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 Choosing The Right PSU, Discussions about power supply units.

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TSyehlai
post Nov 30 2006, 06:44 PM, updated 16y ago

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Always read some most frequent ask question about PSU from lyn forumers like "Which PSU is good fo me?", "Is it a true power PSU?".
Please.. forget about the "True Power", not many can explain to us what the so call 'true power' thing is. Instead of looking for 'true power', maybe we should looking at something that is measurable like ATX12V standard, 12V rails output circuits, Active PFC and power efficiency. Those information can be easily obtain by reading the PSU's label, manual or reviews. It tells us the overall performance of the PSU and makes job easier if you wanna do comparison betweeen PSU or even brands. Here are some PSU Technologies Explained.



PRIMARY PSU TECHNOLOGIES

Single or Dual +12V output circuits
What are Rails?
A rail is the delivery system for power. On a modern PSU these rails are divided into +3.3v, +5v, +12v, -5v and -12v. The important ones for us to look at are the positive rails. These will be specified to deliver an amount of amps per rail. Seeing as w = v * a. This tells us the output in watts of the PSU.

EXAMPLE:
Watts =+3.3v rail*30a = 100w
Watts =+5v rail *30a = 150w
Watts =+12v rail*25a = 300w

Adding them together gives us a power output of 550w.

The most important voltage rail in a power supply now is the +12V rail. This voltage rail supplies power to the most power demanding components including the Processor, DVD drives, HDD, cooling fans and Graphics cards. All of these items draw a lot of current and as a result you want to make sure that you purchase a unit that supplies enough current to the +12Vrail.

Dual +12V output circuits
QUOTE
Good 500w PSU:
Have atleast 18A on 12V rail, so:
(12v *18A)*2 = 432w (total output from 12v rail)

Cap ayam 500w PSU:
Might have only 15A on 12V rail, so:
(12v *15A)*2 = 360w (total output from 12v rail)

That means, the higher Amp(A) on +12V rail(s), the BETTER and capable to provide you HIGHER output on +12V rail(s). 


Single +12V output circuits
QUOTE
Good 500w PSU:
Have 36A on 12V rail, so:
(12v *36A) = 432w (total output from 12v rail)

Cap ayam 500w PSU:
Might have only 30A on 12V rail, so:
(12v *30A) = 360w (total output from 12v rail)

That means, the higher Amp(A) on +12V rail(s), the BETTER and capable provide you HIGHER output on +12V rail(s). 


So how to check the ''True Power'' come out from your PSU?
Observe the Amp value of your +12V rail(s) and do the calculation yourself wink.gif

Why +12V rail(s) is important?
The most important voltage rail in a power supply now is the +12V rail. This voltage rail supplies power to the most power demanding components including the Processor, DVD drives, HDD, cooling fans and Graphics cards !!

Get atleast ATX12V Version 2.1 compliance PSU for mordern rig
ATX12V power supply. With the move to 12V voltage regulators for the processor, ATX guidelines for 5V as main power are no longer provided.
Increased +12 VDC output capability
System components that use 12V are continuing to increase in power. In cases where expected current requirements is greater than 18A a second 12 V rail should be made available. ATX12V power supplies should be designed to accommodate these increased +12 VDC currents.

TIPS: Get a PSU that provides atleast 18A on 12V rails.
(for Dual +12V output type PSU)

user posted image user posted image
These ratings can be found easily on the PSU label.


Active PFC
The AC electric mains can be considered as having two types of power: active and reactive. Reactive power is generated in two cases: when the load current and the mains voltage are out of phase (that is, the load is inductive or capacitive) or when the load is non-linear. The PC power supply is a pronounced example of the second case. It will normally consume the mains current in short high impulses that coincide with the maximums of the mains voltage.

The problem is that while active power is fully transformed into useful work in the load, reactive power is not consumed at all. It is driven back into the mains. It is kind of wandering to and fro between the generator and the load, but it heats up the connecting wires as well as active power does. That's why reactive power must be got rid of.

