This is for people who can only afford 1 property in their lifetime for own stay and below are the reasons:

1.You buy a rm500k condo, you need to pay rm50k upfront Downpayment, rm450k loan, at interest 4% for 30 years, you have to pay rm2.1k per month. Total interest paid would be rm323,409

2.Maintenance fee assume rm200 a month, 1 year is rm2.4k. that is rm2.3k per month just on the condo.

for rm2.3k, it's more than enough to rent a full unit and your rental already includes the maintenance fee and you still have big surplus.

A condo is not like Landed Properties, so Lease Hold or Free Hold doesn't matter much, the older the condo, the lower it's value, because unlike Houses, Highrise won't last forever and will sooner later be demolished to make way for new buildings.

So assume you get to stay in your condo for 60 years, that is rm500k+rm320k Interest investment for just 60 years. That might allow you to stay in the condo for your lifetime or maybe not enough. A simplified version would be you'll be spending rm13k a year for 60 years. Once the highrise reaches it's age, it has little value left, most likely you'll have difficulty selling it off 40 years old units, so you can either continue stay in it or rent it out for the rest of it's shelf life.

So assuming you are buying for own stay, it really is not much different from renting, it's actually cheaper to rent than buy, and less trouble some as when you own the property you have to pay for all the fixes everything you have to settle on your own.

Down side on renting is you have to look face of the owner, if lucky get good owner good unit then it's great, old units chances are the owners won't be able to sell it off even if he wants to, so he have to continue rent, sure rental goes up every year but it would still be cheaper than buying.

Advantage of renting is you have the freedom to move around, any problem just let owner settle, your risk is your potentially losing your deposits but even those amount are still cheaper than Owning. At the end of the day, you just do your part as a good tenant and wipe ur pants when you leave.

Note we are talking about rm500k condos which are considered average, there are many rm700k-1mil condos out there, sure they look good, feels good, but remember you'll be paying for maintenance fees on top of your loans, by the time you finish your loans, you are still paying the fees. and do the math, after 60 years, how much would you have paid for maintenance fee (rm200 x 12 x 60 =rm140k), high end condos easily cost rm500 per month.

Landed properties, even Lease Hold, at least you know the house should still be standing after 80 years, and there is still a chance you can renew your titles at a small fee. Condos, even Free Hold, pretty much worth nothing, ok maybe you get small amount of reimbursement but is nothing compared to the loans you paid for it.

Note this is for own stay and if you can only afford 1 property. Of course if later you dug goldmine buy a house you can rent or sell the condo, that is if you actually dug gold & can afford a 2nd house.

If you can't afford to pay your rents on time, you can't afford to own a property.

For short selling & rental, it might be possible to make profit, but depends heavily on location. For self stay, i say if you can't afford a landed property, better just rent.

Anyway #YOLO, if you really want to own a home, just buy 1. But hey at least i told you so.

inb4 #Rent4Life.

No drills? Tldr. TS is a faggot

Should add consider using a satria

People buy what you kesah apa?

Suka sangat wanna jaga tepi kain orang.

conclusion ts is a jelous faggot

Should build rumah setinggan in the middle of roundabout.

U didnt consider the rent rate will go up gradually after each time change owner. 1st owner bought the unit at 500k after that new owner buy it at 700k n so on. New owner will increase the rate to minimise his installment. Some owner even increase the rate following market rate even though he is the 1st owner.

So in 60 years, u will be paying the current market rent rate of the unit, whereby if u bought the unit 60 years b4 u are just still paying installment for 500k unit.

Completed April 11, 1931; 86 years ago[2][3]
Opening May 1, 1931; 86 years ago
Cost $40,948,900[4]
($645 million in 2016 dollars[5])


The Empire State Building was "officially transferred over to the nascent Empire State Realty Trust for $1.89 billion" in October 2013. http://therealdeal.com/blog/2013... So, we know it's worth at least that.Aug 14, 2014

Actually what TS say does make sense. But actually the loan interest theory is applicable to landed property aswell. Just that landed property tend to appreciate more in the long run. But cons are the rental yield are usually lower for landed property. With endless new property development in our country, I doubt it will be easy to let go even a landed property.

