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> The Official Lowyat.NET Sintua Thread, A thread on Chinese folk religion.

nachtsider
post Dec 31 2014, 12:06 PM

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QUOTE(Seager @ Dec 31 2014, 09:42 AM)
Fascinating read indeed.
This may seem out of topic but there seems to be a couple of huge statues on top of the Guan Yin temple in Penang. Is this something that you're somewhat related to as well?
No, it's completely relevant. Guan Yin is a major goddess in both Buddhism and Chinese folk religion.

If you show me pictures of these statues, I might be able to identify them for you and provide additional relevant information.
loud
post Dec 31 2014, 12:12 PM

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Did your spiritual teacher told you how he got involved with these practice? How he acquired the spirit eye?
nachtsider
post Dec 31 2014, 12:25 PM

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QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 12:12 PM)
Did your spiritual teacher told you how he got involved with these practice? How he acquired the spirit eye?
My teacher became a medium at the age of sixteen. People are usually chosen to become mediums as a form of penance for previous negative karma.

He didn't have the second sight, although he was sensitive to the supernatural.
loud
post Dec 31 2014, 12:44 PM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Dec 31 2014, 12:25 PM)
My teacher became a medium at the age of sixteen. People are usually chosen to become mediums as a form of penance for previous negative karma.

He didn't have the second sight, although he was sensitive to the supernatural.
*
I wonder why it seldom happen on Xtians and Muslims.


loud
post Dec 31 2014, 12:45 PM

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Few of my family members are believers of deities too, not exactly Sintua but the more common ones ranging from chinese, hindu and siamese traditions.

Are the hell deities compatible with the heavenly ones when placing their idols close together in an altar?...since people served them different offerings.

This post has been edited by loud: Dec 31 2014, 12:46 PM
nachtsider
post Dec 31 2014, 02:24 PM

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QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 12:45 PM)
Few of my family members are believers of deities too, not exactly Sintua but the more common ones ranging from chinese, hindu and siamese traditions.
You'd be surprised, how many Chinese deities fall under the sintua/folk religion category. Many people who identify as Buddhists or Taoists are actually sintua practitioners; they just don't know it.

If you related some of the deities that your family believes in, I might be able to tell you if you are actually one of my brothers/sisters in faith.

QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 12:45 PM)
Are the hell deities compatible with the heavenly ones when placing their idols close together in an altar?...since people served them different offerings.
This is a good question.

Heavenly gods and Hell deities are normally placed separately. Take a look at the photo here, for instance; the Heavenly gods occupy the upper portion of the altar, while the Hell deities are placed in an alcove beneath. It is actually quite common for Hell deities to be placed near to or even on the floor; the Chinese phrase for Hell (地狱) literally means 'subterranean prison' or 'prison of the earth', after all.

user posted image
Seager
post Dec 31 2014, 03:34 PM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Dec 31 2014, 12:06 PM)
No, it's completely relevant. Guan Yin is a major goddess in both Buddhism and Chinese folk religion.

If you show me pictures of these statues, I might be able to identify them for you and provide additional relevant information.
*
Need to go through my photo album
But they looked like warriors though
loud
post Dec 31 2014, 08:02 PM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Dec 31 2014, 02:24 PM)
You'd be surprised, how many Chinese deities fall under the sintua/folk religion category. Many people who identify as Buddhists or Taoists are actually sintua practitioners; they just don't know it.

If you related some of the deities that your family believes in, I might be able to tell you if you are actually one of my brothers/sisters in faith.


Tian kong
Na tuk kong
Guan kong
Guan Yin
Ganesh
and a few different buddha idols.

Personally my faith has ceased quite for sometime, what remains is curiosity. But the badass looking idols from the pics you posted are too mesmerizing to be ignore...feel like getting them for ornament purpose. tongue.gif


QUOTE
This is a good question.

