneous RM1k

I pay my agent additional RM1k for them to bid on my behalf.
If you can DIY, the price will be 4~5k.
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post Jul 15 2009, 04:45 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 10:56 PM)
I tried the link again and it is not working. I think that the link is no longer available. smile.gif


Added on July 15, 2009, 4:49 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 10:52 AM)
Just got good news from my agent.
My 2nd property this year is confirmed.
Auction at RM109.4k and market rate is at RM142k. biggrin.gif
*
Wow, congrats. How do you manage to find low price property? How to look for auction property? Where to go to auction for property?

This post has been edited by sdas86: Jul 15 2009, 04:49 PM
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post Jul 15 2009, 04:50 PM

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For me it's ok? Weird.

Any other forumer have this problem?
TSsdas86
post Jul 15 2009, 04:55 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 04:50 PM)
For me it's ok? Weird.

Any other forumer have this problem?
*
Hi,
The link is working now. Thanks.

How do you find auction? Where to attend auction? smile.gif
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post Jul 15 2009, 04:56 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 15 2009, 04:45 PM)
Wow, congrats. How do you manage to find low price property? How to look for auction property? Where to go to auction for property?
*
Thanks.

How to find?
I learn this from Rich Dad 6 steps, look at 20 properties every week.
Remember looking at property is not the first step, that is step number 3.

Low price property are everywhere but you don't want to look at all of them.
Most are in a bad area hence their low price.
Thus need to go back to step 2, finding an area.


As for auction, there are valuable thread in Lowyat about auction.
Some books also do write about it.


Added on July 15, 2009, 4:58 pm
QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 15 2009, 04:45 PM)

Wow, congrats. How do you manage to find low price property? How to look for auction property? Where to go to auction for property?
*
Thanks.

How to find?
I learn this from Rich Dad 6 steps, look at 20 properties every week.
Remember looking at property is not the first step, that is step number 3.

Low price property are everywhere but you don't want to look at all of them.
Most are in a bad area hence their low price.
Thus need to go back to step 2, finding an area.


As for auction, there are valuable thread in Lowyat about auction.
Some books also do write about it.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 15 2009, 04:58 PM
TSsdas86
post Jul 15 2009, 05:00 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 15 2009, 04:56 PM)
Thanks.

How to find?
I learn this from Rich Dad 6 steps, look at 20 properties every week.
Remember looking at property is not the first step, that is step number 3.

Low price property are everywhere but you don't want to look at all of them.
Most are in a bad area hence their low price.
Thus need to go back to step 2, finding an area.
As for auction, there are valuable thread in Lowyat about auction.
Some books also do write about it.
Can you give me the link to the thread or auction?

The book you bought is a good book. I read part of it in bookstore but I do not buy it. laugh.gif I always got bookstores to read books. lolx

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post Jul 16 2009, 10:41 AM

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Try to search for yourself, especially google. wink.gif

From Ongkl blog.
http://reijb.com/must-know-auction-property/
lwb
post Jul 16 2009, 11:48 AM

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"free advices are usually very costly.."
.. there's some point to it.

that's why i don't name my examples.. it's a different way of learning, the principles are more important that explicit illustration (accompanied by figures to substantiate.. folks who have high gullibility and vulnerability would look closely for these.. and more so, from a stranger?!? what's the level of authenticity of it?!? what if i'm just a goofball who knows how to work some fancy figures and impress some "wooo,... waaa"?)

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 16 2009, 11:50 AM
Pai
post Jul 16 2009, 12:53 PM

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hmmmph......95% of profits I made to date are based on free internet- based advise. Maybe Im just plain lucky tongue.gif

A good advise is a good advise, irrespective of whether its free or not. Bottomline, one needs to know have strong basics to able to appreciate and differentiate good/bad advise.



lwb, specifics are the easiest way to spot a BS. A guys who BS will not be able to provide specifics most of the time.
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post Jul 16 2009, 01:18 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 16 2009, 10:41 AM)
Try to search for yourself, especially google. wink.gif

From Ongkl blog.
http://reijb.com/must-know-auction-property/
*
I found some auctions on TheStar Classified. smile.gif
lwb
post Jul 16 2009, 01:25 PM

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specifics ala "copy & paste" ma..

anyway, i'm not into the 'specifics' sort of learning.. because in my other investments, specifics are merely arbitrary..

i earned my bulk of returns over a decade from parental advice(which is also another free form of advices) but filtered through with countless of homeworking and due-diligence..

for example.. my dad won't specify what/where to buy.. but the how/why/when to buy.. and theories are tested there.
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post Jul 16 2009, 01:51 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 15 2009, 03:31 PM)
Hehe not bad...  biggrin.gif
*
Nearby there.
Villa Ros to be exact.

user posted image

user posted image

lwb
post Jul 16 2009, 02:10 PM

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-3
hahaa... censored "specifics"..
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post Jul 16 2009, 02:16 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 16 2009, 01:18 PM)
I found some auctions on TheStar Classified.  smile.gif
*
More than 50% are in bad area. Searching auction property is not 1st of the 6 step. blush.gif
Backkom
post Jul 16 2009, 02:17 PM

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jasonhjk: thanks a lot for your sharing, bit of "censorship" won't hurt there. And the Ongkl blog is good =)

Was not aware of Villa Ros before, have only did a bit of homework on Pulai View, Prima regency (lots of homework), straits view and kip park...

Pai
post Jul 16 2009, 02:28 PM

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@lwb,

lucky you, at least you've got someone to teach you something. Us mere mortals will have to rely and what we learn ourselves and the kindness of internet strangers..... wink.gif

on specifics, one can always copy & paste, but few more questions is all it takes to unravel the whole BS..... ;p
Phoeni_142
post Jul 16 2009, 02:36 PM

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Pai brother - what more questions do u need to ask? The BS is already evident for everyone to see.

Oh well - people that are not specific also have their uses. I enjoy reading their "chicken soup for the soul" posts. Gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling.

Jason - elegantly and beautifully done. Specific smile.gif And your censorship is kinda cute, but justified lah....
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post Jul 16 2009, 02:45 PM

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QUOTE(suiteng @ Jul 15 2009, 11:30 AM)
Free advice is always the most expensive advice wink.gif
*

QUOTE(lwb @ Jul 16 2009, 11:48 AM)
"free advices are usually very costly.."
.. there's some point to it.

that's why i don't name my examples.. it's a different way of learning, the principles are more important that explicit illustration (accompanied by figures to substantiate.. folks who have high gullibility and vulnerability would look closely for these.. and more so, from a stranger?!? what's the level of authenticity of it?!? what if i'm just a goofball who knows how to work some fancy figures and impress some "wooo,... waaa"?)
*
Thanks for elaborating my post and being a role model for all to see wink.gif
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post Jul 16 2009, 03:23 PM

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@phoeni,

I always give ppl benefit of the doubt kua........ wink.gif.


@Backkom,

chief, u play in JB oso? you got time to manage props in diff state?
Backkom
post Jul 16 2009, 04:06 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 16 2009, 03:23 PM)

@Backkom,

chief, u play in JB oso? you got time to manage props in diff state?
*
Sigh, long story... forced to move to JB because of work... so have to do homework lo...
Anyway this Prima Regency is really something interesting, price 100-110k, rental basic unit RM 700, fully furnished RM 1000...

I was so amazed when I first found out about this... (imagine my 200k condo in PJ only getting me 1k also...)
Pai
post Jul 16 2009, 05:24 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 16 2009, 04:06 PM)
Sigh, long story... forced to move to JB because of work... so have to do homework lo...
Anyway this Prima Regency is really something interesting, price 100-110k, rental basic unit RM 700, fully furnished RM 1000...

I was so amazed when I first found out about this... (imagine my 200k condo in PJ only getting me 1k also...)
*
thats above 10% yield, very impressive... smile.gif
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post Jul 16 2009, 05:29 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 16 2009, 02:17 PM)
jasonhjk: thanks a lot for your sharing, bit of "censorship" won't hurt there. And the Ongkl blog is good =)

Was not aware of Villa Ros before, have only did a bit of homework on Pulai View, Prima regency (lots of homework), straits view and kip park...
*
Hehe.
The censor part are only the location and agent contacts.
It's really amusing seeing someone giving bad advice, phoeni and I knows that. cool2.gif
When you meet some other agents or investors whom lied and don't admit their mistake.
It's time to kick them out of your team. Their advise is the worst you can hear.

I can spot free advice that are worthy of hearing once my experience level goes up. wink.gif


Here is the raw picture.
http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/8524/saleprice2.jpg


Here is another ongkl blog about JB's apartment.
Best and worst apartments/condominiums of year 2008 in Johor Bahru


Added on July 16, 2009, 5:35 pm
QUOTE(Phoeni_142 @ Jul 16 2009, 02:36 PM)
Jason - elegantly and beautifully done.  Specific smile.gif And your censorship is kinda cute, but justified lah....
*
Thanks.
I always look up your post when buying property.
What get me going is knowing you went out to look for properties with your Mrs.
Which I have been slacking when starting out.

So when is the next one coming up? thumbup.gif


Added on July 16, 2009, 5:38 pm
QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 16 2009, 04:06 PM)
Sigh, long story... forced to move to JB because of work... so have to do homework lo...
Anyway this Prima Regency is really something interesting, price 100-110k, rental basic unit RM 700, fully furnished RM 1000...

I was so amazed when I first found out about this... (imagine my 200k condo in PJ only getting me 1k also...)
*
Prima is near Giant and Tesco.
The shop houses nearby are still close though.
Maybe I am wrong about the shops because I only passes by there at night.

So are those staying there working in Singapore or working nearby?

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 16 2009, 05:38 PM
Backkom
post Jul 16 2009, 05:44 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 16 2009, 05:29 PM)


Added on July 16, 2009, 5:38 pm

Prima is near Giant and Tesco.
The shop houses nearby are still close though.
Maybe I am wrong about the shops because I only passes by there at night.

So are those staying there working in Singapore or working nearby?
*
Mostly working in singapore or pasir gudang smile.gif
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post Jul 16 2009, 05:56 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 16 2009, 05:44 PM)
Mostly working in singapore or pasir gudang  smile.gif
*
No wonder the high rental.

So far I have only notice 1 Prima unit being auction, shouldn't the price be higher?
Or we are not referring to the same unit? hmm.gif


Ref No: PAHJ2383(1)

Auction Date: 24/06/2009
Auction Place: Suite No. 1602, 16th Floor, City Plaza, Johor Bahru
Auction Time: 3.00 pm
Property Description: three bedroom apartment
Land/Floor Area: 1050 Sq. Feet.
Property Address: #03-02, Block 7 (Wembley Court), Prima Regency Service Apartment, Jalan Masai Baru, 81750 Masai, Johor darul Takzim.

Reserve Price (RM): RM 140,000.00
Backkom
post Jul 16 2009, 05:58 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 16 2009, 05:56 PM)
No wonder the high rental.

So far I have only notice 1 Prima unit being auction, shouldn't the price be higher?
Or we are not referring to the same unit? hmm.gif
Ref No: PAHJ2383(1)

Auction Date: 24/06/2009
Auction Place: Suite No. 1602, 16th Floor, City Plaza, Johor Bahru
Auction Time: 3.00 pm
Property Description: three bedroom apartment
Land/Floor Area: 1050 Sq. Feet.
Property Address: #03-02, Block 7 (Wembley Court), Prima Regency Service Apartment, Jalan Masai Baru, 81750 Masai, Johor darul Takzim.

Reserve Price (RM): RM 140,000.00
*
Me talking about studio units smile.gif
560++ sqf only, so far only heard of 2 auction units but both were called off sad.gif
Phoeni_142
post Jul 16 2009, 07:36 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 16 2009, 05:29 PM)


Thanks.
I always look up your post when buying property.
What get me going is knowing you went out to look for properties with your Mrs.
Which I have been slacking when starting out.

So when is the next one coming up?  thumbup.gif


*
You flatter me, kind sir. tongue.gif I am not worthy of that compliment.

To be honest, I have been "dormant" for the last 4 or 5 months. Work has been bad....But i'm sure everyone goes through that pain as well. We still do go out on most weekends to scout around.

The next deal we want to close has to be done right. There is no margin for error, due to the larger numbers involved. As such, we've been awfully stringent.

Good to know u did well in your last deal. Congrats bro.
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post Jul 16 2009, 09:36 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 16 2009, 02:16 PM)
More than 50% are in bad area. Searching auction property is not 1st of the 6 step. blush.gif
*
Thanks for the tips. Today I bought Azizi Ali "How to pay off your house loan in 5 years or less". It is a good small little book. smile.gif

I also notice that those listed in TheStar Classified is not that good.
Dyong
post Jul 16 2009, 11:15 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 16 2009, 05:44 PM)
Mostly working in singapore or pasir gudang  smile.gif
*
A possible dilution when the new bunch of Service Apartment completes in 3 years time.
Mayland Austin/ Plenitude/ Auntin Heights etc...


Backkom
post Jul 16 2009, 11:18 PM

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QUOTE(Dyong @ Jul 16 2009, 11:15 PM)
A possible dilution when the new bunch of Service Apartment completes in 3 years time.
Mayland Austin/ Plenitude/ Auntin Heights etc...
*
Totally agree with you... If I'm not wrong, Mayland Austin's entry price is in the range of 100k?
One thing I like about Prima Regency is that their JMB seems to be quite strong...
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post Jul 17 2009, 11:46 AM

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that's why i said you're probably smart.. probably smarter than mudflap phoney.. i noted that there're emotional usage in alot of his output content..

even when he goes to the point of "learning from me".. probably this mudflap dawg is looking for a new mastar?

emotions are a stickler to good investor. kudos to you should you know how to ask the right questions.. i learnt that one finds more doors to open, that way.

my insight to properties is not solely on the physical properties alone.. there're just too many info that i'm not at liberty to disclose here as i will violate the trust of my colleagues/institution/industry..

there's a financial cookie trail one can follows.. asking the right question will lead you to the next cookie on the trail.

yes.. it's probably wise to styrofoam-pack all that i've said as b.s.. because i'm not looking for favors, support, praises, etc. here. but i can offer a way of due dilligence (not as to which property.. but the why,how, when..) an antithesis to an inflated assumption perhaps?

This post has been edited by lwb: Jul 17 2009, 11:48 AM
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post Jul 17 2009, 01:20 PM

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QUOTE(Phoeni_142 @ Jul 16 2009, 07:36 PM)
You flatter me, kind sir.  tongue.gif I am not worthy of that compliment.

To be honest, I have been "dormant" for the last 4 or 5 months.  Work has been bad....But i'm sure everyone goes through that pain as well.  We still do go out on most weekends to scout around. 

The next deal we want to close has to be done right.  There is no margin for error, due to the larger numbers involved.  As such, we've been awfully stringent.  

Good to know u did well in your last deal.  Congrats bro.
*
The bigger the number, the longer time needed to put the deal together.
Once all the due diligence is done, the likelihood it will go wrong will be low.
I bet it feels just like going through your first deal, that type of nervous and anxious feeling. nod.gif

At the area I am concentrating, interestingly the rental went up.
With less buyers in the market, I am actually having fun shopping.
Since last month, 3 Sri Akasia apartment auction that I have interest in, were call off.
The owners pay the bank 1 day before auction date.
They believe after the recovery, price will go up.
Their sentiments is a good indication for me even though I didn't manage to play landlord and evict them. sweat.gif

My first deal didn't went too well, I make the mistake of agreeing the seller to transfer the tittle directly to me from the developer's bank. Saving the seller a few thousand.
Till today I have not get the keys.

Last month I just have my agent install a few AC (and other installation) to jack the rent up to RM800.
So starting from this month, I get RM200 and the owner gets RM600.
It's interesting how much one can learn by doing deals. blush.gif


Added on July 17, 2009, 1:26 pm
QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 16 2009, 05:58 PM)
Me talking about studio units  smile.gif
560++ sqf only, so far only heard of 2 auction units but both were called off  sad.gif
*
If you can get the 1050 sq ft apartment for RM140k, that would be a steal.

Works out to be RM133 per sq ft.


560 sq ft for RM110k would get you around RM196 per sq ft.

Looking at the sq ft is important for comparing / analyzing deals.

Do you know how much is the rent for 1050 sq ft?

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 17 2009, 01:26 PM
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post Jul 17 2009, 02:50 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 17 2009, 01:20 PM)

Added on July 17, 2009, 1:26 pm

If you can get the 1050 sq ft apartment for RM140k, that would be a steal.

Works out to be RM133 per sq ft.
560 sq ft for RM110k would get you around RM196 per sq ft.

Looking at the sq ft is important for comparing / analyzing deals.

Do you know how much is the rent for 1050 sq ft?
*
I agree that the amount you pay per sq ft is important.

I usually go to iProperty.com.my to check out the surrounding property $ per sq ft brows.gif
It gives me an idea what's the market rate like in an area

-removed, you already had your blog in your signature-

This post has been edited by b00n: Jul 17 2009, 11:19 PM
Pai
post Jul 17 2009, 06:13 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 17 2009, 01:20 PM)
If you can get the 1050 sq ft apartment for RM140k, that would be a steal.

Works out to be RM133 per sq ft.
560 sq ft for RM110k would get you around RM196 per sq ft.

Looking at the sq ft is important for comparing / analyzing deals.

Do you know how much is the rent for 1050 sq ft?
*
Jason, in many instance, studio will always command more in rentals psf and selling price psf. Do a research on the following development then you'll know :

1. Pantai Panorama
2. Tamarind at Sentul East
3. Amcorp mall
4. Kampung warisan


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post Jul 17 2009, 10:58 PM

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Huh, interesting.

Studio unit trend is picking up among young professionals.
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post Jul 17 2009, 11:04 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 17 2009, 10:58 PM)
Huh, interesting.

Studio unit trend is picking up among young professionals.
*
Yes, I believe it is actually easier to rent out Studio & 2-Rooms
compare to the 3 or 4 room units.

Also, the studio & 2-rooms usually give an overall better return
in terms of rental per invested cost.

user posted image
www.shchoy.com

This post has been edited by shchoy: Jul 18 2009, 02:53 PM
Backkom
post Jul 17 2009, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 17 2009, 01:20 PM)

Added on July 17, 2009, 1:26 pm

If you can get the 1050 sq ft apartment for RM140k, that would be a steal.

Works out to be RM133 per sq ft.
560 sq ft for RM110k would get you around RM196 per sq ft.

Looking at the sq ft is important for comparing / analyzing deals.

Do you know how much is the rent for 1050 sq ft?
*
Hmm don't have the exact rental figures for the bigger units, but if I'm not wrong, the rental yield is not as attractive as studio (of course I prefer to vest in studio unit cause the risk is involved is smaller - me just small fish with very limited holding power)...

Update:
Prima Regency 3 bedroom unit rental
Basic unit - 1k
Furnished - 1.4k

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 17 2009, 11:30 PM
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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 16 2009, 09:36 PM)
Thanks for the tips. Today I bought Azizi Ali "How to pay off your house loan in 5 years or less". It is a good small little book. smile.gif

I also notice that those listed in TheStar Classified is not that good.
*
Well, at least you will learn how loans work. flex.gif

For me I don't intend to pay off my loan for my property.
I would either re-finance every 5 years or flip it.
Taking the equity out and re-invest it.
That is part of my plan.
If you don't understand why, just act as though you do. (LOL) doh.gif

Speaking of which, Investing is a plan.
There are people out there that buys a property and later sell it for a profit.
Later they would continue the cycle again with another property.

There is nothing wrong for flipping properties but flipping alone is not called investing.
Without a plan, they are pushing the wheelbarrow.
And again, if you don't understand, just act as though you do.
Few years ago I don't understand lesson #4 until early this year.

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «



» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «




This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 17 2009, 11:48 PM
Pai
post Jul 17 2009, 11:39 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 17 2009, 10:58 PM)
Huh, interesting.

Studio unit trend is picking up among young professionals.
*
Not just young prof, think now there r more n more older singles (esp ladies) prefer to stay in studio's VS 2b or 3b. Maybe they like it coz less cleaning needs to be done tongue.gif
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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 17 2009, 11:39 PM)
Not just young prof, think now there r more n more older singles (esp ladies) prefer to stay in studio's VS 2b or 3b. Maybe they like it coz less cleaning needs to be done  tongue.gif
*
Less maintenance fee to pay too tongue.gif
TSsdas86
post Jul 18 2009, 06:06 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 17 2009, 11:38 PM)
Well, at least you will learn how loans work.  flex.gif

For me I don't intend to pay off my loan for my property.
I would either re-finance every 5 years or flip it.
Taking the equity out and re-invest it.
That is part of my plan.
If you don't understand why, just act as though you do. (LOL)  doh.gif

Speaking of which, Investing is a plan.
There are people out there that buys a property and later sell it for a profit.
Later they would continue the cycle again with another property.

