Hello kopitiam, I have a dilemma. Recently my company have been recruiting new staff for various position. One of which is a position within my department. Everything went well and there's an able candidate that have passed all the checks and interview and now only require my signature to process his offer letter.

Here's the thing. The candidate had submitted the usual documents for offer letter processing including the latest pay slip from his current company. I took a look at the pay slip and immediately notice the candidate current salary which I believe is too high. I do not have proof but I have a gut feeling the salary slip is doctered or photoshopped because for his level of experience and years of service, it is still a good 40% more. I'm familiar of the candidate current company and the pay slip format is correct. I have spoken to HR about this and they said they cannot verify and that it's not that unusual for the difference in pay.

I would like some of you experts or have experience this same dilemma as me for some feedback. Is there anyway for me to verify the salary slip? I'm hoping for some insight before I decide if I should call the candidate current company for verification.

Thanks for any input

I'll be able to better help if you can upload the "doctered or photoshopped" slip here.

call the candidate company HR directly..

Ask candidate share the income tax and epf lar

Hi Aaron Ong

Sorry I cannot share that.

Have you encounter this problem before? I have absolutely no proof. It's merely a feeling and experience on my side that makes me think it's doctered. Calling up the candidate HR would give up the game

EPF is P&C la.

of cos not..im not in the HR field..

or u can find some who is very pro in photoshop...

The is no law stated employer valid to check the employee or next employee payslip etc. PPDA does covered for employee instead as normal citizen.

Lu tarak duit mau bayar gaji. Move on..why want to kiasu cheapsake klu sudah ada budget?

Why not? If jelly cakap je la.

salary should be what the role deserves. not what the candidate's last drawn salary. his last salary shouldn't matter if you already decided he is worth hiring at the salary that your company offers

it's people like you that makes job hunting a pain in the ass.

Truth story, pbb girl asked me login to epf and show her my account. Because she is very pretty so I just showed to her

To be honest, I don't like the culture of Malaysia to share the payslip.
The offer should be based on the performance of the individual and his/her experience. It should follow the market rate for those experience and capability.

I believed that one of the reason why people are moving out from Malaysia because they are not being compensated well. People in Malaysia tend to move to another companies after one or two years, I think personally due to this also.

no. never ever do this. this is unethical!!!!

ask HR to call the candidate, ask for evidence that the salary is banked into account, oe EA form etc.....

Not in SOP. Also hard to justify to candidate for such documents.

Sorry forgot to clarify that the pay slip is not original. It's a photocopied. It's clear and I'm familiar with that company's pay slip look genuine. Only the basic figure I find odd

I can double the salary of everyone in my department but that doesn't mean I should. We are already willing to give an offer to the candidate but if my guess is true, it's a major red flag for me. It's less about the money and more about integrity

this

I'm pretty sure you are not from the financial industry if you can say like that.

For financial institutions (Bank/investment/insurance), BNM has already set a strict screening rule.

It is compulsory for the prospective company to contact the past employers for up to 7 years to check on their background.

one of the key screening is of course to check with present company on employment records & also salary verification.


First time I hear a HR saying dunno what to do when they think the salary slip is forged....

so why don't you lol

there are obviously better ways to test for integrity if u wanted to. furthermore a person's integrity may change for better or worse over time

Totally agree. If HR reveals it to another company, I don't think the HR is professional enough.
Professionalism in Malaysia will need to be improved.
Even if HR wants to reveal also, they should get the consent from the employee.

It comes back to the question "Why in the first place the staff wants to fake the salary?".
Is it because the employee was not paid well and look for another job so that he/she can be compensated well?

Please contact Aaron Ong as soon as possible. He memang the bestest in HR related issues.

If you're not HR then who are you to kepoh?

Is that all you showed? Wasted opportunity

No I'm not from the finance industry. HR response, or lack there off is probably because the company already green lit the candidate. I suspected the slip was doctered because I'm very familiar with the candidate current company and that basic is very unusual.

I care because the candidate are to fill a position in my sandbox.

You mad fresh grad higher celery than you ma

She got impressed or not

I have a big problem with people looking at previous pay slips.

