Hi Guys,

I wanted to share my experience and also ask for help. I own and drive a Mazda 6, 2011 model 2.5. The car currently is at 89k km. It finish its warranty sometime back. It was a nice car to begin with until some of the problems started. Firstly, the car vibrate and shake since 70k km, thinking that it was a idling rpm problem (and was told it is by the service centre) I got it service and tune by a mazda centre. The vibration improve but slowly it came back. I learned to live with the fact that a premium D segment Japanese car shake like my previous 15 years old wira...sigh.

Now this is what makes me boil, lately the passenger side dashboard started to melt...yes MELT...it become sticky, goeey and clay like.....in other words...it melted. I lodge a report and send the car to mazda centre in Oct. Now, they first said no problem will filed for warranty claim. After 1 month, they called and told me that they cannot claim for the dashboard due to 1. The car is out of warranty....2. service record of my car after 60k km was not with them....err mazda warranty is till 60k or 5 years...after that I am free to service outside right?

Even so, putting aside where I service the car; how is that relevant to the dashcover? changing engine oil will melt the dash cover? not changing the air filter will melt it? or did not flush the coolant will make the cover melt?

Now what should I do? what can I do?

For the record, my 15 years wira neither shake or vibrate.....its dashboard also did not MELT......

This is my first encounter with a MELTING dashboard.......maybe it can be sold as a special feature of the car??

Secondly, I am starting to worry, will the airbag mechanism still work properly? The dashboard is all gooey and sticky; will it affect the deployment of airbag?



This post has been edited by Student111: Dec 28 2016, 03:15 PM

Same problem here - melted dashboard. Worse during summer when the temperature hits 50C !

Summer? Where are you from?

Unfortunately in Malaysia...it is summer whole year long.....maybe mazda should label their dashboard " for cool climate only, it might(surely will) melt if subjected to hot weather, buy at your own risk"

This post has been edited by Student111: Dec 28 2016, 03:21 PM

I don't get it, my understanding is the car is already out of warranty? If it is still within warranty period you must service with them, else they will void your warranty.

Long story short....the car reaches 60k that is when I stopped servicing with them. Then the dashboard start to MELT sometime after that.....

By the way....my question is will it makes a difference whether I service with them or not with them???

All car service has no interaction with dashboard......... at least for me I never "service" my dashboard.....

iinm if you stopped servicing with SC, automatically your warranty is gone. So you need to bear the cost la of whatever items broken.

they just simply give reason not to change it for free. Lucky they didn't say you upgrade 17' rim to 18' so they cannot change the dash for free.

Do you tint your car? Even if not, the dash shouldn't melt. Just curious. My dad 20+ years volvo dash not melt but rattling to the max but car getting faster than before...

Thanks Adam....I suppose you are entitled to your opinion. Just to be on the same page, we are talking about dashboard, the passenger's side dashboard that melt under sun light .....

So every mazda buyer should expect the dashboard to MELT.....especially after the 3 years warranty period or your mazda is above 60k km.

I really don't see how service can make a difference, even if I service the car with them, it will still melt. I think it is a poor quality or bad design. That is why I compare with my previous car, a 15 years old wira. Its dashboard never melted.

Any bro out there has suggestion to solve this?

first of all, the warranty already over.
so, it does not matter whether you still service with mazda or not as that does not apply to your problem.
your problem is product defect due to poor quality.
tell them by referring to honda's airbag defect issue.
does honda tell their warranty over customer that they are not liable to change the airbag due to product defect?

what he is meaning is mazda reserve the right not to change for you because you are not service by them.
since you stop service by them so your warranty void automatically ...
warranty void then you can get the part replace and of course you need to pay the cost la ..

http://forum.mazda6club.com/models-trim/27...rd-melting.html
http://www.abcactionnews.com/money/consume...ing-dash-boards
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Drivers...-368240311.html

try some google search

some of our forumer get their dashboard change even warranty is over ..
if not mistaken .. toyota camry ..

i think only ts has this issue on his mazda 6 (2011), but his title is like generalizing all mazda 6 (2011) will face the same issue.

so far i have never heard/read this kinda issue on mazda or any other car models before

Thanks bro...you mean Toyota Camry also reported similar incidence? This is shocking to me.

TS avoiding my question. U tak tint ur car kan.....