The circuit called active PFC is the most efficient way to suppress reactive power. It is in fact an impulse transformer that is designed in such a way that its instantaneous consumed power is directly proportional to the instantaneous voltage in the mains. In other words, it is made linear on purpose and thus consumes active power only. The voltage from the output of the active PFC device goes right to the switching transformer of the power supply which used to be a reactive load due to its non-linearity. But now that it receives direct voltage, the non-linearity of the second transformer doesn't matter anymore because it is detached from the electric mains and cannot affect it.

The power factor is the measure of reactive power. It is the ratio of active power to the total of active and reactive power. It is about 0.65 with an ordinary PSU, but PSUs with active PFC have a power factor of 0.97-0.99. So, the active PFC device reduces reactive power almost to zero.

Power supply companies rather than the users that profit from active PFC because it reduces the computer's load on the electric mains by over one third. And this amounts to big numbers today when there is a PC standing on every office desk. From an ordinary user's point of view, active PFC makes no difference even when it comes to electricity bills. Home electricity supply meters measure only active power as yet. The manufacturers' claims that active PFC can in any way help your computer are nothing but marketing noise.

Active PFC is not an obligatory feature right now, but from the next year a power supply will have to have a power factor that can only be achieved with active PFC to pass the Energy Star certification (which is voluntary, though).

Passive PFC
Passive PFC is the simplest way to correct the power factor. It is a small choke connected in series with the power supply. Its inductance is smoothing out the pulsation of the current consumed by the PSU and is thus reducing the level of non-linearity. There is a very small effect from passive PFC - the power factor grows only from 0.65 to 0.7-0.75. But while implementing active PFC requires a deep redesign of the PSU's high-voltage circuitry, passive PFC can be easily added into any existing power supply.

Power supplies with passive PFC with eventually be replaced with active-PFC models.

High efficiency
Efficiency is the ratio of input power to output power. The higher the efficiency of a PSU is, the less heat it generates and the quieter its cooling can be made. Your electricity bills will be lower if the efficiency is high, too.

The current version of the ATX12V 2.2 standard limits the PSU efficiency from below: a minimum of 72% at typical load, 70% at full load and 65% at low load. Besides that, there are optional numbers (an efficiency of 80% at nominal load) and the voluntary certification program "80 Plus" which requires that the PSU has an efficiency of 80% and higher at loads from 20% to maximum. The new Energy Star certification program to come to effect in 2007 will have the same requirements as in the 80 Plus.

Minimum Efficiency Required
Minimum measured efficiency is required to be 70% at full and 72% at typical (~50%) load and 65% at light (~20%) load. The recommended guidance is 77% at full load, 80% at typical (50%) load and 75% at light (20%) load to provide direction for future requirements.

HIGH EFFICIENCY = LOWER HEAT = LOWER FAN SPEED = LOW NOICE


QUOTE
Efficiency means, how many percent of power comsume (input) in order to produce the output power.

e.g
if your system need 400W to run, a 80% efficiency PSU will consume 500W of power. 500W x 80% = 400W
if you have a 50% effiency PSU, then you will consume 800W in order to supply 400W for your system.
the higher efficiency PSU you have, the less electricity bill you will pay.
Credit to: YiQi
Low noise
This means that the speed of the PSU fan is varied depending on temperature or, less often, on load power. This speed management is currently implemented in all PSUs, even cheapest ones, so the question is about the quality of implementation. This quality can be viewed from three aspects: the quality of the employed fan, the minimum speed of the fan, and the speed adjustment range. For example, simplest power supplies may have speed management, but the speed is changed from 2500rpm at a 50W load to 2700rpm at a 350W load. It's like the speed doesn't change at all.

