Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+

> Out of breath & winded after compound movement, Deadlift & Squat. Also Creatine question

views
     
TSpergilahsayang
post Oct 24 2020, 05:57 PM, updated 2w ago

Casual
***
Junior Member
308 posts

Joined: Dec 2008
From: NoT WoRTh TelLiNg


Hello Sifu,

I'm a skinny guy trying to bulk up & have been training for 4 months.

At first, it was going fine until my muscle able to handle more weight.

On my 3rd or 4th set of deadlift & squat, I am so winded, out of breath, the heart is pumping too fast for my comfort, body felt light & cant feel my feet (same feeling if having low blood sugar or low blood pressure). No case of fainting yet as I immediately sit down (bracing myself, afraid I faint standing up).

On top of that, squat makes me want to puke too urghh.

Question:

1) What is it that I am lacking? Body endurance? VO2 max? Or low glucose/carb in the system? rclxub.gif
2) How to alleviate this or improve this?
3) In the case where my heart pumped too fast and out of breath, what should I do? Move around? sit down? My body instinctively wants to sit, but I am not sure if that is the right thing to do.
3) Is creatine easy on the stomach?


My health background & other info:

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

guysmiley
post Oct 24 2020, 06:41 PM

Getting Started
**
Junior Member
139 posts

Joined: Dec 2012


i used to be 173cm and 52-54kg. damn skinny!!! one day i went to farmasi to buy that weigh gain, but the staff recommended me multi viitamins. she said need to tale evryday for at least 3 months. but 2 months later i started gaining weight it kept going up. i never go below 75kg. i used to be active. but these days im too busy and my weight now is between 78-82kg.

with your stomach condition, i wont recommend too much heavy lifting. i had stomach operations few years ago and since then i feel pain if i do any heavy lifting or cycling. try things to increase your stamina instead.

also bear in mind, it will take a very long time to see any difference.
Ethan Hunt
post Oct 25 2020, 02:49 PM

Getting Started
**
Junior Member
212 posts

Joined: Jul 2018
Hi bro,

Do you follow any beginner weight training program like stronglift 5x5, fierce 5, vikings etc?

What is your current lift and diet looks like?
Amedion
post Oct 26 2020, 12:25 PM

It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's star
*******
Senior Member
3,342 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: Klang



QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Oct 24 2020, 05:57 PM)
Hello Sifu,

I'm a skinny guy trying to bulk up & have been training for 4 months.

At first, it was going fine until my muscle able to handle more weight.

On my 3rd or 4th set of deadlift & squat, I am so winded, out of breath, the heart is pumping too fast for my comfort, body felt light & cant feel my feet (same feeling if having low blood sugar or low blood pressure). No case of fainting yet as I immediately sit down (bracing myself, afraid I faint standing up).

On top of that, squat makes me want to puke too urghh.

Question:

1) What is it that I am lacking? Body endurance? VO2 max? Or low glucose/carb in the system? rclxub.gif
2) How to alleviate this or improve this?
3) In the case where my heart pumped too fast and out of breath, what should I do? Move around? sit down? My body instinctively wants to sit, but I am not sure if that is the right thing to do.
3) Is creatine easy on the stomach? 


My health background & other info:

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
It is very normal cause compound movement especially those involving glutes/legs use lots of energy and you must be doing a higher volume/intensity that your body havent adapted to.

Continue to do so until the current weigh/reps becomes easier. Rest longer in-between set. Take sweet like hacks while working on heavy compound. Have a proper pre-workout meal. Have enough sleep. Proper programming.

You're just having indigestion problem i think. Avoid spicy food, coffee, oily food, etc. Take apple cider vinegar everyday or supplement that aid digestion.

When you're out of breath. Sit down and rest. If you keep pushing then you might blackout. Know your limit. Listen to your body.

Yes creatine easy on most ppl. I have alot digestion issue like u. Heartburn, food poisoning, etc. but creatine okay for me.