You pay people according to what they can contribute to the company, what added value they can bring, how much you need those skills, how rare are those skills, what premium you might need to pay for those skills and whether the person is a good fit for the company.

The previous pay slip could show the person was grossly underpaid, or grossly overpaid. If grossly underpaid, and you rigidly follow this pay slip thing, you are not going to get any candidates. If grossly overpaid, are you going to pay that as well because of the payslip? I hope not. Assess the candidate, not the previous pay slip.

The practice is not something the western countries follow. It is just a stupid practice that Asian HR follow because they can't think of something more useful and relevant to do.

Focus on the value the candidate can bring to company. Not his or her past celery

Lol..reminds me of my past experience with the hr from a factory in melaka...lol she wants to low balled me la dont belip my current salari and calls me 2-3 times asking for copy of my payslip she insists that i is tipu her..later i sent email to her my scanned payslip terus she call me back n say sori they kenot afford to pay according my rate...lol...

why not just ask him if he is willing to provide further proof of salary banked into his account like bank statements

Its back to your own juristiction after all. If the guy is legit. He's good. You want him. Just pay..its about the trust. 2 ways of trust..simple.

Do not put the a line expecting people to be honest what so ever. This is not a perfect world after all.

ipohmali teaching is never wong..

ohwai

msia is just another cheap labour country, why bother demanding good candidates? just hire bangla...

+1

Everyone, this candidate is not a fresh grad. The candidate is a 15 year veteran and my company is offering a position that is both an upgrade to his title and wages. The candidate already got the job so to speak. This dilemma of mine is about doctered salary slip. Not about the worth of the candidate because ALREADY GREEN LIT FOR APPOINTMENT. The salary indicated in suspected slip has no bearing because we offered way more.

All the above does not absolve the fact that it could be doctored and that's a whole different story.

If we request further documents, it would require a proper explanation. Any explanation given would indicate suspicion, even though it's just my own gut feeling but then the wheels of SOP would turn. Any suspicion of fake credential must be investigated throughly and the candidate letter of appointment will be withheld indefinitely until concrete proof provided. This ladies and gents, is not how I want my newest staff to start their employment. Especially if we will be working closely.

I'm asking for idea that doesn't turn all this upside down on the off chance the slip is genuine. It would not look good

you pay what you think makes sense for the level of experience and market value.

who cares about the payslip?

if it's too high compared to what you expected, don't hire - why you need /k here to advise?

pay peanuts get monkeys. nuff said.

if this is the case, then just let go. just trust the candidate and let him/her do his/her work. dont be judgemental or bias.

Agree!!

This is budaya Malaysia workforce.

Just curious. If his past salary is inflated by 40%, how much is TS paying now? Usually to korek people over, TS sure pay higher than previous employer.
For example, his payslip is showing RM 140K but TS belip actual celery is RM 100K. So how much is TS paying? RM 170K? Now TS feel the candidate doesn't worth RM 170K after seen the payslip?
Ayam confius

This

Agree bro.

Cheapskate boss follow previous salary to lowball candidate.

if got job liao, just check with his previous company HR. tell them that ur comp asked u to verify the slip (if last drawn, last drawn). no point losing sleep over this. is he your boss or u have shit relationship with him?

so let me get this straight, company already want to hire this candidate and able to offer the salary that is agreed upon. but you want to save money and want to lowball him further???

paying people based on salary slip

Do you take a long time to come up with such fable stories?

if he lied about his pay, but you willing to pay him that much, isn't there probation period to see if he can do his job well?

You're just pissed that there's a slight chance you could have hired him for 40% less? don't so cheapskate lar....

Using your example, we would still hire the candidate for the amount we are offering. The inflated 40% had no bearing. But it still does not make doctered credential right. If my suspicion is true that is.

This is a real headache

His current pay is really none of your fucking business. If you made this a mandatory step to get offer letter and you get doctored slip, you fucking deserve it.

It's not my money that pays him. I have no qualm about that. But it's akin to getting pulled one over you. Minimum 3 months probation but the candidate won't have a problem because the skill is there. That one cannot fake

submitting income tax form is a standard SOP of any reputable company

then what other headache you have?

i think you are thinking too much. sendiri cari pasal.

stop it la TS, just say its standard SOP in your bloodsucking department to lowball everyone to keep shareholders happy.

p.s. can we get this tered to 10 pages?