This post has been edited by say_xtr: Dec 28 2016, 04:07 PM

Protip:(applies to cars n non cars) just because its priced such and such, doesnt mean its premium in quality. Keep your expectations in check. Ppl spend good money on some cars for the prestige rather than expecting exceptional reliability .

Thanks VC bro.


Apparently this is a global problem, where mazda replace it for customer in US. The story is reported by NBC and ABC. I believe there is a bro that said he did not heard of any similar incidence so this is a good read. The link actually open my eye how different customer can be treated just because we come from different country.

Yes, I tinted my car. There is no need to avoid your question, but rather missing it. I even upgraded from the FOC tint to the highest grade of VKool and still has the receipt to prove it. But how is this relevant?? Tinted or not...it should not melt.

Also, I parked indoor (basement) during office and also at home. So very minimum exposure to the sun

of course if melt due to hot temperature surely related to your tinted. Some car yes did melt under the sun specially european car. even BMW E90 door handle melt due to our tropical weather.

Asked my friend who drive mazda 3 & 6 so far they didnt experience this

Thanks for helping to check with your friend, and I guess they are lucky to not experience this. From my reading and the link provided, the melting dashboard affect certain model in certain year only, and mazda acknowledge that by doing a recall in US........

I guess I am stuck or rather stick to this dashboard issue....sigh....I certainly thought Mazda is a better brand....

A funny joke from a co-worker who suggested that maybe I can put a "WET PAINT - DO NOT TOUCH" sign on my dashboard......

This post has been edited by Student111: Dec 28 2016, 04:32 PM

2011 is not the latest model , that started in 2012 earliest

This model ts referring to



This post has been edited by rcracer: Dec 28 2016, 04:33 PM

ya la..they'r right. u cant claim.

It's better to pay for a new dashboard before it causes any more problems.

The new one will be subject to the same problem so it's best to get a good tint and try to park inside.

If it is a warranty issue than maybe I cannot claim, but the more I read the more I am convince this is a design/defect issue.

http://forum.mazda6club.com/models-trim/27...rd-melting.html
http://www.abcactionnews.com/money/consume...ing-dash-boards
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Drivers...-368240311.html


Mazda acknowledge the problem in its dashboard, even hiding it for few years before coming to a recall. Please read the link, the recall and replace for US almost 300k cars, without condition. IF it is a service/warranty issue, Mazda will know recall. Car maker usually recall when it is design defect or manufacturing defect (from my limited knowledge, please share with me if this is wrong info).

So Mazda must know something is not right about the dashboard.........

Yes. If you stopped servicing with them, they will void the warranty for YOUR ENTIRE CAR, not just the engine.

Why do you think carmakers so generous give your so many years warranty? so that you keep servicing with them.

The new one will still have same issue? sigh...meaning even if I pay and change it, it will still melt?? What kind of a car is mazda selling?

My car is almost always parked indoor, during office hour and at home. Very rarely it is parked under the sun.

http://forum.mazda6club.com/models-trim/27...rd-melting.html
http://www.abcactionnews.com/money/consume...ing-dash-boards
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Drivers...-368240311.html

This post has been edited by Student111: Dec 28 2016, 04:50 PM

maybe you can ask them to give warranty for the newly purchased dashboard.

It's shoddy alright. You'd expect better from the Japs.

It might be best to sell it but you'll have to replace the dashboard first. Nobody is going to buy a car with a melted dashboard.

I feel for you.. but the state of our nations gov't's stance towards multinational companies more than private individuals are evident.. l guess the only solution is to take this to a small claims court and hope that 'they' will see your side of the story..
I think Mazda Malaysia [bermaz?] has already washed their hands of this problem..

To add insult to injury, I spoke to the service centre and was shock to learn that


1. A new dashboard is over RM 2k++

2. Service centre refuse to tell whether the new dashboard will MELT or not (whether the issue had been resolved with the new dashboard)

3. No warranty

4. No stock and subject to wait list.....(cannot even provide an estimation on MONTHS, and I jokingly ask whether it will be in 2017 and the response is...."Hmm.....should be "


I used to be a Mazda supporter........but I strongly feel this is going to be my last mazda if I ever manage to resolve this.



http://forum.mazda6club.com/models-trim/27...rd-melting.html
http://www.abcactionnews.com/money/consume...ing-dash-boards
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Drivers...-368240311.html

This post has been edited by Student111: Dec 28 2016, 04:59 PM

Another co-worker just heard the melted dashboard story and she is suggesting a new name for my mazda ...



