A raid n00b question since I've not raided pre-BC.

I just took a look at my Spell stats recently and realised that Spell Penetration was zero and the Spell Hit was about 94 (7.45%). A guildmate recommended to get Spell Hit as high as 16% to be effective for raid bosses.

1) For a shadow priest, what should the Spell Hit and Spell Penetration be?

2) Is it possible to achieve 16% with tailored gear, Kara gear and Heroic gear only?

1) spell hit around 10-15%

2) close, but not 16%

hmm....can u give me the name of a shadow priest with those stats that I can armory?

so far, have only compared against Addict's Hansuke since that's probably the only shadow priest that I know in LYN.

check out maybe juice or insurrection guild on horde side.

asia pacific guild... maybe twisted by design? or dimsum

wah..i never seen any shadow priest that i know off on my server with that high spell hit..
most are around 2-4% only.. :\

hmmm...checking out a few other shadow priests, looks like it's not easy to hit even 10% hit rating. they seem to be targeting 1.2k spell damage first and only then tackling the hit rating.

spell dmg comes first and foremost no matter what, chances of you actually landing the spell as opposed to resists (spell hit/pene counter) are much much higher.

Yea, try aim for 1k spellpower unbuff before going for +hit and +crit. It will be sufficient enough for SSC and TE.

Your guildmate is right about the 16% for raiding. Let me explain why you need the 16%.



Source taken from http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/basics/spells.html

Looking at the quoted text above, all bosses we fight with will have a lvl difference of +3, meaning the percentage for our spells to hit without talents and +spell hit rating items is 83%. Adding in another 16% will give you the 99% hit rating cap. And since 12 spell hit rating = 1%, you will require +192 spell hit rating to achieve the 16% spell hit cap.

However, since us shadow priests have this talent called Shadow Focus, my advice to you is to max out this talent for an additional 10% chance on shadow spells to hit or put 4/5 talents in it to achieve 8%.

Therefore, with 8-10% chance on spell to hit, you only need an additional 8-6%, or 96-72 spell hit rating on your gear to achieve the spell hit cap.

The head and chest piece of your Incarnate Regalia set gives 16 and 17 spell hit rating respectively. Also, there are plenty of pre-raiding dungeons that provide blue drops with +spell hit rating.

Don't ask me about my spell hit rating; its still far below the spell hit cap.

Yumiakira, but this was strictly Before BC gear only

qua : okie dokie.

postboy : ta. time to find better gems. as well as better gear. planning to aim for spellstrike set after i get my chest piece done. will probably take awhile urgh.

flush : hee hee...i can understand that. my spell hit is nothing to brag about either but my spell damage needs quite a bit of boosting. need to slot my red gems in. getting broke a bit as lazy to do quests now.

nVidiaFX : cheers.

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Added on July 12, 2007, 12:46 pm http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=rxMhzhZZEGgzMtRotVo

flush, how's this build with Shadow Focus max out? The last point, i just put into Focused Mind as no idea where to put it.

I also took blackout for PvP a bit but left out the crits for Shadow Power.

This post has been edited by myremi: Jul 12 2007, 12:51 PM

Yeap you'll need 16% for bosses in raids because they're all lvl73 mobs and by default you only ahve 83% chance to land a hit on them. The max you can go is 99% which is why you'll be needing 16%.

Spell hit rating is always more valuable than spell damage in raid bosses fights if you haven't reach the cap yet. Once you're at 99% then invest on Spell Dmg.

It is possible to reach 16%. Get Spellstrike Hood and Pants. And fill them with +hit gems or those +hit and +dmg gems.

Thanks khelben. Going to try and test it out a bit then. Currently, the pants I'm wearing are the Trial-Fire ones that drop from Opera Event. Haven't started on Spellstrike set yet but will do soonest.

Hmm..is there any interactive website that allows one to test the build of a cloth + talent + gemslots?

I would prefer Focused Mind maxed out since Mind Blast and Mind Flay, esp Mind Flay, will be your primary
spells besides SWP and VT and 10% cheaper mana = alot in the long run. You can move the 2 points you put in VE into Focused Mind. This is because in raids, esp. 25 mans, I hardly put VE on unless I'm in the main tank's grp.

You might want to shave off the talent points in Spirit Tap and put 2 points in Improved Mind Blast, 1 in Absolution (Disc) and 2 in Mental Agility (Disc).

But then, if you are planning on using ur priest to farm for the mats for the Shadow's Embrace set, then keep Spirit Tap first until you have farmed your mats. While it may be easy to time the last hit for 5 man dungeons with MB or SW:D, you will rarely get the killing blow off of 25 man dungeons with another 12 or so dps classes competing.