Heavenly gods and Hell deities are normally placed separately. Take a look at the photo here, for instance; the Heavenly gods occupy the upper portion of the altar, while the Hell deities are placed in an alcove beneath. It is actually quite common for Hell deities to be placed near to or even on the floor; the Chinese phrase for Hell (地狱) literally means 'subterranean prison' or 'prison of the earth', after all.

user posted image
*

And a buddha is down there enjoying stout with them?

nachtsider
post Dec 31 2014, 09:37 PM

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QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 08:02 PM)
Tian kong
Na tuk kong
Guan kong
Guan Yin
Ganesh
and a few different buddha idols.
It would seem that you indeed, are, one of my siblings in faith. biggrin.gif

Datuk (Na Tok Gong) worship is a Chinese folk religious practice. They are Malay earth gods and nature spirits, the spiritual landowners of Malay soil. If a plot of Datuk-owned land is to be used or developed, the relevant Datuk(s) must be appeased beforehand.

user posted image

user posted image

Lord Guan is the sintua God of War, he who protects humanity from war and its horrors, and who is the patron of fighting men such as soldiers and police. He was a philanthropist in addition to being a warrior, and is thus revered as a god of wealth - a military wealth god, who does not usher in wealth but helps you safeguard your wealth from being swindled or stolen. This quality, coupled with his ability as a strategist, makes him revered by 'fighters' of another kind - traders, businessmen, those who 'do battle' in the world of hostile business takeovers and high stakes deals.

user posted image

user posted image

Lady Guan Yin is recognised by both Buddhism and Chinese folk religion. Within the sintua context, she is the Goddess of Mercy; a former princess who went against her cruel father's wishes and became a Buddhist nun who subsequently worked many miracles, including saving her father from a dreadful illness, despite him attempting to kill her for defying him.

user posted image

user posted image

QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 08:02 PM)
And a buddha is down there enjoying stout with them?
The 'Buddha' of whom you speak is Ksitigarbha Bodhisattva, also known as Di Zang (地藏; Haven - literally 'womb' - of the Earth) or Ojizosama. Recognised by both Buddhism and Chinese folk religion, he is a Hell-associated Bodhisattva whom we sintua practitioners regard as one of the highest ranking beings in the Hellish pantheon. An ancient king of India turned Buddhist high priest, he a saviour and protector of suffering souls, especially deceased children (including aborted babies), and has the power to pardon those who are undergoing punishments in Hell. He has vowed not to accept the status of Buddha until Hell is empty.

user posted image

Ksitigarbha is often present on Hell altars in a position presiding over the other, lesser Hell beings (see image below). But no, he does not drink, haha. Offerings to his subordinates that are incompatible with a Buddhist's vows are positioned at a distance from his image.

user posted image
nachtsider
post Dec 31 2014, 09:46 PM

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QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 08:02 PM)
Personally my faith has ceased quite for sometime, what remains is curiosity. But the badass looking idols from the pics you posted are too mesmerizing to be ignore...feel like getting them for ornament purpose. tongue.gif

And that's perfectly okay. There's no pressure on you to conform to any faith, my friend. You're free to leave and return as you so please, as per what you're comfortable with. I'm more than happy for you to discuss the topic from a curious onlooker's perspective. smile.gif

I'm glad you like the pics I've posted, including those of the statues on my altar. Considerable man-hours and funds went into assembling my personal lineup; feel free to request more photos of it, and ask any relevant questions. cool2.gif

user posted image
loud
post Dec 31 2014, 10:01 PM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Dec 31 2014, 09:37 PM)
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

*
Thank you for their interesting background.
A bit confuse with Guan Yin story. Some source stated that Guan Yin is a He with the original name Avalokiteśvara.
Quote:
The name Avalokiteśvara is made of the following parts: the verbal prefix ava, which means "down"; lokita, a past participle of the verb lok ("to notice, behold, observe"), here used in an active sense (an occasional irregularity of Sanskrit grammar); and finally īśvara, "lord", "ruler", "sovereign" or "master". In accordance with sandhi (Sanskrit rules of sound combination), a+iśvara becomes eśvara. Combined, the parts mean "lord who gazes down (at the world)". The word loka ("world") is absent from the name, but the phrase is implied.[1]

