SRAM Apex compared to Shimano 105 in terms of?

In terms of performance both are very simillar. Weight might be tipping towards apex as their shifters are slightly lighter.

The main thing about SRAM is you either like the double tap shifting or you don't.

Personally, i prefer SRAM as it has a nicer shifter shape for holding onto the shifter hoods. As for performing an actual shift, SRAM seems to take less lever swing compared to a shimano. On the same shift lever, you swing 15degree and you perform an upshift and 30 degree you perform a downshift for the RD. On top of that, you get a shift lever that is independent of the brake lever. Means that you can pull the shift lever back onto your drops and if you are sprinting, a flick of your wrist will allow you to shift up the gear while holding onto the drops.

Double tap might need some getting used to in the start. I also prefer a brake lever that does not swing as it is very disrupting during descents. My last and major + point, is the offer for low gearing that is non existent on Shimano until late last year.

Price wise, they are both almost simillar in the market depending who you buy it from. So, it all boils down to your personal preference.

You planning to upgrade and transfer your 105 to your missus 903? naughty, naughty.. finding excuses eh

not to say that i am pro SRAM.. but , they do sell their groups almost the same from entry level to top tier.. what they do is that they use more exotic and higher grade materials as you progress through the tiers

like Red for example will have lots of carbon, titanium and the use of hybrid ceramic bearings and even more machining to keep weight down. they even provide by default a set of SRAM Professional Fully Sealed shifter cable that is made by gore rideon with the red group. all this combine up to make a lighter and smoother shifting system.

so, what you get is almost simillar shape and feel of the top tier groups but lower performance and heavier weight...

if you look at Apex, it has a history behind it. can't find the original article i read but this does sum it up where the concept of apex came about when contador was leading the 2008 giro into a tough uphill ITT against ricardo ricco.

the sram engineers came up with an idea to mod a SRAM Red RD with MTB parts to fit a larger cassette for contador to spin his way up kronplatz... this article had more details of what was used during that day than the one i read.

http://www.roadbikeaction.com/Tech-Feature...Drivetrain.html

and the SRAM teams used it extensively in the climb heavy edition of last years Giro

http://www.theroaddiaries.com/2011/05/24/s...%80%99s-stages/

Is the FP2 that cheap nowadays.. it is like recently there are a flood of cheap bikes coming from big italian brands...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 05:20 PM

60hm vs 24hm.. the price also very different leh.. maybe might not fit his budget that well...

why sell the di2 ultegra? thought it is all the rave nowadays.

eh... dun take my word for it la... it is just my personal opinions and they might be heavily skewered towards certain things... most important is to listen to different opinions and do further research before you lay the dough... who knows what you want more than yourself, rite?

Looking at it subjectively from a $$$ point of view. For beginner, it depends on whether you think you will be spending huge amounts of money on it in future for another or 2nd bike?

If not and your can afford one bike that will have to last you next 5 years, try to spend a bit more to get to get it right so you don't spend too much money into changing or upgrading it. It will never be possible to get the perfect bike, but the point is to curb un-necessary upgrades after the initial purchase (for example save RM500 now with a 9speed bike and spend RM1000 later to upgrade it to a 10speed) is a pointless exercise and extra hassle.

Of course it is good to have a friend that can borrow you one to get a feel of it before you make your purchase, it minimizes the indecisiveness of buying a particular bike.

I say RM3 to RM5k for mid range starters. You can go as low as RM1.8 for entry level bikes with 9 speed, but future spendings in upgrading it to 10speed is going to hurt.

Carbon is one i recommend to stay away from if you can't stay upright while riding... saw one broken carbon BMC the other day i went KSH... apparently was quite new to the sport and lost control of the bike when going downhill.. OUCH .. heard the owner suffered a broken finger and hope he is OK.

so, important to take in different sides and weigh your priorities with the money you can afford to spend. Unfortunately, cycling is no longer a cheap sport nowadays if you take it seriously.

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 06:32 PM

which leads to my point.. strictly no carbon.. not crashworthy...aluminum if not too heavy a crash will just be dings on the bike and your pride...

among the couple that got mentioned here...without factoring in looks and bike sizing... there will be a lot of other bikes outside but i focus on the ones mentioned in the forum since some might have bought it and you can ask their honest opinions....

i vote the focus variado for being a bike that is sensible... and components that should be capable of taking a beating.

http://www.focus-bikes.com/int/en/bikes/bi...riado-20-6.html

or the Merida Race Lite 904 or Giant TCR SL2 (never check but forummer mentioned costs under RM4.5k) for being the wiser choice on paper for the components they provide.

http://www.merida-bikes.com/en_int/bike/20...ce+Lite+904-com

http://www.giant-bicycles.com/en-in/bikes/...l2/10736/52971/

of course, you have to still think about how far is the bike shops selling this bikes is away from your home and whether you will click with them (this, unfortunately will be a trial and error experience)... that aside, the top 3 is what i think is worth buying...