Respectable manufacturers implement the fan speed management system properly, but often play another marketing trick. The fan speed (or the noise level) they write into the power supply specs is measured at a temperature of 18?C as reported by a sensor inside the PSU. This thermal sensor is usually installed somewhere in the hottest part of the PSU, on the heatsink with diode packs, so you can only have that temperature in reality if you put your PSU in a refrigerator. Although no one keeps PSUs in a fridge, the specification still contains an unrealistically pretty number like a noise level of 16dBA (this is quieter than the background noise in a quiet room). In reality, the room temperature is usually within 20-25?C, and the temperature inside the PC case is closer to 30?C. Of course, you can't get 16dBA under such conditions.



OTHER PSU TECHNOLOGIES (Optional)

Nylon sleeve
Soft braided nylon tubes on the PSU's output cables help lay them out neatly inside the system case.
Some manufacturers have switched from the undoubtedly good idea of using nylon sleeves to the use of thick plastic tubes, often screened and covered with a paint that shines in ultraviolet. The shining paint is a matter of personal taste, of course, but the screening does not do anything good to the PSU cables. The thick tubes make the cables stiff and unwilling to bend, which makes it hard to lay them out in the system case properly and is even dangerous for the power connectors that have to bear the pressure of the cables that resist the bending.
This is often advertised as a means to improve the cooling of the system case, but the tubes on the power cables have but a very small effect on the airflows inside your computer.

Dual core CPU support
This is nothing but a pretty-looking label. Dual-core processors do not require any special support from the power supply.

SLI and CrossFire support
Yet another pretty-looking label that means two power connectors for graphics cards and an ability to yield as much power as is considered sufficient for a SLI graphics subsystem. Nothing else stands behind that label.

Industrial class components
One more pretty-looking sticker! Industrial class components are components that can work in a very wide range of temperatures. But what's the purpose of installing a chip capable of working under -45?C into a PSU if this PSU will never be used in such cold weather?

Sometimes the term industrial class components refers to capacitors meant for operation under a temperature up to 105?C, but that's all clear here, too. The capacitors in the PSU's output circuits heat up by themselves and also located very close to the hot chokes are always rated for a temperature of 105?C max or their service life would be too short. Of course, there is a much lower temperature inside the PSU, but the problem is that the service life of a capacitor depends on the ambient temperature. Capacitors rated for higher max temperatures are going to last longer under the same thermal conditions.

The input high-voltage capacitors work almost at the temperature of the ambient air, so the use of somewhat cheaper 85?C capacitors there doesn't affect the PSU's service life much.

Advanced double forward switching design
Alluring the potential customer with mysterious terms is a favorite trick of the marketing department.

Here, the term means the topology of the PSU, i.e. the general concept of its circuit design. There are quite a number of different topologies. Besides the double forward converter, PC power supplies may use a forward converter or a half-bridge converter. These terms are only interesting for a specialist and don't mean much for an ordinary user.

The choice of the particular PSU topology is determined by a number of reasons like the availability and price of transistors with required characteristics (they differ greatly depending on the topology), transformers, controller chips, etc. For example, the single-transistor forward converter is simple and cheap but requires a high-voltage transistor and high-voltage diodes on the PSU output, so it is only used in inexpensive low-wattage models (high-voltage diodes and transistors of high power are too expensive). The half-bridge converter is somewhat more complex, but has a two times lower voltage on the transistors. So, this is generally a matter of availability and cost of the necessary components. I can predict, for example, that synchronous rectifiers will be sooner or later used in the secondary circuits of PC power supplies. There's nothing new in that technology, but it is too expensive as yet and its advantages don't cover its cost.

RoHS (Reduction of Hazardous Substances)
This is a new European Union directive that limits the use of certain substances in electronic equipment since July 1, 2006. It restricts the use of lead, mercury, cadmium, hexavalent chromium, and two bromides. For power supplies this mainly means a transition to non-lead solders. Yes, we are all for ecology and against heavy metals, but a too hasty transition to new materials may have unpleasant consequences.



SAFETY/CIRCUIT PROTECTIONS

Short circuit protection (SCP)
Short circuit protection is obligatory according to the ATX12V Power Supply Design Guide. This means that it is implemented in all power supplies, even those that don't explicitly mention such protection, that claim to comply with that standard.