I choose to purchase a non landed property because of location and for future upgrade, condo will provide a better cash flow with it having higher demand in the rental market and lower entry price even for future buyer. If buy landed property, need to have deep pocket if planning to relocate in future. Low rental yield and takes time to let go.

so you're comparing a famous skyscraper in a prime location vs some condo/apartments in KL/PJ?

do you know the spec for skyscrapers are much higher than condos? and do you know how much annually they spend on maintenance & repair? and how much it cost to refurbish old buildings?

sure if you have the money to splash you can even make Pizza Tower straight. but who would wanna refurbish old condos? unless it's monumental. sorry folks, old highrise apartments holds little value.

It's a common fallacy highrises lasts only 60+ years. It's all about d built kualiti and d maintenance. Konkrit bloody lasts FOREVER!

advocado datang lagi

Don't jealous

rent 1500 for 30 years = paid 540k and own nothing. errr doesnt sound too good does it?

This post has been edited by pisces88: May 31 2017, 01:40 AM

u havent factor in the increment in rental too. like my own condo, i increased rental by 10% after 3 years.

assuming :

year 1-3 = RM54k rental paid
year 4-6 = RM59k rental paid
year 7-9 = RM65k rental paid
year 10-13 = RM70k rental paid. lets say the increment stops here.

and so on until 30 years, in the end how much you would have paid ?

or maybe u look for cheaper alternative every 5 years, i think in the end of 30 years should have paid roughly 600k in rental

If you're talking about leasehold then ur correct, but Freehold condo or apartment is ok. It's precisely because you don't have much money you can buy. Just need to make sure you find a good condo with good management. Those that maintain the condos well. You sell off the condo after 5 to 10 years then you'd definitely make enough profit for a landed property downpayment.

Despite your statement that the price will depreciate with time, I have yet to see well maintained freehold condos in klang Valley where the price has dropped compared to past 10 years. So many condos and apartments built in early 90s which are still sold at good price way above the original purchase price.

You rent rm1500 for 30 years, you would have spent 500k just paying rent without gaining anything. If you bought the 500k condo, even though you may have spent 900k in total paying the installment for 30 years, you could easily sell it off for at least the launching price. Meaning in total you only lose 400k...that's assuming the condo is sold at launching price, which almost never happens. You'd usually get around double after 30 years, maybe even more if ur location boom even more throughout the years.

Anyways, you opened quite few threads on similar topic before this, so my only question to you is... How many units you renting out now? Rental market not that good until you have to keep posting to convince people to keep renting ah?

No ppl renting TS apartment or condo now?

Lease can be extended back to 99 years at anytime. If value start to be affected or loan becomes difficult owners can collectively apply for renewal. This can be done anytime even for 30 years old property.

i just can't help, his thread always make me laugh ...

Eh eh, kenot say liddat waaan. To maresians, lishold means die lor, no value. Buy property must "hold" it until Jesus comes 2nd time...

Mana nak dapat landed 500k kat area condo 500k??

i thouhmght to bash first but after read the whole thing, yeah wholeheartedly agreed

Seriously good piece of advice. U guys should all just follow TS suggestion. 👍

Pipul dont care.
Pipul buy because property price is always UUU so must bbb because always make profit.

Buy today rm500k
After 3 years can sell for rm750k.
Instant 30% profit. Laugh all the way to the bank.

Buy property is the only investment that won't lose money. Like buying gold, silver and bitcoin. Always make money

no one buy condo where got China 1 belt 1 road come pay tax at Malaysia , this is no good for country income.
and if you rent the owner will sure rise your rental or even they will sell the unit , then you need to look for higher rent unit again

This post has been edited by ngeo88: May 31 2017, 07:48 AM

so many investors ITT.. what happen to property talk?