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Added on January 17, 2012, 7:56 pmi am not sure if you have done your initial survey... but go stroll around a couple of bike shops within your reach... i don't know where you live, but you can check here for list of bike shops.

http://www.baikbike.com/biking-stores/

ask around for bikes within your budget... and take down the models to go home to do more research...

from there on, filter out the bikes that you fancy base on feel and looks... then compare them side by side and pick the ones you like best and go back for 2nd round to see if they have it in your size... and further negotiations...

time consuming, but better than to rush into buying 1 and end up regretting it.

also easier to help once you have narrowed down a list of bikes you can choose as there are so many out there nowadays...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 07:57 PM

actually.. the drops are hard for newcomers to get used to because it requires a wee bit of flexibility and especially a flat tummy...also harder to keep bike straight in line when you cannot taken control in the drops.

i believe you are refering to this position?


i would think this suits beginners better... where you put your hands on the brake hoods.. this allows your torso to be more upright (easier breathing compared to in the drops) and you have control of the brake lever in case you need them...


gripping the handlebar top is another choice... this puts you into sitting even further upright and don't require your arms to extend that far out... for me, a more relaxed position and less stress on your back... but you have to watch the road since your hands will be away from your brakes... i ride in this post during hillclimbs.. easier to pull back on the handlebar


most importantly.. try to alternate between positions as different positions uses different muscles on your body and this will help them rest.

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 08:32 PM

as for standing on the pedal or what we call out of saddle.. try to delay this... try to get comfortable riding your bike on the saddle first...

very hard to describe in words, but once you get used to riding in saddle... standing on the pedals sort of comes naturally... just watch out and dun fling the bike about or you lose grip of your pedal and a slip will means a thumping to your nuts on the top tube... embarrassing if not painful.... also watch for potholes, bumps and try to remain sitted going through those stuff... keeps your center of gravity low and more stable on the bike...



you have to find your rhythm and swing your bike slightly based on your pedal downstrokes... basically left pedal on downstroke bike will lean the opposite way.




* do not follow what you see in pictures... just using them as illustrations... style is not of the importance here..

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Added on January 17, 2012, 8:24 pmhaha... such a waste for your electronic group... well, there is always the EPS on campy... haha

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Added on January 17, 2012, 8:30 pmregarding positioning on your bike...

think this is a fairly good guide and easy to understand... a nicely positioned ride should not feel nervous and twitchy..

http://www.realbuzz.com/articles/the-corre...#pagination-top

and your tyres won't blow up unless you hit big potholes especially at an angle... that or, glass shards and sharp objects.

* no riding fast on downhills as well before you are comfortable.. handling becomes more sensitive as speed increases... a slight mistake can send you kissing the ground.. ride safe..

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 08:36 PM

try and PM hianboy... dunno where he got his lazer helmet.. i think costs around RM400...he said his head is super big and no helmet fit him... lazer was the only one...

and yes, dun rush things... you don't become a pro in 1 week.. i rode for years and i hardly think i can call my self an experienced amateur...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 08:39 PM

yup.. unfortunately you have a limited choice unless you can bear to be laughed at wearing a motorcycle helmet to ride your bike...

it might not be faster now... but it would require less effort to ride at simillar speed on a roadie than a MTB...

however good a helmet.. it is important to know that a helmet has a lifespan like our car tyres... even though you have never taken a hit to the helmet.. it generally will only last 3 to 5 years before the internals will start to degrade and be unsafe for protecting your head...

do give the user manual a check for the recommended lifespan..

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Added on January 17, 2012, 11:23 pmyou aiming to compete in duathlons is it... hehe

jus being passionate about the sport and sharing our opinions and experience is important to keep it alive...

not so much important for me to know what you choose.. but if you can offer your experience on what you have chosen, it'll be good for for comparison in case someone like you comes in and ask around for bikes...

being unable to ride all the bikes... comparisons are just made on paper claims which can sometimes be deceiving...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 17 2012, 11:24 PM

i jus have quite a bit of free time in hand nowadays...

when my workload resumes to 100%... u will see me nowhere near a keyboard

not too sure about the price... but you will most probably be looking at the allez range?

http://www.specialized.com/zz/en/bc/SBCMain.jsp?scid=1101

i saw a 105 spec'd model at GH speedbikes and it retails for RM5.5k if i remember correctly.. not sure how much they will discount off that price...

they should have cheaper models spec'd lower.. you might have to check them out and see...

there is also a model named secteur.. meant more for recreational rather than competitive.. might be around the same price range...

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Added on January 18, 2012, 12:20 amunfortunately we don't have simillar events like the states does.. i'd be interested to try their crits... fast paced riding and constantly jumping for a sprint based on intuition rather than marking one another...



