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 Military Thread V28

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Frozen_Sun
post Aug 16 2021, 10:05 AM

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QUOTE(alexz23 @ Aug 16 2021, 09:55 AM)
I prefer Indonesia to buy more Kaplan MT aka the Harimau. It will be an easy meal for our RPG-7 rocketeers, while eating up a big portion of indonesian military budget.

The hull armor of Kaplan MT is using modular armor. It is categorized as STANAG 4569 level 4 protection, which means the tank can withstand 14.5×114mm AP rounds at 200 meters with 911 m/s velocity. The underbelly of the tank uses V-hull, able to withstand 10 kg AT mine under the tracks and under the center. Due to modularity, the armor can be augmented to level 5 protection (withstand 25 mm APDS-T at 500 m with 1258 m/s velocity) without increasing the volume of the tank, with the frontal arc able to withstand 30 mm rounds.

Bangladesh did have a look at the Kaplan MT, but ordered the VT-5 instead.


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It's the same like Deftech AV8, nearly $10 million each.

Too expensive for an APC

Frozen_Sun
post Aug 16 2021, 11:04 AM

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QUOTE(alexz23 @ Aug 16 2021, 10:37 AM)
Yes it is too expensive, but we got 257 of them in the end, unlike just 18 of the Harimau. Our cost includes the factory, all the various specialized versions with VIGTAQS etc. plus at least 216 Ingwe ATGM missiles that comes with the Gempita.
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Hopefully, not too many Harimau is bought, it's too expensive. If AMX-13 will still be in use, so be it. It's still great for infantry fire support.

For APC, TNI-AD keeps it more sensible with Anoa, less than $1mn each. It's simple and nimble. Functional as battle taxi.

Two battalions of Leopard 2 can be assigned to guard urban centres, roads and highways....there are 10 battalions more of lightly armored AFV, equipped with AMX-13 and Scorpions
Frozen_Sun
post Aug 17 2021, 09:17 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Aug 17 2021, 05:33 PM)
Indonesian Defense Ministry received a defense budget allocation of around USD 9.5 biIllion for the year 2022.
Read morr: https://infopublik.id/kategori/sorot-politi...alutsista?show=
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$3 billion specifically allocated for new procurement
Frozen_Sun
post Aug 18 2021, 09:11 AM

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It's mainly for infantry fire support...as well as killing APC and IFV.


Frozen_Sun
post Aug 18 2021, 10:39 AM

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QUOTE(alexz23 @ Aug 18 2021, 10:36 AM)
If it is just made for fire support and killing APC and IFV, why do you need a 105mm gun??

It looks like a tank, and believe me, the generals will use it like a tank. And the enemy will mark it out as the number 1 target on the battlefield, as it looks like a tank.

As for fire support, malaysian soldiers now have plenty of RPG-7 and to add new lightweight Carl Gustavs to not needing a fire support vehicle with 105mm gun. Which is why we have retired all our 90mm fire support vehicles (SIBMAS, Commando and Scorpion)
IFV not designed to face medium tank????

The Gempita with 30mm cannon and Ingwe missiles is made to kill IFVs and Medium tanks.

Gempita 30mm cannon can easily penetrate the Harimau tall and large side armor, and with a firing speed of 60 rounds per minute, will easily saturate any APS systems installed.
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Retrofitted AMX-13 also has 105mm. HE shells pack more filling.

It will be used like AMX-13...because it replaces AMX-13 in light armored battallions.


Frozen_Sun
post Aug 18 2021, 09:02 PM

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The material for Klewang was flammable. But TNI-AL hasn't bought it yet. I heard it was insured, so the company didn't lose too much financially.
Frozen_Sun
post Aug 27 2021, 05:55 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Aug 26 2021, 07:45 PM)
First Steel Cutting Ceremony of Indonesian Navy new OPV 90M and OPV at PT Daya Radar Utama Shipyard. Credit to Kemhan RI.

user posted image

PT Daya Radar Utama (DRU) OPV 90M.


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Four ships to be built, right?
Frozen_Sun
post Aug 28 2021, 12:13 AM

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QUOTE(Lampuajaib @ Aug 27 2021, 09:55 PM)
Maybe there are 2 different size of OPV or different spesification.
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DRU has two OPV designs...maybe the other is 73m model

https://defence-indonesia.com/web/product-d...l/60374c976452e

https://defence-indonesia.com/web/product-d...l/603753a4ba01c
Frozen_Sun
post Aug 29 2021, 10:41 PM

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QUOTE(Mai189 @ Aug 29 2021, 07:51 PM)


Expected...if you track the loans Indo has been making..they will need 1 generation to pay. It is also quite obvious that they cannot afford many of the equipment on their wish list and/or in the numbers they want.
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Take it easy...Indonesian military enthusiasts already have the habit to take news with a truckload of salt

You are not proving anything new


Frozen_Sun
post Sep 9 2021, 03:06 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Sep 9 2021, 02:27 PM)
We'll see then. Lol.