It was initially thought that the Chinese mis-transliterated the word Avalokiteśvara as Avalokitasvara which explained why Xuanzang translated it as Guānzìzài (Ch. 觀自在) instead of Guānyīn (Ch. 觀音). However, according to recent research, the original form was indeed Avalokitasvara[2] with the ending a-svara ("sound, noise"), which means "sound perceiver", literally "he who looks down upon sound" (i.e., the cries of sentient beings who need his help; a-svara can be glossed as ahr-svara, "sound of lamentation").[3] This is the exact equivalent of the Chinese translation Guānyīn. This etymology was furthered in the Chinese by the tendency of some Chinese translators, notably Kumarajiva, to use the variant Guānshìyīn (Ch. 觀世音), literally "he who perceives the world's lamentations"—wherein lok was read as simultaneously meaning both "to look" and "world" (Skt. loka; Ch. 世, shì).[3] This name was later supplanted by the form containing the ending -īśvara, which does not occur in Sanskrit before the seventh century. The original form Avalokitasvara already appears in Sanskrit fragments of the fifth century.[4]

The original meaning of the name fits the Buddhist understanding of the role of a bodhisattva. The reinterpretation presenting him as an īśvara shows a strong influence of Hinduism, as the term īśvara was usually connected to the Hindu notion of Krishna (in Vaisnavism) or Śiva (in Śaivism) as the Supreme Lord, Creator and Ruler of the world. Some attributes of such a god were transmitted to the bodhisattva, but the mainstream of those who venerated Avalokiteśvara upheld the Buddhist rejection of the doctrine of any creator god.[5]

An etymology of the Tibetan name Jänräsig (Jainraisig) is jän (eye), rä (continuity) and sig (to look). This gives the meaning of one who always looks upon all beings (with the eye of compassion).[6]

In other parts of Asia other than China, Avalokitasvara is commonly refers to the Bodhisattva of Compassion or the Goddess of Mercy. In Korean Buddhism Avalokitesvara is Gwaneum, or Gwanseeum-bosal. In Sanskrit, Avalokitesvara is also referred to as Padmapāni ("Holder of the Lotus") or Lokeśvara ("Lord of the World"). In Tibetan, Avalokiteśvara is known as Chenrezig, སྤྱན་རས་གཟིགས་ (Wylie: spyan ras gzigs) and is said to emanate as the Dalai Lama,[7] the Karmapa[8][9] and other high lamas.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avalokite%C5%9Bvara
nachtsider
post Jan 1 2015, 09:07 AM

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QUOTE(loud @ Dec 31 2014, 10:01 PM)
Thank you for their interesting background.
A bit confuse with Guan Yin story. Some source stated that Guan Yin is a He with the original name Avalokiteśvara.
There's no confusion there, really.

Avalokitesvara is a genderless Bodhisattva, who has many manifestations, male and female alike. It is the female manifestation of Avalokitesvara whom Chinese folk religion reveres as Lady Guan Yin.
leetan33
post Jan 1 2015, 09:54 AM

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Nice thread! Thanks for sharing! thumbup.gif thumbup.gif
leetan33
post Jan 1 2015, 10:16 AM

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https://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopic=3425705&hl=
nachtsider
post Jan 1 2015, 10:27 AM

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QUOTE(leetan33 @ Jan 1 2015, 09:54 AM)
Nice thread! Thanks for sharing!  thumbup.gif  thumbup.gif
Hello Lee, the thanks are mine to offer - I'm grateful that you've come to participate. Feel free to talk about Chinese gods and Chinese folk religion as much as you wish; any questions are welcome. smile.gif

QUOTE(leetan33 @ Jan 1 2015, 10:16 AM)
It is a misconception that all these gods are 'Taoist deities', actually.

For instance, Taoism does not subscribe to the existence of Na Zha and Guan Yin, among many others.

