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medical card, need more information about it
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xeroxeropi
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 Jan 31 2010, 09:11 AM
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New Member
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QUOTE(numbertwo @ Jan 30 2010, 02:35 AM) xeroxeropi...i hope you are not another one who suggests someone to buy ILP without looking at the limitation of this product...
i thought i was offering insights on MEDICARD?? 
i was concerned that many ppl seem to get life insurance and medicard all mixed up.
QUOTE(weikian @ Jan 30 2010, 10:53 AM) ILP has its own strengths and weakness. Its depends on personal needs and affordability.
everything has their strengths and weaknesses. i'm glad there're some ppl here who understands this fact.
just because sthg didnt not live up to ur expectations, doesn't mean it won't be suitable for someone else. insurance is not a one-size-fits-all product.
ur needs and concerns should be addressed and covered. and everyone has different needs & wants.
QUOTE(PJusa @ Jan 30 2010, 07:27 PM) generally ILP is the more costly variant that forces a lock-in on the insured if the overall coverage is identical. if you cant handle early savings and save them for future high premiums and you know the plan is perfect for you and will remain so then ILP might be a decent choice. for pretty much all other cases GI will be better than ILP for identical coverage.
what do u mean by "costly"?
although costs would be a major concern for everyone, it shouldn't be the most important issue when considering insurance. just make sure ur needs are covered. then adjust accordingly to ur budget and other concerns.
i assume GI=general insurance?
this is a grave mistake to suggest GI as being the same as ILP because ILP is LIFE INSURANCE and general insurance is other insurance that doesnt concern the human life. egs: motor, house, jewellery... these two aren't the same and shldnt be treated as such.
just by comparing the costs of the two, of coz, ILP would seem costlier because GI is just a few hundreds/year. but they both have different functions so shouldn't be compared like apple to apple.
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xeroxeropi
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Jan 31 2010, 09:04 PM
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New Member
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QUOTE(PJusa @ Jan 31 2010, 11:10 AM) xeroxeropi, we are talking about medical (H&S) insurances and not life. i do have serious objections to life insurances but that is a different story. ILP H&S plans are almost always more expensive to the consumer than the same cover for H&S from GI. this is due to the nature of the product. a GI H&S plan outperforms ILP H&S plans on a multitude of levels (no lock-in, no high upfront premiums, lower overall costs) that we already discussed to great length in this thread. in a nutshell: if you want a medical card, stay far away from ILP H&S. (this applies to the vast majority). just because people purchase those plans doesnt mean they are good plans. ppl tend to make bad decisions. also purchasing a whole life insurance is generally not a good idea because it creates a lock-in situation with significant issues of underinsurance when it comes to the core protection areas (health and if you so wish TPD) when you look at the premium you pay. costly means: you pay more with ILP than you would pay with GI for the same (!) product. this is due to the nature of the two products and its inevitable. why pay more for something when you dont need to? on a side-note: your posts would be ever so much easier to read if you would use the normal font. the big font is pretty hard to read for me. EDIT: sorry - i got the threads mixed up. the detailed discussion on let's say pro/con for ILP vs. H&S is not in this thread but here: http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?act=ST&f=153&t=940897
??? 
wasnt i talking about medical card in my first post? i was talking abt medical card the whole time until Mrnumbertwo asked if i'm supporting ILP. it was clear there was still much confusion even after i explained how medical cards and life ins are two diff things. (ie: your current comment)
you continued with your "ILP sucks" slogan although i ald explained how it's completely different product from GI--point by point. canot compare GI with ILP coz ILP is life cover.
i also DID say ppl got diff needs and not everyone suit the same product. WHAT U PAY IS WHAT U GET. medical card is for paying hospital/medical bills. life ins is to cover *your life*, it's ald expected that it would cost more. do you think medical card will pay you a lump sum when you get TPD/CI or touch wood, die? of coz not. that's where the costs are incurred.
why are you continuing to beat around the bush when i ald pointed out to you why the two shouldn't be compared that way?? don't blame my font for your lack of understanding, man. (i thought bigger fonts usually are easier to read not smaller fonts? strange)
well, if you want to continue condemning ILP, that's your choice. i'm not forcing anyone to buy it. i'm just telling you the difference between those products. it's your choice not to get ILP for yourself, but please don't continue to further confuse other ppl who are seeking clarifications here.
i just want to clear misunderstandings as it seems so many ppl keep thinking getting medical card= life insurance. or that medical card/PA is ald more than enough.
getting only a medical card is not a good solution for anyone because premiums for medical cards get burnt every year.
besides that, a complete protection means getting Life, TPD, CI, PA, H+S (medical bills) ALL BASES COVERED.
this in turn means that ILP will be good for ppl who needs life insurance but canot afford to get traditional life policy that pays more bonuses and have bigger cash value. with ILP, you can put in all the riders cheaply compared to traditional policy. like i said, you get what you pay for. u pay more for traditional life policy, of coz you will get more cash value inside when you cash out. it's logical.