BAT MOBILE....since it cannot go under the sun and must stay hidden from sun light


Mazda....if any of you are listening, u can try sponsoring the next batman movie. Since Bat Mobile is only appearing at night so your dashboard wont MELT.........

Yes, you are right.

It happened to my Toyota Camry 2008 model, it became sticky and gluey but they did improve on the next batch though.

Do u need a new one? I mean your car is approximately 6yrs old - l personally would look for a half cut one..
bearing in mind , paying for a new one is adding salt to the wound of 'No Warranty'..

some guys in the mazda 6 fb club replace the leather outside cost around 1k iinm. u may join the club and ask around. no need to change dashboard la.

addon: check your engine mountings. if cant solve the vibration problem consult the fb group. they are more than happy to assist.

This post has been edited by weikeat90: Dec 28 2016, 05:51 PM

got pictures of the dashboard? What does a melted dashboard look like.

Toyota & Lexus dashboard issue is not melting but cracking and peeling off.

This post has been edited by 6UE5T: Dec 28 2016, 09:07 PM

then cannot claimed ad la....

walaoo

common thing rite - -

now you either change it with them or let it melt like your heart

Consumer rights are furiously defended there not to mention huge market/population, thats why global car manufacturers must buck up or face huge financial consequences. In our region however, we can tolerate these so car companies used a different kind of techniques to sell cars to us...the tidak apa technique. It works most of the time.

Could it melt because something heats up inside the dash board?

Scare even if change the dashboard but the root cause is different

My 2010 m3 dashboard also started melting 2 years ago.

No tint.

But no big issue, car still fun to drive.

typical issue with soft touch dashboard/panels......even vw & bmw got similar problem

but y satria soft touch 1995 car not melting?

special "tropicalised" secret recipe formula by local dashboard supplier...

diferent type of material. Should note though... for some reason, some late satria/wiras do have a slightly diferent kind of interior issue. for lack of a better way to describe it, the dash excretes some sort of oily liquid. early model satris have issues with the pillar trims, they turn to dust!.



Student111

sticky issue u bukan the only one

lexux/toyota is/altezza (camry as well)


vw


maserati


and lastly.... mazda 6..... (they did a recall in the US) m3's are apparently suffering the same issue


basically this soft touch fancy rubbery coatings suffer issues when they get old. My old old junk car has this issue where this material is found.

This post has been edited by lsm1991: Dec 29 2016, 10:52 AM

Wait till you see KIA spectra's dashboard. My fren told he bought a 2nd hand spectra for 15k, after 2-3years of ownership the dashboard transformed due to the heat. He said the dashboard basically "caved' in and become out of shape. He sold it off not long after that.

My Nikon D300 dslr rubber handgrip also become sticky/gooey after 7 years

phones also old sony ericsson have that same coating (i think its a coating in most cases)

Mouse too haha. My Razer Orochi went sticky on me after 2 years of use. Off topic lol.

lsm1991 - tq for the picture....


The bigger question is how did car maker like Mazda get away with this? Frankly, I own a 15 years wira with no such problem (hahahaha except the window mechanism).

Soft touch or hard touch....now that dash board is NO TOUCH!

For those of you considering Mazda.....do factor this into your purchase consideration.

Now u all know why some cars even high end ones comes with plastic or leather dash and never fake leather? This is the problem. Cheap vinyl. 1980s-1990s car cheap vinyl does not melt and go sticky. They just dry out and crack. So people used to buy Armour All/ STP Son of a gun to counter this problem.

For bro who think that this is a warranty period issue....maybe we can see it as a car manufacturer who know there is a problem with certain car part but still go ahead and sell it to us....then when it melt try to get out by saying it is over the warranty period or your car is not service properly?

Please go thru the link....mazda issue a black and white, documented, non conditional recall.....mazda even pay back to those customers who paid before the recall was issued.

I tend to see it as local dealer + Mazda is bullying Malaysia consumers. Anyway, thanks everyone for suggesting alternative to fix the dash. I feel STUPID if I am forced to go back to the service centre, pay 2k++ for a non-warranted dash....