Problem is, he can't afford house. See people buy then sudah jeles and triggered

My apartment maintenance fee rm 80 only weh. Old apartment though.

I don't think that's the case. Clearly he is an investor, wanting people to rent his unit, pay for his installments & giving him profits, instead of buying their own home.

Lolz. Yep. Can be either 1 scenario. But both is butthurt and triggered Liao.

In our endless pursuit for achieveing "developed" country status.

We will lose:

1) affordability to buy house
2) affordability to Marry
3) affordability to have kids
4) affordability to retire
5) ultimately, affordability to even own anything.

Remember this well kids, malaysia will become like singapore, japan, south korea, hong kong, where living expenses rise and nobody can afford a single speck of land.

And in the future? Nobody will ever own anything, everything is leased by private companies.

thread capitalist

Imma agree with this.

/k most basic n fundamental concept on properties: BBBUUU is and will always be applicable in msia

One only need to ask one question: WHY is ts saying all this? then you can see lor..

the person who own the land is his/her father name use to name the road / project

Whether ts like it or not...condo is gonna be the dominant landscape in klang valley...because lack of land for freehold houses.

I believe its only exterior....if one can repaint whole building...condo looks as good as new. Concrete last longer than 60 yrs....dude.

Depends on govt policy... u see the current govt policy seem to aim for high cost....i dunno why....free mkt for property...lack of affordable housing not everybody gets prima1 house....gst....exvise duties...free falling exchange rate n cut on govt hospital n fuel subsidy.

Had it happen in mamakthir time die die he maintain these sibsidies.

Actually it is the rating agency like moody...std n poor n firtch r the true syaitan...they now monitor debt rating n watch budget deficit of nations....they r policing nations to prevent us from wanting cheap housing affordability. These rating agencues are now even targetimg australia budget deficit n tripple A status.

Its usa n its minions using rating agencies wanna turn asia inyo another hong kong.

So for msia to want access to cheaper funds we gotta cut subsody. Rating agency people r evil.

If you want to buy landed property like double storey linked house in KL, it may easily costs you RM750k to RM1m.

I wouldn't give him too much credit if I were you
The truth is he is really just as stupid as he sounds

This post has been edited by idoblu: May 31 2017, 08:54 AM

In finance and general economy, it's the rating agencies, yes. In property, the equivalent of them are the valuers. Valuers hold the ultimate control.

Whether the real estate market will go way beyond the public affordability or not, is up to the valuers. Second, is the buyers, the herd mentality.

Poor people buy house / condo live there for life, not for sale or make profit. Stupid ts.

You can see some people agree with him ITT. He's saying what investors want to be said. From the non-investors' POV, yes, it's all garbage.

I always wanted to buy a landed house. ayam poorfag, got 1 consider achieved lifegoals already.

I heard Sg Petani landed damn 7 cheap

please please please don't correct those who wanted to continue to rent. It's a blessing we need a balance if different mentality group of folks..

so don't buy la. nobody force you to buy.

also those stating owners rent out rates that can cover monthly installment, for sub 300k units yes, for rm500k unit nobody will rent ur units. condos are not shoplots, condos rental just to cover abit of monthly loans the profit comes from selling it within 10 years or the loans after finishing loans.

nobody will rent a 700sqft 2 room condo for rm3k a month that is not inside KL city center.

sure rental rate will go up but still much cheaper than owning it & less hassle. remember your rental already included maintenance fee, your bank monthly repayment doesn't, thus it's much cheaper to rent.

remember my loan calculation is pretty conservative @ 4% per annum with no adjustments too for 30 years.

i have yet seen a Condo as old as 50 years so i reserve my comment. but looking at Singapore, the fate of old condos/hdb are usually demolish & rebuilt.

if it's located at CBD, no way it will get renewed, it will have to make way for new projects.

so free hold might have some small value compared to lease hold, but remember you don't own any land with free hold for highrise unless you own the whole block.

nobody thinks about this because it hasn't happened yet.

and remember, i'm talking about folks that can only own 1 property in their lifetime unless they dug gold. and for own stay purpose. not for investment.