*** so, yes, your comparison is like comparing buying a Myvi (medical card only) vs a Mercedes (ILP+all riders) vs Ferrari (traditional life policy) ***
you may want a Myvi only to take you from point A to B and is fuel efficient so you can use your money for other things. go ahead.
but some ppl wld prefer to be more comfortable. get more things covered. it's also up to them. their needs are entirely diff from yours.
you canot tell them they are just wasting their money coz a car is only a car. they prefer to have a better airbag/braking/etc system than Myvi ley?? Merc gives a smoother ride than Myvi, bla bla bla... You dont know what kind of situation they are in as much as they don't know about urs.
if they can afford it, why can't they get it? it's their choice.
your bias and prejudice stemmed deeply from costs and what YOU PERCEIVED as cost inefficiency. let's just lay it all out there for ppl to know and decide. not mar everything with what you think is not a cost efficient choice. every choice has their pros and cons.
what is costly to you doesn't mean it's costly to everyone else. how much your life is worth is also all up to you to tag. (yes your life is priceless, but this is another long discussion... not now lar) however, can we all afford the premiums on the values we put our lives to be worth? this is how ILP comes in lar.
sidetrack a bit... for me personally, from the illustration with the cars, i feel that getting only a medical card is like actually getting the Myvi without wheels.
it's totally absurd to get only a medical card coz you never know when you will get sick and how much your sickness may or may not cost you. no one is a fortuneteller and can see into the future. hence, this is why ins agents advise you to get all your bases covered (Life, TPD, CI, PA, H+S (medical bills)) before you even think about doing investments.
so, cost is not sthg you would dedicate a section on how much a completely diff product outperforms another product although it's cheaper.
now, about your lock-in period argument...i'm quite confused about your stand. why are you advising ppl to get medical card, sthg that premiums will be considered burnt when you dont stay in hospital/getting treatment vs advising ppl against getting sthg for their family since everyone will die in the end??
lock-in period shldn't be a concern at all bcoz the idea behind insurance is to get protection, not as a pure investment vehicle. stop treating it as such. your money is used to create a safety net for ur future medical needs/ease family burdens when you pass on.
plus, you can alw cash out ur policy's cash value any time. but why do so when your intention supposed to be getting protection, not earnings?
protection should be placed as much importance as food and shelter. coz without protection, your food and shelter will be jeopardized as well. imagine your savings all depleted for paying ur medical bills, hospital stay coz u got the cheapest thing--medical card only.
##pls note that not all expenses can be paid off with the medical card or that 60k, 120k or whatever lifetime limit is a lot. plus, there's a annual cap on how much you can claim depending on what medicard you bought.
life insurance pay out the moment you claim for CI/TPD/PA/life lost IN CASH. you/your family can choose to pay extra med bills your medicard didnt cover/whatever with the cash instead of being told what you can or not claim using a medical card.
isnt this better? would this be a relief to you and your family?
you shouldn't see your money as being thrown away frivolously into insurance bcoz you see nthg in return now. insurance is to cover your life's future unfortunate events. this is a long-term relationship. treat it with respect.
dont expect to reap instant rewards when all you put into your basket is rm150-200/mth (which are what most ILP policies are. cheap affordable life coverage)
if nothing happens now, good lah!! who wants sthg bad to happen to themselves so they can claim money one?
pls remember that everyone will get old, sick and die eventually. no one is immortal.
in order for the company to pay you when you get old, sick/die, you need to get into an agreement to put aside sums of money into a future medical fund for yourself NOW. not only when you r ald sick baru korek from everywhere.
your life is protected from day 1. if you really really wanna make a great deal of money out of insurance, make sure get into accident and die instantly. then your "investment" will be guaranteed however much you're insured lor. easy.
when that happens, company can go to your family and say "eeyer.. why so unfair one!?!! your husband only paid us 1mth premium of rm250, now we have to give you back $100k+ $25k PA because he died from accident yesterday." meh??
stop thinking of insurance as a burden. the company is carrying your burden for you ald once you got into agreement with them mar. 
you're giving yourself the peace of mind.
if you feel that you're underinsured, can always top up what.
so, no. i dont see how being "locked-in" into this situation my whole life is bad for me. i can die any time. i won't know how. so, i would definitely not risk my chances at getting only term insurance that expires when i'm ald old and have higher risks of needing medical care.
i would gladly put aside money so that my family are well-taken care of if sthg happens to me.
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