There is nothing wrong for flipping properties but flipping alone is not called investing.
Without a plan, they are pushing the wheelbarrow.
And again, if you don't understand, just act as though you do.
Few years ago I don't understand lesson #4 until early this year.

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
Hi, great post.

It is not easy to find a good real estate for investment. I am looking at one in Kuching area but I think that it is over-priced. Most houses in Kuching is over-priced. I am not sure hwy it is so expensive in Kuching. hmm.gif
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post Jul 19 2009, 09:49 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 18 2009, 06:06 PM)
Hi, great post.

It is not easy to find a good real estate for investment. I am looking at one in Kuching area but I think that it is over-priced. Most houses in Kuching is over-priced. I am not sure hwy it is so expensive in Kuching. hmm.gif
*
I am not very sure regarding the market there, but if you can find an investor in that area.
Talk with him, ask him out and treat him lunch.
You'll learn much more. smile.gif

lainux
post Jul 20 2009, 12:15 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 19 2009, 09:49 PM)
I am not very sure regarding the market there, but if you can find an investor in that area.
Talk with him, ask him out and treat him lunch.
You'll learn much more. smile.gif
*
Wanna have lunch? thumbup.gif
shchoy
post Jul 20 2009, 10:25 AM

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You may want to start... just browsing properties in sites like
iproperty.com or thinkproperty.com.my

This will give you an idea on the market there.

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www.shchoy.com

This post has been edited by shchoy: Jul 20 2009, 10:25 AM
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post Jul 21 2009, 08:55 AM

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QUOTE(lainux @ Jul 20 2009, 12:15 AM)
Wanna have lunch?  thumbup.gif
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You in JB? brows.gif
brutus
post Jul 21 2009, 09:14 AM

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QUOTE(shchoy @ Jul 17 2009, 11:04 PM)
Yes, I believe it is actually easier to rent out Studio & 2-Rooms
compare to the 3 or 4 room units.

Also, the studio & 2-rooms usually give an overall better return
in terms of rental per invested cost.
i always thought the 3-bedroom would be the easiest to rent out, no?
studio does provide better returns but dont forget they also costs more psf than the avearge unit.
lainux
post Jul 21 2009, 11:26 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 21 2009, 08:55 AM)
You in JB?  brows.gif
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KL.. vmad.gif
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post Jul 21 2009, 11:58 AM

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QUOTE(lainux @ Jul 21 2009, 11:26 AM)
KL..  vmad.gif
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You are lucky.
There are more investor in KL compare to JB. wink.gif
ecVk
post Jul 21 2009, 03:56 PM

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Lol. Whats so lucky about that?
Backkom
post Jul 21 2009, 04:14 PM

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QUOTE(lainux @ Jul 21 2009, 11:26 AM)
KL..  vmad.gif
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Lainux kor... organize a makan session in KL ler rclxms.gif
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post Jul 21 2009, 04:35 PM

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QUOTE(ecVk @ Jul 21 2009, 03:56 PM)
Lol. Whats so lucky about that?
*
That is because so far I only spotted one investor whom have more experience than me in JB. blush.gif

If go KL, I might want to meet up with the others. rclxms.gif
Backkom
post Jul 21 2009, 05:10 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 21 2009, 04:35 PM)
That is because so far I only spotted one investor whom have more experience than me in JB. blush.gif

If go KL, I might want to meet up with the others.  rclxms.gif
*
Should come up this weekend... got "luxury" property fair + free talks rclxms.gif
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post Jul 21 2009, 10:21 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 21 2009, 05:10 PM)
Should come up this weekend... got "luxury" property fair + free talks  rclxms.gif
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Eh?

I thought you stay in JB? rclxub.gif
babana
post Jul 21 2009, 10:25 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 21 2009, 11:58 AM)
You are lucky.
There are more investor in KL compare to JB. wink.gif
*
haha, more investors means more competition as well. would be prob much harder to parang auctions units too! wink.gif
Backkom
post Jul 21 2009, 10:31 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 21 2009, 10:21 PM)
Eh?

I thought you stay in JB? rclxub.gif
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Now still in KL, moving to JB soon... cry.gif
Pai
post Jul 22 2009, 12:09 AM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Jul 21 2009, 09:14 AM)
i always thought the 3-bedroom would be the easiest to rent out, no?
*
It really depends on your property's target segment.

smile.gif
shchoy
post Jul 22 2009, 08:14 AM

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Who's most likely to rent a 3-room?... Family.
Who's most likely to rent a 2 or 1 room?... Single or Couple.

Who's most likely to buy their own place to stay?.... Family.

Hence, which target audience is larger? Family or Couple?

Although it's not entirely clear cut ...
but i believe it should apply in most cases.


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post Jul 23 2009, 04:39 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 19 2009, 09:49 PM)
I am not very sure regarding the market there, but if you can find an investor in that area.
Talk with him, ask him out and treat him lunch.
You'll learn much more. smile.gif
*
Hi,
Sorry for late reply.

In Kuching, most of the people I know is buying house to live in it. Not buying for investment. Anyway, I will try to get more friends in real estate and learn from them.

I have a friend from Penisular quite good in real estate investment. I think I will try to learn from him. smile.gif


Added on July 23, 2009, 5:07 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 19 2009, 09:49 PM)
I am not very sure regarding the market there, but if you can find an investor in that area.
Talk with him, ask him out and treat him lunch.
You'll learn much more. smile.gif
*
Hi again,
From what I read in Azizi Ali's book, he said if we have RM100k, we can theoretically control 10 properties of RM100k each by putting down payment RM10k. That is theoretically.

So, I would like to ask you some questions:
1. Since you have been working as an employee, how much money do you need to get started in real estate investment?
2. How much money or income per month in order for the bank to give us loan?
3. Since you do not plan to pay off the loan, then would you feel that you have a lot of debt?

I know that Rich Dad technique is to control debt carefully and use it as a tool to become very rich. The problem is that if we do not have a lot of income per month, how could we get loan and from the bank?

I feel lost.. Please help. Thanks. smile.gif


Added on July 23, 2009, 5:14 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 14 2009, 11:06 PM)
A book I just bought today, RM36.90 poorer:

You can become rich in property
by Peter Yee.
user posted image

Pai.
This book has some details in putting properties in a company.
I have not read that chapter yet.
You may like to browse through in a book store.
*
I saw this book and it was at Sale in Popular. I bought another book by Azizi Ali "How to remain an employee and still become a millionaire".

This is a good book and I haven't finish reading it. I get it at RM35+.

This post has been edited by sdas86: Jul 23 2009, 05:14 PM
rakyat
post Jul 24 2009, 11:16 AM

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Hi again,
From what I read in Azizi Ali's book, he said if we have RM100k, we can theoretically control 10 properties of RM100k each by putting down payment RM10k. That is theoretically.

So, I would like to ask you some questions:
1. Since you have been working as an employee, how much money do you need to get started in real estate investment?
2. How much money or income per month in order for the bank to give us loan?
3. Since you do not plan to pay off the loan, then would you feel that you have a lot of debt?

I know that Rich Dad technique is to control debt carefully and use it as a tool to become very rich. The problem is that if we do not have a lot of income per month, how could we get loan and from the bank?

I feel lost.. Please help. Thanks. sdas86

Very good question which I have been asking around but could not get a reasonable answer. Most property investment 'guru' preach bout leverage on bank loan by putting up only 10% d/p or 0% d/p and using rental income to pay the installment.

This sounds good on paper but will only work for your 1st property or up to 2nd property. After that the bank will refuse your loan since u r already tied down with too much loan repayment based on your monthly income. Correct me if I'm wrong but rental income is not considered by the bank.

Si-fus pls. enlighten a wannabe property investor

Pai
post Jul 24 2009, 12:21 PM

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QUOTE(rakyat @ Jul 24 2009, 11:16 AM)
1. Since you have been working as an employee, how much money do you need to get started in real estate investment?
2. How much money or income per month in order for the bank to give us loan?
3. Since you do not plan to pay off the loan, then would you feel that you have a lot of debt?
4.The problem is that if we do not have a lot of income per month, how could we get loan and from the bank?
*
1. When you know enuff, you can investing with just RM1.
2. Depends on the loan you need.
3. What you feel is irrelevant. Whats more releveant is your balance sheet.
4. a. Work harder, earn more.
b. Get multiple streams of income.
c. Ensure ou CCRIS is clean..
brutus
post Jul 24 2009, 12:45 PM

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QUOTE(rakyat @ Jul 24 2009, 11:16 AM)
Si-fus pls. enlighten a  wannabe property investor
there is no short cut about this. you need to "learn" along the way eventhough you read 1,000 books on property investment.


Added on July 24, 2009, 12:47 pm
QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 24 2009, 12:21 PM)
    b. Get multiple streams of income.
  
simple message but not easy to achieve. whistling.gif

Pai,

may i add as below:

using the power of 2 or more. thumbup.gif


Added on July 24, 2009, 12:48 pm
QUOTE(rakyat @ Jul 24 2009, 11:16 AM)
Correct me if I'm wrong but rental income is not considered by the bank.
WRONG, very wrong!

This post has been edited by brutus: Jul 24 2009, 12:48 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Jul 24 2009, 01:46 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 23 2009, 04:39 PM)
Hi again,
From what I read in Azizi Ali's book, he said if we have RM100k, we can theoretically control 10 properties of RM100k each by putting down payment RM10k. That is theoretically.

So, I would like to ask you some questions:
1. Since you have been working as an employee, how much money do you need to get started in real estate investment?
2. How much money or income per month in order for the bank to give us loan?
3. Since you do not plan to pay off the loan, then would you feel that you have a lot of debt?

I know that Rich Dad technique is to control debt carefully and use it as a tool to become very rich. The problem is that if we do not have a lot of income per month, how could we get loan and from the bank?

I feel lost.. Please help. Thanks.  smile.gif


Added on July 23, 2009, 5:14 pm

I saw this book and it was at Sale in Popular. I bought another book by Azizi Ali "How to remain an employee and still become a millionaire".

This is a good book and I haven't finish reading it. I get it at RM35+.
*
1. For starters, starting with DP X 2 will be reasonable. After you get the property, you need some cash in case you make a mistake. For example, you neglect your due diligence and the piping burst. Hence forking out a big sum to drill the piping up from the concrete. Try to start a small deal, prefer less that RM100k.

2. Depends on how much loan you are borrowing. Some banks use the thumb of rule a third of your salary for your loan payment. If your salary is RM3k, the loan that you take must not exceed RM1k for your monthly payment.

3. I know the difference between good debt and bad debt. Most people cannot tell the difference that is why they are in big trouble. Same goes for an asset and liability, both have good and bad.

If your income is less than RM2500, start a small deal by buying a low cost flat.
Don't be like me, salary too high and want to buy a flat. vmad.gif

It's good to hear you are buying more books to read but I like to caution you.
Start small and take baby steps, take your time to read or listen 2 audio books per week.
Don't do over excessive or you would burn out and give up. nod.gif


Added on July 24, 2009, 1:55 pm
QUOTE(rakyat @ Jul 24 2009, 11:16 AM)
Very good question which I have been asking around but could not get a reasonable answer. Most property investment 'guru' preach bout leverage on bank loan by putting up only 10% d/p or 0% d/p and using rental income to pay the installment.

This sounds good on paper but will only work for your 1st property or up to 2nd property. After that the bank will refuse your loan since u r already tied down with too much loan repayment based on your monthly income. Correct me if I'm wrong but rental income is not considered by the bank.

Si-fus pls. enlighten a  wannabe property investor
*
If your previous unit are being rented out, you need to let them see your leases.
The bank will discount your rental by 25% and if it still exceeds your expenses, the bank will very glad to loan you again.

Example, your rental is RM1000 and after discount is RM750.
If your expenses is less that RM750, the bank will consider your salary as though you have not make any loan before.


Added on July 24, 2009, 1:57 pm
QUOTE(brutus @ Jul 24 2009, 12:45 PM)
there is no short cut about this. you need to "learn" along the way eventhough you read 1,000 books on property investment.
I use to thought that way too but found out later how wrong I am.
The real learning is by doing the real thing. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Jul 24 2009, 01:57 PM
Pai
post Jul 24 2009, 02:54 PM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Jul 24 2009, 12:45 PM)
using the power of 2 or more. thumbup.gif
*
good point smile.gif


Added on July 24, 2009, 2:56 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 24 2009, 01:46 PM)
I use to thought that way too but found out later how wrong I am.
The real learning is by doing the real thing. biggrin.gif
*
forums like this can shorthen one's learning curve as well. wink.gif


This post has been edited by Pai: Jul 24 2009, 02:56 PM
rakyat
post Jul 24 2009, 04:05 PM

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If your previous unit are being rented out, you need to let them see your leases.
The bank will discount your rental by 25% and if it still exceeds your expenses, the bank will very glad to loan you again.

Example, your rental is RM1000 and after discount is RM750.
If your expenses is less that RM750, the bank will consider your salary as though you have not make any loan before.


Added on July 24, 2009, 1:57 pm

TQ for enlightenment notworthy.gif Hmmm now can look for nother investment property hmm.gif

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post Jul 24 2009, 07:57 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 24 2009, 02:54 PM)

forums like this can shorthen one's learning curve as well.  wink.gif
*
You are right Pai.
Here is the cone of learning.

By participating in the discussion, we retain 70% what we learn after 2 weeks.

By reading books alone, 10% only.

user posted image
TSsdas86
post Jul 24 2009, 09:07 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 24 2009, 07:57 PM)
You are right Pai.
Here is the cone of learning.

By participating in the discussion, we retain 70% what we learn after 2 weeks.

By reading books alone, 10% only.

user posted image
*
This is a good diagram. I remember Robert Kiyosaki mentioned it before. smile.gif
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post Jul 24 2009, 09:45 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 24 2009, 09:07 PM)
This is a good diagram. I remember Robert Kiyosaki mentioned it before.  smile.gif
*
In his book Financial IQ. blush.gif
TSsdas86
post Jul 24 2009, 09:58 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 24 2009, 09:45 PM)
In his book Financial IQ. blush.gif
*
I saw it the videos of YouTube if not mistaken. smile.gif
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post Jul 24 2009, 10:42 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 24 2009, 09:58 PM)
I saw it the videos of YouTube if not mistaken.  smile.gif
*
Yup, it's there too.
TSsdas86
post Jul 26 2009, 10:43 PM

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[quote=Pai,Jul 24 2009, 02:54 PM]
good point smile.gif

What is the power of 2? Need some explanation. smile.gif
Backkom
post Jul 26 2009, 11:05 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 26 2009, 10:43 PM)
good point  smile.gif

What is the power of 2? Need some explanation. smile.gif
*
Combine power with your wifey/hubby rclxms.gif

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 26 2009, 11:17 PM
TSsdas86
post Jul 27 2009, 02:49 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 26 2009, 11:05 PM)
Combine power with your wifey/hubby  rclxms.gif
*
I see. Now, I get it. biggrin.gif Sadly, I don;t even have a girlfriend now. So, the best investment is to invest to get a girlfriend and then get married. biggrin.gif
Pai
post Jul 28 2009, 01:17 AM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 27 2009, 02:49 PM)
So, the best investment is to invest to get a girlfriend and then get married.  biggrin.gif
*
In most cases, the opposite happens, and they can easily turnout to be your worst nightmare tongue.gif
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post Jul 28 2009, 08:37 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 28 2009, 01:17 AM)
In most cases, the opposite happens, and they can easily turnout to be your worst nightmare  tongue.gif
*
Divorce.

The husband is left with all of his 3 kids and half of his estates. shakehead.gif
brutus
post Jul 28 2009, 09:17 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 26 2009, 11:05 PM)
Combine power with your wifey/hubby  rclxms.gif
*
FAMA also can mar! cool2.gif
why only think about GF, BF, Wife and Husband? blink.gif

This post has been edited by brutus: Jul 28 2009, 09:21 AM
Backkom
post Jul 28 2009, 09:54 AM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Jul 28 2009, 09:17 AM)
FAMA also can mar! cool2.gif
why only think about GF, BF, Wife and Husband? blink.gif
*
Hehe that's I'm doing... leveraging "horizontally" (partner) + "vertically" (parents)...
I can't give a lot of money to my parents, but hopefully can help them make more money? rclxms.gif
brutus
post Jul 28 2009, 11:04 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 28 2009, 09:54 AM)
Hehe that's I'm doing... leveraging "horizontally" (partner) + "vertically" (parents)...
I can't give a lot of money to my parents, but hopefully can help them make more money?  rclxms.gif
*
yes, very good strategy! thumbup.gif
luqmanz
post Jul 28 2009, 06:12 PM

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QUOTE(rakyat @ Jul 24 2009, 11:16 AM)


This sounds good on paper but will only work for your 1st property or up to 2nd property. After that the bank will refuse your loan since u r already tied down with too much loan repayment based on your monthly income. Correct me if I'm wrong but rental income is not considered by the bank.

Si-fus pls. enlighten a  wannabe property investor
*
I'm no guru ... just someone who likes to brainstorm laugh.gif

If the bank wont let u get another property after u have 2 of them under your sleeve ... why not just chill-out, rent out those two properties (create positive cashflow), and sell them after 3-5 years (to lock your profit). After u sold the properties .. you can use the profit to DP 3-4 new properties, rent them out and sell them when u have the chance ... keep doing this again and again .. until maybe u will have 8-10 properties after 10 years ?

laugh.gif
noed18
post Jul 28 2009, 06:25 PM

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QUOTE(rakyat @ Jul 24 2009, 04:05 PM)
If your previous unit are being rented out, you need to let them see your leases.
The bank will discount your rental by 25% and if it still exceeds your expenses, the bank will very glad to loan you again.

Example, your rental is RM1000 and after discount is RM750.
If your expenses is less that RM750, the bank will consider your salary as though you have not make any loan before.


Added on July 24, 2009, 1:57 pm

TQ for enlightenment  notworthy.gif Hmmm now can look for nother investment property  hmm.gif
*
Still learning in property investment..

Is this a standard practice by all banks?? or it's just a good benchmark to know if your rental is good enough to bail you out from hitting loan limit?

Rule of thumb says, if salary 3000, installment should not be more than 1000, 33%.
If rental 3000, (installment + maintenance) should not be more than 2250, 75%??? sweat.gif

Or do they usually take rental add into gross income and redo your commitment test again?

thanks.
brutus
post Jul 28 2009, 09:32 PM

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QUOTE(noed18 @ Jul 28 2009, 06:25 PM)


Or do they usually take rental add into gross income and redo your commitment test again?

this depends on bankers. different banks have different factoring.
my advise:
whether you can afford the nth unit of property is not your say. the bankers will have the final say.
so, dont be afraid to ask around. wink.gif
Minolta
post Jul 28 2009, 09:39 PM

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Here's some of the lessons I've learnt from investing in properties that I can share. Note that you can be a "property investor" even by owning only 1 property, but a true investor will aim for much more quantity in his/her lifetime.



1. Try to start as soon as you can and as young as you can.

2. I know its cliche by now, but location is No. 1. This is critical especially in your 1st property. Buy wrongly and you will unlikely be a property investor again. Don't care what everyone else say. I will only invest in certain areas. This is a myopic view, but it is to reduce risk.

3. Property investment is risky. Do not go into it without the stomach for risk. Try to find "less risky" properties as much as you can.

4. You do not need to think very long to buy a property. No need to call "feng shui master", or call best friend or ask forums etc. When I go to see a property, I am already prepared to buy it. The only thing to consider when viewing are the minor details. Goodbuys do not usually wait for you.

5. Never, NEVER ever buy a property jointly with your relatives/girlfriend etc. NEVER, even your wife.........Oklah, if you really have no choice and the property is selling for 1/2 the market price and you can immediately make a killing selling it 3 months later, then set up a company to buy it.

6. Reinvest all your earnings. Especially in the beginning. When you've made your 1st bucket of gold, then you can use for others lah.

7. Have a strategy early on. Capital gain with little rental income or rental income with little capital gain? I mean, really. Sure, you can be really good or lucky to get a property with both, but its rare, and usually applies to property bought from developer. In times like this, then there is a possibility of both.

8. Throw in every cent of your extra money into extra payment of the principle amount.

9. Leverage on your current properties to get the loans to buy your next property. This goes without saying, but often times, you're leveraged so high it scares you. Get as much loan as you can on as low interest rate as you can. Do not be afraid to refinance or write to your bank from time to time asking for lower interest rate.



minolta

This post has been edited by Minolta: Jul 28 2009, 09:43 PM
Backkom
post Jul 28 2009, 10:02 PM

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QUOTE(Minolta @ Jul 28 2009, 09:39 PM)
5. Never, NEVER ever buy a property jointly with your relatives/girlfriend etc. NEVER, even your wife.........Oklah, if you really have no choice and the property is selling for 1/2 the market price and you can immediately make a killing selling it 3 months later, then set up a company to buy it.