This post has been edited by nachtsider: Jan 1 2015, 10:27 AM
leetan33
post Jan 1 2015, 10:31 AM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Jan 1 2015, 10:27 AM)
Hello Lee, the thanks are mine to offer - I'm grateful that you've come to participate. Feel free to talk about Chinese gods and Chinese folk religion as much as you wish; any questions are welcome. smile.gif
It is a misconception that all these gods are 'Taoist deities', actually.

For instance, Taoism does not subscribe to the existence of Na Zha and Guan Yin, among many others.
*
The concept of "San Jiao He Liu / San Jiao He Yi (Confluence of Three Religions / Combination of Three Religions) has already in existence back in Han Dynasty.
In Chinese religion, we absorb the teachings of these three religions, namely Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism.
http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E4%B8%89%E6%...%90%88%E6%B5%81
nachtsider
post Jan 1 2015, 10:47 AM

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QUOTE(leetan33 @ Jan 1 2015, 10:31 AM)
The concept of "San Jiao He Liu / San Jiao He Yi (Confluence of Three Religions / Combination of Three Religions) has already in existence back in Han Dynasty.
In Chinese religion, we absorb the teachings of these three religions, namely Buddhism, Taoism and Confucianism.
It is the syncretic form of Chinese religion, which combines some Taoist elements, some Buddhist elements and some Confucian elements, that I refer to as Chinese folk religion or the sintua belief.

However, Chinese folk religion often puts its own interpretation on Buddhist beliefs, Taoist beliefs and Confucian beliefs - see, for instance, our take on Guan Yin.

Also Chinese folk religion has some of its own unique elements, as well.

Trance mediumship - the concept that deities can possess the bodies of human mediums in order to communicate with mortal devotees - is one example. Taoism and Buddhism do not subscribe to this belief, which is very ancient, much older than either of these religions.

Chinese folk religion also accepts a number of non-Chinese belief systems, such as Datuk worship, and includes deities that Buddhism and Taoism either do not recognise at all, or pay the merest of lip service (e.g. the Monkey King and Na Zha).
leetan33
post Jan 1 2015, 10:55 AM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Jan 1 2015, 10:47 AM)
It is the syncretic form of Chinese religion, which combines some Taoist elements, some Buddhist elements and some Confucian elements, that I refer to as Chinese folk religion or the sintua belief.

However, Chinese folk religion often puts its own interpretation on Buddhist beliefs, Taoist beliefs and Confucian beliefs - see, for instance, our take on Guan Yin.

Also Chinese folk religion has some of its own unique elements, as well.

Trance mediumship - the concept that deities can possess the bodies of human mediums in order to communicate with mortal devotees - is one example. Taoism and Buddhism do not subscribe to this belief, which is very ancient, much older than either of these religions.

Chinese folk religion also accepts a number of non-Chinese belief systems, such as Datuk worship, and includes deities that Buddhism and Taoism either do not recognise at all, or pay the merest of lip service (e.g. the Monkey King and Na Zha).
*
Well said! thumbup.gif
EnergyAnalyst
post Jan 1 2015, 11:21 AM

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Interesting. Good thread to subscribed to. If you don't mind, please share with me what is eight immotals' place in the whole scheme of things?

This post has been edited by EnergyAnalyst: Jan 1 2015, 11:23 AM
Blofeld
post Jan 1 2015, 11:38 AM

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QUOTE(nachtsider @ Dec 31 2014, 02:24 PM)
You'd be surprised, how many Chinese deities fall under the sintua/folk religion category. Many people who identify as Buddhists or Taoists are actually sintua practitioners; they just don't know it.

If you related some of the deities that your family believes in, I might be able to tell you if you are actually one of my brothers/sisters in faith.
This is a good question.

Heavenly gods and Hell deities are normally placed separately. Take a look at the photo here, for instance; the Heavenly gods occupy the upper portion of the altar, while the Hell deities are placed in an alcove beneath. It is actually quite common for Hell deities to be placed near to or even on the floor; the Chinese phrase for Hell (地狱) literally means 'subterranean prison' or 'prison of the earth', after all.

user posted image
*
Interesting thread for reading.

All those pictures taken, are at your house?

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