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English Clubs Liverpool Kop Talk 2014, Welcome Emre Can & Rickie Lambert

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Cloud0890
post May 12 2014, 08:34 PM

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QUOTE(shamsul_LP @ May 12 2014, 03:41 PM)
Its not about the mistake in chelsea game. Its about defensive job. No doubt he contribute a lot at the other end but  he doesnt give enough protection to the back 4. He doesnt have enough energy to cover fullback when they goes into opponent half due to aging age. For me the best place for gerrard is further upfront. Lets take the other to do defensive job.
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I agree. Looking at Fernandinho, he does the job of controlling game tempo and strong enough defensively to cover the marauding Yaya Toure.

You could say Gerrard is more similar to Pirlo. At Juventus both Vidal and Pogba are very strong and capable of doing lots of running and defensive work to help Pirlo out. Both players are not exactly creative players so their play relies on wingers and strikers to create most of their chances. In our case we expect both midfielders ahead of Stevie to both attack and help Gerrard out which is a big big workload and only Hendo is capable of doing both jobs effectively.
Cloud0890
post May 13 2014, 04:48 AM

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QUOTE(hfi @ May 12 2014, 10:14 PM)
But it's a whole different system. We can't take a player's position and compare it like for like, and neglect their qualities and roles for their teams. I've been critical of Gerrard at the start of the season where he had been lackluster and it took us several different formations to get the most out of him. We went from 4231 to 352 and neither of those formations worked for him. But credit to him and BR, he grew as one of the best players in hte league. Sure he has his weakness but you just can't argue his contributions this season. Pivotal goals after goals - granted most of it were pens but they were crucial match winning pens. His deliveries have been pin point accurate and is one of the reasons why Skrtel have been banging in goals this season. He's also one out of the two players who can take a freekick with deadly result.

I will have no problem milking him for the next 2-3 years if he can maintain this kind of form. I think what we need this summer is another box to box midfielder. Like you said, we are similar to Juventus in that we deploy a 3 man midfielders and perhaps this has been said already but we really missed Hendo from his suspension. Allen may still have a role in the team but i worry about Lucas - he looks really out of pace and he doesn't look comfortable operating in tight pockets unlike Hendo who seems to be growing in confidence and ability.
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Yeah but don't misunderstand me. I'm not being critical of Stevie, in fact I'm loving him in this new role and he has won us more points from this position than losing. My point is if we are to continue using him in this position we need 2 box to box midfielders to help him out. Allen is a good squad player but Lucas from what we have seen this season is very lacking in his offensive game. Yes he was an attacking midfielder but he seem to have lost his attacking instincts. Maybe BR can work some magic with him this off season but we need to bring in another Hendo type player. If we are to stop playing with a defensive specialist type defensive midfielder I don't see a future for Lucas in this squad because I don't think he is capable of doing what Stevie's currently doing for us in that role.

Juventus actually plays a 3-5-2 so there is also another centre back to help cover for Pirlo. Both their wingbacks are predominantly defensive players with lots of stamina to provide width running up and down the flanks. Flanno has a not very good statistic of being dribbled past many times this season but I think that is down to experience and not being a left footer which also affects his offensive game since he is almost always obliged to pass the ball back into midfield instead of swinging in a cross with his less capable left foot. Glen Johnson on the other hand has been horrendous for at least 2 seasons now. He used to be good enough offensively to negate his defensive flaws but he hasn't been able to have much impact down the flanks as we were used to seeing in his prime. Strengthening our full back positions should be a priority this off season. 27m for Luke Shaw might look hugely inflated but I would say he is already 2nd best if not the best LB in England at age 18. Highly unlikely but would be a dream if we managed to hijack Utd's move. Will definitely be more happy with Shaw than Lallana.
Cloud0890
post May 13 2014, 07:10 PM

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Mascherano? Why would we need him when we are doing away with specialized defensive midfielders. He's basically a much more expensive upgrade of Lucas who can barely get any game time and I would say Mascherano's offensive game is even more limited than Lucas' so it is between his tackles or Stevie's passes. Modern day DMs seem to be trending more towards a hybrid of Pirlo and Makelele. Javi Martinez, Fernandinho and Busquets are some examples.