*
Had some nightmare sharing with your other half? tongue.gif
I on the other hand enjoyed the leverage of sharing with other half + improvement/maturity in relationship as we share the same "career" thumbup.gif
Minolta
post Jul 28 2009, 10:14 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 28 2009, 10:02 PM)
Had some nightmare sharing with your other half?  tongue.gif
I on the other hand enjoyed the leverage of sharing with other half + improvement/maturity in relationship as we share the same "career"  thumbup.gif
*
haha, just wait lah. you will know what i mean with time. i do not wish it for you, but chances are, you will rclxub.gif
TSsdas86
post Jul 28 2009, 10:15 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 28 2009, 08:37 AM)
Divorce.

The husband is left with all of his 3 kids and half of his estates. shakehead.gif
*
laugh.gif Need to find gf carefully. biggrin.gif
brutus
post Jul 28 2009, 10:29 PM

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QUOTE(Minolta @ Jul 28 2009, 10:14 PM)
haha, just wait lah. you will know what i mean with time. i do not wish it for you, but chances are, you will rclxub.gif
*
both must share the same "passion" towards property investment. if just by using the other half name to make up the short fall, then chances are later on will be..... rclxub.gif
Backkom
post Jul 28 2009, 10:32 PM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Jul 28 2009, 10:29 PM)
both must share the same "passion" towards property investment. if just by using the other half name to make up the short fall, then chances are later on will be..... rclxub.gif
*
Agree thumbup.gif
brutus
post Jul 28 2009, 10:38 PM

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things will get even more interesting when one uses the power of "seperate entity"
Backkom
post Jul 28 2009, 10:58 PM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Jul 28 2009, 10:38 PM)
things will get even more interesting when one uses the power of "seperate entity"
*
Referring to Brutus Sdn Bhd? tongue.gif
Yeah that's something totally new to me... am trying to find out and learn more about this...
brutus
post Jul 28 2009, 11:02 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 28 2009, 10:58 PM)
Referring to Brutus Sdn Bhd?  tongue.gif
with a company name like that sure no tenant will want to come la! doh.gif
yes, Sdn Bhd is THE way to go in the long run!! cool2.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 11 2009, 11:15 AM

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Just got my loan signed yesterday in the lawyer firm.

These days bank aren't that willing to loan more.
To get 90% loan, I have to put RM15k FD as deposits into this bank; with 5 years bond.
I also buy MRTA to up the total loan amount making it exceeding 100k, so the bank is willing to loan me BLR-1.85%. Some other fees are also borne by the bank. If you guys still remember, this unit auction price is RM109,400.

I have the intention to put my sister name and my name on the SAP but since the auction was in my name, I have to go ahead with just putting my name only. The lawyer is kind enough to draft an additional agreement that whenever I sell this property, 50% of the gain will be return to my sis.
So the next property will put under my sis name with the same agreement yesterday. Since there is a 50% discount for the stamp duty, that could save us around RM500.

Also spoke to my banker, for me to lend money on next property would be a bit problematic. The loan amount would be lesser.
So what I would do is, there is another auction tomorrow and my sis name will be in it. Latter there will be another agreement being draft that states I own half of the property. Of course I will be the one financing the monthly payment. wink.gif





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Backkom
post Aug 11 2009, 02:21 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 11 2009, 11:15 AM)
Just got my loan signed yesterday in the lawyer firm.

These days bank aren't that willing to loan more.
To get 90% loan, I have to put RM15k FD as deposits into this bank; with 5 years bond.
I also buy MRTA to up the total loan amount making it exceeding 100k, so the bank is willing to loan me BLR-1.85%. Some other fees are also borne by the bank. If you guys still remember, this unit auction price is RM109,400.

I have the intention to put my sister name and my name on the SAP but since the auction was in my name, I have to go ahead with just putting my name only. The lawyer is kind enough to draft an additional agreement that whenever I sell this property, 50% of the gain will be return to my sis.
So the next property will put under my sis name with the same agreement yesterday. Since there is a 50% discount for the stamp duty, that could save us around RM500.

Also spoke to my banker, for me to lend money on next property would be a bit problematic. The loan amount would be lesser.
So what I would do is, there is another auction tomorrow and my sis name will be in it. Latter there will be another agreement being draft that states I own half of the property. Of course I will be the one financing the monthly payment. wink.gif
*
My purchase price was 110k. I financed the legal fees (non ZEC) and I got BLR - 1.95% with 90% margin.
(And this is my 3rd 90% loan this year.)
brutus
post Aug 11 2009, 06:57 PM

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backkom, you really power ler!
Backkom
post Aug 11 2009, 07:04 PM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Aug 11 2009, 06:57 PM)
backkom, you really power ler!
*
Like I said before - leverage "vertically" + "horizontally" rclxms.gif
brutus
post Aug 11 2009, 07:09 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 11 2009, 07:04 PM)
Like I said before - leverage "vertically" + "horizontally"  rclxms.gif
*
at least you are walking the talk and taking advantage of the available situation.
some people got this advantage also dont know/want to use!
lainux
post Aug 11 2009, 11:58 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 28 2009, 09:54 AM)
Hehe that's I'm doing... leveraging "horizontally" (partner) + "vertically" (parents)...
I can't give a lot of money to my parents, but hopefully can help them make more money?  rclxms.gif
*
Oi... not only did you not give ur parents money, but you are asking more? rclxms.gif thumbup.gif doh.gif

help them make more money? Or the money earned just goes into another prop, and slowly, they become yours? thumbup.gif

I believe many younger people started it that way, borrow from parents for dp. At least that is how I started w/ my first prop. Hmm.. did I return the money earned? hmm.gif


Added on August 12, 2009, 12:06 am
QUOTE(Minolta @ Jul 28 2009, 09:39 PM)
Here's some of the lessons I've learnt from investing in properties that I can share. Note that you can be a "property investor" even by owning only 1 property, but a true investor will aim for much more quantity in his/her lifetime.
1. Try to start as soon as you can and as young as you can.

2. I know its cliche by now, but location is No. 1. This is critical especially in your 1st property. Buy wrongly and you will unlikely be a property investor again. Don't care what everyone else say. I will only invest in certain areas. This is a myopic view, but it is to reduce risk.

3. Property investment is risky. Do not go into it without the stomach for risk. Try to find "less risky" properties as much as you can.

4. You do not need to think very long to buy a property. No need to call "feng shui master", or call best friend or ask forums etc. When I go to see a property, I am already prepared to buy it. The only thing to consider when viewing are the minor details. Goodbuys do not usually wait for you.

5. Never, NEVER ever buy a property jointly with your relatives/girlfriend etc. NEVER, even your wife.........Oklah, if you really have no choice and the property is selling for 1/2 the market price and you can immediately make a killing selling it 3 months later, then set up a company to buy it.

6. Reinvest all your earnings. Especially in the beginning. When you've made your 1st bucket of gold, then you can use for others lah.

7. Have a strategy early on. Capital gain with little rental income or rental income with little capital gain? I mean, really. Sure, you can be really good or lucky to get a property with both, but its rare, and usually applies to property bought from developer. In times like this, then there is a possibility of both.

8. Throw in every cent of your extra money into extra payment of the principle amount.

9. Leverage on your current properties to get the loans to buy your next property. This goes without saying, but often times, you're leveraged so high it scares you. Get as much loan as you can on as low interest rate as you can. Do not be afraid to refinance or write to your bank from time to time asking for lower interest rate.
minolta
*
This is so true, I lost many good props for thinking too much, worrying too much. Sometimes, I think bargaining for that extra 3k discount is a waste of time and opportunity.


This post has been edited by lainux: Aug 12 2009, 12:06 AM
brutus
post Aug 12 2009, 08:36 AM

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QUOTE(lainux @ Aug 11 2009, 11:58 PM)
This is so true, I lost many good props for thinking too much, worrying too much.  Sometimes, I think bargaining for that extra 3k discount is a waste of time and opportunity.
*
yes, you can easily ean more than that if the property is "good". cool2.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 12 2009, 08:52 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 11 2009, 02:21 PM)
My purchase price was 110k. I financed the legal fees (non ZEC) and I got BLR - 1.95% with 90% margin.
(And this is my 3rd 90% loan this year.)
*
Wow, not bad. rclxms.gif

I only got BLR-1.85%. So which bank is it?
Backkom
post Aug 12 2009, 09:01 AM

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QUOTE(lainux @ Aug 11 2009, 11:58 PM)
Oi... not only did you not give ur parents money, but you are asking more?   rclxms.gif  thumbup.gif   doh.gif

help them make more money?  Or the money earned just goes into another prop, and slowly, they become yours?   thumbup.gif

*
Wah don't la say like that... I do give money to my parents sweat.gif
And I have no intention to "telan" their profit... they're aging and they need a huge standby medical fund. I am already extremely grateful if they can take care of themselves, never thought of taking anything more from them tongue.gif


Added on August 12, 2009, 9:04 am
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 12 2009, 08:52 AM)
Wow, not bad. rclxms.gif

I only got BLR-1.85%. So which bank is it?
*
CIMB rclxms.gif
Actually HLB also offered me BLR - 1.95%, but they force me to buy 5k++ worth of MRTA (plus had some bad experience with them recently). While the legal fees involved for the CIMB loan is only 3k++, so I decided to take CIMB.

This post has been edited by Backkom: Aug 12 2009, 09:04 AM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 12 2009, 09:04 AM

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QUOTE(lainux @ Aug 11 2009, 11:58 PM)
Oi... not only did you not give ur parents money, but you are asking more?  rclxms.gif  thumbup.gif  doh.gif

help them make more money?  Or the money earned just goes into another prop, and slowly, they become yours?  thumbup.gif

I believe many younger people started it that way, borrow from parents for dp.  At least that is how I started w/ my first prop.  Hmm.. did I return the money earned?  hmm.gif


Added on August 12, 2009, 12:06 am
This is so true, I lost many good props for thinking too much, worrying too much.  Sometimes, I think bargaining for that extra 3k discount is a waste of time and opportunity.
*
Gee, I think most kids ask money from their parent to buy their first house when they marry.

In real estate investing, it's always best one can come up with their DP for their first property.
If not, it is a possible symptoms of mismanaging of his own money.

Since my second property, I'll let others pay for the DP and I'll manage it. That way I can acquire property faster.
If my family is not able to finance the next deal, time to find my "cash rich" friend. biggrin.gif
Backkom
post Aug 12 2009, 09:08 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 12 2009, 09:04 AM)
Gee, I think most kids ask money from their parent to buy their first house when they marry.

In real estate investing, it's always best one can come up with their DP for their first property.
If not, it is a possible symptoms of mismanaging of his own money.

Since my second property, I'll let others pay for the DP and I'll manage it. That way I can acquire property faster.
If my family is not able to finance the next deal, time to find my "cash rich" friend. biggrin.gif
*
By the way, I didn't "ask" for money from my parents - my dad's name is in the S&P and loan agreement, we're investing partners! rclxms.gif
brutus
post Aug 12 2009, 09:17 AM

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then would be more difficult to obtain 30yrs loan tenure right?
Backkom
post Aug 12 2009, 09:33 AM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Aug 12 2009, 09:17 AM)
then would be more difficult to obtain 30yrs loan tenure right?
*
Nope, loan tenure based on my age. But the combined income of borrower(s) will include my dad's income.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 12 2009, 09:58 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 12 2009, 09:33 AM)
Nope, loan tenure based on my age. But the combined income of borrower(s) will include my dad's income.
*
Exactly, my next deal will base on my age even though the SAP is solely using my sis name.
Since I am the one paying for the loan. biggrin.gif
brutus
post Aug 12 2009, 10:00 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 12 2009, 09:58 AM)
Exactly, my next deal will base on my age even though the SAP is solely using my sis name.
Since I am the one paying for the loan. biggrin.gif
*
huh? shocking.gif
SPA- sis name
Loan- your name only?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 12 2009, 04:44 PM

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QUOTE(brutus @ Aug 12 2009, 10:00 AM)
huh? shocking.gif
SPA- sis name
Loan- your name only?
*
Yup, my sis married to a foreigner and she is a housewife.
She would have problem securing a loan.

Anyway I'll profit more this way and she'll have a piece of mind leaving her money with me as she got to put her name in the deed.


Added on August 13, 2009, 7:49 pmI lost the bid. Well some time we win, sometime we will lose.
Time to move on for a new deal. wink.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Aug 13 2009, 07:49 PM
aug11
post Aug 18 2009, 01:49 AM

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how do you measure it's a good investment?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 18 2009, 09:24 AM

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QUOTE(aug11 @ Aug 18 2009, 01:49 AM)
how do you measure it's a good investment?
*
It depends on how good an investor are you.

Start looking at your financial statement, do you spend more than you earn?
Overspending is a warning that you could mismanage a good in investment and turn it into a bad one.

That is when I come in and buy your property. brows.gif


Learning to manage your own personal finance and have a monthly financial statement would help you gain insight on how to spot deals that make you money.
aug11
post Aug 18 2009, 09:36 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 18 2009, 09:24 AM)
It depends on how good an investor are you.

Start looking at your financial statement, do you spend more than you earn?
Overspending is a warning that you could mismanage a good in investment and turn it into a bad one.

That is when I come in and buy your property. brows.gif
Learning to manage your own personal finance and have a monthly financial statement would help you gain insight on how to spot deals that make you money.
*
my expenditures take 60% of my salary.

what i mean is normally how do u judge a property worth to INVEST?
is there any measurement for it?
TQ!


Added on August 18, 2009, 9:41 amfor a property investor like u, u may invest 2,3,4,5...N properties.

1. do u able to get 90% loan for all the properties from the bank?
2. do u buy MRTA or MLTA or TERM insurance to protect ur properties? Which one is the most suitable one for property investor?

TQ!

This post has been edited by aug11: Aug 18 2009, 09:42 AM
Pai
post Aug 18 2009, 11:20 AM

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QUOTE(aug11 @ Aug 18 2009, 09:36 AM)
for a property investor like u, u may invest 2,3,4,5...N properties.

1. do u able to get 90% loan for all the properties from the bank?
2. do u buy MRTA or MLTA or TERM insurance to protect ur properties? Which one is the most suitable one for property investor?

TQ!
1. Nope. It depends on your income and credit standing.
2. I normally dont unless my wife forces me tongue.gif
arsenal
post Aug 18 2009, 11:30 AM

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Buy any condo 3 years ago near KTM Subang area easily can earn 60K net profit..tongue.gif

Sell now?..hmmm
Backkom
post Aug 18 2009, 02:06 PM

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QUOTE(arsenal @ Aug 18 2009, 11:30 AM)
Buy any condo 3 years ago near KTM Subang area easily can earn 60K net profit..tongue.gif

Sell now?..hmmm
*
I guess we already missed the "mega sale" bandwagon - now the property price in that area is like those Gucci new arrival items...
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 18 2009, 02:13 PM

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QUOTE(aug11 @ Aug 18 2009, 09:36 AM)
my expenditures take 60% of my salary.

what i mean is normally how do u judge a property worth to INVEST?
is there any measurement for it?
TQ!


Added on August 18, 2009, 9:41 amfor a property investor like u, u may invest 2,3,4,5...N properties.

1. do u able to get 90% loan for all the properties from the bank?
2. do u buy MRTA or MLTA or TERM insurance to protect ur properties? Which one is the most suitable one for property investor?

TQ!
*
60% is a good value to start off.

My measurement is using the rent to judge it's value.
A fully furnish apartment with rental of RM1000 is worth RM100,000 to me.


1. The first property I got 83% loan of the SPA value but in reality it's a 100% loan.
Second property I top up the loan to exceed RM100k by buying MRTA, this time round I got 90%.
arsenal
post Aug 18 2009, 02:43 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 18 2009, 02:13 PM)
60% is a good value to start off.

My measurement is using the rent to judge it's value.
A fully furnish apartment with rental of RM1000 is worth RM100,000 to me.
1. The first property I got 83% loan of the SPA value but in reality it's a 100% loan.
Second property I top up the loan to exceed RM100k by buying MRTA, this time round I got 90%.
*
110K house can get 1.6k rent if furnished...tongue.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 18 2009, 03:59 PM

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QUOTE(arsenal @ Aug 18 2009, 02:43 PM)
110K house can get 1.6k rent if furnished...tongue.gif
*
That is very good. rclxms.gif

This Friday I got another 3 more auction unit that I want to get but 1 called off and left 2.
Luckily the one called off is a less desirable one.
Not affecting the one that I really want.
Cross finger hard! flex.gif

I may get into a problem of bank not loaning me money.
Oh well. thumbup.gif
arsenal
post Aug 18 2009, 04:29 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 18 2009, 03:59 PM)
That is very good. rclxms.gif

This Friday I got another 3 more auction unit that I want to get but 1 called off and left 2.
Luckily the one called off is a less desirable one.
Not affecting the one that I really want.
Cross finger hard! flex.gif

I may get into a problem of bank not loaning me money.
Oh well. thumbup.gif
*
I am thinking to buy another property too...Maybe around Subang area..

Jason. you only buy Johor areas? Dont want to try Klang Valley?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 18 2009, 05:00 PM

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One of the important rule when starting out in property investment.
Invest near home. biggrin.gif

So nope, no KL for me at the moment.
aug11
post Aug 18 2009, 05:08 PM

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QUOTE(arsenal @ Aug 18 2009, 02:43 PM)
110K house can get 1.6k rent if furnished...tongue.gif
*
didnt know that there is such a good deal in klang valley market.
wao~ that's cool man.
i think i got to work harder to find out where it is.

This post has been edited by aug11: Aug 18 2009, 05:09 PM
jbbeng
post Aug 19 2009, 11:13 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 18 2009, 05:00 PM)
One of the important rule when starting out in property investment.
Invest near home. biggrin.gif

So nope, no KL for me at the moment.
*
Hello Jason,

I am intending to buy a apartment around Johor City Centre and I am considering apartments such as Bistari Impian or the DNP Apartment.

Do you have any advice on this? Hope you could provide your views in terms of pricing, value, location, etc.

It seems to me that the prices of both the apartments have depreciated from the initial offer value. Why is it so? Is it a general trend all over for prices of apartment/condo to drop?

This post has been edited by jbbeng: Aug 19 2009, 11:14 AM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 19 2009, 12:19 PM

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I have no idea on those location.

Maybe you can visit www.reijb.com
There are lot's of info there.


Not all JB area are the same.
For example, the area I selected didn't drop much due to the current financial crisis.
It's price drop due to the earlier speculation in 97, pretty much stabilize 2 years back and more people are moving into this area. Rental starts increasing RM50 in some property as demand picks up.
It's very hard for people to rent in this area as all has been taken up. Yes, no more rental unit. Zip. Natha. Will be kicking a few ex-landlord to make way for my new tenant. flex.gif

Also do note some areas are experiencing speculation due to the Iskandar project.
Half a mil for a semi D.


Interest rate is another factor.
Now such a low interest, take 3 to 5 years for price to increase substantially.
Why the increase?
Inflation.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Aug 19 2009, 01:12 PM
jbbeng
post Aug 21 2009, 10:06 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 19 2009, 12:19 PM)
I have no idea on those location.

Maybe you can visit www.reijb.com
There are lot's of info there.
Not all JB area are the same.
For example, the area I selected didn't drop much due to the current financial crisis.
It's price drop due to the earlier speculation in 97, pretty much stabilize 2 years back and more people are moving into this area. Rental starts increasing RM50 in some property as demand picks up.
It's very hard for people to rent in this area as all has been taken up. Yes, no more rental unit. Zip. Natha. Will be kicking a few ex-landlord to make way for my new tenant.  flex.gif

Also do note some areas are experiencing speculation due to the Iskandar project.
Half a mil for a semi D.
Interest rate is another factor.
Now such a low interest, take 3 to 5 years for price to increase substantially.
Why the increase?
Inflation.
*
Is there any website that monitor the changes of the house value? Current rate per sq ft around a certain area?

With regards to the interest issue, are you referring to that of the price of rental or the price of a property?

If true as you say that the price of either one(rent or value) would go up in the next 3-5 years (in general), that would be great as I intend to stay at that property after purchase and only considering selling it off after 3-5 years.

Appreciate if you could recommend an agent which you normally deal with. Perhaps I could get in touch with him/her to seek more advice. Do PM if you are willing to share. smile.gif




Backkom
post Aug 21 2009, 11:21 AM

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QUOTE(jbbeng @ Aug 21 2009, 10:06 AM)
Is there any website that monitor the changes of the house value? Current rate per sq ft around a certain area?

With regards to the interest issue, are you referring to that of the price of rental or the price of a property?

If true as you say that the price of either one(rent or value) would go up in the next 3-5 years (in general), that would be great as I intend to stay at that property after purchase and only considering selling it off after 3-5 years.

