i bought a house with my ex-partner 2 years ago.

Now, as we broke up, she doesn't service the loan, do not allow me to rent it out, do not want to sell to others or even selling her half share to me.

And she avoided my call and msgs and the house is left empty for the last 2 years.

Besides declaring myself bankrupt, what other choice do i have to get rid of her name from the house?

The lawyer said nothing he can do about it, unless to bring this to court.

Any advice?

Bring it to court then

talk to her ...go lawyer will be pricy ...else u pay for the loan lol

thats the problem with a joint name property. one of my friend is also doing this right now with his girlfriend. they plan to get married next year or 2010.

Yes, your lawyer is right, nothing can be done.

That's why it is always advisable not to put joint name in property ownership. If one disagree to sell the property and reluctantly to sign on whatever reason, the other party simply can't do anything about it. In this kind of situation, the property is as good as a stone.

Even for husband and wife, it is advisable to put under wife name or husband name, don't put joint name. As if one passed away without will or any other reasons, the property need to go through a lot of documentation before it can be sold or transferred. I know people feel secure to put in joint name but there are a lot of troublesome consequences afterwards if something goes wrong afterwards be it divorced, death etc.

Actually if think ahead or properly, it is not as secure as people think to put joint name as well. Just like TS case, even you own half of the property, but the other party reluctant to compromise or agree on you to sign, then owning half of the properties is as same as owning nothing, because the properties is totally useless without the other half signature.

That's why it is advisable to put one name only. If it is husband and wife, then the others party can put a will to transfer the ownership afterwards, much better.

Summarise, if something goes wrong under joint name, it could be troublesome afterwards.

hehe follow the legal side bro

Yeah a lot of friends warned me bout this beforehand... but it's easier said than done... they themselves got tied up with their gf's names to their house as well...

i tried to be nice, wanted to pay her back her portion + interest.. and she just want to make my life difficult.. luckily her name is attached to the bank loan as well, or else i m dead..

this is so unfair... i am somehow forced to go bankrupt..

How close are you before the break up?
If you're close enough to know the family, than pls bring it up to the family.
Legally I wouldn't say it's impossible (though I'm not from legal background) but it would be hard and involve lots of money and time. Because you can actually file a civil case. But during the case proceedings and all, one would still need to service the loan. Thus I would say it's not worth it.

You have to warn her that if your name is bad because of this loan, hers also would be in the credit report i.e. CCRIS and CTOS since it's a joint loan.
All we can say here is good luck!

If you are forced to go bankrupt due to this loan, your ex also will get the same treatment. Does she not care about it at all? In fact, both of you will lose big time if the loan is not serviced. Let her know on this matter and resolve it.

Do whatever u need to do.
Get ur ex to sit down, listen to what u gotta say.
Analyse the whole scenario to her.
Anyhow, if she's still stubborn, tell her u will take the route below:

Stop servicing the loan. Let the bank auction off the property.
If you still want the property, get somebody u can trust like ur parents, to bid for it.

That's why it is advisable to put one name only.

For couple or husband and wife that want to buy house,

Buy the house, either put you name or your girl friend name only.

Your name, you service the loan, ok, break up, no afterwards problem.

Girl friend name, your girl friend service the loan, may be actually you are paying the money, break up, then your girl friend need to service the loan, not you.
Although previously loan paid by you down to the drain. But it is much much better the stuck in between with no solution while still need to service the loan just like TS case.

Is the house fully paid up?

The house loan under whose name you, her or both?

If it's her stop paying... sweet

If it's you stop paying... not so sweet but do it

You'd need to stop putting money into the house coz it's a drain on money and you don't get anything back

Once the bank gets involved, she has an ultimatum I go down you go down too women

This post has been edited by aaronpang: Oct 17 2008, 12:19 PM

talk to her is not an option for me.... cuz she dun pick up my phone, nor reply my smses and msges... even her family members rejected my call...

stop paying the loan is also not a good solution... i am 28 and go bankrupt like dat my future will gone...

yeah... women.... she knows i wont dare to stop servicing the loan... or rather she wanted to go down together wif me... wuu.. scary....

guys out there take my case as a lesson... dun trust gals!!