Everdying
post Oct 26 2020, 12:36 PM

Two is One and One is None.
Group Icon
Staff
30,549 posts

Joined: Jan 2003
when u say "cannot eat a large portion of food."...means? twice a day? once a day?
why not 5-6 smaller meals a day?
TSpergilahsayang
post Oct 26 2020, 01:29 PM

Casual
***
Junior Member
308 posts

Joined: Dec 2008
From: NoT WoRTh TelLiNg


QUOTE(Everdying @ Oct 26 2020, 12:36 PM)
when u say "cannot eat a large portion of food."...means? twice a day? once a day?
why not 5-6 smaller meals a day?
*
Means each portion is small (acceptable size example: 3 boiled egg + 2 loaf bread & STRICTLY NO WATER/DRINKS) and it may digest slowly before feeling can eat again.

Right now I eat 5-6 meals a day. 2 major meal, 2 x homemade shake, 1 in-between cheat snack. Highest ever get 3000 calories per day, lowest 1800; averaging at 2356 calories per day this month. Right now the surplus is still okay & gained weight....for now lah tongue.gif


Amedion
post Oct 26 2020, 03:47 PM

It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's star
*******
Senior Member
3,342 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: Klang



Drink alot of water bro. Preferable the first thing in the morning before u consume anything. That'll kick start your body and aid digestion.
TSpergilahsayang
post Oct 26 2020, 04:08 PM

Casual
***
Junior Member
308 posts

Joined: Dec 2008
From: NoT WoRTh TelLiNg


QUOTE(Amedion @ Oct 26 2020, 03:47 PM)
Drink alot of water bro. Preferable the first thing in the morning before u consume anything. That'll kick start your body and aid digestion.
*
I took some of your advice. Took pre-workout meal a little bit nearer before workout session & took sweet candy during the workout, breathing properly + immediately sit/rest longer after each set. Starting to look better, but only can tell with confidence on my next leg day.

Oh talking about water, I do drink 600ml of water when I wake up. But during the day, I would only drink water according to my 'schedule' as to not 'compromise' my stomach volume. I noticed that drinking a lot of water throughout the day too much will make my stomach even more 'not hungry' longer. Needless to say, my daily water consumption is obviously sub-par at the moment. Maybe 1.5l daily right now I think. So, by right, I can't take creatine right? Since my water consumption is subpar tongue.gif
Amedion
post Oct 26 2020, 04:14 PM

It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's star
*******
Senior Member
3,342 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: Klang



QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Oct 26 2020, 04:08 PM)
I took some of your advice. Took pre-workout meal a little bit nearer before workout session & took sweet candy during the workout, breathing properly + immediately sit/rest longer after each set. Starting to look better, but only can tell with confidence on my next leg day.

Oh talking about water, I do drink 600ml of water when I wake up. But during the day, I would only drink water according to my 'schedule' as to not 'compromise' my stomach volume. I noticed that drinking a lot of water throughout the day too much will make my stomach even more 'not hungry' longer. Needless to say, my daily water consumption is obviously sub-par at the moment. Maybe 1.5l daily right now I think. So, by right, I can't take creatine right? Since my water consumption is subpar  tongue.gif
*
Oh ok. Good to hear that you're doing better.

Yes i think you drink more than me. 1.5L good enough. I don't drink more than 1L plain water most of the time (exclude coffee, protein shakes, sugary drinks).

No worries you can still take creatine. Of course if u drink more water it will be more beneficial. Otherwise your muscle cant store cause its insufficient. Still 1.5L is good enough.
TSpergilahsayang
post Oct 26 2020, 04:32 PM

Casual
***
Junior Member
308 posts

Joined: Dec 2008
From: NoT WoRTh TelLiNg


QUOTE(Amedion @ Oct 26 2020, 04:14 PM)
Oh ok. Good to hear that you're doing better.

Yes i think you drink more than me. 1.5L good enough. I don't drink more than 1L plain water most of the time (exclude coffee, protein shakes, sugary drinks).

No worries you can still take creatine. Of course if u drink more water it will be more beneficial. Otherwise your muscle cant store cause its insufficient. Still 1.5L is good enough.
*
Oh My gosh, it's a relief to know that someone else (not to mentions people with more exp in bodybuilding) drink less water than me hahaha.