Oh btw, Improved PW:S doesn't scale that well with spell dmg + healing gear, since only 10% of your +heal bonus adds to your shield. But for holy spec with tonnes of +heal, it does. So it is a choice of just putting 1 talent in Imp PW:S and moving 2 talents into Martyrdom, or leaving it as it is. But Martyrdom will really save ur ass both in PVE and PVP.

And like what Khelben said, focus on your spell hit gear first. Veiled Noble Topaz is a really good friend of Shadow Priests.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=rxRMkhbZZihgdMtohtVo

how's thing now? although there's one point into Silent Resolve.

phew. learning ain't easy.

U really should keep ur talents in Imp SW:P cos with talents, it is the most mana efficient dmg spell available to a shadow priest.

Just imagine, SW:P without talent is 18 sec DoT. Your base dmg from the highest rank SW:P is 1800 dmg. Without +spell dmg gear, that gives you 100 per sec. So with 2 talent points, you get an additional 300 dmg.

How SW:P scales with +dmg gear is that, since it is a damage over time spell component, you get 99% benefit out of your + spell dmg bonus.

And the + spell dmg bonus is calculated (spell dmg)/18 secs. Not spell dmg/24 secs.

Let's say for example, you have 900 spell dmg bonus. You gain an additional of 50dmg per sec (900/18). Multiply that buy 24 secs u gain (50dmg X 24sec) = 1200.

When you take into account shadow weaving, darkness and misery, u gonna melt faces with that 2 talent points.

CAn't really explain much more for now, im alt tabbing in gruul's lair atm.

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Added on July 12, 2007, 5:00 pmbtw silent resolve not really necessary. ur not holy spec n ur not pvping hard. 1 talent point doesnt do much. and 2 points in spirit tap isn't very good either

This post has been edited by flush: Jul 12 2007, 05:01 PM

bleargh, i need your armory link. playing with limited talent points per tier is excrutiating. the final i could play around with was this one :

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=rxRMkhbZZihgdMtohtVo

but it involved deducting points from Blackout and maxing out Darkness.

so, after your gruul, post up a good build please. my head is already aching.

Are u going for PVP or PVE? or you mixing both? you can't get best talent if you're going for both.

If you focusing more on PVE, check my new talent, but i took silence...most of the fully PVE spec they dont get improve fear and silence. I took it just for some out door pvp LOL. others are into PVE.

Hehe finished d. Got the collar of chogall!!

here's a link to my ideal build, not my current one yet as i am still using farming spec GG

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=dxMRkhhZZVGTuMpohtVo

Ok, I put 3 points in Shadow Affinity, but what you should do is just put 2 points there first. You can choose to either move that talent point into Shadow Focus, or Shadow Weaving.

The reason behind it is because your spell dmg gear might not be that high at the moment and you shouldn't have to worry about threat that much. Plus, u can ask a pally to salv u

I put 3 points in MB because by the time you cast SW:P, VT, mind flay X 2, ur MB cd should be ready. But you can also choose to move that talent into other points like Mental Agility, Shadow Weaving if its not maxed, or Shadow Focus.

Try it out with only 42 or 41 talent points in Shadow, Shadow Affinity with only 2 talents and Imp Mb with only 2 talent points. If in raids, u find that your aggro is too near the threshold, you can put the additional talent point in Shadow Affinity and choose either Shadow Weaving or Imp MB.

Good luck with your experimenting.

<-----
always going to spell dmg for farming, and +spell hit for raiding.
and my max hit rating only 8% T_T

questions: does that means hit rating important for a prot warrior too when going to raid?

its the best TPS stat to have. And hey look waht i got today =p

http://www.wowhead.com/?item=30102

check out nihilum or death and taxes guild

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Added on July 13, 2007, 2:47 amdefinitely

This post has been edited by colincsf: Jul 13 2007, 02:47 AM

Dun bother the hit, just go for stam and dodge.

check out drlovetalk on khazgorath

He is my guild priest leader, and about 3rd best geard on my server currently (just kara,tailored and gruuls gear)

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Added on July 13, 2007, 10:33 amHuh? its not as important as +sta, def and dodge....no point being able to hit the boss 100% of the time if u get squished all the time.

This post has been edited by jwrx: Jul 13 2007, 10:33 AM

alot of epic eq includes + hit,sta,def,dodge all in one

avoidance & mitigation increases tremendously with higher tier gear. Hit just affects ur tps. I personally favour some hit over no hit at all. I've myself am sporting stats like 20% dodge, 17% parry and 38% block. With all that steady rage inc, u would like to land more attacks than less. And +hit is the best stats to increase ur TPS which in turn allows the raid to dps harder. Having too much avoidance generally is nvr reali a good thing. U may find urself lasting reali long but what u wan to achieve is constant dmg inc cos that supplies u with the rage and healers being more focused on u.