There's a flaw though... if you pay your monthly installment after 30 years you will most likely lose rm330k like what you've calculated but in return you have something at least..

For renting.. after 30 years. You wouldn't get anything at all. Let's not talk about the inflation and the rise of the rental after a couple of years. by just having a monthly rental of RM1500, you do realize in 30 years time it will be RM540k right?

that applies mainly for new units.

for older units it's more difficult to sell unless the location is real prime, and the condo is real good, but chances are good location + good condo are usually Leasehold making it more difficult to sell off. also chances are these units already finished loan so the rental is more like side income for owners, thus less incentives they want to increase rental alot since if you are good tenant they already enjoy hassle free stable income.

if you rent new units, chances are the owners already planned on selling before you even rented the units.

as i said before, old highrise apartment start to lose value after certain age, after 10-15 years, but of course the sales price will still be higher than purchase, but take into inflation account you notice there is not much rise in value compared to landed or new condos. after 30 years, good luck selling it. even if it's nicely maintained, it will be outdated and old.

how many % is that rm80 compared to your monthly loan payment?

condo normally start around rm300 nowadays. whether they up the cost in the future i don't know since we all know cost always goes up, including cost for gardeners.

my 300k apartment, maintenance 130 only, free paip show once a while at staircase beside my house

theres an issue with folks understanding both, the rental market is mobile and its also one where the cost is lower than purchase. people often mistaken that you are paying the other persons instalment to be equal to paying their own, the other person bought the unit long ago and the instalment is often much lower than what you would pay, if you bought new.

the savings from there, and from the legal fees, general in house maintenance and what not can be placed in better assets, personal business, shares, and what not.

the argument of at the end of the day you have something from purchasing a house is quite inaccurate, while its yours in name, it carries no value, cause you cant do anything to it.

its a common mistake i see people do, they buy house with every last penny they have, then when old suddenly they realise they cant sell the house

Malaysia still good, only problem is majority young people die die want to move into KL.

and Foreigners (Singaporeans) die die want to migrate to Melaka & Penang.

Malaysia, take Peninsular for example, actually have ample of land compared to the population. Taiwan has same population as Malaysia.

Problem is Government refusal to develop other states that is not KL. Look at USA, UK & Europe, they have many big cities for each country, and other smaller towns are generally equally developed, at least the basic needs are there, not as good as big cities, but at least enough not to deter folks from moving in. Thus you see big cities are cramped, but smaller towns still got many people moving in.

But of course seeing how Malaysia population is increasing every year, some day Malasysia will also run out of land even in Sabah & Sarawak, but that is still a very long way to go. and who knows, 1 war and everything changes.

In klang valley mostly the maintenance fee is about RM0.30 to RM0.35 per sqft. Even the condo in Setia Alam newly launch the maintenance cost RM0.30 per sqft...can fight with KL price already.

EXACTLY.

LYN should get rid of this "star" shit.

Really? I also wanna buy le.

Condo unit already cost rm1mil, 1m for double storey link sounds good.

But then again, why die die want to stay in KL?

The premium you have to pay for Houses (even in PJ/Subang/Shah Alam) would cost you so much you actually make more money if you move to smaller town with lower living cost.

ts bodo

if ur condo can last longer than u ok lo.

but ur kids maybe need to move out for demolish.

house, on the other hand, as long as land title no issue they can continue stay unless house really bad quality. those papan house in kampung quite old edi still ok.

Who the efff buy condo for own stay???

All new high-rise project goreng group buy style by the notorious BBB and UUU gang

Whats left is bumi lot and expensive units

Genuine buyer can't even place booking on high rise project

So you're saying the rent may actually be higher than the installments. That's very possible, yes.

