this is actually postgraduate stuff, you need not know these details at undergraduate level, other than basic principle outlines like what starghazzer stated above......they are correct, and adequate for passing undergraduate clinical exams.........

you would not be required to know these details till your final surgical posting, just before you finals.......there are usually 2 or 3 surgical postings, the first is mainly to familiarise the clerking of patients and diagnosis making..........and the last, details into treatment options........

---

Added on March 24, 2009, 10:27 pmdoes nus still use the old basic sciences subjects method, or have they moved to the intergrated system? pbl is more interesting for students, at the risk of shallower basic science knowledge with black holes in some areas.........

This post has been edited by limeuu: Mar 24 2009, 10:27 PM

you sat for both ukcat and bmat?

i presume you had PROVISIONAL offers.........so what is the offer cutoff from the 3 you are offered........?

---

Added on March 26, 2009, 3:51 pmit would be foolish to take up an offer which you cannot afford........borrowing money is not that simple, huge sums like this needs collaterals, and will be a burden to repay, especially if you return to work in msia, where pay is very low.........

unless you get a scholarship, i would advise against committing to such financial commitments....

This post has been edited by limeuu: Mar 26 2009, 03:51 PM

please note that at this point, you can only stay back in uk to work for the 2 foundation years......and will need to leave after that, due to eu laws governing who they can employ......

the ruling came with compliance with eu laws.........and effective 2006.......previous to that, commonwealth citizens are readily granted a 4 year visa to pursue postgraduate qualifications while working.......

there is a respite at the moment, as the indian graduates association there won a court case, argueing this is discrimination.......but the home office is appealing.......

in any case img's are now barred from taking up numbered jobs, ie jobs leading to certification as a specialist.......but i think at the moment, international students graduating from uk unis, are considered 'home' students, not img...........

whatever, there is a lot of uncertainty at the moment, and it will probably be settled by the time someone entering now graduates........and it can work either way.......you may still be allowed to stay on and work, or you will have to leave......

in the recent past, many people can stay on because there was a shortage of doctors, so these international students were easily absorbed into the work force...........uk have since increased the throughput of doctor training by 50%, from 4000+ to 6000+ doctors a year, and the shortage is likely gone, especially when the eu laws say they recruit from within the eu first (eg poland) before foreigners........

undergraduate med schools in oz:

jcu, bond, newcastle, unsw, uws, utas, monash, adelaide, uwa..........

This post has been edited by limeuu: Mar 26 2009, 07:52 PM

no........hypermax is referring to the exam all medical graduates must take and pass to practice.....the us equivalent is the usmle step 2.......

entrance exam is for entry into medical schools........to better select the best students.......in oz and uk, these are tests of intelligence and aptitude, not just knowledge.......so it is more that what you have gone through in stpm......the majority of students applying will have good knowledge, and score AAA or ter 95 and above, so they have to sub-stratify this group to select the best candidates.......

visualise, getting married is nothing new.......these jpa/mara scholars have been given allowances for their spouses and children on scholarship......someone i know sent on a postgraduate scholarship in glasgow brought along her husband and 4 kids, all paid for by the scholarship......for 4 years..........

---

Added on March 27, 2009, 11:42 pmsigh.........

i am tired already....i shall now pass the baton to hypermax to warn people about russia and ukraine.........

This post has been edited by limeuu: Mar 27 2009, 11:42 PM

what a sense of deja vu........all the arguments in the blog, justifying, pleading to be judged individually......and blogger receiving all kinds of insults, like i did........

well, medical schools should, and most in developed countries do, strive for zero defect.......

here now, we have people pleading to be allowed to play russian roulette with 3 live bullets in the 6 slots.........pointed at innocent unsuspecting patients......

but i am tired, let the next generation deal with this........i will just make sure there isn't a gun pointed at me head.......

it used to be apprenticeship, in the old days, before formalised medical education.......but the basic principle remains...........students learn from the practices and live examples they see around them, during the clinical years.....that is what you are doing in the clinics, in spite of little structured teaching.......