Caulker hasn't impressed me enough so personally not too keen on him. Lovren would be a nice one to have with his ability to play the ball like Agger.

Alberto Moreno looks a good prospect but a fee of 20-30m for someone unproven and on paper looks very lacking on the physical side might struggle to adapt to the league. Shaw will be the dream signing but looks impossible now. Ricardo Rodriguez might be a better alternative than Moreno for his bigger stature and has 2 good feet. Marcos Rojo has also impressed me and he can play both CB and LB which is a plus point. Maybe too soon to call time on Sakho but if we can get a good offer then why not. He has only managed 1 clean sheet in 19 games, a very very worrying statistic.

Barkley? Everton will never!

Shaqiri? Yes please, but only possible if he wants to leave Bayern. Up till now he seems to be contented in his backup role there.

Angel Di Maria is also another dream signing I have in mind. Transformed into a centre midfielder this season by Ancelotti and preferred over Isco for his work rate. If we are targeting Lallana for his versatility and work rate I don't see how Di Maria is inferior to him. Price might not even differ much from Lallana's considering the inflated fee being thrown around by the media now.
Cloud0890
post May 13 2014, 07:35 PM

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QUOTE(hfi @ May 13 2014, 07:17 PM)
Is Di Maria left footed ? I can see how we are linked with Lallana because he's two footed and we've had problems with the left side our midfield. We shifted Sterling, Coutinho, Allen and even Hendo there. So it's clearly a priority.
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Yeah Di Maria is left footed but has shown ability to play on both flanks and down the middle using both feet.
Cloud0890
post May 14 2014, 01:52 AM

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QUOTE(w_lun @ May 13 2014, 11:02 PM)
Watched some of his matches this season and he was really good. Doubt RM would sell him.
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QUOTE(AnythingK @ May 13 2014, 11:33 PM)
He is very very good, just look at how Ancelotti prefer him over Ozil.
He had all the ability for an attacking player, and he tracks back too!  biggrin.gif
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He is also only 3 months older than Lallana. After such a good season there is no way Real Madrid will be selling him except to fund for a bigger name superstar signing. Definitely one of the underrated players in Real Madrid's star studded squad.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 09:30 AM

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QUOTE(Duke Red @ May 14 2014, 05:02 PM)
With Lallana, the main question seems to be if he's worth the money?

Well we need to consider the amounts we shelled our for Henderson and Allen and why we paid top dollar for the duo? Allen hasn't lived up to his price tag but if Henderson has another season like the last, I'm sure we can all agree that he was worth it.

Now, back to Lallana. What does he have going for him?

1) He's an experienced player despite spending most of his career a rung below the Premiership. He has been a regular started for 6 seasons. He's captained the side since 2012 which suggests that he has leadership qualities. With Gerrard on the decline, we need a leader in midfield.
2) He's versatile, equally comfortable with both feet and can therefore play in a variety of positions.
3) He's creative  and has created 68 chances this season, more than any other English player. Sadly, he's only had 6 assists but with better finishes, this figure would be higher.
4) The bloke can score. He constantly hits double figures in all competitions.

It will be a risk but given his all round attributes, perhaps less of a risk than Hendo and Allen. Clubs like Chelsea and Man City have shown that they are willing to spend on players which show promise and if he has a successful World Cup, they'll be willing to pay top dollar for him. Look at Shaun Wright Phillips, Scott Parker, Steve Sidwell and Jack Rodwell. The latter had scored much less goals than Lallana, was only 21 and Citeh paid between 12-15 million for him. I suppose it's a case of needed to strike when the iron is hot.
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This here is a good read highlighting Lallana's strengths and weaknesses.
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/footb...et-adam-7120485

Lallana would appear to fit into the Coutinho mould, too; tricky but tenacious. After 33 games this season, Lallana had covered over 358,000 metres, or over 222 miles; that, incredibly, was just short of Liverpool's own marathon man Henderson, who covered over 359,000 metres, or over 223 miles, in that time. Lallana had also made more sprints than Henderson, highlighting how well he pressed the opposition from the front.