Appreciate if you could recommend an agent which you normally deal with. Perhaps I could get in touch with him/her to seek more advice. Do PM if you are willing to share. smile.gif
*
1. No such information for free - you can buy similar info from Ho Chin Soon.
2. Interest rate is lower than inflation rate. Hence the difference between the 2 will sort of be your "sure profit" - correct interpretation, Jason?

jbbeng
post Aug 21 2009, 02:46 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 21 2009, 11:21 AM)
1. No such information for free - you can buy similar info from Ho Chin Soon.
2. Interest rate is lower than inflation rate. Hence the difference between the 2 will sort of be your "sure profit" - correct interpretation, Jason?
*
Hello Backkom, could you provide me with links to sites that has info or explains about the difference between interest rate and inflation rate? And how is this so called "sure profit" is determined. smile.gif

This post has been edited by jbbeng: Aug 21 2009, 02:47 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 22 2009, 08:41 AM

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QUOTE(jbbeng @ Aug 21 2009, 10:06 AM)
Is there any website that monitor the changes of the house value? Current rate per sq ft around a certain area?

With regards to the interest issue, are you referring to that of the price of rental or the price of a property?

If true as you say that the price of either one(rent or value) would go up in the next 3-5 years (in general), that would be great as I intend to stay at that property after purchase and only considering selling it off after 3-5 years.

Appreciate if you could recommend an agent which you normally deal with. Perhaps I could get in touch with him/her to seek more advice. Do PM if you are willing to share. smile.gif
*
All website that I visited are lacking in information. You must look a few properties in the same area to understand it better.
Or you can call a season agent in that area or banks.
They have past transaction price and banks valuation.

I believe the price will go up base on previous data, but don't believe me for it as it's not accurate.
I also would prefer you to find you own agent, interview a few first and get some experience.
Learn it from the streets will put you far ahead. nod.gif


Added on August 22, 2009, 8:59 am
QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 21 2009, 11:21 AM)
1. No such information for free - you can buy similar info from Ho Chin Soon.
2. Interest rate is lower than inflation rate. Hence the difference between the 2 will sort of be your "sure profit" - correct interpretation, Jason?
*
Har, what Ho? ohmy.gif

Not really.
What happen is at a low interest rate, people will start to buy property again.
It's cheaper compare to 10 years back.

Whenever a loan agreement is sign, money is created. Or the so called fiat currency.
The supply of money increase in a few minutes but the supply of property remain un-change for a few years.
With the increase of money supply, that causes inflation.
Not just to property, but to everything.

Inflation has it's good and bad.
Good, you get richer is you are a rich person.
Bad, you get poorer if you are a poor person.


In Malaysia, the government is trying to reduce the inflation to 0%.
That is a propaganda to get more voters by reducing prices in necessary items.
The result of it is you get to buy stuff cheaper but you can't buy them as it is either sold out or being ship to other country for profit.

Having inflation is not that bad at all, it also promote growth and more job opportunity.
Must Read Website on Money, Let YOUR money work for you. Learn that.


Today the market is already bad, so buying now for cashflow would not damage my financials.
If 5 years down the road, the economy is still bad.
It doesn't bother me if I can't sell it as I already got my money back from the rental.

Will the housing price go down?
That depends on the masses, if everyone have jobs, able to pay off their debt, happily spending their money and have confident the economy will rebound soon.
Unlikely. icon_rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Aug 22 2009, 09:07 AM
Jutawan
post Aug 22 2009, 09:17 AM

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Good thread, a good information for me to analyze.
Pai
post Aug 22 2009, 09:18 PM

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jason and backkom,

whats your take on Mayland's new studio project in JB? Can make it?
Backkom
post Aug 22 2009, 11:07 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 22 2009, 09:18 PM)
jason and backkom,

whats your take on Mayland's new studio project in JB? Can make it?
*
Hehe, Pai kor radar very sharp!
I just received the brochure - landscaping and overall concept looks nice (better than Prima Regency).
Total number of units - whopping 1800! (I think including the "future development" plots indicated in the site plan)

Studio price starting from 104.4k (116k with 10% discount for 484 sqf - RM 216 psf).
Completion July 2012.
Location - near Jusco Tebrau, Hospital Sultan Ismail, Austin Golf Club and Sunway College.

Don't dare to say can make it (big) or not yet - have to wait till I visited the site (and move into Prima Regency myself) before I could say that I have the confidence...
Still need to explore further on the target tenant group (people who work in Pasir Gudang? Singapore? Nusajaya?).


Pai
post Aug 23 2009, 02:16 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 22 2009, 11:07 PM)
Hehe, Pai kor radar very sharp!
I just received the brochure - landscaping and overall concept looks nice (better than Prima Regency).
Total number of units - whopping 1800! (I think including the "future development" plots indicated in the site plan)

Studio price starting from 104.4k (116k with 10% discount for 484 sqf - RM 216 psf).
Completion July 2012.
Location - near Jusco Tebrau, Hospital Sultan Ismail, Austin Golf Club and Sunway College.

Don't dare to say can make it (big) or not yet - have to wait till I visited the site (and move into Prima Regency myself) before I could say that I have the confidence...
Still need to explore further on the target tenant group (people who work in Pasir Gudang? Singapore? Nusajaya?).
*
read newspaper only, mana ada sharp sweat.gif

btw, those 1800 units, are launched in one-go or by phases?

This post has been edited by Pai: Aug 23 2009, 06:34 AM
arsenal
post Aug 23 2009, 03:53 AM

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Taikor Pai,

Got any good place to invest at the moment? Can share share? I will spend you starbucks...tongue.gif
Pai
post Aug 23 2009, 06:34 AM

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QUOTE(arsenal @ Aug 23 2009, 03:53 AM)
Taikor Pai,

Got any good place to invest at the moment? Can share share? I will spend you starbucks...tongue.gif
*
Same advice --> Buy nearby LRT props with >8% yiled. Cant go very wrong there tongue.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 23 2009, 12:04 PM

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Err, that is not my main investing location. tongue.gif
But that area is also good, going towards high end homes.

My target is mainly on the middle class.


Also, I don't buy developing projects.
Only completed ones. blush.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Aug 23 2009, 12:07 PM
arsenal
post Aug 23 2009, 12:14 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 23 2009, 12:04 PM)
Err, that is not my main investing location. tongue.gif
But that area is also good, going towards high end homes.

My target is mainly on the middle class.
Also, I don't buy developing projects.
Only completed ones. blush.gif
*
Developing one can even get more profit margin than those completed...smile.gif
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post Aug 23 2009, 01:05 PM

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QUOTE(arsenal @ Aug 23 2009, 12:14 PM)
Developing one can even get more profit margin than those completed...smile.gif
*
Err, not really.
Here is the calculation for my third unit.

Town house
Market value RM80k as of today.

Purchase price RM60k
Stamp duty RM50
Bankers cheque RM5
Loan RM57k @ 4%, 30 years (estimate)
Down payment 5% @ RM3k
Agent fees RM3k
Lawyer fees RM2k (estimate)

Today I put in RM8055, if the price remain the same for 5 years and I sell.
My profit would be RM80k - RM57k - RM8055 + amortization + cashflow = RM14,945 + amortization + cashflow

First, the cashflow.
Rental is RM450 per month.
Maintenance is RM33.
Mortgage RM272

Cashflow for 5 years = (RM450 - RM33 - RM272) X 12 X 5 = RM8700


Secondly, amortization.
For 60 months the tenants put money into my town house's equity.
That comes up to RM5595.


Finally, the profit is RM14,945 + RM8700 + RM5595 = RM29,240
Compare to the RM8055 I put in today, the gain for 5 years later would be extra 363%.



If I buy a developing property today, I put my money down and it get traps for 3 years before the project is fully complete then I can sell it away.
The question is, what is the market value after the project is complete?
I don't know as there is no past history for reference.

Also I lose money every month as I have to pay interest on my loan.
When calculating the gain for the incomplete property, one has to add interest into the calculation.
For a developed property can be rent out immediately and the tenant pay for my interest.
So it's not required to add into the calculation. thumbup.gif
Pai
post Aug 23 2009, 04:14 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 23 2009, 01:05 PM)
Err, not really.
Here is the calculation for my third unit.

Town house
Market value RM80k as of today.

Purchase price RM60k
Stamp duty RM50
Bankers cheque RM5
Loan RM57k @ 4%, 30 years (estimate)
Down payment 5% @ RM3k
Agent fees RM3k
Lawyer fees RM2k (estimate)

Today I put in RM8055, if the price remain the same for 5 years and I sell.
My profit would be RM80k - RM57k - RM8055 + amortization + cashflow = RM14,945 + amortization + cashflow

First, the cashflow.
Rental is RM450 per month.
Maintenance is RM33.
Mortgage RM272

Cashflow for 5 years = (RM450 - RM33 - RM272) X 12 X 5 =  RM8700
Secondly, amortization.
For 60 months the tenants put money into my town house's equity.
That comes up to RM5595.
Finally, the profit is RM14,945 + RM8700 + RM5595 = RM29,240
Compare to the RM8055 I put in today, the gain for 5 years later would be extra 363%.
If I buy a developing property today, I put my money down and it get traps for 3 years before the project is fully complete then I can sell it away.
The question is, what is the market value after the project is complete?
I don't know as there is no past history for reference.

Also I lose money every month as I have to pay interest on my loan.
When calculating the gain for the incomplete property, one has to add interest into the calculation.
For a developed property can be rent out immediately and the tenant pay for my interest.
So it's not required to add into the calculation.  thumbup.gif
*
363% is good, but 600% is better tongue.gif
constant
post Aug 23 2009, 05:46 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 23 2009, 01:05 PM)
Err, not really.
Here is the calculation for my third unit.

Town house
Market value RM80k as of today.

Purchase price RM60k
Stamp duty RM50
Bankers cheque RM5
Loan RM57k @ 4%, 30 years (estimate)
Down payment 5% @ RM3k
Agent fees RM3k
Lawyer fees RM2k (estimate)

Today I put in RM8055, if the price remain the same for 5 years and I sell.
My profit would be RM80k - RM57k - RM8055 + amortization + cashflow = RM14,945 + amortization + cashflow

First, the cashflow.
Rental is RM450 per month.
Maintenance is RM33.
Mortgage RM272

Cashflow for 5 years = (RM450 - RM33 - RM272) X 12 X 5 =  RM8700
Secondly, amortization.
For 60 months the tenants put money into my town house's equity.
That comes up to RM5595.
Finally, the profit is RM14,945 + RM8700 + RM5595 = RM29,240
Compare to the RM8055 I put in today, the gain for 5 years later would be extra 363%.
If I buy a developing property today, I put my money down and it get traps for 3 years before the project is fully complete then I can sell it away.
The question is, what is the market value after the project is complete?
I don't know as there is no past history for reference.

Also I lose money every month as I have to pay interest on my loan.
When calculating the gain for the incomplete property, one has to add interest into the calculation.
For a developed property can be rent out immediately and the tenant pay for my interest.
So it's not required to add into the calculation.  thumbup.gif
*
Hi Jason,

1) You have already profited 20k from your astute purchase and this caused a big jump in your returns. If you assume you bought at market price( assume not everybody has your skills to buy cheap), you would have made only RM9240 over 5 years. Furthermore, you have not factored in vacant period, maybe some repairs, assessment, quit rent, your travelling expenses etc etc and maybe your labour time!

2) Assume, if interest rates go up to 6%, how much would you have made (or lost) instead?


Looking forward to your calculation.
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post Aug 23 2009, 08:54 PM

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edit.............

This post has been edited by AndreA_ApplE: Aug 23 2009, 08:55 PM
Buggo
post Aug 23 2009, 09:13 PM

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Keep it up guys. I spent 4-5 hours on this thread alone. Very informative I have to say!
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 23 2009, 09:16 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 23 2009, 04:14 PM)
363% is good, but 600% is better  tongue.gif
*
Maytower? brows.gif

I have not furnish the unit, furnishing it would get a higher return. laugh.gif
But see how first, have not look at the internal yet since I got it from an auction.


Added on August 23, 2009, 9:53 pm
QUOTE(constant @ Aug 23 2009, 05:46 PM)
Hi Jason,

1) You have already profited 20k from your astute purchase and this caused a big jump in your returns. If you assume you bought at market price( assume not everybody has your skills to buy cheap), you would have made only RM9240 over 5 years. Furthermore, you have not factored in vacant period, maybe some repairs, assessment, quit rent, your travelling expenses etc etc and maybe your labour time!

2) Assume, if interest rates go up to 6%, how much would you have made (or lost) instead?
Looking forward to your calculation.
*
hi constant.

If I bought at RM80k market price, loan RM72k @ 4%.
The cashflow per month is RM73.
5 years would be RM7380.
Amortization is RM6877.

The money put in would be:
Down payment RM8k
Agent RM2k (fee without bidding)
Lawyer RM2k

Total RM12k.


If sell at RM80k, the profit would be RM7380 + RM6877 - RM4k = RM10,257
Extra gain after 5 years 85%.

After including other expenses, this is not a very good deal.



For number 2. BLR increase from 5.55% to 6.05%.
Then I re-adjust the interest rate from 4% to 4.5%.

My cashflow drop from RM144 to RM128. Or RM16.
But then I might increase the rent by RM50 every month.

When interest rate increase, it's harder to buy a house to live in.
So what happen is the property value will go down and rental value will go up. icon_rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Aug 23 2009, 09:53 PM
Pai
post Aug 24 2009, 01:34 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 23 2009, 09:16 PM)
Maytower?  brows.gif

*
nope, was referring to the new Mayland developement.
Backkom
post Aug 24 2009, 09:50 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 23 2009, 02:16 AM)
read newspaper only, mana ada sharp  sweat.gif

btw, those 1800 units, are launched in one-go or by phases?
*
I saw it in newspaper once - then I could not find anymore info! Nothing is on Mayland's website...

Palazio's total number of units is only 660++. But I heard from the SA in the Plaza Damas office that they have 1800 units. So I presume that they will be launched in phases. Will upload the brochure after I scan them tomorrow.

Pai
post Aug 24 2009, 02:23 PM

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Backkom, in your expert opinion, this Pallazio studio can be rented out for RM800 p/m? smile.gif
Backkom
post Aug 24 2009, 03:58 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 24 2009, 02:23 PM)
Backkom, in your expert opinion, this Pallazio studio can be rented out for RM800 p/m? smile.gif
*
Me no expert! sweat.gif

It depends on many factors:
1. Economy recession/recovery - people working in Singapore/Pasir Gudang/Nusajaya (lots of non-JB, or even expats with relatively higher paying jobs)
2. The upkeep of Prima Regency - confidence on the security and maintenance
3. Phasing of the 1800 units - if all of them are released into the market within narrow time frame...

Some known factors:
1. Austin is the higher end neighbourhood compared to where Prima Regency is.
2. I would prefer Jusco Tebrau over Tesco/Giant Plentong.
3. Hospital nearby.
4. Lake view units will be superb!
5. Plentong/Permas Jaya area has more matured commercial area (plus point for Prima Regency?)

Prima Regency is currently commanding RM 650-750 for basic units, RM 1000 and above for fully furnished.
So RM 800 for Palazio basic may be doable. Of course there would be people who are willing to pay more for newer and nicer units.

But 3 years from now, inflation/economic recovery may work for us, but over-supply/poor workmanship/poor maintenance may work against us.

(Will be able to tell better picture after I start living there...)
life2ez
post Aug 24 2009, 05:15 PM

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wow.. a very good thread indeed, lot more things to learn, keep up good jobs guys.
now i'm feel too shy to claim i'm a property agent after i read through this thread due to lots more things i need to learn from all the gurus here.
anyway i'll try the best to help my potential client. since i don't know whether i'm a good agent or not.
But one think for sure i like to share my property auction listing here with all of you here, no obligation.. just to share among us.
for those who want that listing goes direct into your email, pls drop me your email to subscripe.

jbbeng
post Aug 26 2009, 10:03 AM

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I finally booked an apartment at Bestari Impian. tongue.gif

Seems like a fair price to me at RM178 per sq ft as compared to newly built Suriamas Apartment located next door. Bout Rm220 per sq ft. I check with the loan officer and they confirm it is under the category of Prime area of JB.

Lower floors are renting at RM1,100 - RM1,300 per month.

Hope everything goes well.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 26 2009, 10:37 AM

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How long it will take it to build and what is the interest have to pay every month?
jbbeng
post Aug 26 2009, 11:26 AM

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Its ready built...unsold unit.

Interest i probably getting BLR - 2.2
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post Aug 26 2009, 03:47 PM

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Oh, I am not familiar with that area.
If can get BLR-2.2%, your loan exceed 200k?
Dyong
post Aug 26 2009, 09:21 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 24 2009, 03:58 PM)
Me no expert!  sweat.gif

It depends on many factors:
1. Economy recession/recovery - people working in Singapore/Pasir Gudang/Nusajaya (lots of non-JB, or even expats with relatively higher paying jobs)
2. The upkeep of Prima Regency - confidence on the security and maintenance
3. Phasing of the 1800 units - if all of them are released into the market within narrow time frame...

Some known factors:
1. Austin is the higher end neighbourhood compared to where Prima Regency is.
2. I would prefer Jusco Tebrau over Tesco/Giant Plentong.
3. Hospital nearby.
4. Lake view units will be superb!
5. Plentong/Permas Jaya area has more matured commercial area (plus point for Prima Regency?)

Prima Regency is currently commanding RM 650-750 for basic units, RM 1000 and above for fully furnished.
So RM 800 for Palazio basic may be doable. Of course there would be people who are willing to pay more for newer and nicer units.

But 3 years from now, inflation/economic recovery may work for us, but over-supply/poor workmanship/poor maintenance may work against us.

(Will be able to tell better picture after I start living there...)
*
Mate, the lake is a turn off, trust me.

Backkom
post Aug 26 2009, 10:57 PM

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QUOTE(Dyong @ Aug 26 2009, 09:21 PM)
Mate, the lake is a turn off, trust me.
*
Really? Thanks for the tip! Am gonna check out the site soon...
propcritic
post Aug 27 2009, 09:59 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 26 2009, 10:57 PM)
Really? Thanks for the tip! Am gonna check out the site soon...
*
Tumpang Tumpang checking can boh?

mizzdreyhere
post Aug 27 2009, 10:44 PM

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Hi, this had been a very good read.

I am planning to get my first apartment next year. Contemplating whether to get an apartment unit near uni/colleage for students or for working adults/young families.

Not many locations in mind yet, yet to check out anything...its just an idea which needs to be expanded =) So far, had been eyeing properties at Damansara, Cheras & Bangi.

Hope to get some feedback from you guys here
Backkom
post Aug 28 2009, 07:42 PM

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QUOTE(propcritic @ Aug 27 2009, 09:59 PM)
Tumpang Tumpang checking can boh?
*
Can can... The more the merrier biggrin.gif
myvi5949
post Aug 28 2009, 09:41 PM

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QUOTE(Dyong @ Aug 26 2009, 09:21 PM)
Mate, the lake is a turn off, trust me.
*
Yup.. People living around lake there complain about mosquito.
Backkom
post Aug 29 2009, 10:24 AM

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QUOTE(myvi5949 @ Aug 28 2009, 09:41 PM)
Yup.. People living around lake there complain about mosquito.
*
Ic ic... any foul odour coming from the lake?

myvi5949
post Aug 29 2009, 05:22 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 29 2009, 10:24 AM)
Ic ic... any foul odour coming from the lake?
*
Only thing i know is about the mosquito problem.. got it from reading the newspaper. Tenants have been complaining.. Mosquito reaching top floors..
Other than that i think Austin is a good place to invest.

If u like Austin maybe u would also like to take a look at Bukit Indah.. Good neighborhood, with malls and shops. Near Nusajaya.


propcritic
post Aug 29 2009, 08:00 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Aug 28 2009, 07:42 PM)
Can can... The more the merrier  biggrin.gif
*
Fai tit Fai tit...when checking???
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 30 2009, 01:40 AM

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Interestingly my first bank that I take loan from only gives me 70%.
Since it's a 3rd unit, they classify it as an investment property.

So I would be meeting new banker. smile.gif
Dyong
post Aug 30 2009, 02:36 AM

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Congrats for your 3rd purchase.

70% financing huh... is it because of Auction property buy or Income-Mortgage financing ratio?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 30 2009, 07:47 AM

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Nope, 'cos I got 2 loan from this bank already, hence the lower amount.
yewkhuay
post Aug 30 2009, 10:40 AM

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true, unless u can show strong financial background, if not bank will reduce the MOF for ur 3rd property, but if u finance under other bank u may get 90%.
Pai
post Aug 30 2009, 11:50 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 30 2009, 07:47 AM)
Nope, 'cos I got 2 loan from this bank already, hence the lower amount.
*
which bank is this?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Aug 31 2009, 10:00 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 30 2009, 11:50 PM)
which bank is this?
*
UXB... blush.gif
hiiragizawa
post Aug 31 2009, 12:01 PM

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I would like to personally thank Backkom, jasonhanjk and Pai for their many replies here in this informative thread.