I always 'beat myself up' around the fact that I did not drink enough; because of the last urine+blood test, doc said my hydration level is a few 'degree' away from optimal.

Maybe I'll try creatine next week + lil bit more water & see. Maybe that also ramp-up my motivation brows.gif
Spitzer
post Oct 26 2020, 11:27 PM

Getting Started
**
Junior Member
138 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: K.Hills



QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Oct 24 2020, 05:57 PM)
Hello Sifu,

I'm a skinny guy trying to bulk up & have been training for 4 months.

At first, it was going fine until my muscle able to handle more weight.

On my 3rd or 4th set of deadlift & squat, I am so winded, out of breath, the heart is pumping too fast for my comfort, body felt light & cant feel my feet (same feeling if having low blood sugar or low blood pressure). No case of fainting yet as I immediately sit down (bracing myself, afraid I faint standing up).

On top of that, squat makes me want to puke too urghh.

Question:

1) What is it that I am lacking? Body endurance? VO2 max? Or low glucose/carb in the system? rclxub.gif
2) How to alleviate this or improve this?
3) In the case where my heart pumped too fast and out of breath, what should I do? Move around? sit down? My body instinctively wants to sit, but I am not sure if that is the right thing to do.
3) Is creatine easy on the stomach? 


My health background & other info:

» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
Those compound movements are definitely hard on your body, evenmore so if you do proper bracing your core, and holding your breath in like a can of unopened coke during the motion of deadlift/squats. But, it's very surprising when you've been training for 4 months and you're still having such a major issue with this? I mean don't get me wrong, i'm still worn out like hell after 5x8 of deadlifts/squats - but it's within limit.

Looking on top of whatever physical issues you may have, are you using too heavy of a weight? What's your height/weight/bodyfat ratio? You kept on increasing the weight during that 4 months duration?
Are you squatting more then your bodyweight for reps? Try 80-90% bodyweight for reps - those should be easy for a typical male.
Are you sure you have the proper form down? Proper form makes yourself feel "solid" - it's really a hard feeling to describe but it just feels right - and it took me 6months+ of solid form practice to get all my compound forms spot-on for my body's aspect ratios.

Also - are you consistent in that 4 months of weightlifting? ie. at the bare minimum, 3 type of compound lift(squat/bench/deadlift/ohp/row) every week for 16weeks without miss?
And no, i won't comment on your nutrition/other body related matters as it's not possible to comment on those with just words you've posted - i'm not a e-doctor.

QUOTE(guysmiley @ Oct 24 2020, 06:41 PM)
i used to be 173cm and 52-54kg. damn skinny!!! one day i went to farmasi to buy that weigh gain, but the staff recommended me multi viitamins. she said need to tale evryday for at least 3 months. but 2 months later i started gaining weight it kept going up. i never go below 75kg. i used to be active. but these days im too busy and my weight now is between 78-82kg.

with your stomach condition, i wont recommend too much heavy lifting. i had stomach operations few years ago and since then i feel pain if i do any heavy lifting or cycling. try things to increase your stamina instead.

also bear in mind, it will take a very long time to see any difference.
*
Correct, to see any solid difference, at least 4-6 months of consistent effort must be done first! And if really things doesn't go your way - be very critical in evaluating your own effort or just get a personal trainer - as they will be accountable to evaluate every aspect towards hitting your goal (not those stupid p.trainers u see in gym who help ppl how to bench press only)

oh and.. 78-82 kg, that's fat for someone that short right? How's it feel to experience being skinny, and then fat, which is better? biggrin.gif
TSpergilahsayang
post Oct 27 2020, 01:15 AM

Casual
***
Junior Member
308 posts

Joined: Dec 2008
From: NoT WoRTh TelLiNg


QUOTE(Spitzer @ Oct 26 2020, 11:27 PM)
Those compound movements are definitely hard on your body, evenmore so if you do proper bracing your core, and holding your breath in like a can of unopened coke during the motion of deadlift/squats. But, it's very surprising when you've been training for 4 months and you're still having such a major issue with this? I mean don't get me wrong, i'm still worn out like hell after 5x8 of deadlifts/squats - but it's within limit.