Any other solutions?

http://forum.mazda6club.com/models-trim/27...rd-melting.html
http://www.abcactionnews.com/money/consume...ing-dash-boards
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Drivers...-368240311.html

This post has been edited by Student111: Dec 29 2016, 12:34 PM

Haha,

Do U think our local courts will uphold all tat u have listed - in overseas..
Bermaz have already washed their hands here in listing the fine print of all warranties - in not servicing in their SC's..
In the US, they [Mazda US] honor this type of claim cos they dont want to have bad publicity , over here in Bolehland, its hard for you to prove otherwise.. you can try.. l guess but be prepared to take a long long n tedious walk...

frankly speaking.... from what i understand, all this happened outside of the warranty period. So regardless of where you serviced it, you are probably not going to be able to get anything out of them.

If you could, then anyone with a similar issue would be able to make claims. Even I should then be able to make claims for a 21 year old car. Once you are out of that warranty period, it is up to them to decide if they want to help you out.
I believe they added the second reason as a general answer, if serviced outside bla bla bla, warranty bye bye~ could be a generic template answer too.... who knows?


now solution? if the damned thing costs 2k to replace.... get it fixed.... maybe wrapped in leather. i much like leather wrapped stuff...

This post has been edited by lsm1991: Dec 29 2016, 01:22 PM

My 2010 mazda 6 FL dashboard also melting, cost quoted by bermaz to replace the affected area more than RM1.Xk

My dad's ex harrier also kena. Have to refurbish dashboard with new material. Cost about 1xxx.

If you replace with a brand new 1,the cost should be way higher. Anyways, your car is considered old model. Most car manufacturers won't even layan this case. Sorry to say.

Since Mazda Malaysia is not going to help much, I think you'd be better off going to a car accessory workshop to get your dashboard fixed and wrapped in leather. It should cost you half or slightly less than the 2K they are asking for.

Try this, to me no point spend another 2k for the dashboard which will melt again in few years time.

https://www.facebook.com/Wah.Auto/

Sometimes those dashboard polish/sprays does damage our dashboard too.

You need to consider the legality of your issue.

What is warranty? Putting it in broad terms, it's a promise by the Company to replace specific parts, if faulty, over a duration of time.

Should this time laps or should warranty become void, due to owner action, then all repairs have to be borne the customer.

Weather your dashboard was tempered with or not is not the issue at this moment in time. You have run out of warranty, the guarantee on product quality is over!

I'm not supporting Mazda, certainly it is poor quality, especially for D segment! In fact Mazda should recall. However I appreciate this heads up. I will now strike Mazda off my list, Tq!

This post has been edited by SKYjack: Dec 31 2016, 06:09 AM

Most likely the plastic was exposed to some sort of solvent and wasn't cleaned off properly , even small things have solvents , car fresheners, perfume, glass cleaners, certain polishes etc.

The reason of melted dashboard, it happens to most of the car that also ship to euro due to the so called "green policies" whereby it makes most of the manufacturer to produce the interior with recycled plastic, even my porsche (2011) entire console and my previous fucked up ferrari (2008) steering had this problem.

In euro, it is estimated that 8-12% of the vehicle is made of plastic, and because of them constantly worshiping the mother earth green policies, they have no choice but to make a lot restriction, then this germans decided to use PET/PS/PUR plastic to make their car interior, of course it wont have much problem in their weather, but then when it started to ship into tropical country, the problem started.

Sometimes, all this so called green policies is just another excuses to cut cost, producing inferior quality. PET is definitely cheaper, and when japanese realised this, they follow the trend too.

Trust me, dont live in the myth of weather too hot, or perfume caused this, (tho it has the possibility to crack your dashboard) but a drop of perfume wont make your whole dashboard screwed up. it is the grade of the plastic, made of a recycle grade.

No fix for this, even after you changed your dashboard, expect the same shit to happen again if you always park outside.

I used to work closely with a giant automotive company, in their R&D, this dashboard melting things, are a well known shit in the industry, but i didn't know mazda has followed the trend. Especially a more luxury class that will export to the EU countries and have to apply the EU policies.

This post has been edited by Freemasonry: Dec 31 2016, 07:25 AM

This is not specifically mazda related problem. Lexus, Toyota, Nissan, BMW and any brand using the said material has been highlighted by owners in many forum for many years. I hope OP can change the topic wording to just melting dashboard.

