If I knew, I'd be a whale, but I'm not, so

This is so off-topic.

AI is in fact logical (in our context so far; you could of course code AI to be probabilistic or entirely random instead of deterministic), far too much so without the restrain of emotions, empathy, nor human values (hence unable to build what we call "common sense"). That's why the typical example of an AI which when instructed to stop global warming, may choose to kill all humans as the best solution; or if asked to not kill humans in the process, may choose to deep cryogenic sleep humans instead.

But... off-topic.

This post has been edited by Enigmatic: Sep 16 2017, 12:31 AM

Some whale woke up, suddenly got buy order at 9 btc and 15 btc each... or is it the biggest whale, luno itself?

Luno, they normally trade at a premium from world's average though.. only earlier today they were lower when it hit 12k. Now its back to around RM700 premium.

Everyone expecting US market to wake up to a shock and continue to slide
someone just supported $3000 and up it goes https://www.coingecko.com/en/price_charts/bitcoin/usd

hehe, same boat you guys trying for 12k+, makan dinner suddenly shoot up. oh well.

Omg so many coins to choose from?

Which one? Tenx, monaco, Neo, Adex theyre currently a bit undervalued.

Hello Realist, welcome and please do not worry about sounding harsh here.
We are, after all, an open forum thread where opposing opinions are highly encouraged and debated in a civilised manner, so as long as you are respectful (no name-calling and derogatory remarks) then you're very much welcomed.
I am obviously no financial expert, so just trying to share my own views here for an intelligent discussion amongst peers.

You said people on this thread are deluded because we say bitcoins are cheap right now, at USD 3k plus. Yes, I personally still say it is cheap now. And one year ago it was massively cheap. Unbelievably cheap. Dirt cheap.
How do we assign value to something like bitcoin (or any other cryptocurrency, for that matter)? How can we say it is worth USD 10k? Or USD 100k? Or even USD 1 million?

Well, first of all (and this is important), we need to clarify here that the most valuable characteristic of bitcoin is not the bitcoin itself. It's the technology behind the concept of bitcoin, which is the distributed ledger concept. And the underlying implementation of this distributed ledger concept that is utilised by bitcoin, is the blockchain concept.
It is the confidence of the general public in this distributed ledger concept, that gives actual value to bitcoins and other digital currencies.
It is an extremely simple concept, really, but throughout the entire history of modern mankind, there has never been a time where financial transactions are totally transparent, immutable and free from direct manipulation by governments. No government can make more bitcoins than is capped by the protocol; no government can declare certain transactions void or invalid; no government can go back to delete or reverse a transaction; it cannot be hacked (well, strictly speaking, a powerful quantum computer will be able to, but let's leave that for another discussion); it cannot be shut down.
Just as we progressed from horse-drawn carriages to engine-driven automobiles, digital currencies are not only revolutionary......it is an inevitable evolutionary progression. Human technological advances cannot be stopped.
I don't understand your comparison of a digital currency to a laptop or a phone. Digital currencies are not supposed to be complex in that sense.

Of course prices can be manipulated, and it will be. Those who hold large amounts of it will be able to influence prices globally, just the same as oil-producing countries can manipulate global crude oil prices (imagine if OPEC suddenly agrees to shut off the tap in every oil-producing country in the world......) but in that same example, we have seen that such a drastic strategy has never been able to be implemented, because no matter how many internal agreements are made, people will always try to undercut and outsmart each other.

As to people putting money into something that is "not backed by anything", people do that every single day when they buy and sell gold, silver and any other precious metal and stone. None of them have income generating potential except for capital gains either. So, for example, if tomorrow, the whole world suddenly reaches a consensus and decides that nobody wants gold anymore, the price of gold will drop 90% immediately (remaining 10% is due to the real industrial use of gold in electronics, medicine, aerospace, etc.).
Same if you buy stocks in a company that doesn't pay dividends. You are buying the stock based solely upon the confidence that someday, someone else will be willing to pay a higher price for it to buy from you.
The notion that you need something to be "backed" by something else in order to have financial value, is a fallacy.
Real financial value is derived purely from one thing only: human perception.
Nothing to do with how complex it is, nor how rare it is, nor how useful it is.
It is the human perception that drives the demand for something, which ultimately influences the financial value of it.

And right now, millions of people around the world are confident that a borderless, unmanipulatable and cryptographically secure digital currency will be the next step in financial technology, and are willing to pay more than USD 3k for it, therefore it is worth that much.

And by the way, you may not know it yet, but there *are* real world use cases for cryptocurrencies. For example, TenX has a debit card that lets you actually swipe your card at any merchant globally that accepts Visa or MasterCard, and lets you pay directly in cryptocurrencies like bitcoin, ether, dash, etc. You can see videos on YouTube of people buying food, beer, etc. with cryptocurrencies.
People have been buying cars and houses, electronic gadgets and many other things with bitcoin.
Japan even recognises bitcoin as legal tender.
Just because you do not see it being widely adopted in Malaysia yet, doesn't mean it's not big elsewhere.

Ugh......sorry for the incredibly long post, folks.
I started typing and I just got carried away.
Didn't realise how long it was until I posted it.

lol.. do you have tldr version??

My attempt at TL:DR version would be :

1. A currency/metal or anything only has value if someone attach value to it.
- hence something cheap or not is only when you can look at it retrospectively (Compare it to the past).
- e.g if I tell you back in Jan 1k btc is cheap, you won't believe me. But after hitting 4-5k for a few months, 3k btc seems awfully cheap now.

2. BTC may or not be the future, but at the way it is, its looks so.
- adoptions are slowly being integrated across the world.
- not massively implemented yet in Malaysia doesn't means its useless.

Supreme TL:DR version: ...... Buy cryptocurrency.

Well written



Anyway, after giving out my Buy Call for Syscoin earlier and having it hit my TP of 8000sats, I've received several PMs asking me what to buy next.

Let me stress here, i do not have a solid level of knowledge in regards to cryptos as I'm still learning and getting myself accustomed to the philosophies and market cycles of cryptos. Getting used to the crypto market definitely is different from the traditional environment of trading in stocks (The volatility in cryptos are much higher than stocks which in return requires me to customise my trading methods for cryptos by setting looser stop-losses etc in order to match the volatility of the market)

After researching the next cryptos which i feel may do well for the short term-trading is NAV coin! Ive loaded my portfolio pretty heavy with this coin and I'm looking for it to hit the following TPs:

TP1: 30,000
TP2: 35,000
TP3: 38,500

[Trade on your own risk but do remember this, if you win on this trade, its because of me and if you loose on this thread, blame yourself for following my tips ]



penanghomes blue

This post has been edited by shankar_dass93: Sep 16 2017, 03:09 AM

NAV good call for short term

Rough night yesterday, much exited lol.

dammit. i slept too early cuz too tired. didnt buy during the dip

1st exchange is 30/09

2nd and 3rd exchange is 30/10 ( 1 more month)

@WengHerng

Very well written. Couldn't agree more.
It's human perception of how valuable something is that drives is value. All things are inherently invaluable until we put a price on it.
And when you think of it, our paper money is actually just paper, just that it's a consensus that the ringgit is a legal tender so everyone accepts.

I knew it. This is why nobody should trust the big bankers.

https://steemit.com/news/@jeffreyahann/jp-m...selling-bitcoin

More like the people wants to have a guaranteed news. and not a rumor. Since it is confirmed the last 2 exchange in China is gonna close down by 30 Oct, atleast they know they can still trade until that day.

Not like having the exchange close anytime soon with uncertainty and having users concerned with their wallets in the exchange.