I'm giving myself a year to study and learn while gaining capital for my first property.
Pai
post Aug 31 2009, 09:10 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 31 2009, 10:00 AM)
UXB... blush.gif
*
that is strange, I still got 90% from them..........but was told that should be my last loan from UxB for many years to come tongue.gif

Have to say I like UOB's service and felxibility.... thumbup.gif


Added on August 31, 2009, 9:12 pm
QUOTE(hiiragizawa @ Aug 31 2009, 12:01 PM)
I'm giving myself a year to study and learn while gaining capital for my first property.
*
thats the way to go smile.gif

Keep us informed when u hunt for your 1st ya wink.gif

This post has been edited by Pai: Aug 31 2009, 09:12 PM
Dyong
post Aug 31 2009, 10:48 PM

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Pai,

What's your view on Mayland Regalia?
Pai
post Sep 1 2009, 01:24 AM

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QUOTE(Dyong @ Aug 31 2009, 10:48 PM)
Pai,

What's your view on Mayland Regalia?
*
My view is very much dependant on the entry cost..........so unless u give the entry price im neutral tongue.gif
wahlauyeh
post Sep 1 2009, 03:25 PM

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hi to all sifus here, i'm studying throughout this thread for quite some time...try to pick and learn from scratch.
Hope to be able to invest for the 1st property in year time.

i will try to catch up with all the book sifoo and si mou refering to..but hmm.gif ...which to start 1st? as fundamental?

thanks & regards,
wahlauyeh
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post Sep 1 2009, 05:10 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 31 2009, 09:10 PM)
that is strange, I still got 90% from them..........but was told that should be my last loan from UxB for many years to come  tongue.gif

Have to say I like UOB's service and felxibility....  thumbup.gif


*
That is really strange, I'll call them again next year as I need to get the rental unit up and going first.
wahlauyeh
post Sep 1 2009, 06:25 PM

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hi jasonhanjk,

for the auction property you had made, after paying the deposit only look for property loan?

sorry for noob question tongue.gif
Backkom
post Sep 1 2009, 07:03 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 1 2009, 06:25 PM)
hi jasonhanjk,

for the auction property you had made, after paying the deposit only look for property loan?

sorry for noob question tongue.gif
*
After you successfully bid the unit (paying 5% or 10% of deposit), then you look for loan...
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 1 2009, 07:44 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 1 2009, 06:25 PM)
hi jasonhanjk,

for the auction property you had made, after paying the deposit only look for property loan?

sorry for noob question tongue.gif
*
Just as Backkom said. Also like to add, once the loan approve, you can start looking for tenant.
The first auction property have one ready tenant, will move in once everything is settle.
Man my agent is real fast. wink.gif
wahlauyeh
post Sep 1 2009, 09:57 PM

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understand from my mortgage banker, there is a risk where in 90-120 days bank might not be able to issue the balance purcahse price on time...issit true? happen often?
i'm eyeing 1 under market value condo...but for investment purpose

some further question..can i select my own lawyer? or issit must use auctioneer's lawyer ?


Backkom
post Sep 1 2009, 10:37 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 1 2009, 09:57 PM)
understand from my mortgage banker, there is a risk where in 90-120 days bank might not be able to issue the balance purcahse price on time...issit true? happen often?
i'm eyeing 1 under market value condo...but for investment purpose

some further question..can i select my own lawyer? or issit must use auctioneer's lawyer ?
*
1. Risk of going over the given 90/120 days period - you have to work hard to avoid that, call lawyers/bankers as often as you can to follow up.
2. You have to get your own lawyer, auctioneer does not provide lawyer.
yewkhuay
post Sep 2 2009, 12:37 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Aug 31 2009, 09:10 PM)
that is strange, I still got 90% from them..........but was told that should be my last loan from UxB for many years to come  tongue.gif

Have to say I like UOB's service and felxibility....  thumbup.gif


Added on August 31, 2009, 9:12 pm
thats the way to go  smile.gif

Keep us informed when u hunt for your 1st ya  wink.gif
*
my 3rd loan offer from public revised from 80% to 90% after i forward the LO from OCBC to them. rclxm9.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 2 2009, 08:45 AM

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QUOTE(yewkhuay @ Sep 2 2009, 12:37 AM)
my 3rd loan offer from public revised from 80% to 90% after i forward the LO from OCBC to them.  rclxm9.gif
*
Good to hear that, I too like to have a few bankers under me to keep a bit of competition going on.
Now only have 1 banker.

Later I would ask all my banker to join me for lunch and go through my financial issues. nod.gif
Hehe.


Added on September 2, 2009, 8:58 am
QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 1 2009, 09:57 PM)
understand from my mortgage banker, there is a risk where in 90-120 days bank might not be able to issue the balance purcahse price on time...issit true? happen often?
i'm eyeing 1 under market value condo...but for investment purpose

some further question..can i select my own lawyer? or issit must use auctioneer's lawyer ?
*
It would be better to call up one of the banker before the auction starts.
Let the banker look at your financial and see likely would the loan get approve.

For banks that give ZEC, the condition is to get one of their lawyer's service.
Different banks have different panel of lawyer.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Sep 2 2009, 08:58 AM
Backkom
post Sep 2 2009, 09:19 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 2 2009, 08:45 AM)

It would be better to call up one of the banker before the auction starts.
Let the banker look at your financial and see likely would the loan get approve.

For banks that give ZEC, the condition is to get one of their lawyer's service.
Different banks have different panel of lawyer.
*
Bank panel lawyer will only handle your loan documents - of course you can appoint them as your S&P lawyer, or elect your own lawyer.
plankton
post Sep 2 2009, 12:26 PM

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have a noob question bout loans, what is the process/who do i contact to find out about our loan eligibility / pre approved loan amount? to help in my prperty search. Thx
Star_knight79
post Sep 2 2009, 12:38 PM

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Shit, the property price has gone up so much.
All because of the buying selling game + govt to maintain the interest.
I just don't how Malaysia can live on in this kind of situation.
But the good thing is they can borrow money from Malaysian through bond.
How are they going to pay back???
wahlauyeh
post Sep 2 2009, 01:37 PM

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Hey guys, need some opinion of urs on below case:

RM110k Auction on Apartment equip with swimming pool, gym, playground.
MArket price for it is around rm 135k-150k.
Condition of aprtment unknown and furnished or not also unknown as it is a auction property.
Market rent is RM650 (Conservative speculation) - RM 750
What do you guys think?
Backkom
post Sep 2 2009, 02:49 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 2 2009, 01:37 PM)
Hey guys, need some opinion of urs on below case:

RM110k Auction on Apartment equip with swimming pool, gym, playground.
MArket price for it is around rm 135k-150k.
Condition of aprtment unknown and furnished or not also unknown as it is a auction property.
Market rent is RM650 (Conservative speculation) - RM 750
What do you guys think?
*
You need to solve your "unknowns" -
1. You can assume that the unit is unfurnished cause the unhappy ex-owner will definitely take away whatever that he can take!
2. Go check out the apartment's condition.
3. Call up at least 4-5 agents to get a good feeling (speculation is dangerous) about rental - 650 is basic unit or furnished?

wahlauyeh
post Sep 2 2009, 09:15 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 2 2009, 02:49 PM)
You need to solve your "unknowns" -
1. You can assume that the unit is unfurnished cause the unhappy ex-owner will definitely take away whatever that he can take!
2. Go check out the apartment's condition.
3. Call up at least 4-5 agents to get a good feeling (speculation is dangerous) about rental - 650 is basic unit or furnished?
*
thx, will take action on checking the unit this Saturday, it is a townhouse type, i got friend living overthere.
the design is total 4 floor where by this unit is ground floor and the stair case started at 1st floor. that mean need to go down staircase 1 floor to get to this ground floor unit. Get the picture? smile.gif

1207sf. but checking with auctioneer with the inclusive of carpark, they dont know bout this as they do not have the consent, they take note my number said will let me know tomorrow. Shall i further my investigation to that particular bank or lawyer(asignor)?

Rental wise, yes..i agree like wat u mention need to check out with several agent to survey the rental.
As for Furnished or not, i try to peek from outside this Saturday ..hope can found some more clue on it.


notworthy.gif thx for the opinion.


Backkom
post Sep 2 2009, 09:21 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 2 2009, 09:15 PM)

1207sf. but checking with auctioneer with the inclusive of carpark, they dont know bout this as they do not have the consent, they take note my number said will let me know tomorrow. Shall i further my investigation to that particular bank or lawyer(asignor)?

*
The info about car park can be found on the Proclamation of Sales. Ask the auctioneer to fax the POS to you, and you can read it from there - if the unit comes with car park, the POS should have something about "accessory parcel". Good luck!
wahlauyeh
post Sep 2 2009, 09:40 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 2 2009, 09:21 PM)
The info about car park can be found on the Proclamation of Sales. Ask the auctioneer to fax the POS to you, and you can read it from there - if the unit comes with car park, the POS should have something about "accessory parcel". Good luck!
*
thnx for the sharing, they intend to fax over, but at that time i'm not in office, nvm. i ask them to fax over by tomorrow when i'm in office. smile.gif

any other info i should dig out? tongue.gif

best regards,
wahlauyeh



Backkom
post Sep 2 2009, 10:28 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 2 2009, 09:40 PM)
thnx for the sharing, they intend to fax over, but at that time i'm not in office, nvm. i ask them to fax over by tomorrow when i'm in office. smile.gif

any other info i should dig out?  tongue.gif

best regards,
wahlauyeh
*
1. Check whether bank is paying agent commission (are you using an agent?)
2. Check whether the arrears of maintenance fee, quit rent and assessment fee are paid using the purchase money (that means paid by bank)
wahlauyeh
post Sep 2 2009, 11:54 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 2 2009, 10:28 PM)
1. Check whether bank is paying agent commission (are you using an agent?)
2. Check whether the arrears of maintenance fee, quit rent and assessment fee are paid using the purchase money (that means paid by bank)
*
1st ques, i search the auction myself, do i need to attach one agent to go for the auction? from what i know is i need to prepare the bank draft and some proper documentation. coorect me if i'm wrong ar, sifoos wub.gif
2nd ques, i will need to speak to the bank/auctioneer?

tq

Backkom
post Sep 3 2009, 07:40 AM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 2 2009, 11:54 PM)
1st ques, i search the auction myself, do i need to attach one agent to go for the auction? from what i know is i need to prepare the bank draft and some proper documentation. coorect me if i'm wrong ar, sifoos wub.gif
2nd ques, i will need to speak to the bank/auctioneer?

tq
*
1. If bank is paying commission, no harm getting an agent to represent you. Give him your ceiling price, and he'll bid for you - avoid situation where the auction atmosphere makes you too emotional and end up bidding over your planned ceiling price! If bank is not paying commission, then better do the work yourself.
2. This piece of info can be found in the POS.
wahlauyeh
post Sep 3 2009, 05:57 PM

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Still not yet get the fax from the auctioneer, had yet to check out the agent given commission or not.
Whole day out of office, no chance to wait the fax in office.
i contacted my lawyer, he said normally succeed bidder will pay the property outstanding maintenance fee, bills for this condo.
hm..really need to check out the figure of this figure..??
my fren who is in mortgage asked the condo market value is about rm150k. hmm.gif ...now tendering 110k..what u guys think..can go?

by the way,thanks backkom.
Backkom
post Sep 3 2009, 06:04 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 3 2009, 05:57 PM)
Still not yet get the fax from the auctioneer, had yet to check out the agent given commission or not.
Whole day out of office, no chance to wait the fax in office.
i contacted my lawyer, he said normally succeed bidder will pay the property outstanding maintenance fee, bills for this condo.
hm..really need to check out the figure of this figure..??
my fren who is in mortgage asked the condo market value is about rm150k. hmm.gif ...now tendering 110k..what u guys think..can go?

by the way,thanks backkom.
*
Normally buyer will have to pay upfront (the maintenance fee bla bla bla) - but if the POS says that it'll be paid using the purchase money, the bank will reimburse all those fees to you. This matters a lot, some auction units have such arrears up to 10k!

Anyway bear in mind that reserve price may not be your final purchase price, and there's always such possibility that the auction gets called off. 9 out of 10 auctions which I have bought bank draft for were called off... vmad.gif
wahlauyeh
post Sep 3 2009, 06:20 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 3 2009, 06:04 PM)
Normally buyer will have to pay upfront (the maintenance fee bla bla bla) - but if the POS says that it'll be paid using the purchase money, the bank will reimburse all those fees to you. This matters a lot, some auction units have such arrears up to 10k!

Anyway bear in mind that reserve price may not be your final purchase price, and there's always such possibility that the auction gets called off. 9 out of 10 auctions which I have bought bank draft for were called off...  vmad.gif
*
if the auction unit called off, the bankdraft we gonna excahnge back from bank? sorry noob question.
Backkom
post Sep 3 2009, 06:23 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 3 2009, 06:20 PM)
if the auction unit called off, the bankdraft we gonna excahnge back from bank? sorry noob question.
*
Yup, some banks will charge you a few ringgits service charge...
wahlauyeh
post Sep 4 2009, 09:46 AM

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normally if the auction had nobody bid, the next time it auction with how many % decrease ar?

regards,
wahlauyeh
Backkom
post Sep 4 2009, 10:57 AM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 4 2009, 09:46 AM)
normally if the auction had nobody bid, the next time it auction with how many % decrease ar?

regards,
wahlauyeh
*
10% of current reserve price...

wahlauyeh
post Sep 4 2009, 12:38 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 4 2009, 10:57 AM)
10% of current reserve price...
*
hmm.gif ...should wait for 1 more round?.. tongue.gif

tomorrow i will checking the condition of the respective unit..cross finger it is a good unit.. smile.gif
happy weekends to everyone here.


Added on September 7, 2009, 2:54 pmalready checkout the townhouse. currently got tenant. so wondering should i pop up and ask the tenure and check out the unit.?
Managed to speak to the management person in charge and he bring me along to see another unit which is empty and same townhouse type.
so far still thinking whether to be patient and wait for one more auction.
1 question: normally take how long to re auction the unit again?

This post has been edited by wahlauyeh: Sep 7 2009, 02:54 PM
life2ez
post Sep 10 2009, 12:51 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 4 2009, 12:38 PM)
hmm.gif ...should wait for 1 more round?.. tongue.gif

tomorrow i will checking the condition of the respective unit..cross finger it is a good unit.. smile.gif
happy weekends to everyone here.


Added on September 7, 2009, 2:54 pmalready checkout the townhouse. currently got tenant. so wondering should i pop up and ask the tenure and check out the unit.?
Managed to speak to the management person in charge and he bring me along to see another unit which is empty and same townhouse type.
so far still thinking whether to be patient and wait for one more auction.
1 question: normally take how long to re auction the unit again?
*
Ya if you brave enough, go and talk to the tenant, ask them the make a site visit, ask them, if you buy this house does they will continue to rental with you.
normally within 1 - 2 month this unit will be in auction again.
it's worth to wait, but when the price is revised then that will bring more bidder to this property, and sometime it's ending with the price more than when it in 1st auction.
can you PM me the address unit, than i can check for you.
TSsdas86
post Sep 10 2009, 03:02 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Aug 30 2009, 07:47 AM)
Nope, 'cos I got 2 loan from this bank already, hence the lower amount.
*
Wow, you get 3 loans from the same bank? How is that possible?

Your salary should be very high to do so right?

I am curious how you manage to do it. Can share your story? smile.gif
wahlauyeh
post Sep 10 2009, 03:15 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Sep 10 2009, 03:02 PM)
Wow, you get 3 loans from the same bank?  How is that possible?

Your salary should be very high to do so right?

I am curious how you manage to do it. Can share your story? smile.gif
*
i think the 3rd loan is under his sister name bah... smile.gif
like he mention he is handling for her sister.
TSsdas86
post Sep 10 2009, 03:16 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 1 2009, 07:44 PM)
Just as Backkom said. Also like to add, once the loan approve, you can start looking for tenant.
The first auction property have one ready tenant, will move in once everything is settle.
Man my agent is real fast. wink.gif
*
Hi Jason,
It is me again. I have some questions to ask:
1) How do you find for tenant?
2) Normally, if the rental fee is around RM700 to RM1000, I think that it is not easy to get tenant. So, how to do you handle this problem?
3) Normally, how long does it takes for you to get tenant for your property?
4) If you are hiring agent, then the fees would not be cheap. What is the job of agent?

Sorry for the noob questions. blush.gif


Added on September 10, 2009, 3:17 pm
QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 10 2009, 03:15 PM)
i think the 3rd loan is under his sister name bah... smile.gif
like he mention he is handling for her sister.
*
O I see. thanks for reminding me about that. Now, I understand why.

This post has been edited by sdas86: Sep 10 2009, 03:17 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 11 2009, 02:24 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 10 2009, 03:15 PM)
i think the 3rd loan is under his sister name bah... smile.gif
like he mention he is handling for her sister.
*
I can tell you it's getting harder.

As I have 2 loans but still not able to show they are being rent out.
Hence the difficulty in getting the loan.
The 3rd one purchase using my mom's name and loan using both of our name since she is still working.
My name is included to get a 30 year mortgage.

2nd one didn't manage to put under my sis name because not sure how the auction system yet that time.


Added on September 11, 2009, 2:36 pm
QUOTE(sdas86 @ Sep 10 2009, 03:16 PM)
Hi Jason,
It is me again. I have some questions to ask:
1) How do you find for tenant?
2) Normally, if the rental fee is around RM700 to RM1000, I think that it is not easy to get tenant. So, how to do you handle this problem?
3) Normally, how long does it takes for you to get tenant for your property?
4) If you are hiring agent, then the fees would not be cheap. What is the job of agent?

Sorry for the noob questions. blush.gif


Added on September 10, 2009, 3:17 pm

O I see. thanks for reminding me about that. Now, I understand why.
*
If you want to be rich, be incompetent.
If you want to be very rich, be lazy.
So the answer to question 1, I'll let the agent find them.

2) It's not easy if you price your rental above market price.
Normally in an area that has low vacancy, it's easier to get tenants.
To know your rental market rate, ask your agent.

3) That depends on how good you manage your property. I heard from a tenant about a neighbor.
That neighbor move out, follow by cleaning done by a cleaning company, next day a new tenant moves in.
My first property is already tenanted, so not much of a hassle.
2nd one standing by, 3rd one still try to get a loan.

4) Agents are different. I have not went thru mine but I can tell you roughly what they will do.
They will get in tenants, get the leases done, explain how much deposit required.
After tenants move in, collect 1 month rent from me as commission.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Sep 11 2009, 02:36 PM
TSsdas86
post Sep 12 2009, 02:30 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 11 2009, 02:24 PM)

If you want to be rich, be incompetent.
If you want to be very rich, be lazy.
So the answer to question 1, I'll let the agent find them.

2) It's not easy if you price your rental above market price.
Normally in an area that has low vacancy, it's easier to get tenants.
To know your rental market rate, ask your agent.

3) That depends on how good you manage your property. I heard from a tenant about a neighbor.
That neighbor move out, follow by cleaning done by a cleaning company, next day a new tenant moves in.
My first property is already tenanted, so not much of a hassle.
2nd one standing by, 3rd one still try to get a loan.

4) Agents are different. I have not went thru mine but I can tell you roughly what they will do.
They will get in tenants, get the leases done, explain how much deposit required.
After tenants move in, collect 1 month rent from me as commission.
*
Hi Jason,
You said be incompetent and be lazy can become very rich. If a person is incompetent and lazy, how that person can become rich?

Another question:
Example of loan:
30 years at 4% pa RM200,000

That would be around RM955 per month to pay for the loan.

So, if I do not rent my house at around RM1000, it would not be a good deal. So, it would not be easy to rent the house at RM1000 per month. People would prefer buying the house instead. rclxub.gif

So, your idea is to find houses in low vacancy area that are selling at low price. Am I right? It is not easy t find such property right?

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post Sep 12 2009, 02:58 PM

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Take some time and think about it, how do you be lazy and let someone do it for you?

Talk to a few agents to find out which area has been low and about to come up. They are your ears and eyes in the market.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Sep 12 2009, 03:00 PM
TSsdas86
post Sep 12 2009, 08:09 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 12 2009, 02:58 PM)
Take some time and think about it, how do you be lazy and let someone do it for you?

Talk to a few agents to find out which area has been low and about to come up. They are your ears and eyes in the market.
*
Thanks. I will try. notworthy.gif
noed18
post Sep 15 2009, 10:36 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Jul 24 2009, 01:46 PM)

If your previous unit are being rented out, you need to let them see your leases.
The bank will discount your rental by 25% and if it still exceeds your expenses, the bank will very glad to loan you again.

Example, your rental is RM1000 and after discount is RM750.
If your expenses is less that RM750, the bank will consider your salary as though you have not make any loan before.
OKAY, we can show the tenancy agreement & bank statement for rental income proof, but macam mana the bank knows your expenses?? some may be paying off 30yrs loan, some maybe 5yrs loan?? Not to mentioned, all other implicit cost, cukai, insurance etc...