Overpower (overload) protection (OPP)
This protects the power supply from overload on all of its outputs combined. This protection is obligatory.

Overcurrent protection (OCP)
This protects the separate PSU outputs from overload (but not yet from short circuit). It is available on many, but not all, PSUs, and not for all of the outputs. This protection is not obligatory.

Overtemperature protection (OTP)
This protects the PSU from overheat. It is not required and is not implemented often.

Overvoltage protection (OVP)
This protection is obligatory, but is only meant for critical failures. It works only when some output voltage shoots 20-25% above the nominal value. In other words, if your power supply yields 13V instead of 12V, you must replace it as soon as possible, but its protection is not required to react yet because it is designed for even more critical situations.

Undervoltage protection (UVP)
As opposed to too-high voltage, too-low voltage cannot do much harm to your computer, but may cause failures in operation of the hard drive, for example. This protection works when a voltage bottoms out by 20-25%.



Source: X-bit labs
Edit by me

Encolsed with some PSUs reviews HERE and HERE... Enjoy laugh.gif


Usefull Links:

i) Official XS ~ Tiered PSU Manufacturer Brand Listing

ii) PSU Recommendations for High End Gaming PC's ~ jonnyguru

iii) Power Supply Manufacturers ~ hardwaresecrets

iv) PC modding Malysia's Power Supply reviews.

v) extreme psu calculator.

vi) 1000W Power Supply Unit Roundup

vii) Power Supply Terminology ~ PC Power & Cooling

viii) Tech Questions and Answered ~ PC Power & Cooling

This post has been edited by yehlai: Nov 20 2010, 09:43 PM
TSyehlai
post Dec 2 2006, 05:59 PM

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~~~ Reserve ~~~


This post has been edited by yehlai: May 17 2007, 01:58 PM
TSyehlai
post Dec 2 2006, 11:40 PM

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Will put those info later please read my post.

This post has been edited by yehlai: May 17 2007, 02:14 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 1 2007, 08:56 PM

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QUOTE(Nemesis181188 @ Jan 1 2007, 05:22 PM)
I wanna ask a question.My psu which is a cooler master 430w doesn't have what we call that cable that connects to a graphics card which i heard.So if just say i want to upgrade my gc which needs the cable,must i buy a new psu or is there any cable which could be bought and just simply added to the wires so that i could connect it to the gc?
*
I think u only need to change PSU when u RUN SLi/CF.
Cooler Master 430W sure can support any single card in PCI-E slot.
TSyehlai
post Jan 15 2007, 09:05 AM

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QUOTE(afosz @ Jan 15 2007, 08:29 AM)
how bout upgrading to 7900GS, any suggestion of the PSU?hopefully not too costly since 7900GS already cost a lot to me biggrin.gif if i'm not mistaken,X1950XT consumes lots of power than 7900GS right? sweat.gif
*
Atleast 450W for safety and future proof.
Can try get Enermax FMA II. If really budget tight then ACbel.
Dont recommend u CM Extreme Power or Real power.
TSyehlai
post Jan 15 2007, 09:50 AM

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QUOTE(sniperwolf @ Jan 15 2007, 09:38 AM)
I dont think there any problem as if someone on tight budget to get a cm extreme 430w for usage. I had recently help a client to build a pc running 7900gs with that psu and its rock stable with his am2 dual core, running together with 2 hdd and 1 optical drive. It aint as bad as you guys mentioned. If one can afford more, surely will recommend something which cost more. smile.gif
*
No doubt for tight budget, CM Extreme is a nice choice.. but after some forumers die or explode their CM Extreme PSU and one of them post me the pic, now i dont recommend CM Extreme alrdy. Moreover CM = ACbel, so i rather get an ACbel.
In term of Price/Performance i would rather go for SilvStone 400w than CM Extreme.

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 15 2007, 11:27 AM
TSyehlai
post Jan 15 2007, 04:27 PM

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Enermax FMA II 450W then..

Edit: Im gonna update This Thread soon since alrdy get back my mobo.