Ts could wrap the dashboard to accomodate malaysia weather. Since warranty has ended, its.the cheaper alternative than changing the dashboard. You could check out companies like carzone in fb.

From your logic , topic title or news headline in malaysia towns (eg. Robbed in KL/ murder in Kepong ) should be change wording to robbery or murder only..since these crimes not specifically related to these towns.

Dont see a point to change title . Those easily confused and come to conclusion arent qualified to participate in forum anyway.

Well, nope you're not getting there. I'm just saying pointing only to Mazda is a bit too much now while clearly the input in the thread already revealed the problem which involved other manufacturers/brands too, for using the same material/style/process/fashion.

SC wont care about it, as long as out of warranty or warranty void, then you have to pay, unless you can gather all mazda 6 owner and file a reports to them, maybe they will have a look.

gather all owners go complain to tribunal council. it it useless to go to manufacturer.

This is what I will do....
I will check with other Mazda 6 owners (maybe join their FB or the Mazda 6 forum in car club section), find out whether their car has the same problem.

If only one or two having this issue, I think Mazda is going to ignore your demand as it is not a "defect".

I doubt you will get anywhere complaining to the consumer tribunal. Once out of warranty repair of any defects is up to the goodwill of the manufacturer. You can't compare countries with strong consumer laws with our own.

in msia, consumers are at the mercy of supplier on warranty .
in my experience , choosing a reputable supplier is important .

camry dashboard also got problem . 2 of my friends claimed it foc last year. car >6 years.

honda let me claimed my abs foc [car also 5 yrs old.] [1997-2002]

Comedy. You're no longer within the warranty period, they are not obligated to provide warranty.

If you have continued to service your vehicle with them, they may have offered goodwill repair.

Tough luck.

I would sue them (at least in Small Claims court). And also make this viral. Don't underestimate the power of social media...
This is not a defect warranty issue. It's a substandard material issue! Imagine your chassis starts buckling because of metal fatigue, and it is caused by inferior material. Or welding. Even if the 5 years is over, Mazda cannot be allowed to just wash their hands with "warranty over".

There is a significant difference in defects that cause diminished road worthiness & subsequently endanger the life's of occupants and public. Sticky dashboard may not carry much weight to warrant legal action.Legal redress via warranty on this specific issue has expired.

Full exposure with social media may bring better results. The more ppl come to know this, better the chance of a remedy. Possibility of Mazda offering a fix in order to keep the issue under raps. Just like me, think the number of ppl who are going to strike Mazda models off their list. I'd say best line of attack is create as much publicity as possible, on this issue.

This post has been edited by SKYjack: Jan 2 2017, 07:43 AM

Why strike Mazda off your list? New models may not have the same problem as old models. Manufacturers do learn from their mistakes.

I hope you are right. Mazda is the only Jap model I had any inclination towards.

Ginny88,

NOT TRUE.....Mazda knew about this, but they did nothing for existing customer. Mazda might or might not learn from their mistake, BUT IT IS AT OUR (car owners) expense!

For someone who truly learn from their mistake, 1. offer apology to those affected by your mistake, then 2. take corrective action 3. avoid from repeating it in future.

So far, I am not sure I see this happening for Mazda.

Skyjack,

The choice is yours, but I will think twice before buying mazda. I confirm with a relative about camry, he got his 9+ years old camry's dashboard changed by service centre, FOC. No question was asked beside for evidence of car ownership + 2 days of waiting.

Think twice, it is our hard earn money that car manufacturer going to use it to LEARN FROM THEIR MISTAKE

I consider sticky dashboard a serious issue. It is appalling Mazda wants to stay within the warranty boundary on this issue. Camry & other manufactures have stepped beyond warranty limits on a case by case basis. Your case certainly warrants one.

Even if newer Mazda models do not exhibit this problem, the whole attitude & approach Mazda took on your issue is appalling. This has drastically eroded my confidence in Mazda!

Thanks for the info...I have one big doubt in my mind which is related to the passenger side airbag. The MELTED dashboard part include the airbag cover too (I see wording - AIRBAG written on top) so I am worry will this affect the airbag mechanism in anyway?