Any rule of thumb for them to estimate? Or it's just a theory and not easily applicable in real world?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 15 2009, 10:56 PM

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Put your financial statements in order. Keep good records that is easily readable.

If you don't know, you can ask a bookkeeper to help you.
Or play the game cashflow 101.
noed18
post Sep 15 2009, 11:52 PM

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sorry, i think i slipped a key direction in my question. Does the bank really request for all the documents/trail records/support to show proof or they have their way to determine based on your property location + outstanding amount.
Joink
post Sep 16 2009, 07:59 PM

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Make sure you have a stable career before venturing into properties.
TSsdas86
post Sep 16 2009, 08:54 PM

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QUOTE(Joink @ Sep 16 2009, 07:59 PM)
Make sure you have a stable career before venturing into properties.
*
I agree. If we want to start investing in property, then I think we need to work for around 2 to 3 years, save money and then start to invest. It is not an easy investment and it is not cheap. So, we need to be very careful.
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post Sep 16 2009, 09:23 PM

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QUOTE(noed18 @ Sep 15 2009, 11:52 PM)
sorry, i think i slipped a key direction in my question. Does the bank really request for all the documents/trail records/support to show proof or they have their way to determine based on your property location + outstanding amount.
*
Yes, your financial statement is your report card when you leave school.
They need your payslip, bank that shows bank in, epf, income tax, savings, etc.
They are not going to loan you the money base on your English literature that you got A in high school. shocking.gif

If you have a credit card and have some late payments, they too are able to check on it. They are CTOS, CCRIS and others.
Of course, there are ways to correct late payments.

Bank themselves have their own property price valuation.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Sep 16 2009, 09:29 PM
ehl
post Sep 17 2009, 09:41 AM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 16 2009, 09:23 PM)
Yes, your financial statement is your report card when you leave school.
They need your payslip, bank that shows bank in, epf, income tax, savings, etc.
They are not going to loan you the money base on your English literature that you got A in high school.  shocking.gif

If you have a credit card and have some late payments, they too are able to check on it. They are CTOS, CCRIS and others.
Of course, there are ways to correct late payments.

Bank themselves have their own property price valuation.
*
Do we really have to produce a formal Profit and loss + Balance sheet statement or just a simple presentation of income and expenses?

CTOS & CCRIS is scary... always keep you record clean... maybe it wont give you extra loan but definately it will not demerit your credibility.

This post has been edited by ehl: Sep 18 2009, 10:13 AM
wahlauyeh
post Sep 17 2009, 11:03 PM

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my targeted auction unit is taken by somebody liao...sad.gif
sienZZzz

simplesmile
post Sep 17 2009, 11:10 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 17 2009, 11:03 PM)
my targeted auction unit is taken by somebody liao...sad.gif
sienZZzz
*
happened to me 2 times already.
Pai
post Sep 18 2009, 12:36 AM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Sep 17 2009, 11:03 PM)
my targeted auction unit is taken by somebody liao...sad.gif
sienZZzz
*
if you got your property in the 1st auction u went, chance are u've overpaid. tongue.gif

Went 2 times as well and I've bought zerro wink.gif
Backkom
post Sep 18 2009, 07:39 AM

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QUOTE(simplesmile @ Sep 17 2009, 11:10 PM)
happened to me 2 times already.
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I bought bank draft 10 times, 9 times got called off vmad.gif
noed18
post Sep 18 2009, 09:08 AM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 18 2009, 07:39 AM)
I bought bank draft 10 times, 9 times got called off  vmad.gif
*
On top of the 5% or the 10% bank draft depending on the auction unit requirement, what are the other associated cost that will need up front cash payment?? I am aware of legal fees, stamp duties, and probably set aside few k just in case of outstanding bills, any other expenses that unlikely to avoid? Thanks.

Also, this may sound Noob, but how long it takes for the whole thing to get transfer over and handover key?

This post has been edited by noed18: Sep 18 2009, 10:14 AM
ehl
post Sep 18 2009, 10:17 AM

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If sucessfully aquired the auction unit. what is the post procedures and cost if any?

and how long will it take to get the possession (keys) ?
wahlauyeh
post Sep 18 2009, 01:05 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Sep 18 2009, 07:39 AM)
I bought bank draft 10 times, 9 times got called off  vmad.gif
*
sweat.gif ...quite many time ler...

cynthusc
post Sep 18 2009, 03:53 PM

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I am also reading more and more about property investment and find the posts here interesting. There seems to be a lot of promotion of Robert Kiyosaki so I would like to share this link http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html

It makes for interesting reading!
aramis888
post Sep 18 2009, 04:40 PM

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QUOTE(cynthusc @ Sep 18 2009, 03:53 PM)
I am also reading more and more about property investment and find the posts here interesting.  There seems to be a lot of promotion of Robert Kiyosaki so I would like to share this link http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html

It makes for interesting reading!
*
rclxms.gif rclxms.gif thumbup.gif thumbup.gif

TSsdas86
post Sep 18 2009, 10:55 PM

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QUOTE(cynthusc @ Sep 18 2009, 03:53 PM)
I am also reading more and more about property investment and find the posts here interesting.  There seems to be a lot of promotion of Robert Kiyosaki so I would like to share this link http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html

It makes for interesting reading!
*
I read the website and I found that the site is saying a lotof bad stuff about Robert Kiyosaki. I am one of the fans and readersof Robert Kiyosaki's books. I find that some of his personal financing tips are good and helping me to look at my financial status. Maybe some of the story telling part in his books are not true but some of the financial tips he gives are good. biggrin.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 19 2009, 12:21 PM

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John Treed, RK number 1 basher.
John has been famous for many years, and not because of his books. sweat.gif
TSsdas86
post Sep 19 2009, 03:05 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 19 2009, 12:21 PM)
John Treed, RK number 1 basher.
John has been famous for many years, and not because of his books. sweat.gif
*
Hi Jason,
I am following some advice from Robert Kiyosaki and after I read the John Treed website, I feel confused. I am not sure whether I can truly follow Robert Kiyosaki advice or not. rclxub.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 19 2009, 05:49 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Sep 19 2009, 03:05 PM)
Hi Jason,
I am following some advice from Robert Kiyosaki and after I read the John Treed website, I feel confused. I am not sure whether I can truly follow Robert Kiyosaki advice or not. rclxub.gif
*
Well, it's your choice really.

Some choose to believe in Treed but others believe in Kiyosaki.
As I have choose to believe in Robert, so far I am getting profit from my property and silver trading. notworthy.gif

So choose wisely. nod.gif
TSsdas86
post Sep 20 2009, 03:55 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 19 2009, 05:49 PM)
Well, it's your choice really.

Some choose to believe in Treed but others believe in Kiyosaki.
As I have choose to believe in Robert, so far I am getting profit from my property and silver trading. notworthy.gif

So choose wisely. nod.gif
*
Hi,
Silver trading? How can we trade silver in Malaysia?

Pai
post Sep 20 2009, 09:12 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Sep 19 2009, 03:05 PM)
I am following some advice from Robert Kiyosaki and after I read the John Treed website, I feel confused. I am not sure whether I can truly follow Robert Kiyosaki advice or not. rclxub.gif
*
a good advise is a good advise, irrespective where it comes from smile.gif
TSsdas86
post Sep 20 2009, 09:35 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Sep 20 2009, 09:12 PM)
a good advise is a good advise, irrespective where it comes from  smile.gif
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Thanks. You reply gives me a direction to follow again. Thanks a lot. rclxms.gif
SUSjasonhanjk
post Sep 22 2009, 09:22 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Sep 20 2009, 03:55 PM)
Hi,
Silver trading? How can we trade silver in Malaysia?
*
So far I only know UOB in Singapore.

ETF in US can be trade too.
TSsdas86
post Sep 23 2009, 12:09 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Sep 22 2009, 09:22 PM)
So far I only know UOB in Singapore.

ETF in US can be trade too.
*
Thanks for the info. I need to look into it. I am going to ask some friends working in bank about it. smile.gif
Joink
post Sep 23 2009, 08:55 PM

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A very good read for those that are starting out....


Attached File(s)
Attached File  68_69_milandoshi_FA.pdf ( 1.82mb ) Number of downloads: 298
TSsdas86
post Sep 23 2009, 10:47 PM

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QUOTE(Joink @ Sep 23 2009, 08:55 PM)
A very good read for those that are starting out....
*
Thanks for the free ebook. Nice. thumbup.gif
ehl
post Sep 24 2009, 11:54 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Sep 20 2009, 09:12 PM)
a good advise is a good advise, irrespective where it comes from  smile.gif
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In order to do what we like most, we must willing to accept ideas to work out our own best course of actions.

Criticise for enlightenment not for the sake of argument or pride.
iw2481632
post Sep 24 2009, 05:30 PM

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Hi Senior Investors,

Is there any post about how do you start your first investment?

How long to get u prepare mentally & financial to start investment in property?

Success cases are a lots here, how about your failure case, not to expectation case. Can share your story?

ps: 1 DST - own stay, 1 DST - rent out (zero cash flow), plan to start buying soon.

This post has been edited by iw2481632: Sep 24 2009, 05:30 PM
R o Y
post Sep 25 2009, 12:35 AM

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QUOTE(iw2481632 @ Sep 24 2009, 05:30 PM)
Hi Senior Investors,

Is there any post about how do you start your first investment?

How long to get u prepare mentally & financial to start investment in property?

Success cases are a lots here, how about your failure case, not to expectation case. Can share your story?

ps: 1 DST - own stay, 1 DST  - rent out (zero cash flow), plan to start buying soon.
*
before you start buying, you should explore if its possible to convert your zero cash flow DST rental to positive cash flow. Is it at almost breakeven level now or very negative?
iw2481632
post Sep 25 2009, 12:03 PM

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QUOTE(R o Y @ Sep 25 2009, 12:35 AM)
before you start buying, you should explore if its possible to convert your zero cash flow DST rental to positive cash flow. Is it at almost breakeven level now or very negative?
*
For the rented DST, 1. interest rate at BLR+0.1, 2. Pre-collected monthly rental for 12 mths yearly for the past 4years(rental off mkt price 15%).

Refinance is not my option at the moment although it does not generate positive cash flow but with the pre-collected rental parking in loan acct + some cash parked there. Monthly interest cost is around 70 per month. Understand that this is bad COCR, it is my funding's resort at the moment.
Zack Styler
post Sep 25 2009, 12:12 PM

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QUOTE(iw2481632 @ Sep 25 2009, 12:03 PM)
For the rented DST, 1. interest rate at BLR+0.1, 2. Pre-collected monthly rental for 12 mths yearly for the past 4years(rental off mkt price 15%).

Refinance is not my option at the moment although it does not generate positive cash flow but with the pre-collected rental parking in loan acct + some cash parked there. Monthly interest cost is around  70 per month. Understand that this is bad COCR, it is my funding's resort at the moment.
*
Mind to ask, is the monthly rental received is the same amount you are paying for the monthly installments?
iw2481632
post Sep 25 2009, 12:20 PM

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QUOTE(Zack Styler @ Sep 25 2009, 12:12 PM)
Mind to ask, is the monthly rental received is the same amount you are paying for the monthly installments?
*
off by -15% of monthly installment.
ehl
post Sep 25 2009, 02:09 PM

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QUOTE(iw2481632 @ Sep 25 2009, 12:20 PM)
off by -15% of monthly installment.
*
have you included your quit rent & assessment and maintenance charges?

You have to reconsider renegotiate the bank interest rate or take your deposit to make principal repayment for interest saving.
R o Y
post Sep 25 2009, 02:17 PM

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QUOTE(iw2481632 @ Sep 25 2009, 12:03 PM)
For the rented DST, 1. interest rate at BLR+0.1, 2. Pre-collected monthly rental for 12 mths yearly for the past 4years(rental off mkt price 15%).

Refinance is not my option at the moment although it does not generate positive cash flow but with the pre-collected rental parking in loan acct + some cash parked there. Monthly interest cost is around  70 per month. Understand that this is bad COCR, it is my funding's resort at the moment.
*
First thing you should do then is to ask your bank to give you a lower rate. BLR+0.1 is very very high. Jus tell your bank that a few other banks have offered you a much better rate and that you're considering to refinance once your penalty period is over (I assume its close to being over or is already over). You should be able to get at least BLR-2% saving you 2.1% in interest.

At the same time, ask them to stretch your loan tenure to the maximum allowed by the bank, this will reduce your principle repayment portion of your monthly installment.

by doing both, should be able to lower your monthly installment by at least RM50.

If you dont mind sharing the exact figures, its relatively simple to see if you can convert your negative cashflow into positive or at least breakeven.

If you leave it being negative, this will reduce the borrowing capacity for your next loan to purchase your next investment property.
iw2481632
post Sep 25 2009, 02:18 PM

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QUOTE(ehl @ Sep 25 2009, 02:09 PM)
have  you included your quit rent & assessment and maintenance charges?

You have to reconsider renegotiate the bank interest rate or take your deposit to make principal repayment for interest saving.
*
Inclusive.

Pls refer to Post #336 for answer on 2nd sentence.
TSsdas86
post Sep 25 2009, 09:04 PM

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QUOTE(Joink @ Sep 23 2009, 08:55 PM)
A very good read for those that are starting out....
*
Hi Joink,
Can I share this ebook with my blog readers? I want to provide a download link in my blog for this ebook because it is very useful.

Can I share it?

Please let me know asap.


ehl
post Sep 25 2009, 09:57 PM

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QUOTE(iw2481632 @ Sep 25 2009, 02:18 PM)
Inclusive.

Pls refer to Post #336 for answer on 2nd sentence.
*
Thats why I said reconsider..

FD rate is not as good if compare with your principal reduction..
Joink
post Sep 25 2009, 10:16 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Sep 25 2009, 09:04 PM)
Hi Joink,
Can I share this ebook with my blog readers? I want to provide a download link in my blog for this ebook because it is very useful.

Can I share it?

Please let me know asap.
*
Sure but it is not mine.

Just give the cedit to Milan. biggrin.gif
BearKing2000
post Oct 21 2009, 01:39 AM

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Hi all,

First of all, I would like to thank everyone who has made this a very resourceful site for property investment. I'm starting to look into Auction Property, but have many questions in my mind, which i hope to get some guidance here. Gam xia Gam xia.....

1.) If we are the successful bidder for an auction property, we will get a Memorandum of Sale immediately. Correct? And this MOS is equal to the S&P for a normal property transaction. Then do i still need to spend money on solicitors on the purchase documents? rclxub.gif rclxub.gif

2.) Where can we check the outstanding balance for water & electricity bill?

3.) From what i understand, below will be all the cost of acquisition of an auction property, please correct me if i'm wrong:
- Downpayment (Base on Margin of finance provided by bank)
- Legal Fee & Stamp Duty ( Not too sure about this, this is asked in Question No. 1)
- Loan Agreement Fee (My banker will absorb this)
- Repair Work (Depends on the condition of the unit)

4.) Is there any possibility to get more than 90% loan for an auction property? Because i understand that for a sub-sale property, we are able to get more than 90% loan if we r buying the unit below the bank's valued price by marking up the S&P. Can we do this with auction property???

Thank you very much!! notworthy.gif notworthy.gif notworthy.gif


Pai
post Oct 21 2009, 10:18 AM

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QUOTE(BearKing2000 @ Oct 21 2009, 01:39 AM)
Hi all,

First of all, I would like to thank everyone who has made this a very resourceful site for property investment. I'm starting to look into Auction Property, but have many questions in my mind, which i hope to get some guidance here. Gam xia Gam xia.....

1.) If we are the successful bidder for an auction property, we will get a Memorandum of Sale immediately. Correct? And this MOS is equal to the S&P for a normal property transaction. Then do i still need to spend money on solicitors on the purchase documents? rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif

2.) Where can we check the outstanding balance for water & electricity bill?

3.) From what i understand, below will be all the cost of acquisition of an auction property, please correct me if i'm wrong:
          - Downpayment (Base on Margin of finance provided by bank)
          - Legal Fee & Stamp Duty ( Not too sure about this, this is asked in Question No. 1)
          - Loan Agreement Fee (My banker will absorb this)
          - Repair Work (Depends on the condition of the unit)

4.) Is there any possibility to get more than 90% loan for an auction property? Because i understand that for a sub-sale property, we are able to get more than 90% loan if we r buying the unit below the bank's valued price by marking up the S&P. Can we do this with auction property???

*
1. From what I understand, u dont need to assign a solicitor to execute a new snp. But pls check around coz Im not extremely sure about this one.

2. TNB and management office.

3. maybe just stamp duty.

4. No chance at the moment of application.
BearKing2000
post Oct 21 2009, 07:28 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Oct 21 2009, 10:18 AM)
1. From what I understand, u dont need to assign a solicitor to execute a new snp. But pls check around coz Im not extremely sure about this one.

2. TNB and management office.

3. maybe just stamp duty.

4. No chance at the moment of application.
*
Pai Kor,

I have asked 2 agents doing auction property...they say i need to pay money to lawyer, but they can't tell me the difference about SNP and Memorandum of Sale (Auction Unit)...so i don't really trust in what they say...mayb they just want to take the money and put into their pocket...

I'm very new to this property investment market...so i do not have any solicitors who i can consult for free...can anyone recommend me some good solicitors who is willing to spend time with me to explain to me the whole procedure of auction property?? I'm in Johor Bahru...thanks in advance

Recently i have met some housing agents...all of them seem very cunning, and only have money in their mind...so whatever they say, i will just give a 50% discount...this is a dog eat dog world..... sad.gif , so for small dog like me will most likely be eaten by those big bad wolf...so i intend to learn more from all investors, rather than listening to housing agents...

Thanks a million!!! notworthy.gif notworthy.gif

This post has been edited by BearKing2000: Oct 21 2009, 07:32 PM
Pai
post Oct 21 2009, 07:42 PM

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QUOTE(BearKing2000 @ Oct 21 2009, 07:28 PM)
Pai Kor,

I have asked 2 agents doing auction property...they say i need to pay money to lawyer, but they can't tell me the difference about SNP and Memorandum of Sale (Auction Unit)...so i don't really trust in what they say...mayb they just want to take the money and put into their pocket...

I'm very new to this property investment market...so i do not have any solicitors who i can consult for free...can anyone recommend me some good solicitors who is willing to spend time with me to explain to me the whole procedure of auction property?? I'm in Johor Bahru...thanks in advance

Recently i have met some housing agents...all of them seem very cunning, and only have money in their mind...so whatever they say, i will just give a 50% discount...this is a dog eat dog world..... sad.gif  , so for small dog like me will most likely be eaten by those big bad wolf...so i intend to learn more from all investors, rather than listening to housing agents...

Thanks a million!!! notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif
*
PAGING JASONHAN!!!!!

wink.gif


p/s : He is based on JB n he bought auction props before, so he can best advise you, mate.
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 22 2009, 10:13 AM

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Saw your PM, I won't know a lot of answers but I'll try my best to answer you.

Most agents only want your money to bid on your behalf, eventhough they are paid by the bank to register their client whom won the bid.
Nothing right or wrong, it's just their way of doing business.

Now before we start off, here is a few serious question that I will ask you before I go deeper. If I am not satisfy, you will need to get it improve.
Treat it as a challenge. Every question has a reason behind it.

1. Why you want to invest in properties?
If your reason is strong, you will find ways to solve your problem. There will be more problem coming up after you acquire the unit. biggrin.gif
Having talk to 2 agents had show that you have the innitiative, good.

2. How you manage your finance? How much you put away every month, in dollar and percentage?
This is important, if you mismanage your money. Buying a property will make you lose even more.

3. What have you learn about investings, which books have you read?

Here is a hint how to get started:
Normally banks would put up units being auction through an auction house. Sometimes you can visit these auction website, banks website or even one of the bank's branch.

Now, more than 50% of the properties being auction are bad. You must do your homework and find a good area.
A good agents is not easy to find, I have found her (2nd agent) and she is my dream gal. wub.gif

There are 6 simples steps to become a succesful real estate investor, that is:

1. Choose to be an investor
2. Select an area
3. Finding an agent
4. Select a property
5. Put the deal together
6. Management
BearKing2000
post Oct 22 2009, 10:39 AM

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Hi JasonHan,

Thanks for the reply...and here is my answer to your questions...

1.) Why you want to invest in properties?
I have a full time day job, and i trade forex during my free time. I do make money from the forex market, but i feel uneasy when i remember that if i stop trading one day, i will lose the income as well...but with property investment, i'm able to create a stream of income which doesn't require my physical appearance, and the leverage is high...if the bank is willing to take up the 90% risk of us buying a house...that means property investment is quite safe IF we know what we are doing

2.) How you manage your finance? How much you put away every month, in dollar and percentage?
As i'm still single at the moment, i do not have much commitment on my shoulder, i'm able to park aside 70% of my monthly income

3.) What have you learn about investings, which books have you read?
As i mentioned in Q1, i'm currently investing/trading in forex market, and i know the market quite well, i have read plenty of books regarding this topic...and i started looking into the property market after reading Robert Kiyosaki's book, i'm still in the midst of understanding the whole process of property investment, it is a total different game comparing to forex...so i'm here as a noob to learn from the most basic concept

Actually i have done some homework, like viewing some units for sale, rent...talked to a few agents...attend some auction session to get the feel...visited some banks like pbb, scb, UOB, ocbc...i'm understand quite clearly on the sub-sale procedure, but i still need lots of guidance on the after auction procedure...