How can it carry no value? Can't be done anything to? House appreciate. Can be sold. How's that inaccurate?

Why can't they sell it when they're old? That's what all these investors do.

well, after 30 years you do own something, but nothing much. you using it for own stay anyway, so the cost for renting 60 years might be little difference from owning a property. but remember you don't need to chuck 10% DP and you have zero list in losing your investment if you cannot service your loans for few months. if you rent, you have Plan B & C, move to cheaper place, or sleep under the bridge, but if you Own, you will have to pay up on time every month for the 30 years. Also all the paper work etc.

i'm being pretty + by saying condos can last 60 years, even older flats right now might be 30-40 years old. many of those 3 storeys flats already demolished, you can see in Bandar Tun Razak, all moved into Razak Mansion.

remember highrise & landed house are totally different things. Landed, you own the land, if house is old, you can just demolish & rebuild, highrise, you don't really own the land.

I've read a study, that that's one of the main reasons why the govt maintain bumi lot concept in property industry. Traditionally, you don't find bumi investors often, they buy a house because of need, not greed, so they're not the type who would queue in sales gallery at 3am.

please make it clear you are talking about Properties in General, or Landed House or Highrise Apartments/Condos.

For landed house, especially free hold, i don't see any issues here selling it off. lease hold, high chance to renew unless the location is prime or "Booked".

because new Condos have most facilities like park etc, all these cost money as it takes up land, not just pure maintenance & repair, thus KL or PJ, the cost would be more or less there. those paying rm130 a month, probably very old units, or very minimalistic.

Yah. Main target all corner lot and end lot with land.

alot bang, esp in KL/PJ & Penang.

you have investor buying, but ultimately their buyer target are legit 1st home owners buying for own stay. you can say 40/60 investors vs self stay. of course also depends on location.

Hey, don't shoot the messenger.

rent to be lower, our msian rental market is actually quite bad despite what people likes to say, the rent appreciation has been abysmal and the returns are worse than FD in most cases.

well, when you sell it, where you going to stay?

keep in mind that when your house appreciates, so do others, so say if you have a 1m house that appreciated 100% from 500k, the general market would also be at that price.

A little over 10%

No Bro. Really happen lah. 12am hire a small team to camping outside launching developer area. All this people target end lot with land and corner lot to make fast bucks. The only way to avoid pening2 is to get semi-D outside Kl and Selangor huhuhu

This post has been edited by doremon: May 31 2017, 09:40 AM

No demand for bumi lot = no investment into bumi lot

Economy 101

Shouldn't people stop doing it if its abysmal?

They can stay where they have stayed all this while, or at their other property. Many investors nowadays have more than 2 props.

Yes, the whole market appreciate, but there will always be buyers, no? There will always be new young investors wanting it.

you really believe majority are genuine buyers? many are hired by developed to boost the hype.

But if the location is good. There is high possibilities of redevelopment the plot and developers pay quite good price for it.

That's what I'm saying. Non-investors don't do this.

That's the point. Bumi lot is there as an "opposite" of investment. It's for own stay, as what all units should be.

Yes exactly

Now looking for a descend house BP there. Plan to settle down there near future. Looking at LBS developments. I not sure but fall in love with their design etc2

good still got limit, developers have to pay for the land, and they have to pay individual owners, remember it's Leasehold, any repayment is in "Good Faith". they can just wait the title to expire and pay you nothing if they want.

house different because you own the land. chances are you get good compensation way before the title expired.

anyway chances are the repayment won't be enough to buy another equivalent properties unless you own the landed property then can buy a condo.

well, when was the last time you heard anyone keep track of their daily finances and cost?

even if they have 2, you cant put value on the one that you intend to stay in. so while you can sell off one, the last one that you are in, cannot be moved.

well there will always be buyers, but when you sell off the last property you have, you still have to find a place to stay no?