in order to do that, a firm grasp of basic medical sciences is mandatory, and essential, otherwise one will be completely lost........

at graduation, you can only be as good as that level of healthcare standard you trained in......and no better.......because that is all the examples and experiences you know.......

msia is used to the british standards, being a colony before, and still conducting an education system very similar to the brits, including medical schools.......and that standard required a high level of competency from housemans.......ie basic core knowledge MUST be in place, eg like mentioned in the blog, interpreting acid-base balance, the basic ABC of resus, bacis ecg reading skills, able to take and present a coherent history and examination etc..........

unfortunately, many of these housemans do NOT have these basic skills, and senior doctors end up RETEACHING basic medical school stuffs.......when it should be at the next level, ie emphasis on therapeutics........

the problem now is russian/ukrainian, and possibly indonesia as well......in the past, it was india graduates......don't flame me, yes, the exact issues here of loose selection criteria, weak students and poor teaching has been around for a long time, and equally applies to some indian med schools, especially those unrecognised ones......

like i said, a potentially fatal game of russian roulette.......

does msia really want to play the game?.....

This post has been edited by limeuu: Mar 28 2009, 09:03 AM

not going to happen........it will be political suicide.......

when they derecognise the Ukraine one, the MIC was up in arms, heated words said in parliament, and some mic guy suspended........

many see this easy access to 3rd world med schools as a counter-balance to the invisible quota system in ipta..........

in any case, jpa and mara also wants these cheap places to send their students to.......

it's a numbers game.......nobody really cares about quality........

they are only interested in your money...........

the english language medicine programme is purely to attract mostly 3rd world students and parents, to study there.......since hardly anyone speaks english there........so there is no concern about standards, as these 3rd world students will not stay on and work and treat patients there......they just don't care about the quality of students taken in, or the standards of doctors produced........

in any case, doctoring is considered a dirty job, and do not pay well in russia, so most bright students do NOT want to do medicine, unlike in countries like msia.......

---

Added on April 2, 2009, 11:20 amthat is a rip-off.......they should ban middleman agents like this........these agents does not care who or what kind of doctor these russia med schools produce, they just want to recruit as many students as possible, and pocket the fees.........they have recruited arts students, people with 5's and 6's in their sciences at spm before..........

This post has been edited by limeuu: Apr 2 2009, 11:20 AM

my point is, why do you need to go through a middleman agent?........why can't you apply directly to the uni?........

that sijil sokong is just a rough way of controlling who gets offered places in med schools in other countries....you do NOT need it to go study, but you may get into trouble when you want to return and register to work......the very fact that the mohe needs such a rule show how bad it is.......of med schools taking in very poor qualify students....

hmmmm....i wonder why so many indonesians go to penang, kl, melaka, spore, even kuching for their medical treatment........

by that same reasoning, soon, they will stop coming, as they will perceive the msian doctors as inferior in quality, being trained in russia, indonesia etc.....the old generation of well trained doctors from the developed world and the early days of ipta will be retiring soon......

dr. mahathir is a graduate from the old um in spore......the first batch from the new um in kl graduated in 1969 and will now be 65 years old, many of them are retired......

that statement would suggest you are probably not doctor material......

why not talk about it?......isn't racism wrong?......

if it is, shouldn't we make efforts, including highlighting it, so it can be corrected, prevented........no?

then you will also not like the idea of mrsm schools, matrikulasi, asasi sains, uitm, mara colleges, mara scholarships, jpa scholarships, klse listing requirements, bhd employment requirements, gov contract bidding requirements, professional firms equity requirements,...........an almost endless list that is part of institutionalised msian life......

---

Added on April 5, 2009, 9:44 am

good that you make a stand......the problem is, many malays remain neutral, refuse to make a stand, or even tacitly support these discriminatory policies, in the name of ketuanan melayu and a non-existent 'social contract'.......

This post has been edited by limeuu: Apr 5 2009, 09:44 AM