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 15 2007, 04:28 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 15 2007, 08:27 PM

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QUOTE(akachester @ Jan 15 2007, 07:56 PM)
Yes, i do agree.The Silverstone Element 400W is a very reliable PSU compared to CM extreme.But i dont think we will still be able to get the Element 400W here..Maybe the Strider 400W..
*
Check Zamree7 bulk.

QUOTE(Kataro @ Jan 15 2007, 08:09 PM)
Wanna ask a question about my Liberty 400W... notworthy.gif

[attachmentid=181329]

As shown in above attachment, my +12V reading is only 11.19V, is it normal (from what I read untill now, it is not normal, isn't it?)?
My spec is as my sig below and 2 penaflo exhaust fan, 2 PSU's fan as intake and 1 hard disk cooler...
I have ordered my PCI-e 7600GS from forumer here...I wonder will my PSU can give enough juice to support it? futhermore, I will upgrade my ram to DDR2 667 1 or 2GB in the near future...so I afraid my PC will not be able to boot if I have that spec... sad.gif

Any idea? Please give your comment...  icon_question.gif Thanks... notworthy.gif
*
12V rails fluctuate about +/-5% is normal.

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 15 2007, 08:33 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 16 2007, 08:54 PM

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QUOTE(akachester @ Jan 15 2007, 10:23 PM)
Well, i was about to purchase the Element 500W last time out due to the great amount of recommendation given and amazing review but recently, the stop the production of the Element for the Strider.I will definitely get the Strider 560W but not now..The CM Real Power 450W is serving me good but i wanted a more reliable one..As far as i can see, i wanted something that is modular and might be cheap but there aint one..So, the Strider 560W is definitely my best choice now..
*
Yup.. really cheap. So i got myself one..
TSyehlai
post Jan 16 2007, 09:39 PM

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QUOTE(yuka @ Jan 16 2007, 09:32 PM)
i'm planin' to upgrade my agp rig, see my sig...
and currently i'm using iCute 450w... do u think this PSU can stand for some few times after i upgrade my proc, rams, gc, some ccfls, fans, and dvd-rw?  icon_question.gif
should i upgrade? if yes, pls recommend me...
budget dont know, but recommend me some low-end PSU that suitable to my rig  nod.gif
*
Soon or later i will cause u some prob.. especially after u upgrade rig.
if u lucky the pc will reboot.. if worst then it might burn some hardware or PSU explode..

http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...post&p=10019428
TSyehlai
post Jan 17 2007, 07:34 PM

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Since he dint set his budget yet, sure im gonna recommend him some better stuff instead of CM Extreme. Its different story with your fren's rig...
For low budget PSU i still think Silverstone Element 400w is a steal.
This PSU comes with A.PFC, Stable 12V rails, High eff. and nice cooling which CM Extreme cannot offer. nod.gif

CM Extreme 450W: RM 160
Silverstone 400W: Rm 199

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 17 2007, 07:42 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 18 2007, 08:39 PM

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QUOTE(chickenducksoup @ Jan 18 2007, 08:13 PM)
hi can tell how 2 calculate the watt base on amp tat u state?

thank
*
Here: http://www.extreme.outervision.com/psucalculator.jsp

QUOTE
ask a question, i-cute 480watt dual fan blue LED << its pure watt is how many ? i cant search it from internet.. model also didn`t notice at its box.. just some japanese word there..


If u heavent buy it yet , then void it..
If alrdy bought, then change PSU b4 tht iCute give u any problem.
Silverstone Element 400w. RM 200 is a good choice.

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 18 2007, 08:42 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 19 2007, 11:48 PM

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QUOTE(sniper69 @ Jan 19 2007, 11:06 PM)
... while Enermax FMA 350W @RM169...
*
Yup.. agree. FMA 350w is good. If want 400w then can try Silverstone Element 400W. Only cost RM 200 at lyn bulk

QUOTE(ahdai @ Jan 19 2007, 11:14 PM)
so if i wan to get a lower budget 1, better choose Acbel 350W rather than PowerLogic 450W? bcoz my budget is around 130 onli......
*
FMA 350w is nice.
But if choose between Powerlogic and ACbel, then i think i will get ACbel.
CM iGreen is a ACbel too. Atleast ACbel make PSU for CM.