Looking on top of whatever physical issues you may have, are you using too heavy of a weight? What's your height/weight/bodyfat ratio? You kept on increasing the weight during that 4 months duration?
Are you squatting more then your bodyweight for reps? Try 80-90% bodyweight for reps - those should be easy for a typical male.
Are you sure you have the proper form down? Proper form makes yourself feel "solid" - it's really a hard feeling to describe but it just feels right - and it took me 6months+ of solid form practice to get all my compound forms spot-on for my body's aspect ratios.

Also - are you consistent in that 4 months of weightlifting? ie. at the bare minimum, 3 type of compound lift(squat/bench/deadlift/ohp/row) every week for 16weeks without miss?
And no, i won't comment on your nutrition/other body related matters as it's not possible to comment on those with just words you've posted - i'm not a e-doctor.

*
1) Oh yes, holding the breath for proper bracing do exaggerate my out of breath condition. Probably one of the reasons today was a bit easier as I hold my breath less.

2) Height: 170, current weight 55 (was 46 before my 'diet' on May, started training on July), Bf%: I think 15-18% now as I see faint abs & rib cage, but don't know accurately really hmm.gif

3) Still learning & correcting my compound form along the way.

4) The weight on the compound movement increased a bit, but still lame in comparison to a typical male (yeah I sedar diri tongue.gif ). Below is the starting weight and where I am now (for 12 reps):

Squat 20kg ----> 30kg (scared to increase more weight for now as squat makes me reflux)
Deadlift 30kg ----> 45kg
Bench 18kg ----> 35kg
OHP 18kg ----> 26kg
bend over row 14kg ----> 30kg
pull-up 3 reps ----> 10 reps
Push up 3 reps ---> 20 reps ; now doing weighted push up 10KG 12reps

I do the workout at home, with barbell, dumbbells & resistance band.

5) Consistency, I'd say so-so. In these 4 months, I only have 35 workout sessions. Improving my body is kinda a 'reward' to myself after a certain successful project. So I seldom force myself on days that I really don't want to do it. Oh yeah, I did pause my workout for a month after getting sick for stomach problem (August)



Amedion
post Oct 28 2020, 10:19 AM

It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's star
*******
Senior Member
3,342 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: Klang



QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Oct 26 2020, 04:32 PM)
Oh My gosh, it's a relief to know that someone else (not to mentions people with more exp in bodybuilding) drink less water than me hahaha.

I always 'beat myself up' around the fact that I did not drink enough; because of the last urine+blood test, doc said my hydration level is a few 'degree' away from optimal.

Maybe I'll try creatine next week + lil bit more water & see. Maybe that also ramp-up my motivation brows.gif
*
Haha.. Very lazy to go drink water..

You will feel nothing for first week or two. Then slowly realize you can do more reps on following week.

QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Oct 27 2020, 01:15 AM)
1) Oh yes, holding the breath for proper bracing do exaggerate my out of breath condition. Probably one of the reasons today was a bit easier as I hold my breath less.

2) Height: 170, current weight 55 (was 46 before my 'diet' on May, started training on July), Bf%: I think 15-18% now as I see faint abs & rib cage, but don't know accurately really  hmm.gif

3) Still learning & correcting my compound form along the way.

4) The weight on the compound movement increased a bit, but still lame in comparison to a typical male (yeah I sedar diri  tongue.gif ). Below is the starting weight and where I am now (for 12 reps):

Squat 20kg ----> 30kg (scared to increase more weight for now as squat makes me reflux)
Deadlift 30kg ----> 45kg
Bench 18kg ----> 35kg
OHP 18kg ----> 26kg
bend over row 14kg ----> 30kg
pull-up 3 reps ----> 10 reps
Push up 3 reps ---> 20 reps ; now doing weighted push up 10KG 12reps

I do the workout at home, with barbell, dumbbells & resistance band.