Having too much avoidance generally means allow healers to breath and heal others. With only 15 hit rating which come from a shield, i have no problem in TPS. My unbuff dodge , parry and block is 25.7%, 16.96%, 36.49%. Avoidance also helps alot when you receive too much spike damage that could probably 1 shot you.

yes what u mention has a valid point. But as tank, aside from focusing on the defensive aspect of it, ur tps is something u can look to improve. From my experience in ssc n tk, most bosses in the end requires heavy dps and to allow the raid to do that falls soley on the tank. And what are the ways for the tank to self increase his tps? +hit & +block value being the best 2. Shield slams crits for 2k (look at my armory n the amount of block value i have) and just that additional hit ( i generally use icon of unyielding courage +30hit trinket) really does wonders. That will take us to the point of my mitigation n avoidance. Is it sufficient? At this point of time in my progression lvl ( 6/6 ssc, 1/4 tk) i would most definitely say yes. The stats may seem low but 3 healers is all that is enuf to heal me while the rest can focus on the raid / OTs. There is no need for them to help heal but focus on me. (Dun forget being a tank, u have Last stand, Shield wall, Pots & healthstones all available to you to clutch save yourself ) And on the other hand, the raid benefits from the high TPS that i generate allowing them to dps alot harder, which gives u a faster dead boss.

This setup might most probably need to change comin into Hyjal / BT but as of now this is more than sufficient and in fact even more ideal. Surely being all defensive is what the tank should be doin but once u face and evaluate an encounter, u can find a happy medium as to what is enuf for mitigation & avoidance and actually push on for offensive stats. The only bosses i would say right now thats makes me wear my full tanking set is vashj n tidewalker. Others i will normally change my neck and trinket slots.

This post has been edited by Kurei: Jul 13 2007, 11:32 PM

With 1% hit. My average TPS is around 900-1000 for boss since they parry and dodge alot. And my progression, SSC 6/6, TE 2/4. Oh ya, i played taiwan server .

http://armory.wowtaiwan.com.tw/character-s...9F%B3&n=Postboy

sigh been waiting for that neck....

Ya, quite a nice necklace. But i would change using the maiden's neck when tanking Tidewalker, if a tank can survive tanking tidewalker for that 10min, he basically able to tank any bosses.

myremi : Check out http://www.shadowpriest.com .

ta cityman. night shift again? hee hee....
and thanks for the website link. forgot about that site.

although they mention a lower hit rating than 16%. i'm not sure but i get the feeling that they're now using 8% with the spell hit rating to be 76 with Shadow Focus 5/5 talent. http://www.shadowpriest.com/viewtopic.php?t=3384

one of the postings in that forum is also on the curator fight. differnet school's of thought. some go full out on astral flares. others are just focusing on curator. atm, aside from the initial SW:P, VE and VT on curator, i then help out on the flares coz it's hard for the melee to bring everyone of them down. however, becoz of the short range of MF, i'm standing always in front of the flare and always next to melee that i usually get blasted quick badly during the fight. what do the other shadowpriest do during Curator's fight? On Curator or flares?

They didn't mention a lower hit rating than 16%...

hmm...are the numbers derived based on calculation though? or does the character sheet values do not take into account talent bonus? because i have full shadow focus now and on character sheet is 101 hit rating showing 8%?

char sheet does not show ur talent bonus.
1% chance on spell hit = 12.5 spell hit rating which means u need 200 hit rating to reach the 16% cap. with 10% from talent u have more than enough spell hit currently. i only put 4 points into shadow focus so that i can play around with 1 more talent point.

ps. WAH! u got more spell hit from items than me!

errr, believe me, it was unintentional. lol! it's like the gear on the left hand side of the character sheet are blues whereas the right hand side of the character sheet is full epics. i was gearing up on spell damage and coincidently, spell hit was also on those items.

now just need to motivate myself to farm the spellstrike set and get 2 primal nethers.

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Added on July 18, 2007, 3:08 pmps. what is your armory link? >.>

This post has been edited by myremi: Jul 18 2007, 03:08 PM

Ya agreed. Went into tk last week, got alar down n solarian seems easy enuf barring raid make-up. Damn now reali need to try to get my stm up for kael.

my armory link?

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Added on July 19, 2007, 11:11 amwhy are u warriors hogging our thread!
/shakes fist
/cast mind flay

This post has been edited by flush: Jul 19 2007, 11:11 AM

Yea, alar and solarian got nerfed badly. The only frustrating part for kael is the trash mobs and the phase 1