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 19 2007, 11:52 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 25 2007, 06:53 PM

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QUOTE(afosz @ Jan 25 2007, 02:32 PM)
Is Silverstone 400W good at LYN bulk?12V1 with 14A (Max) and 16A (Peak) is it a total of 30A or 12V1 14A 12V2 15A and total 29A?

Between this 4 Enermax Liberty 400W, Enermax FMA II 460W and Silverstone 400W, Fortron FSP SAGA 400W, which is worth your wallet?
*
For me is Silverstone. Cheapest and good + reliable!!

QUOTE(hongchiang @ Jan 25 2007, 04:33 PM)
i am using a PSU with single +12V rail with 22A only. Then the total Watt is  460Watt.
For my rig in my signature is it enough to support that?
because sometime i having instability of my pc, restart, hang..
checking whether is PSU problem ..icon_question.gif
*
Good enough. But AirZeon is almost same like i-Cute actually.

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 25 2007, 06:55 PM
TSyehlai
post Jan 25 2007, 07:28 PM

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QUOTE(hongchiang @ Jan 25 2007, 07:01 PM)
oh...
then i think is not my PSU prroblem...
pc always nto stable..
not even can oc...now only running at stock speed....
any idea?thanks for the reply man.. notworthy.gif  notworthy.gif
*
But i think it can be PSU prob.. becoz Airzeon is almost like iCute.
Siaverstone 400W, Rm 200 is a better choice.
Your 'not stable ' means frequent reboot pc??

This post has been edited by yehlai: Jan 25 2007, 07:29 PM
TSyehlai
post Feb 14 2007, 11:27 PM

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QUOTE(jy14 @ Feb 14 2007, 01:24 PM)
Hi yehlai,

Like to ask anyway to test the PSU without fixing it into the rig ? I remember once I read something like this in LYN, but can't seem to find it anymore. Please advice.

Thank you.
*
Multimeter or voltmeter.
http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/show...ad.php?t=137886

TSyehlai
post Feb 27 2007, 12:39 PM

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QUOTE(vassalle @ Feb 27 2007, 11:38 AM)
Anyway, moderno habes stock already for his st56f. By anychance ATE brings  the PSU? C-zone charge quite expensive la @ RM 399. sad.gif

/sorry a bit off topic.
*
Try get from Kingmarker or Zamree.
I get mine from Zamree, RM349. By COD
contact : 012-6858880
TSyehlai
post Mar 4 2007, 01:29 PM

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QUOTE(Matrix @ Mar 1 2007, 04:59 PM)
Just bought a Coolermaster ExtremePower 430W...saw something funny in the specs...something about "Peak 430W for 30 seconds"...means what?? If it hits 430W after 30 secs, it'll BLOW UP???? shocking.gif
*
Not blow up.. but might cause pc reboot i think.
If happen too frequent can cause h/w failure/dmg.
TSyehlai
post Apr 14 2007, 09:19 PM

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Top up RM21 can get Silverstone 560W alrdy, but Liberty is modular PSU. Good for pc modding.

TSyehlai
post Apr 15 2007, 08:29 PM

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QUOTE(xixo_12 @ Apr 15 2007, 07:53 PM)
my rig now:
amd x2 am2 3600+ 90nm
msi k9nu neo
1gb ddr667 corsair
msi 7300gt
PSU 225W

wanted to change:
DFI INFINITY NF570-M2/G
amd 4800+ brisbane

Do i need to change psu?
wanted to oc..
way psu, do u recommend
*
225W is hardly enough for ur current setup.
If wanna upgrade to AMD 4800, need to switch to a 400W PSU atleast.
As usual, Enermax FMA 535W or Silverstone Strider 560W would be good.
Cost arround RM320-350.




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