U are not bankrupt when the bank auction off the house. The bank would be merely exercising their rights under the Charge Document for recovering NPLs. In fact, if the final selling price is higher than what u owed the bank, u might get some money back (after deducting auction expenses).

U are only 'bankrupt' when u're seriously in debt, either u declare it urself (by application) or ur creditors sue u so that they can claim something back thru whatever assets u have.

Like what Aaron said, there's no point u continue paying in a condition like this. The more u pay, the deeper the hole.

This thread reminded me of:
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/776792

So for those reading this, think twice, thrice, even hundred times before deciding whether to legally join ownership of a property with your partner (wife included) or not.

Sell the house would be the better solution even at a loss.

Still it requires her signature. Give her some money to sign on it, then settle the case rather than no solution.

Never ever purchase anything with joint name.

You don't actually have to talk to her let the bank do it...

Technically the house doesn't belong to either of you, it's owned by the bank. Let the bank repossess it, just like cars if you fail to pay the car loan the bank will reposes the car to recover the loan amount. Fortunately unlike cars houses don't depreciate

You're a bankrupt if you owe money and the bank has no means to recover the funds like credit cards for example or personal/business loans without collateral.

It's not about trusting girls don't do a joint anything with a guy either

i think its kinda hard to foresee this kind of event. those who worry about such event after marriage can draw up a prenuptial agreement to minimize or eliminate their concerns.

for TS case maybe can check with lawyers who r familiar with these kind of problems. the lawyer u enquired from may not be familiar with such case cos the least he could do is fill u in on other options instead of bringing u to a dead end.

This post has been edited by speed7791: Oct 18 2008, 01:07 PM

You talk to the bank, tell bank you willing to pay the installment if other people name is remove, if never pay more than six month bank can lelong the house and you can re buy under your name or someone you can trust more.

Thanks for all the advices..

yeah i've talk to a lawyer who is good in divorce case. He said i can actually send her a legal letter and let her choose to buy or to sell, since she wont buy it then she got no choice but to sell to me, and pay me back half of the monthly instalment i paid so far... anyway, i m talking to him again this tuesday..

I haven't try this way yet, but i am sure the bank wont care all they want is money, even if i purposely not paying them they'll still put my name into CTOS, CREAS and all the Cs they can think of.... and even they lelong the house and cant cover the loan, they would probably sue me to bankrupt...

This post has been edited by Star_Scream: Oct 19 2008, 01:03 AM

TS since she dun care the house anymore y u dun rent it to sumbody?
she wont check also wat ..

Oh.. she has sent me a registered mail earlier stating that all any tenancy agreement will be voided without her consent.. meaning if i purposely go and rent it to someone, and if she knew it, she would kick the tenants out and i'll have to compensate them...

high risk, you'll never know what will a woman do when she is in a state of 'unconsciousness'...

Let the bank lelong the house. If there is outstanding payment, you just pay that amount to bank (sort of compensation to bank to free yourself).

This is still better than continue pay the installment and get nothing from it.

What exactly happen between you two until breaking up? Pity you, messy life you got there...

Something went wrong ler... yeah, even my lawyer said my life is messy...

anyway, she has just replied my mail, and decided to sell it to me plus 5% of total value of the house as 'throw pot fees'...

i am still considering...

At least now she offered you the solution.

It is a good opportunity window for you to get out the messy situation of stuck in between.

dude, offer it back to her at that price, and if she doesn't accept, negotiate it down.

shoot... makes me worried now ...cause i'm not even a half owner...but a quarter owner only! but i guess i won't be selling my house...just leave it if anything happens... sigh...

Then prey hard the rest 3 quarter won't be like TS case.