5) Consistency, I'd say so-so. In these 4 months, I only have 35 workout sessions. Improving my body is kinda a 'reward' to myself after a certain successful project. So I seldom force myself on days that I really don't want to do it. Oh yeah, I did pause my workout for a month after getting sick for stomach problem (August)
*
You only hold your breath for heavy attempt. Other reps you just brace and keep breathing like normal.

If you hold & brace every single rep. You don't lift anything also feel dizzy already.

Build strength first. Don't go 12reps on compound movement. Go 5-8 and keep increasing weights. Once you have decent strength then only do 12-15 controlled reps to keep the tension.
guysmiley
post Oct 28 2020, 04:44 PM

Getting Started
**
Junior Member
139 posts

Joined: Dec 2012


QUOTE(Spitzer @ Oct 26 2020, 11:27 PM)
Correct, to see any solid difference, at least 4-6 months of consistent effort must be done first! And if really things doesn't go your way - be very critical in evaluating your own effort or just get a personal trainer - as they will be accountable to evaluate every aspect towards hitting your goal (not those stupid p.trainers u see in gym who help ppl how to bench press only)

oh and.. 78-82 kg, that's fat for someone that short right? How's it feel to experience being skinny, and then fat, which is better?  biggrin.gif
*
i prefer to be skinny. then i can skateboard better. now too heavy to ollie. hahaha

im 173cm, so the weight is ok lah. but i think my joints not used to the sudden weight gain. so from personal experience, dont gain too sudden.
Spitzer
post Nov 2 2020, 04:39 PM

Getting Started
**
Junior Member
138 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: K.Hills



QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Oct 27 2020, 01:15 AM)
1) Oh yes, holding the breath for proper bracing do exaggerate my out of breath condition. Probably one of the reasons today was a bit easier as I hold my breath less.

2) Height: 170, current weight 55 (was 46 before my 'diet' on May, started training on July), Bf%: I think 15-18% now as I see faint abs & rib cage, but don't know accurately really  hmm.gif

3) Still learning & correcting my compound form along the way.

4) The weight on the compound movement increased a bit, but still lame in comparison to a typical male (yeah I sedar diri  tongue.gif ). Below is the starting weight and where I am now (for 12 reps):

Squat 20kg ----> 30kg (scared to increase more weight for now as squat makes me reflux)
Deadlift 30kg ----> 45kg
Bench 18kg ----> 35kg
OHP 18kg ----> 26kg
bend over row 14kg ----> 30kg
pull-up 3 reps ----> 10 reps
Push up 3 reps ---> 20 reps ; now doing weighted push up 10KG 12reps

I do the workout at home, with barbell, dumbbells & resistance band.

5) Consistency, I'd say so-so. In these 4 months, I only have 35 workout sessions. Improving my body is kinda a 'reward' to myself after a certain successful project. So I seldom force myself on days that I really don't want to do it. Oh yeah, I did pause my workout for a month after getting sick for stomach problem (August)
*
i think you should put more focus/research about breathing during each lifts then. Im not expert enough to explain in detail because it's something i naturally learn what works best for me... but even myself don't hold my breath the whole duration incl unracking part - you'll feel pening that man, im sure alot of ppl can relate.

Also - don't worry about the # of kg's you're lifting, seriously in gym i can say noone cares if you're lifting an empty bar pun as long as you're not obviously fooling around hogging the spot. What's important is you MUST progress/increase your weights to actually see improvements/changes past the initial honeymoon stage of 1-4 months of muscle/physiological changes.

but if you just want to stay healthy, then it's not so important la... just keep practicing proper form, you'll know you have proper form by constantly leaving the gym without joint/bone/nerve pain, and only that sweet muscle soreness the next day.
TSpergilahsayang
post Nov 16 2020, 10:22 PM

Casual
***
Junior Member
308 posts

Joined: Dec 2008
From: NoT WoRTh TelLiNg


QUOTE(Amedion @ Oct 28 2020, 10:19 AM)
Haha.. Very lazy to go drink water..