Why you idiots offer the pay according to last drawn salary and think it is justified ?

Last time I worked for a non profit organization as an IT support and got paid RM 300 monthly.

When I go for interview in an IT company, they wanted to offer according to my last salary and I directly told them it's non-profit org that only can pay RM 300, so is it they are going to offer RM 400 for IT support in a professional IT company ?

Straight away shut them up good, and I don't even want to bother continue with the interview since they don't have a figure in mind.



If you have a vacancy, you should put your offered salary for the expected responsibilities.

This post has been edited by Hattori: Feb 18 2020, 09:34 PM

Thats very common to edit payslip.

U alrdy have the justification. Dont know what hold u back to ask more supporting doc unless u are not in a position to hire or not

If u cant further verify then your sign is not relevant. Sign or no sign also hired

This post has been edited by JungWoo: Feb 18 2020, 09:35 PM

U just jelly his salary high la.

In the end not ur money also. Apa lu mau kesah.

Once u get fired u will know ur loyalty wif kampani is kinda foolish.

U are a pawn just like the guy u hire.. Not a shareholder.

Belajar la dik.

True syoreyz.

Lancau... Aaron Ong is back

Did she sucks your D after that?

Epf kan ada

Mohon ipohmali AKA Aaron Ong masuk meet satu kepala geng is this your dupe aaron ong

the jealousy is strong in this thread.

my advise is just move on. pointless to butthurt over a spilled milk.

there is a chinese saying

dont hire someone you dont trust, hire someone you should trust him/her

Sounds like most people here would want people who doctored credential to work for them...........

Jus close 1 eye and approve la...
Not ur father comp pun or mother money...
Kasi chan la...

This show pay slip thingy is among the stupid practice done here in malaysia. Just because some so called smart alec did it before, the rest just follow.

It is just to lowball candidate, nothing else. If see current pay higher than what can pay, buat bodoh and push for what they can pay. Like that, don’t request from the beginning if have own idea how much to pay.

Should stop this nonsense practice.

pay slip not pnc meh?

If it is your concern on "doctored" pay slip, then call him personally and interview him face to face again, test his integrity. If really suspicious about this, and yet do not want to spend more time, look for other people then.
honestly, if me, i will not provide my payslip, as it is related to my personal experience and knowledge. You decide how much I worth and to pay, not based on the past payslip.

If he is really good and deserves the amount your company agreed upon, then hire lor

But you donno whether the slip is doctored or not. You make an assumption and being prejudice.

In other words, you are aaron ong chinaman boss.

if dont iike then just dont hire la......

u scared because it had been approved, you will get into problem if you dont sign?

you thoughts are clouding your judgement. if you do not agree to employ this person, then just skip. there are other candidates there for you to choose, right? unless the one you choose is not favoured by your superiors la.......

You push people with underhanded moves like pay slips, then get back underhanded lash back and complain?

Fuck off lah. You don't deserve honesty or loyal employees.

if interviews all pass and you want the candidate，bayar jer lah，if not afford，interviews others，why so butthurt？

you own the company is it？

why you care how much he earns in his previous job???
your company is paying for his future efforts, just monitor during his probation if justified for salary.

RM1 is also considered too much for goons

What if you are wrong? How will you remedy it?

Either call him back from interview, clarify this matter with him, or just go ahead and go through with the hiring process. You basically have no proof, but you're so hung up on him doctoring the payslip. It's no longer a matter of you not wanting to work with someone "with no integrity", it's becoming more of a "I was right all along" mentality. It's personal to you now, just look at your responses in the thread.

If he has the skills to back it up then why not. The salary he requested has been approved. So it is still under budget. That simply means now he is paid with what he deserved.

with TS experience mind set yet can be hired as HR，i know the company have no future already...

soli ah TS，i know truth hurt！

tldr
ts = idiot

No, we’re wondering why you’re so hung up over the matter.

The candidate has the required skill set and experience plus his asking salary has been approved. Let it go la.