This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 18 2012, 12:20 AM

the price list is not posted on the net.. unless some of us owns one of it... there will be no way to find out the actual price of it unless you ask them yourself..

look through the specialized site and take down he exact model and specs that you have interest in, call them up to check if they have it and the price for it. if it is right, then you go and measure size.

http://www.johny2k.com/ghspeedbikes/contact-form.php

give them a call @ 03-6142 9303

they won't give you the final price over the phone. they will just let you know of the MSRP.

ryan3721 is right... butting is mostly used on frame and spokes... it is supposed to help make the tubes lighter and with the possibility of making it even stronger than a straight gauge tube... materials saved in the middle section which handles less stress loads can be used at both ends to beef it...hence, stronger..

what the boardman and focus did not mention is what sort of aluminum alloy was used to make the frame... basically there are 6000 and 7000 series aluminum... on frame, it is commonly 6061 and 7005 tubings... 7000 series tubes will resist metal fatigue a bit more than a 6000 series tube..

did you manage to confirm the price of the TCR SL2... i went to rodalink the other day and only did i manage to find out they no longer handle giant bikes anymore and they don't have that specific model in the shops...

if it is confirmed to be sold at the same price... then it is quite a bargain bike.

Rival's direct competitor is Ultegra...

Apex is to 105...

There is no groupsets that fall below Apex as there is nothing for them to reduce or take off to make it a lower spec'd group and neither do they want to create not cross compatible 9-speed group just to compete with shimano..

Furthermore, the price gaps between Tiagra, Sora and 2300 are too minimal to make a differentiating group for.

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 18 2012, 09:17 AM

Think someone asked before also.. You are referring to the Trek Alpha 1.2 right?

http://treknology3.com/cms/index.php?optio...d=93&Itemid=242

http://www.trekbikes.com/int/en/bikes/road.../1_2_h2_compact

at RM3k i assume MSRP .. slightly pricy for me for a 9 speed rig, but then if you really like Trek.. there is no valid arguments for this... Alpha 1 series used to costs in excess of 4k.. think they brought down the price to be more competitive..

Seen some cycling magz recommend previous year models as a 2nd bike or one that you can take it for an abuse yet be quite comfy for an aluminum frame at the same time...

still.. RM3k and a possibility to spend more to go up to 10-speed is where the deal is less sweet for me...if they provided full 10 speed tiagra.. they have more chances on paper...

think a trek and specialized is no difference in terms of pricing.. they are direct competitors in the pro tour arena after all..

for brands that are not as big as them... giant, merida, polygon and the likes... a sora - tiagra mix bike comes in just a tad over RM2k and typically under RM2.5k...

for example, the 105 (not sure if full 105) allez seems to be listed as RM5.5k while sky.live got his 105 mixed boardman for RM4.3k... branding seems to play a part in the pricing of this bikes... especially when they are full concept shops..

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Added on January 18, 2012, 10:56 amnot a conventional way.. and hope the mods dun come kaciao...

http://magazinesdownload.com/category/Bicy...yers-Guide.aspx

give this a read... not that we will have all this here.. but will give you an insight on what to expect for 2012 range...

becareful with this... it is major poison bombs inside...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 18 2012, 10:56 AM

trek outside of trek concept shop? weird.. but worth a try...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 18 2012, 11:09 AM

with what happen at the last langkawi triathlon... dun think malaysia will be hosting anymore full triathlon's anymore...

think most of the calendar is now filled with 70.3 formats... or run-bike-run events...

i dun know how to swim unfortunately.. so i will just stick to my 2 wheeler...

anyone on a leg powered 2 wheeler is a cyclist

never ridden a track or fixie as well... somehow doesn't feel natural without brakes...

can use sheldon's gear inch calculator... tells you the difference between each gear combinations...

normally the smallest cog on the rear cassette seldom change... it is either a 11 or 12 smallest..so, the diff between a 9 and 10 is usually more ratios to choose from and the ratios between the smalles and largest will be closer and you will find that your pedal revolutions will jump or drop less with each gear shift...

like a 11-32T cassette.. nice for steep climbing days.. but very hard to find your pedaling cadence on the road especially if you are following in a group...

for super flat rides... quite a lot depends on 11-25T for closer ratios and less changes to your cadence as your speed goes up and you shift up...

there will be 11-21 and 11-23T as well but you have to be superfit to use those or you will break down and cry once you reach a steep slope...

speaking purely from a road perspective...

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Added on January 18, 2012, 11:52 amspeaking on ratio and cadence...

no ratio is too high on a bike... you will find your 50 x 11 or 53 x 11 coming into play when you are riding 50 to 60kph...

of course if you ride a 50 x 11 then it'd be painful and hard to do...

best is to learn where your natural cadence is and find the right gear to suit that for every speed range...

This post has been edited by butthead: Jan 18 2012, 11:52 AM