Hope to get more guidance from you...mind to meet up at a nearby mamak stall for a cup of tea?? haha....

Thanks again!!
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 22 2009, 11:07 AM

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Hehe.
Quite impressive with you answer.

I keep looking at deals every week. So I know in JB some areas will be coming up.
Basically the area I invest are in good neighborhood and the rental able to cover expenses with profit. I just intro to a friend yesterday, a deal can get him approx 14% return of his money via rental, Cash on Cash Return (COCR). Also the reserve price is below 25% below market.

Or later we could spend another RM5k to install AC and water heater to jack up the rent, that will increase the COCR to near 30%.

This Sunday I am free, so PM me. biggrin.gif
BearKing2000
post Oct 22 2009, 11:22 AM

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14% return??!! that is a real good deal!
Is this a sub-sale unit or an auction unit??

I have already PM you...i am free anytime after office hours and weekend...call me when u feel like guiding a newbie like me...haha...

Thanks!!
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 22 2009, 01:48 PM

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QUOTE(BearKing2000 @ Oct 22 2009, 11:22 AM)
14% return??!! that is a real good deal!
Is this a sub-sale unit or an auction unit??

I have already PM you...i am free anytime after office hours and weekend...call me when u feel like guiding a newbie like me...haha...

Thanks!!
*
Ah well.
My friend just called and he don't want this 14% deal at Permas. doh.gif
Had to look for him another one at Tampoi.

Edit:
It's an auction unit.
The problem with auction is when the maintenance owe by the owner could go up to RM10k.
Normally investor have to pay up first then claim back from the bank later.
If cash strap, auction is not the best deal here.

I estimate needing approximate RM30k to invest in auction, otherwise re-sale would be fine for people whom have below RM10k cash.
Normally my agent will check all these and let me know upfront. It's faster this way.

I could do those checks but it will waste a lot of my time, not to mention finding the deals.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Oct 22 2009, 01:54 PM
Eng_Tat
post Oct 22 2009, 06:36 PM

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have question for sifus, if i want to buy auction apartment let say reserve price at 60k, what is the minimum money i shud have in hand? also must i engage my own lawyer for s&p and loan..etc? or we dont need lawyer to execute the sale? let say the previous owner still owe maintainence fee, who will pay most of the time? the bank or me? also what about outstanding electric bill, who will pay as well? sorry for my ignorance. thanks
BearKing2000
post Oct 22 2009, 06:53 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Oct 22 2009, 10:13 AM)
Now, more than 50% of the properties being auction are bad. You must do your homework and find a good area.
A good agents is not easy to find, I have found her (2nd agent) and she is my dream gal. wub.gif


*
Wah...dream gal ah....i have yet to meet 1 leh...can intorduce ah?? haha... drool.gif

How to get agent to check all those outstanding bills for you on an auction property? I met a few agents and they ask me to check myself..... vmad.gif


Added on October 22, 2009, 7:15 pm
QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Oct 22 2009, 01:48 PM)
Ah well.
My friend just called and he don't want this 14% deal at Permas. doh.gif
Had to look for him another one at Tampoi.

Edit:
It's an auction unit.
The problem with auction is when the maintenance owe by the owner could go up to RM10k.
Normally investor have to pay up first then claim back from the bank later.
If cash strap, auction is not the best deal here.

I estimate needing approximate RM30k to invest in auction, otherwise re-sale would be fine for people whom have below RM10k cash.
Normally my agent will check all these and let me know upfront. It's faster this way.

I could do those checks but it will waste a lot of my time, not to mention finding the deals.
*
Those agents that i met ask me to check for the outstanding bills by myself leh...they say they only get a very little comission from the bank, and not willing to spend too much time on 1 unit...

This post has been edited by BearKing2000: Oct 22 2009, 07:15 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 22 2009, 10:02 PM

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To check these basics, you pay them another RM1k to RM2k extra.
If you want them to negotiate with the current tenant to move, another RM1k. These are the charges upon successfully bidding the property.

If fail to get the unit, at most you pay them for their transport and search fees.

If a court order is needed, another few more k. Hopefully you don't go into that.


Added on October 22, 2009, 10:08 pm
QUOTE(Eng_Tat @ Oct 22 2009, 06:36 PM)
have question for sifus, if i want to buy auction apartment let say reserve price at 60k, what is the minimum money i shud have in hand? also must i engage my own lawyer for s&p and loan..etc? or we dont need lawyer to execute the sale? let say the previous owner still owe maintainence fee, who will pay most of the time? the bank or me? also what about outstanding electric bill, who will pay as well? sorry for my ignorance. thanks
*
For RM60k reserve price, check you need to put how many % down.
If 10% DP, buy a RM6k bank draft.
If your budget is RM80k, get ready RM2k cash and a few hundred for stamp fee.
Just go to your bank where you create your savings account and buy a bank draft with your savings.
It costs RM5 to buy. To cancel it also costs RM5.

Most of the time maintenance will be borne by the bank but you have to pay upfront first.
Some banks will play dirty and don't want to pay. sweat.gif

Electric bill borne by the new owner except if it's a court auction.

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Oct 22 2009, 10:08 PM
Eng_Tat
post Oct 23 2009, 11:13 AM

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thanks jasonhan, do i still need to engage any lawyer? also since its below 100k, loan will be nzec do i still need a lawyer for it or the bank will kaotim seems its the bank auction (my previous loan was done by my lawyer who represent me for subsale)? also i saw liek u are seems to be based in jb. what do you think about bandar seri alam?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 23 2009, 01:48 PM

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QUOTE(Eng_Tat @ Oct 23 2009, 11:13 AM)
thanks jasonhan, do i still need to engage any lawyer? also since its below 100k, loan will be nzec do i still need a lawyer for it or the bank will kaotim seems its the bank auction (my previous loan was done by my lawyer who represent me for subsale)? also i saw liek u are seems to be based in jb. what do you think about bandar seri alam?
*
Yes you need lawyer for both your SAP and loan document.
You can use the bank's panel of lawyer.
One of my NZEC loan, I uses HXBC lawyer and settle the SAP at the same time.

Having the same lawyer handling the loan and SAP would speed up a bit.
Do beware not all lawyers are the same.

Where is bandar seri alam?
Eng_Tat
post Oct 23 2009, 02:03 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Oct 23 2009, 01:48 PM)
Yes you need lawyer for both your SAP and loan document.
You can use the bank's panel of lawyer.
One of my NZEC loan, I uses HXBC lawyer and settle the SAP at the same time.

Having the same lawyer handling the loan and SAP would speed up a bit.
Do beware not all lawyers are the same.

Where is bandar seri alam?
*
masai area. 5-10min from plentong, half way to pasir gudang lor.


Added on October 23, 2009, 2:08 pmalso previously i use jal n lim lawyer, office in cs.

This post has been edited by Eng_Tat: Oct 23 2009, 02:08 PM
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 23 2009, 02:08 PM

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I am not sure, have you scout that area?

Plentong there is Prima Regency, another auction coming for a 1024sqft unit.


Jal and Lim.
That is a firm that I use too. biggrin.gif

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Oct 23 2009, 02:09 PM
Eng_Tat
post Oct 23 2009, 02:13 PM

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is that unit 3r2b unit? btw how much is the reserve price?
also how is hxbc service? i think jal and lim service not bad la. lawyer name is karen, nice lady..
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 23 2009, 02:31 PM

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QUOTE(Eng_Tat @ Oct 23 2009, 02:13 PM)
is that unit 3r2b unit? btw how much is the reserve price?
also how is hxbc service? i think jal and lim service not bad la. lawyer name is karen, nice lady..
*
At today's market, most bank's service are good.
I got to know this banker via my agent.
If they are good, words spread around.
HXBC got a higher property valuation which some banks do not.
I use UXB twice until they say I loan too much from them and start reducing the loan amount to 70%.

Some properties like town house, SXB doesn't want to give loan.

My lawyer is Thian, one thing I like them is they open on Saturday.

The reserve price starting is RM13xk, the last time there is another auction exceeds RM160k.
I don't have the details yet.
BearKing2000
post Oct 23 2009, 02:36 PM

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Mind to share the HxBC banker's contact?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 23 2009, 02:44 PM

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QUOTE(BearKing2000 @ Oct 23 2009, 02:36 PM)
Mind to share the HxBC banker's contact?
*
Hehe.
I'll let you copy the name card when we meet tomorrow. biggrin.gif
mohawkvidtz
post Oct 25 2009, 12:20 PM

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Sorry to interrupt this wonderful discussion..

I really wanted to invest in real estate however my greatest fear is the tenant

What protection do I have if a tenant damage my property or if the tenant didn't pay the rent?

With all of the respect sifu please help me
eugene jk
post Oct 25 2009, 12:46 PM

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QUOTE(mohawkvidtz @ Oct 25 2009, 12:20 PM)
Sorry to interrupt this wonderful discussion..

I really wanted to invest in real estate however my greatest fear is the tenant

What protection do I have if a tenant damage my property or if the tenant didn't pay the rent?

With all of the respect sifu please help me
*
Tenancy agreement

Pai
post Oct 25 2009, 03:13 PM

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QUOTE(mohawkvidtz @ Oct 25 2009, 12:20 PM)
Sorry to interrupt this wonderful discussion..

I really wanted to invest in real estate however my greatest fear is the tenant

What protection do I have if a tenant damage my property or if the tenant didn't pay the rent?

With all of the respect sifu please help me
*
security n utlities deposit smile.gif
mohawkvidtz
post Oct 25 2009, 08:26 PM

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So sorry but I'm really new to the real estate world..

how could I make the Tenancy agreement and security n utlities deposit?

Do i need an attorney or something?

SUSjasonhanjk
post Oct 29 2009, 01:27 PM

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Cash on Cash Return vs. Internal Rate of Return
by James Miller

Cash on Cash
Cash in Cash return, or Return on Investment (ROI) is the easiest Rate of return to calculate. It is also the one I use the most often as it tells me what the money is generating with regard to actual cash I can put in my pocket today.

To calculate it you take the amount you are getting from an investment, typically on an annual basis, and divide it by the amount you have invested. Multiply this number By 100 and you have a percentage representing Cash on Cash Return.

For example if I have $10,000 in a property that is netting $100 per month, I am getting $1200 per year on my $10,000.

I divide the $1200 by $10,000 to get .12 I multiply this number by 100 to get my percentage of 12%

As you can see, cash on cash is a pretty simple and straightforward calculation. But what if we want to take into account the amount we are paying down on the loan each month, or he appreciation of the property?


Internal Rate of Return
Internal rate of return (Sometimes called Annual percentage yield) is the total true return on an investment taking into account depreciation, appreciation, and equity gained from paying down the debt.

It is much harder to calculate, as items such as depreciation depend on your taxable income. You also have to make some assumptions with regard to appreciation until a property is actually sold and that number is known.

This calculation is typically done over a holding period of 3 to 7 years. The period is usually fairly short since IRR typically decreases as time goes on.

If we take the example above assuming the following:

1) Home is worth $100,000.
2) I can depreciate 3% of its value the first year,
3) I am in a 35% tax bracket.
4) That property values have appreciates at 6% that year
5) I am paying down $100 per month toward the principal on my mortgage payment.

We get the following:

$1200 Cash on Cash return from above
$1050 Depreciation ($3000 Depreciation X 35% tax bracket)
$6000 Appreciation ($100,000 X 7%)
$1200 Principal Pay Down ($100 X 12 Months)
_______
$9,450 Total Internal Return

As a percentage:

$9450 first year IR divided by $10,000 initial investment = 94.5% IRR the first year.
Keep in mind that this is not spendable cash. Appreciation was our biggest number and it won’t be realized until we sell the home.

I have found that if I am doing well with regard to cash on cash return, my IRR Is going to be a better number. This assumes that there are no deferred maintenance issues and that I am not going to sell the property at a loss.


http://realestategozone.wordpress.com/2009...rate-of-return/


Added on October 29, 2009, 1:32 pmHow to use Real Estate to get an infinite return on your money.
by James Miller


I am going to start off by pulling back the curtain on the great OZ of “infinite return”.

An infinite return on your money can happen when you have nothing in an investment. While “infinite return” sounds like a large amount of money- after all infinity is a really big thing- the way the math works out, it doesn’t have to be large at all.

For example, if you get a dollar back from an investment that you have no money in, you have received an infinite Return on Investment or ROI.

In fact I really think it should be called a “division by zero” rate of return on your money, as that is what the calculator tells me if I try to calculate it.

We have gotten an infinite return a few times with Real Estate.

Here is an example of one method we used on a property we bought a couple years ago.

We bought a fixer upper house for $50,000. We got the sellers to give us a second mortgage for $10,000 which the bank treated as a down payment. We left the closing with a net of $800 being deposited into our account.

As sexy as that was, it still didn’t give us our “infinite return”.

The house needed to be repaired before anyone could live in it. We spent about $5000 on fixes like new windows, carpeting, and replacing the radiator hose that they had used on the bathtub drain instead of the proper fix – a $2 PVC elbow.

Once fixed up, we sold the three bedroom one bath house on a Lease Option, or “rent to own” contract, we let the buyer in light, allowing them to put down only $3000.

We held the property a year this way, netting about a $100 per month cash flow. After one year, the fist mortgage was “seasoned”, and the value of the property had increased due to the repairs we made. Because of these two factors, we were able to refinance everything we owed into a new first, paying off the original first and second, the repair bills and were able to take out an additional $3,000 to put in our pocket.

While our cash on cash ROI for the first year was only around 60%, $1200 annually on the $2000 we had left in the property, the cash on cash return became infinite once we pulled out the remaining money we had invested in it.

I should take a moment to let you know how that deal worked out:

The tenant buyer we put in the house did not exercise their option to purchase in the allotted two year time frame. This worked out ok for us as he forfeited the $3000 he put own, and became a tenant only. We raised the rent from $600 to a market rate of $650.00 per month.

We would have every right to kick him out, as our intention was to sell and he had two years to get financed, but we don’t like to do that if we don’t have to.

If they so desire, we try to let the person living in a lease option home stay on as a tenant, if they miss the exercise date.

It also very hard to kick a young couple out who have paid diligently over the past two years, and it really doesn’t hurt us to let them stay.

If they ever want to buy the house from us we would honor that as well, but at a new higher market rate and not at the price we would have let have it for a few years ago.

Here are the steps to receiving an infinite return for the example I just described:

1) Locate a fixer upper type property. Make sure that 70% of after repaired value of the property is enough to pay off everything you will invest in it.

Example: Property acquisition cost is $50,000. Repairs and holding costs total $20,000. After repaired vale of the property should be at least $100,000.

Try to get a seller second on the place for a minimum of one year, negotiate for no interest, and no payments if possible.

Make sure the property will net positive cash flow by at least 15% of the monthly income. Monthly income will typically need to be at least 1% of loan against the property in order to just squeak by cash flow wise.

2) Repair the property, put a tenant, or tenant buyer in place.

3) After holding the property for one year refinance the property paying off everything that you have invested in it and possibly taking cash out. Be careful not to take too much out as the more you take out, the more you will cut into the monthly cash flow.

You should have a positive cash flow with now money invested, giving you an infinite return.

As a final thought you should note that you can also have negative “infinite returns” if you lose money each month on an investment.

Leverage works both ways.


http://realestategozone.wordpress.com/2009...-on-your-money/

This post has been edited by jasonhanjk: Oct 29 2009, 01:33 PM
EddyHyip
post Dec 1 2009, 03:37 PM

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hello guys,

I need your views on penang property... how is the characteristic like and in which way do you think it's prospectful?

A brief intro by me:-

Just started working and started saving. Investing won't come soon to me as I need to equip myself with basic knowledge, some case study from experienced investors and money!

Work based in Sarawak and was in Penang (hometown) previously...

My view is... certain penang property value can rise quite fast and significant but it takes time (5-10 years) and the rental rate is often not sufficient to generate positive cash flow. I see only 3-4% annual return.

Sarawak property? Overpriced..

My horizon is not wide enough. So I accept view and challenges to my statement as well.

Regards..
SUSlokideangelus
post Dec 1 2009, 04:46 PM

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hi bro,

Need your expert advice here.

I'm currently looking to purchase a home for myself and my GF. We intend to stay at the unit and hopefully when have sufficient cash next time sell of the place and buy a better home in the near future.

The thing is that i've zero knowledge on property.Hence need your advice. At the moment i'm working in cyberjaya and would be transferred to KL Central next year.We are looking for a place that has public transport and convenient. Preferably near by Cheras area.

My budget is RM 220K. I'm interested in areas which are freehold and has at least 3 rooms and 2 bath. The area must not be to congested and has a good resale value "investment".

As for my part i've scouted several developments such as:

1) 1 Petaling
2) Connought Avenue
3) Cheras Intan
4) Desa Sri Puteri
5) Taragon Puteri

which of these developments would you suggest to look into and are there any other developments that i should look into?

really appreciate your help. thanks a million.
EddyHyip
post Dec 1 2009, 05:53 PM

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i think leasehold might be applicable to you too since you wish to shift to bigger home when you prosper...

a leasehold has 99 years tenure and lets say you will sell the house off after 20 years, the tenure is still 79 years and still seem attractive.

it also depends where you're buying and any future development in the area

_____
am no expert in this but my pov... open...

This post has been edited by EddyHyip: Dec 1 2009, 05:54 PM
wahlauyeh
post Apr 12 2010, 12:06 PM

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been sometime nobody posted here...
calling bro jasonhanjk, pertaining to the auction unit, when i successfully bid is under my name, but when i go for loan might be combining other party name...is it possible?

SUSjasonhanjk
post Apr 12 2010, 02:49 PM

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As long as your name is partly within the loan document.
Check your banker for more details.
wahlauyeh
post Apr 12 2010, 03:27 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Apr 12 2010, 02:49 PM)
As long as your name is partly within the loan document.
Check your banker for more details.
*
thanks. On top of that, we will loose our deposit in Auction if we fail to get any lona in the stated 60-90 days?
SUSjasonhanjk
post Apr 12 2010, 05:03 PM

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QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Apr 12 2010, 03:27 PM)
thanks. On top of that, we will loose our deposit in Auction if we fail to get any lona in the stated 60-90 days?
*
Yes and if you scare too late.
Still can apply another 30 day grace period.
wahlauyeh
post Apr 12 2010, 05:21 PM

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QUOTE(jasonhanjk @ Apr 12 2010, 05:03 PM)
Yes and if you scare too late.
Still can apply another 30 day grace period.
*
thanks jason. notworthy.gif

Have anyone purchase thru auction and claim back the money from KWSP account?
is it possible we redeem back our deposit from our KWSP on auction unit?


Added on April 14, 2010, 12:11 pm
QUOTE(wahlauyeh @ Apr 12 2010, 05:21 PM)
thanks jason. notworthy.gif

Have anyone purchase thru auction and claim back the money from KWSP account?
is it possible we redeem back our deposit from our KWSP on auction unit?
*
Inaddition of above question, I had found out that the owner of the unit have outstanding RM3k++ on management fees, are we (new Owner) need to pay off?
or it will be settle by the bank?

anyone can clarify...thanxx

This post has been edited by wahlauyeh: Apr 14 2010, 12:11 PM
LameCouple
post Jul 24 2010, 08:53 PM

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Hi all Si Fu out there, sorry if this question some stupid. tongue.gif
I want to buy my first investment property, but when i read around ppl talking bout ROI. Can i know how to calculate ROI?

Many thanks in advance notworthy.gif
jam_lennon
post Jul 26 2010, 10:18 PM

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how to show bank i'm the rental recipient? mean i'm the landlord to my properties? currently i rent to a company. they did provide me rental received acknowledgement, need 2 provide for how many months?
cutealex
post Jul 26 2010, 11:33 PM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 26 2010, 10:18 PM)
how to show bank i'm the rental recipient? mean i'm the landlord to my properties? currently i rent to a company. they did provide me rental received acknowledgement, need 2 provide for how many months?
*
go and obtained stamped duty on your copy of tenancy as a proof of rental.
jam_lennon
post Jul 28 2010, 11:38 PM

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ok la, to many sifu here... i'm reading regarding investment in properties, i got read the book recommend by alot of ppl here, azizi ali "how to bcome millionaire lardlord" (or similar name)

1 big question puzzle me, let say rental bringing positive cashflow (minus loan repayment, repair cost, maintenance fees and every misc fees/cost) is just rm200-300. thou it is +ve cash flow but however is still not good enough to cover my monthly expenses. even like sifu Pai he menage to rent his properties to a international student @ 2.2k but i guess it just bringing cash flow like +800, i believe that one is rare case. i wodner even i rent out 10 properties, i still only getting like 5~6k max mai 8k rental per month. i still think it is pretty risky when fail to get tenant and 9/10 properties is under mortage...
Backkom
post Jul 29 2010, 07:32 AM

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QUOTE(lokideangelus @ Dec 1 2009, 04:46 PM)

We are looking for a place that has public transport and convenient. Preferably near by Cheras area.