TS, if you are the guilty party, i suggest you take up the offer, but if you think other wise, negotiate..

Then u better guai guai treat your other half lo

---

Added on October 23, 2008, 6:01 pmI suggest better don't try to negotiate anymore la. Later she change her mind again, TS will get into deeper shit. Just accept the offer when the window is open!

This post has been edited by knwong: Oct 23 2008, 06:01 PM

thanx for all the advices...

yeah it's true, cant hesitate any longer or else she may change her mind..

currently preparing the money... and asked the lawyer to prepare all the documents so she would only have to sign in one go...

actually i've foreseen this would happen, and i should've sign an agreement to prevent this to happen...

those out there with joint name properties can try to do something to prevent case like mine to happen... just as an insurance...

True. I believe we can ask the lawyer to prepare some sort of "buy-sell" agreement. Where by both party agrees on how to divide the said property if anything were to happen between the owners.

Wat do u mean is, if the hse is 200k, u r paying her 100k+10k'throw pot fees'=110k for buying her half share? wow wat a rich guy

If i am dat rich, i wont be busy posting msg here...

basically i m taking the full loan instead of joint name from the bank and pay her back the deposit (half of 10%) + all the legal fees she paid earlier..

I've seen Joint name purchasing. Agreements on both party is 50% - 50% of the property. Just wonder, for Joint owners. Possible to put 3 person names? Will it be higher.

Bit TS, do you mind telling the property location? Planning to sell off?

Want to ask....if we ask bank to auction it off...do we get some off in return or declare bankcrupt???

it's in kota kemuning... if i sell it now, cant cover loan penalty, interest, lawyer fee etc etc.. rugi puluh puluh ribu...

so dun plan to sell, moving in end of this year..

new houseowner, remember to check the penalty and how long they tie you down... i missed that part, and i m not suppose to sell or refinance it for at least 5 yrs or a 17k penalty would be imposed... 17k!!


not sure, but u i heard it is a long process... u must have missed the payment for at least 6 months, and along the way ur name would have been blacklisted...

if the bank manage to auction the house, they will used the money to cover the loan. if there are balance left, you may need to top up. or else, if it's more than 30k, they will then sue u bankrupt..

i m not sure what will they do if there r profit after auction...

Pay you back the balance

good luck to you TS

Don't repeat the same mistake

aiyo TS, wat lar u did to ur ex until she resorts to this. Either ways, im from Kota Kemuning too, very dead area, dunno why i shift here. sigh

this seems to be an emotional issue rather than legal.. if u can fix her emotions then the problem will automatically fix itself.

well, i din manage to fix her emotion therefore my last resort is to use the legal way..

anyway, she promised to sign it this / next week (my lawyer be the middle man) so hopefully everything will come to the end...

wow... this is really dramatic. how's everything?

the story actually continued until very recently when it's finally done.

hopefully this story could be a lesson to u guys and anyone wif similar problem can get advice from me..

Lesson :
1) Always sign a prenuptial agreement before marriage in the first place.
2) Use either one partners name

It's always easy to dispense advise but if you are in such situation at that time, it may be diferent. At that time, you are so in love and you thought you will be forever, so emotional wise you have sealed it. If don't put her name, perhaps there's an element of distrust.

At the end of the day...it's hard lah...

So what happened at last? U take over her part of the loan too? If me, I will let the bank lelong the house. I may get burned, but so does she.

wow.. A+ problem.. hehe.. but i wish to know the different route of the story if she rejected all the offers.

ermm.. maybe in other threads.. )

The last resort to solve this if you want the house:

1) Make the bank lelong the house. (but your record will be bad for one two years)
2) Your family go and bid the house with the market price.
3) Two possiblities:
- You gf goes and bid the house at higher price, she own the house
- You win the bid, you get the whole house and continue to serve the loan
4) Both ways you are in better condition.