You will feel nothing for first week or two. Then slowly realize you can do more reps on following week.
You only hold your breath for heavy attempt. Other reps you just brace and keep breathing like normal.

If you hold & brace every single rep. You don't lift anything also feel dizzy already.

Build strength first. Don't go 12reps on compound movement. Go 5-8 and keep increasing weights. Once you have decent strength then only do 12-15 controlled reps to keep the tension.
*
QUOTE(Spitzer @ Nov 2 2020, 04:39 PM)
i think you should put more focus/research about breathing during each lifts then. Im not expert enough to explain in detail because it's something i naturally learn what works best for me... but even myself don't hold my breath the whole duration incl unracking part - you'll feel pening that man, im sure alot of ppl can relate.

Also - don't worry about the # of kg's you're lifting, seriously in gym i can say noone cares if you're lifting an empty bar pun as long as you're not obviously fooling around hogging the spot. What's important is you MUST progress/increase your weights to actually see improvements/changes past the initial honeymoon stage of 1-4 months of muscle/physiological changes.

but if you just want to stay healthy, then it's not so important la... just keep practicing proper form, you'll know you have proper form by constantly leaving the gym without joint/bone/nerve pain, and only that sweet muscle soreness the next day.
*
Happy to report that my workout has improved significantly. No more light-headed. I focused more on lifting heavier weight at 8 reps. I also had the courage to increase my squat weight little by little without inducing the feeling of puking.

It has been 19 days since I took creatine. Happy to tell you that my stomach is okay yay!

Some of my workouts like bench, ohp , pushup and some isolation work do have extra 2 rep with creatine, but not all movement. Weird. I can also do more workout at one go (previously I had to separate some movement in the morning & night for certain session because muscle just won't 'fire' any longer).

Recovery --> It's really hard to get as much DOMS as before now with creatine. I know its a good thing, but I felt unaccomplished? hahaha

Water retention? ---> Initially I wanna take creatine so that maybe I'll look fuller when the muscle retains the water (tricking my mind to be even more motivated hahaha). But I think I don't notice any muscle gets significantly bigger after creatine hahaha.

Pic of progress from July to now:
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «



Not a huge result, but I think I can be happy with this considering I am doing it for fun (make it fun, and I can do it forever yooo). Also no more visible rib cage & other bones. But I can only imagine if I took this a little bit more seriously like many gym go-er , fuhhh probably even more significant result tongue.gif


Amedion
post Nov 17 2020, 12:21 PM

It's a bird! No, it's a plane! No, it's star
*******
Senior Member
3,342 posts

Joined: Jul 2005
From: Klang



QUOTE(pergilahsayang @ Nov 16 2020, 10:22 PM)
Happy to report that my workout has improved significantly. No more light-headed. I focused more on lifting heavier weight at 8 reps. I also had the courage to increase my squat weight little by little without inducing the feeling of puking.

It has been 19 days since I took creatine. Happy to tell you that my stomach is okay yay!

Some of my workouts like bench, ohp , pushup and some isolation work do have extra 2 rep with creatine, but not all movement. Weird. I can also do more workout at one go (previously I had to separate some movement in the morning & night for certain session because muscle just won't 'fire' any longer).

Recovery --> It's really hard to get as much DOMS as before now with creatine. I know its a good thing, but I felt unaccomplished? hahaha

Water retention? ---> Initially I wanna take creatine so that maybe I'll look fuller when the muscle retains the water (tricking my mind to be even more motivated hahaha). But I think I don't notice any muscle gets significantly bigger after creatine hahaha.

Pic of progress from July to now:
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

Not a huge result, but I think I can be happy with this considering I am doing it for fun (make it fun, and I can do it forever yooo). Also no more visible rib cage & other bones. But I can only imagine if I took this a little bit more seriously like many gym go-er , fuhhh probably even more significant result  tongue.gif
*
Keep it up bro.

 

Change to:
| Lo-Fi Version
0.0289sec    0.70    5 queries    GZIP Disabled
Time is now: 26th November 2020 - 08:09 PM