My budget is RM 220K. I'm interested in areas which are freehold and has at least 3 rooms and 2 bath. The area must not be to congested and has a good resale value "investment".

*
First of all, I'm not sure whether you could still find things at the RM 220k range with "public transport, freehold, 3BR, not congested and good resale value".
You might wanna look for auction units, the 2nd best chance for "good resale value" (or good capital gain to be exact) - apart from buying new launches.

If you're buying for investment, you can look up for feedback in forums.
But now you're buying for own stay, suggest that you do more site surveys and reading, try to shortlist down to 1-2 options, then get forummers to give comments (in terms of maintenance, rental etc).
lamode
post Jul 29 2010, 11:04 AM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 28 2010, 11:38 PM)
ok la, to many sifu here... i'm reading regarding investment in properties, i got read the book recommend by alot of ppl here, azizi ali "how to bcome millionaire lardlord" (or similar name)

1 big question puzzle me, let say rental bringing positive cashflow (minus loan repayment, repair cost, maintenance fees and every misc fees/cost) is just rm200-300. thou it is +ve cash flow but however is still not good enough to cover my monthly expenses. even like sifu Pai he menage to rent his properties to a international student @ 2.2k but i guess it just bringing cash flow like +800, i believe that one is rare case. i wodner even i rent out 10 properties, i still only getting like 5~6k max mai 8k rental per month. i still think it is pretty risky when fail to get tenant and 9/10 properties is under mortage...
*
that is why there is a saying that leverage is two edge blade.

location is very important here, you dun wan to have many properties that is on hard to find tenant location.
Backkom
post Jul 29 2010, 01:29 PM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 28 2010, 11:38 PM)
ok la, to many sifu here... i'm reading regarding investment in properties, i got read the book recommend by alot of ppl here, azizi ali "how to bcome millionaire lardlord" (or similar name)

1 big question puzzle me, let say rental bringing positive cashflow (minus loan repayment, repair cost, maintenance fees and every misc fees/cost) is just rm200-300. thou it is +ve cash flow but however is still not good enough to cover my monthly expenses. even like sifu Pai he menage to rent his properties to a international student @ 2.2k but i guess it just bringing cash flow like +800, i believe that one is rare case. i wodner even i rent out 10 properties, i still only getting like 5~6k max mai 8k rental per month. i still think it is pretty risky when fail to get tenant and 9/10 properties is under mortage...
*
1. Fail to get tenant - if you buy the right property (not some abandoned condo block), I do not believe in "fail to get tenant". It's always the matter of how much rental you're demanding. My personal view - I'm willing to go low as long as I can rent out. Worse case you'll have to bear half the monthly cost (instalment, maintenance fee etc), and it won't be for long.
2. Rental is not the only source of profit. The fact that somebody is helping you to pay instalment is already a type of profit. Plus capital appreciation.
3. Nobody would tell you that property investment is risk-free. There are people who think that properties are high risk and share market is lower risk. But personally I believe the otherwise. So it's your risk appetite that counts. I lost money in stock market because I'm not passionate about it (therefore don't do enough homework, and don't really bother to monitor). But i'm doing fairly OK in property investments - because I put in effort to do homework.
jam_lennon
post Jul 29 2010, 06:45 PM

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but izzit getting like +200, +300 +ve cash flow is consider average?? i believe some might can get >500 +ve cash flow per rental, but it is rare, right?

agree with above post, as long as my location is good, i not worry about getting tenant, just worry about getting the right/decent tenant
Pai
post Jul 29 2010, 07:39 PM

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QUOTE(Backkom @ Jul 29 2010, 01:29 PM)
But i'm doing fairly OK in property investments - because I put in effort to do homework.
*
OK is an understatement, spectacular is more appropriate. wink.gif


Added on July 29, 2010, 7:52 pm
QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 29 2010, 06:45 PM)
but izzit getting like +200, +300 +ve cash flow is consider average?? i believe some might can get >500 +ve cash flow per rental, but it is rare, right?

agree with above post, as long as my location is good, i not worry about getting tenant, just worry about getting the right/decent tenant
*
Jam, what your big picture? Why invest in properties? smile.gif

This post has been edited by Pai: Jul 29 2010, 07:52 PM
ecVk
post Jul 29 2010, 11:22 PM

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Im a student and i want to start investing somewhere near PJ area. My budget is around 10k. Should i invest in lands? Where should i start ? Should i wait till im working?
Backkom
post Jul 30 2010, 08:14 AM

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QUOTE(ecVk @ Jul 29 2010, 11:22 PM)
Im a student and i want to start investing somewhere near PJ area. My budget is around 10k. Should i invest in lands? Where should i start ? Should i wait till im working?
*
1. You can't get a loan without income unless your dad becomes your guarantor.
2. You need at least 15% of the house price (subsale/auction) as capital investment. So with 10k capital you're looking at properties around the range of RM 65k.
3. Or go look for low/zero down payment new launch projects - but again back to loan issue.

Maybe you should just start by investing on books and seminars...


Added on July 30, 2010, 8:18 am
QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 29 2010, 06:45 PM)
but izzit getting like +200, +300 +ve cash flow is consider average?? i believe some might can get >500 +ve cash flow per rental, but it is rare, right?

agree with above post, as long as my location is good, i not worry about getting tenant, just worry about getting the right/decent tenant
*
I think you need to readjust your "benchmark criteria" from "amount" to "percentage".
If you buy RM 2 mill property, +ve cashflow only RM 200 - super bad deal.
If you buy RM 110k property, +ve cashflow RM 200 - that's a fairly good deal.

Go pick up some books, punch some calculators...
Property investment is a combination of rental yield and capital gain, and there are so many variables (interest rate is one that you can't control).

This post has been edited by Backkom: Jul 30 2010, 08:18 AM
jam_lennon
post Jul 30 2010, 09:50 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 29 2010, 07:39 PM)
OK is an understatement, spectacular is more appropriate.  wink.gif


Added on July 29, 2010, 7:52 pm
Jam, what your big picture? Why invest in properties?  smile.gif
*
i wanna build my passive income > my expenses, in 10y
Pai
post Jul 30 2010, 11:00 AM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 30 2010, 09:50 AM)
i wanna build my passive income > my expenses, in 10y
*
So whats the magic number? wink.gif
jam_lennon
post Jul 30 2010, 01:47 PM

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at the time being, it is around 1k ~ 1.5k
edyek
post Jul 30 2010, 02:29 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 30 2010, 11:00 AM)
So whats the magic number?  wink.gif
*
Pai, hows your passive income status? Good?

QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Jul 30 2010, 01:47 PM)
at the time being, it is around 1k ~ 1.5k
*
Good luck to you! smile.gif
jam_lennon
post Jul 30 2010, 04:10 PM

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oh, that's my expenses la, passive = 500 sajer
i still dun have my own stay properties (currently staying with parent)
Pai
post Jul 30 2010, 04:43 PM

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Ed, havent reach my 5 figure monthly property passive income target yet........ hopefully within 2012 lah smile.gif

Jam, so u r targetting 1.5k monthly passive income only per month?
jam_lennon
post Jul 30 2010, 05:41 PM

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current objective is passive > expenses
alot of short term goals = long term goal
Pai
post Jul 30 2010, 10:07 PM

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so Jam, besides properties, any other way you know that couldd give you passive income of rm1.5k per month? wink.gif
edyek
post Jul 31 2010, 08:48 AM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 30 2010, 10:07 PM)
so Jam, besides properties, any other way you know that couldd give you passive income of rm1.5k per month? wink.gif
*
Frankly speaking, other than properties I do not have other passive income (exclude FD). doh.gif
I've not yet really invest in paper asset. Currently holding a little share in stock (for the sake of my friend who ask me to invest with him). sweat.gif
vvn0vvn
post Aug 2 2010, 01:54 PM

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Hi all Sifu,

Mind to share with newbies like me what is your investment strategies? from your point of view, will you go for diversity of your passive income?
jam_lennon
post Aug 2 2010, 04:36 PM

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QUOTE(Pai @ Jul 30 2010, 10:07 PM)
so Jam, besides properties, any other way you know that couldd give you passive income of rm1.5k per month? wink.gif
*
i tried forex only, very risky
so i scare of share/blue chip
and was thinking about buying bonds
edyek
post Aug 2 2010, 04:59 PM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Aug 2 2010, 04:36 PM)
i tried forex only, very risky
so i scare of share/blue chip
and was thinking about buying bonds
*
I'm not into paper asset, but you've tried forex and yet you are scare of blue chip shares? Ain't blue chip shares more stable than forex?


jam_lennon
post Aug 2 2010, 09:41 PM

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blue ship should be ok, but it takes very very long years baru see the fruits.... thou properties took like 5-10y at least too but still i can stay in properties but i can't do anything to the bluechip

currently targeting those 150k apartment so if anything goes wrong it wont harm my wallet
Backkom
post Aug 3 2010, 06:39 AM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Aug 2 2010, 09:41 PM)

currently targeting those 150k apartment so if anything goes wrong it wont harm my wallet
*
Not many choices within this range in Klang Valley...Mentari court or Miharja Apartments?
jam_lennon
post Aug 3 2010, 09:24 PM

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Backkom,notworthy.gif notworthy.gif .
u r very good, care to give me more tip why there are good or not worthy? 1 thing puzzled me which is, y ppl wanna sell their chicken which lay golden egg?

bkfeng89
post Aug 3 2010, 09:33 PM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Aug 3 2010, 09:24 PM)
Backkom,notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif .
u r very good, care to give me more tip why there are good or not worthy? 1 thing puzzled me which is, y ppl wanna sell their chicken which lay golden egg?
*
Because they want to get back their capital to buy kambing or cow which give better return? biggrin.gif
Backkom
post Aug 3 2010, 10:45 PM

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QUOTE(bkfeng89 @ Aug 3 2010, 09:33 PM)
Because they want to get back their capital to buy kambing or cow which give better return? biggrin.gif
*
Haha... very good point!
Or people sell for various reasons - bigger house for own stay, wedding, children... or some bad reasons such as break up, divorce...
vdfoo
post Aug 3 2010, 10:57 PM

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QUOTE(jam_lennon @ Aug 3 2010, 09:24 PM)
Backkom,notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif .
u r very good, care to give me more tip why there are good or not worthy? 1 thing puzzled me which is, y ppl wanna sell their chicken which lay golden egg?
*
maybe when they bought, they only bought a little egg. then egg become little chick, and chick become big chicken. owner has eaten enough eggs, so when festival comes, time to slaughter the big fat chicken for big meal icon_idea.gif
bkfeng89
post Aug 3 2010, 10:59 PM

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QUOTE(vdfoo @ Aug 3 2010, 10:57 PM)
maybe when they bought, they only bought a little egg. then egg become little chick, and chick become big chicken. owner has eaten enough eggs, so when festival comes, time to slaughter the big fat chicken for big meal  icon_idea.gif
*
This thread is turning kopitiam-ish, but i like!
Haha everyone's investment goals is different after all, it all depends on the individual's risk appetite, philosophy, expected returns, etc.
Waachaaa
post Sep 13 2010, 11:47 PM

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Dear All,

Any condo recommended at Kepong/Jln Ipoh, Jln Kuching
FOr rental 1st, and slowly convert to own stay after 5 years.

Budget RM300K
Backkom
post Sep 14 2010, 06:16 AM

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QUOTE(Waachaaa @ Sep 13 2010, 11:47 PM)
Dear All,

Any condo recommended at Kepong/Jln Ipoh, Jln Kuching
FOr rental 1st, and slowly convert to own stay after 5 years.

Budget RM300K
*
Sri Putramas? Think still can get something in Sri Putramas 1 below 300k?
Waachaaa
post Sep 14 2010, 09:31 PM

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Corerct me if im wrong

Sri Putramas 1 is the 1st phase
Sri Putramas 2 is the 2nd (2nd hand selling RM350K)
and the new Sri Putramas 3 is selling RM400K and above?

Does that area really worth the price?
As the 1st 5 years i will be renting out before own stay.
Also heard the quality of Sri putramas 1 is the lowest.
Backkom
post Sep 14 2010, 10:20 PM

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QUOTE(Waachaaa @ Sep 14 2010, 09:31 PM)
Corerct me if im wrong

Sri Putramas 1 is the 1st phase
Sri Putramas 2 is the 2nd (2nd hand selling RM350K)
and the new Sri Putramas 3 is selling RM400K and above?

Does that area really worth the price?
As the 1st 5 years i will be renting out before own stay.
Also heard the quality of Sri putramas 1 is the lowest.
*
You pay peanuts, you get monkeys.
You have to decide how to balance among price-quality-location. Only you yourself can tell whether it's worth it or not.

You asked for something along Jln Kuching below 300k, I provided my suggestion.
Personally I think 300k is too low to get anything decent these days (especially if Sri Putramas 1 is low quality for you). Even leasehold condo in deep deep Puchong costs more than 300k.

You should do your homework, shortlist several properties that you think are worth buying, and bring it to the forum for feedback.
szeki
post Mar 6 2011, 01:25 PM

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Dear All,

Someone please enlighten me if vendor financing exists in Malaysia?

This is how it works:
When you sell a property, you could:
This strategy is not well known, it involves breaking down the amount owing into a series of instalment repayments over an agreed time frame, instead of a lump sum cash payment. For example, you could take the RM100,000 property and sell it on the basis that you receive a RM10,000 deposits and the balance on vendor's terms, which might be 1300 weekly repayments (25 years) of RM173.86. If you're not paid out earlier, over the term of the contract you'll receive RM226018.

The fundamentas behind the sale are:
1) Your client has the beneficial ownership of the property. This allows him to rent or sell the property.
2) You retain legal ownersip because the title of the property remains in your name until the purchaser makes his.her final payent due under the contract.

Anyone heard this before?
dripinrain
post Mar 6 2011, 01:51 PM

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QUOTE(szeki @ Mar 6 2011, 01:25 PM)
Dear All,

Someone please enlighten me if vendor financing exists in Malaysia?

This is how it works:
When you sell a property, you could:
This strategy is not well known, it involves breaking down the amount owing into a series of instalment repayments over an agreed time frame, instead of a lump sum cash payment. For example, you could take the RM100,000 property and sell it on the basis that you receive a RM10,000 deposits and the balance on vendor's terms, which might be 1300 weekly repayments (25 years) of RM173.86. If you're not paid out earlier, over the term of the contract you'll receive RM226018.

The fundamentas behind the sale are:
1) Your client has the beneficial ownership of the property. This allows him to rent or sell the property.
2) You retain legal ownersip because the title of the property remains in your name until the purchaser makes his.her final payent due under the contract.

Anyone heard this before?
*
It has been done before during the recession by developers but only for 1 or 2 yrs instalment for 10% deposit. I don't think anyone would go thro the trouble now (due to hot market), some more for 25 yrs cos it is very bad for cash flow (instead of receiving 100%of hse price in 2yrs, now stretch 25yrs) & purchaser might default on payment yet can't be evicted from the property - the spa will have to be very tight to protect the vendor yet will stil have to b involved in headache of legal eviction process. As ownership/title is in vendor's name, if the property appreciates, if i am the vendor, i might just ask purchaser to leave & sell the property at higher profit. Wonder if vendor can earn interest, might be disallowed by bankNegara. Very bad for both parties. But i'm keen to hear other side of story ..

This post has been edited by dripinrain: Mar 6 2011, 01:54 PM
szeki
post Mar 6 2011, 02:08 PM

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No dripinrain,

it's win-win situation. Let me explain. For this to work, the purchaser must meet the following criteria:
1) He/she is capable of servicing the loan but didnt get approved by bank for mortgages
2) He/she is renting a house and looking to buy a new home. For example, graduates who has a decent income but no deposits etc.

Well, here is the way i help:
1) I purchase the property and have the title transferred to my name
2) Draft up vendor agreement, increase the property cost and interest rate to be changed to the purchaser. For example, i bought the property for 100k, variable loan at rate of 7% for 25 years. Now, on vendor's term, i sell for 130k, 2% additional rate for loan 25 years.

The purchaser win by:
1) getting a house
2) Own the house instead of paying rent.

I win by:
1) Higher cash flow every month.
2) If purchaser decide to cash in, i win by higher property price.

Subject to the following terms:
1)Puchaser has the beneficial ownershop of the property. THis allows him.her to rent the property or sell it.
2) I retain leagal ownership because title remains in my name until he/she makes his or her final repayment

Does it work here in malaysia?
Bonescythe
post Mar 6 2011, 02:27 PM

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QUOTE(sdas86 @ Jul 11 2009, 09:58 PM)
I am very new to property investment or real estate investment. I am planning to buy a lot of houses and shops to rent out but I do not know how to get started.

1. Normally, how much capital is required to get started? I want to start small, maybe buy a single storey house (RM100k to RM200k) then rent it.
2. Buy houses, shops or lands, which is better?
3. I read books of Robert Kiyosaki and play the Cashflow games. It can buy high value property using very little money of our own. Is that possible? How to do it?

I am very new to this and I hope I can learn before I jump into this investment. Thanks for any help and guidance.  smile.gif
*
Scout for good potential area. Know what is going to happen in that area soon.
Then enquire for the bank value for the property prices there.

Sometimes, the property prices will be below what the bank value them. You can then "mark up SPA" in order to borrow full loan. Thus, your bank approve 90% will be able to cover mostly everything (Property, agreement fees and misc)
Then rent them out smile.gif

With the spare cash, continue to roll and roll.. Scout for good location. smile.gif
Then repeat the same process again..

Of course 1 thing to consider is your current cash inflow, must be able to fit the requirements..
If a place is valued at 600k, but selling at 500k.. But your income does not even meets requirement for 500k.. Then too bad sad.gif

Sounds easy eh? Haha.. But the hard part is to be able to get that property at good prices. sad.gif

This post has been edited by Bonescythe: Mar 6 2011, 02:30 PM
szeki
post Mar 8 2011, 10:29 PM

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QUOTE(szeki @ Mar 6 2011, 02:08 PM)
No dripinrain,

it's win-win situation. Let me explain. For this to work, the purchaser must meet the following criteria:
1) He/she is capable of servicing the loan but didnt get approved by bank for mortgages
2) He/she is renting a house and looking to buy a new home. For example, graduates who has a decent income but no deposits etc.

Well, here is the way i help:
1) I purchase the property and have the title transferred to my name
2) Draft up vendor agreement, increase the property cost and interest rate to be changed to the purchaser. For example, i bought the property for 100k, variable loan at rate of 7% for 25 years. Now, on vendor's term, i sell for 130k, 2% additional rate for loan 25 years.

The purchaser win by:
1) getting a house
2) Own the house instead of paying rent.

I win by:
1) Higher cash flow every month.
2) If purchaser decide to cash in, i win by higher property price.

Subject to the following terms:
1)Puchaser has the beneficial ownershop of the property. THis allows him.her to rent the property or sell it.
2) I retain leagal ownership because title remains in my name until he/she makes his or her final repayment

Does it work here in malaysia?
*
Anyone?
suisui99
post Apr 18 2011, 03:04 PM

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any comment for me, i plan to invest at nusajaya!
melzhang
post Apr 19 2011, 12:50 AM

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szeki

It will not work in Malaysia, perhaps other country but definately not Malaysia.

First of all, your concept is good but to for 25 years of loan, who can gurantee the furture.

Secondly, your concept only "BEST" benefit the owner not the purchaser. Purchaser service the loan half way, lose his ability to pay, he default on your payment, breached the contract. He lose everything.

If your concept can work, I got 11 properties in hand to sell using your concept.. but who's willing to buy right ?

Last but not least,

1)Puchaser has the beneficial ownershop of the property. THis allows him.her to rent the property or sell it.

Purchase must have a PA from you as the owner for him to sell the property, and I'm not sure are you well versed with the law, just to share with you a PA can easily be challenge in court and worst scenario if you do a irrevokable PA to your purchaser, he or she can just sell the house without your consent at all and you don't get anything after he sell it which benefits the purchaser. As an owner, are you willing to do that ?

Your concept got too many loop holes in the legal matters, and don't tell me you're going to buy the property with cash as an owner then re-sell it through your methods ? If you have a bank loan on that property, you will definately need the bank's consent to empower it to another person which usually is likely to fail, plus without any empowerment of rights on that property, who's that stupid to buy from you over some contracts which can easily challenge in court ?

Think again ???

Just my 2 cents.

MeLz


 

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