But don't do this until you have no more choice..

the story din stop there... i forgot about this thread completely so din update it..

she din wan my 'throw-pot' fees, she never tot i could actually manage to come out with the money that she requested earlier..

i think all she wans is to give me a hard time, so she started to use different method to harass me... lock my gate, make 'false' police reports, scream in front of my house etc etc... phheww..

went thru lots of hell, eventually manage to found a solution. lucky me i found a good and helpful lawyer to bring this case to court. then she decided to quit and settle the matter outside the court. took the money, sign the paper and leave me alone.

now that's A++ story...

Perhaps she felt hurt when you "throw port". And the relationship problem is rather complex to say who is wrong. But rule of thumb, whoever move out first is wrong. relationship is never a contractual thing, once gone it is gone, no use to hold the house.

That's why people always say don't do partnership in business with relatives. And now don't put property name with two persons' name.

I think Hong Kong even has a rule that if the people can take back diamond ring etc from previous gf, whatever...

Wow, ur ex gf is pretty scary! Make life so difficult, refused to service loan, refused to sell... finally comes to an end.

My bf and I are buying our first investment property, will draw out a prenuptial agreement, in case one perty defaults, or either party breaks up, whichever party (that calls the shoot to break up) must reimburse back the other party all the legal cost + selling price and to bear the cost of transfer, or subject to agreement of both parties, to sell at the market price and profit to be equally distributed.

hi chess gal it's good that both of u drew out a prenuptial agreement prior to buying a property together.

but IMHO, to ask for whichever party "that calls the shoot to break up" is pretty subjective. What IF u found ur bf cheat behind ur back and u have to call the shots to break up and then u hav to pay everything?? <-- no offence arrr, juz to create a scenario only

things can get VERY VERY messy if not executed properly..

True, agree with you star scream.

Perhaps to sell to whoever party that wishes to buy. Anyways, we jointly agree to buy as both refuses to put in too much of initial capital into the property and plan to buy another property next year, so saving the liquid cash for our next hunt.

Hope all is well for you at the end star scream.

I'm no lawyer, but I've read of cases where judges declare pre-nups null and void.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prenuptial_agreement

Why don't you buy one property and let your bf buy the other one? It'll be far less messy.

Quite an evenful story... glad to hear its finally over for you..

It is not surprise to hear such incident.. I have 3 couple friends who bought prop with joint name, and all these 3 pairs eventually got broke-up.. 2 pairs got their props settled, 1 more still hanging unsettled.

I even nearly joint name with my elder sister to get a RM700k house. My mum was very delighted because we finally can move to a new place.. But we just couldn't come to an agreement if either party wants to pull out and pay either party, thus we decided to call it off..

Even the closest relative also involve risk, or worst risking the sibling relationship.. As chinese saying, "talking about money will only spoilt the relationship", especially to someone closest to you.

Yeah ..no matter whom you're thinking to partner with its normally ending up in similar scenario ...sometimes the closer you are to that person, the bigger emotional attachment you will have ..and when thing goes wrong the amplitude is also far bigger ..so if you can afford it , buy OWN ..or get a proper agreement before hand ...

Initially that was the plan, but he wishes to join in the bandwagon. If in case really breaks up, then one person get one or we simply split.

Btw, am looking for lawyer, anyone to recommend?

I can recommend you my lawyer, he solved all my problems. Very nice and reliable guy. If you dun mind his office is in Malacca (he travels to KL frequently), pm me.

This post has been edited by Star_Scream: Jan 13 2010, 02:24 PM

can call your lawyer send her a warning letter regarding service of the loan.

you can claim for constructive or resulting depends on situation.

anyway, you can call the lawyer to write up a warning letter first, then see how her response.

Hi all,

I read recenty that in Singapore, a property with two joint owners cannot be disposed of by way of a will. Instead, when one of the owner dies, the property passes automatically to the surviving joint owner.

My question is - is there a similar law in Malaysia? Or are each joint owner free to name whoever they wish as their beneficiary?