Will wrapping it also impact on the airbag?

product defect is another issue la, even my 17 year old car can claim warranty ondefected product n honest by dealer due to consumer right ..... but that not in malaysia ...

I'd just get the dashboard wrapped in new leather or something, probably would cost around 1k, saves the hassle of dealing with the SC - and saves your time too.

At the end of it, look at it from a practicality point of view, yes, ethically Mazda is wrong, but are you willing to spend so much time going back and forth, claiming your rights as a consumer and probably waiting for months, maybe a year to solve the issue, and not to mention the tremendous effort you need to put on your side in complaining, negotiating, visiting Mazda so many times?

I'd rather lose 1k~ish to wrap the dashboard and live peacefully after that. Yes, I'm not much of a consumer rights kind of guy, I'm more of a practicality kind of guy. I believe if you push them for a replacement, at the end of it they might give you a free replacement, but in the process you probably would have lost so many other things (time for example) that's much more valuable.

a known issue, google oversea forum you can find similar complain, that's because use of environmental friendly material.

"not in malaysia"........that's where the truth lies! You can Google for answers, but it does not apply in Malaysia!
Very sensible approach! I'd certainly go for this.

This is not the first dashboard melted on Mazda car, my friend Mazda CX5 also suffering from this issue, he parked his car under the sun everyday and take LRT to working place, after just 2 years the dashboard melted!

This post has been edited by feelfree: Jan 18 2017, 10:36 PM

Wth did mazda do on the Dashboard materials etc? But ur friends cx5 can claim warranty unlike ts.

TS should to write to Mazda Motor Japan to complain.

Ur car must be CBU Japan? CBU Japan Mazda always got melting dashboard problem.

Toyota has the volume to give out all this extra perks. Mazda doesnt have the sales volume to compete with Toyota.

If you want to base your choice of car on manufacturers who are willing to fix out of warranty items on goodwill you may be basing on something which is illusory and non-repeatable. All manufacturers evaluate on a case by case basis for out of warranty defects. Just because Toyota has fixed an out of warranty melted dashboard before doesn't mean it will fix other out of warranty claims or even the same claim by another owner. Goodwill may depend on the prevailing circumstances of the day and your luck in meeting the right person to attend to your claim.

Thank you, this is a good advice. I am not pending my decision on willingness of car manufacturer to fix out of warranty items on goodwill. In fact I am deciding on the fact that car manufacturer like Toyota, Honda and etc just change it...no goodwill or not but they accept it as part and parcel of their ethic in doing business.

I fully agree with you if it is out of goodwill things will change from case to case, but so far it seems the other jap manufacturer just change for owners that came forward with such defect...this makes me think long and hard. Also it does not seems that in the case of other jap manufacturer that cases depends on who is the person that attend to the case, knowing Toyota and etc, I believe there is a standard SOP that they follow, true to their kaizen nature.

However, your opinion is really good that it gave us another things to consider. In any "goodwill" situation we are at the mercy of the car manufacturer so the point is to make it a standard practice not mercy hand out.

Hi Xeda,

I agree with u, I am now whole heartedly gave up on Mazda and its service centre. I spoke to the SA and ask " is there anything else we can try so that we can claim? He tells me off " No, u cannot claim" and hang up on me. I am baffled and clueless as I just spend 2 days working with them on another issue and I was not rude but exploring option with him. BTW, the SA also refuse to answer my call after he hang up.

Anyway, I am ready to get it done outside but can someone advise will that be ok with the air bag? Secondly any shop to recommend?

There shouldn't be any problems with airbags since I think they will cut the wrap so airbags can be deployed. Not sure how much it will cost you to wrap your dashboard as I don't have a Mazda, but previously I asked at an interior shop in sunway they would charge around 1k for my car.

There's a lot of places that could do dashboard wrapping, there's Carzon, Carbideco, to name a few. Cost is highly dependent on what material you choose. I suggest googling and contacting them to ask for a quotation. Carbideco is at punchong if I remember correctly.

Which service centre you go to? I faced some incompetent service centre before, I told them my car problem and that service advisor just replied, your car needs to be serviced.. I mean what kind of response was that? I'm not even sure what should I do? Report to Mazda Malaysia or? Yes, I agree the car itself is not perfect and I'm not pissed off with that but what pisses me off the most is the attitude of their service advisors..