my advise, never buy a development that is super huge, like those in Shah Alam forgot the name but got 1 big roundabout and the taman itself is a huge roundabout. there's at least 1000 houses there. when you build such big project, every penny counts because they end up amount to big savings, so no doubt they will cut as much cost as they can. there's security on many sections but with so many houses & surrounded by forest/lakes/highways, it's sitting ducks. i won't dare jogging at their fancy lakeside at night or early mornings.

it's better to get decent quality older houses than brand new development.

since you in BP, i'm guessing with a decent money you can get quite decent houses.

also try to avoid areas with kampung or flats very nearby, because usually got issues.

that's pretty inaccurate most condo's would start @ rm2xx.

Well that's another flaw for thinking that way. Now i'll trigger some thought process of yours. For the person who now own the property, they can choose to sell it with most likely a huge appreciated value and then only go for renting. You will most likely deposit a couple of hundred thousand into your banking account. So @ the end of the road would there be any difference between the person who rent and bought one initially?

Please don't get to the part of investment. You do realize property itself is some kind of investment to certain of us.

Looks what happened in HK for example, most of the citizen will struggle to own a house cause by market scalper.

not very bright if all you can think of is selling it off while you are alive, unless you have no heirs. but all these can be arranged with a lawyer.

anyway like i said, will the Condo outlast you or will it be scheduled for demolish while you still staying there?

landed properties are different from condos.

compare the population density of HK & MY, MY is like Australia. There's ample of land, but Malaysians prefer to cramp together because lack of development in other states by government.

if other states were equally developed, KL won't be so packed.

Legit home buyer prefer new developer unit with freebies

Those investor with low holding power might let go their unit to genuine buyer at minimum profit if not loss

To have a house to stay in, that's a value. Especially when all this while it's installment have been partially paid by renters. That's a big value. Compared to someone who doesn't have it (because they were renting) and then have to get a one.

To say it's no value is inaccurate.

rm200 for 700sqrft? or minimalist low cost condos? livable ones rm300 consider cheap.

Aha, kena tuduh pro dacing pulak.

Please lah, i never vote & not intend to vote in future...

o really? then it's true expert says house price is falling.

then why all /k still moaning about house price. majority of them are making rm20k/month.

Why buy condo up to RM1mil? Not worth! Living in KL gives you more opportunities in the sense of career. Even living in Penang, Ipoh or JB also give you a problem of high living cost.

We are not there yet.. It will take sometime. It's very common for places like HK, SG, JP but not yet in MY.

That's really a bad philosophy. Sell now > rent within a year > then buy another smaller unit/bigger unit up to your preference.

It's not hard i've been doing that for years. I don't understand why was it so hard, people come to me and talk to me asking for advice "you buying apartments like buying vegetable.. The process is is a pain..bla bla bla". Well look i buy with a mindset that i treat the purchase of property as in a kind of saving plan for myself. The difference is that someone would help me along the way as part of my saving plan - that's all. It's not hard to stay in one while at the same time planning to shift within the next 3 years or so.

It's only hard when you don't plan for it.

Anyone would go for dev units if its still available, even late investors. But most of the time they're not -- all snapped up. It's called oligopolistic capitalism.

the guy say KL double storey terrace can get for rm1mil, i also want, i never say i want buy rm1mil condo.

Then, indeed, you are helping BN to win.

Actually it's similar to the whole world, like UK - London, France - Paris, Japan - Tokyo, US - California, DC, Miami.. The list goes on. Everywhere is more or less the same personally to me. There will be a city where it will be the main focus for it's country, transaction purpose and trading purpose.

No la.. it's for 10xx sft.. All 3 units of my condo I'm paying RM19x and RM2xx respectively. If it's commercial then it would be different or if it's some high end condo in KL it will be different. In selangor there are still alot of condo's maintenance fee which are affordable. Bear in mind you are paying these for some security and someone to sweep and clean the floors for ya.