Well good for Singapore. Bravo!!! Oh btw why all of the sudden you are talking about Singapore? No one is asking about Singapore. Are you Singaporean or Malaysian? Lol.

The C-130J Super Hercules is done deal. Indonesia ordered 4 units through DCS.

user posted image

Typhoon 2nd hand Tranche 1 - nah its not gonna happened.
Rafale - we'll wait and see then. Lol.
V-22 Osprey - its only a US sale approval DSCA announcement.
A400M - its not TNI-AU prefered choice. So nope.

Lol.
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Most important things are rafale and air warfare frigates. Others are bonuses.

We'll see if prabowo can beat purnomo in terms of procurements
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 9 2021, 11:28 PM

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FA-50 is decent for ground strike, AGM-65 and JDAM for precision, Mk-82 with CCIP aiming is enough to target medium-sized building
Can be used for limited maritime strike too. AGM-65 can disable coast guard ship or corvette with only MANPAD-grade air defence.

But, it doesn't have BVR capability.

user posted image

Frozen_Sun
post Sep 9 2021, 11:53 PM

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QUOTE(alexz23 @ Sep 9 2021, 11:40 PM)
FA-50 Block 20 is in development, will have BVR capability, along with targeting pods and probe for air to air refueling.

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news/def...50-golden-eagle

https://www.bloomberg.com/press-releases/20...e-for-kai-fa-50
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Better wait for it...should be able to carry 4 AIM-120 and 2 AIM-9 for air superiority missions
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 10 2021, 08:42 AM

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QUOTE(Lampuajaib @ Sep 10 2021, 08:17 AM)
Many unaware the important  of airlift and sealift.
Logistics is the key to win a war.
ID with her vast teritory has the reason to build up this capability.
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Probably just to replace C-130B not to expand fleet...to maintain 20+ units operational.
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 11 2021, 01:04 PM

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Severe downgrade....BMP-3 is much better than AAV7
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 11 2021, 01:17 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Sep 11 2021, 01:10 PM)
Afaik the BMP-3F and BT-3F contract for the Indonesian Marines is not yet cancelled but is on hold. Maybe Indonesia is trying to get a waiver from the US government.

Ofcourse with a 100mm gun the BMP-3F has more firepower than the AAV7.
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BMP-3 isn't only for bringing marines onshore, but also provide fire support. Machine guns, 30mm autocannon, ATGM and 100mm gun are perfect combinations.

I remember a USMC AAV7 became a RPG-7 target practice during early days of 2003 invasion....many died. It's just an easy, hapless target....can't barely shoot back.
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 11 2021, 01:56 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Sep 11 2021, 01:31 PM)
Imho any amphibious armored vehicle are lightly armored. If its too heavy it won't float. Don't know if the BMP-3F armor could withstand a RPG attacks. Maybe there some news of the BMP-3F in the Yemeni-Houthi conflict as iinm the UAE is one the operator of the BMP-3F. The only advantage the BMP-3F has is its 100mm gun and can fire a GLATGM.
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Of course, it's common knowledge that amphibious IFV is lightly armored.
But, AAV-7 is a 3.5 meter tall lumbering box, while BMP-3 is much shorter and can shoot back furiously.
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 11 2021, 06:44 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Sep 11 2021, 02:51 PM)
So what other choice do we have? Its either the AAV7 or the ZAHA. Don't know if they want the wheeled Pandur 8x8 like the TNI-AD though. Afaik both BMP-3F and BT-3F contracts are on hold not cancelled. Unless Indonesia got a waiver from the US.

US to Exempt India, Indonesia and Vietnam from CAATSA Sanctions
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Yes...I know there's no choice...if US insists to block the sales. US is too dominating.

We will end up with AAV7 and it's a severe downgrade.
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 15 2021, 08:05 AM

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^
RVV-AE
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 17 2021, 07:41 AM

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Type-31/Arrowhead-140 is also based on Iver Huidtfeld design.

Will Arrowhead-140 compete with Iver Huidtfeld?

Or will build all four?

32 VLS Mk41, up to 128 ESSM....not bad

user posted image

This post has been edited by Frozen_Sun: Sep 17 2021, 07:48 AM
Frozen_Sun
post Sep 18 2021, 05:56 PM

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QUOTE(azriel @ Sep 18 2021, 05:43 PM)
Yes more towards AAW role while the FREMM is for ASW role.

Unconfirmed it will be 24 x VLS CAMM-ER.

For the SSM they are looking at VLS. Don't know if there is any Western type SSM VLS.
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CAMM can be quad packed in Sylver VLS...so theoretically 24 x 4 = 96 CAMM

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