Haha remind me of one of my cousin who graduate and work in Ipoh. His ski is good and I advise him to come KL

Guess what, some company really offer based on his last drawn which make me laugh so hard that it can't even match a fresh graduate. Luckily has a good cousin here stopping him accpting those offer

TS, very simple

Ask HR to contact the candidates to come to your offices

Ask him to login to either his online EPF or Bank account using your office desktop

You can then see his net salary or EPF contribution and work out the details of his gross pay

If it checks out, you give him offer letter on the spot

If not you withdraw his offer

Plain and simple

This..if u think hes not worth it then find others and dont lowball ppl

This post has been edited by yeezai: Feb 18 2020, 10:20 PM

call the candidate current company for verification

lol this guy be crazy

after 5 pages, ts:



This post has been edited by Phoenix_KL: Feb 18 2020, 10:26 PM

imagine asking someone whos been working for over 15 years in the industry to log into their personal bank accounts using a computer that is centrally connected with the rest of the network and expect them to cooperate.
professionalism is a joke in mereisia.

p.s. free bump

As a rule of thumb, you are shortlisting a candidate based on the skill sets, experience and salary range that fits in to your budget. During the interview, if the candidate is good, you give him an offer and by this time I believe you already knew his salary expectations. Now, in this case, you are NOT the HR. You feel the pay slip is doctored and have gotten feedback from the HR that this is nothing unusual with the difference in pay. So, all you need to do is, leave his previous pay out of scope as its HR's problem and not yours. It's not YOUR JOB to find if his payslip it's altered or not. What you need to consider really, is whether he is good during the interview and and you think he can add value to the position.

This is because TS doubt the guy salary

I have changed jobs many times before and no one has ever doubted my salary

I would ask for EPF Statement as proof but some ppl says it can be forged

If TS really has doubts and contact the candidates HR could jepotdise the candidate current job, this is the best way to clear TS doubts

I am not saying its for all candidates, just to clear TS doubts on this particular issue

A lot of people forge pay slip and d0cument, especially all the K earning 20k above. Most of them added 1 more zero.

TS, should call the guy up, and ask him does him forge the payslip, and prove if he say otherwise.

This post has been edited by kelvinfixx: Feb 18 2020, 10:32 PM

There are 2 issues here... first is the salary, which I think is a non-issue. The company shouldn't ask for it in the first place.

Now the 2nd issue is that the candidate (potentially) lying about his salary... which is give bad impression to the candidate.

Doctored documents are serious matter. I would call him up and ask him to bring the original documents. All documents, certs, pay slip etc. Photocopy and certify on site.

Maybe he didn't just doctored his payslip. Maybe he doctored more than that.

I have seen ppl doctoring their qualifications. Not too bothered by payslip though as we will offer what we can based on the candidate.

Just say this is company policy to check all original documents on the spot before issue offer letter.
Every company got different policy.

If he cannot show, then there must be something fishy.

This post has been edited by joey2000: Feb 18 2020, 10:39 PM

The only guy who understood the serious side of it. Thank you!

Do I have to repeat why confronting is not the best choice?

It's bad for me cause, duh, I'm accusing something very serious and I could be wrong.

It's bad for the candidate because put yourself in his shoe. Do you want to start a new work this way? (if innocent)

The candidate will add much needed exp and skill no doubt about it. I guess my beef is with the act itself more than their gain. Like I said the candidate cannot forge experience or skill that is confirmed.

Aiyah I now regret asking here... More headache

you will still have the probation period to assess his skillset and experience. if he is who he says he is, you should be able to tell when he starts. trust is important.

Malaysia should just completely ban and make it illegal for prospective employers to ask about previous salary.

It's completely stupid, just offer what the candidate is worth based on the market, not previous salary

People should tell their MP / government to enact laws to make it illegal for employers to ask job applicant's salary so that 1. Salary negotiations would not be lopsided, 2. Talents can eventually earn up to their potential rising out of middle income trap, 3. More talents can be retained in effort to develop the economy into high income economy.

Example of states adopting such laws: https://www.hrdive.com/news/salary-history-...es-list/516662/