I know Southampton is probably the best pressing team in the league last season but wow never thought Lallana does as much running as Hendo. No doubt he can fit into our style and the concern for most of us here is obviously the touted 25m price. If it was 15m instead I think we will be very happy with this link.

Oh and by the way I don't really mind throwing in a few extra million (if we have money to spare) if it means getting on Southampton's good books. Their academy is pretty amazing - Walcott, Ox, Bale, Shaw...who's next? I want him!

This post has been edited by Cloud0890: May 15 2014, 09:36 AM
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 09:42 AM

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QUOTE(digilife @ May 15 2014, 09:33 AM)
The Saints wanted 37Mil

doh.gif
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QUOTE(wadefak @ May 15 2014, 09:37 AM)
its 37 now? i just woke up this morning to see the price is 30 mil. price increase rate is crazy! rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif

well maybe its also due to pressue from woy. he asked both Lallana and Shaw to sort out their future before world cup starts. hmm.gif
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Lol no? Where are you getting that amount from? Most news reports I've read are saying 25m and maybe one or two quoting 30m but 37? Definitely not heard of that yet.

Lallana has been linked heavily with a £20m move to Anfield, although the Saints are said to be holding out for £25m.

There's not much logic in that to be honest when 18 year old Shaw is touted for 27m.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 09:54 AM

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QUOTE(jacckl @ May 15 2014, 09:49 AM)
$30m? might as well went for other target. we are not chelsea, city or mu, our budget is pretty limited and should not spend most of it on just 1 player.
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Yeah. For me 15 is fair 20 is acceptable. But can't really think of any alternatives at the moment though. If we can't get him then might as well give Suso a chance and reinvest the money in replacing Glen Johnson.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:23 AM

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QUOTE(digilife @ May 15 2014, 10:00 AM)
The Merseysiders have tabled a €25m bid for the England international but the Saints are set to reject the offer as they have a far higher valuation of their skipper

Southampton have placed a €37 million valuation on Liverpool target Adam Lallana, Goal understands
source
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QUOTE(wadefak @ May 15 2014, 10:02 AM)
just noticed that its the same because 30M is in pound and 37 is in euros. according to google's exchange rate tongue.gif
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There you go. It's the exchange rate my friend. Regardless though, it is still overpriced. If what you have there is true then our 25m euro bid equates to 20m pounds which is acceptable to me.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:26 AM

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QUOTE(hfi @ May 15 2014, 10:21 AM)
He's their Gerrard so anything up to 30mil is about right tho i reckon we'll get him much lower. It depends on whether he will push for the move and i think he might just do that. Unlike the Gerrard situation, he knows the Saints can never get CL football nor compete for the title, and he knows sooner or later the team will be gutted (from the manager to coaches to players) and be left to rebuild ad infinitum.

Now having said this, one of the things i noticed last season is that much of the potency of the Saint's attack came from the link up play between Lallana, Rodriguez and Shaw. Lallana and Shaw in particular worked really hard for each other and their link up was almost telepathic. It even carried into the England team where the introduction of both Shaw and Lallana competely changed the game for the better. So i think it's paramount that we get a solid leftback next season to complement Lallana or i fear we might not get the most out of him (that is if we do end up getting the player).
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Alberto Moreno is apparently our target for 15m pounds but Sevilla is said to be holding out for in excess of 25-30m with Real Madrid possibly joining in the bidding war. I'm not too keen on Spanish defenders to be honest in terms of their defensive and physical capabilities.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:27 AM

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QUOTE(Max_07s @ May 15 2014, 10:25 AM)
this is based on what? ticket? prize?
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user posted image

Our number of televised games stand at 28 games which is the most in the league this season.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:34 AM

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QUOTE(reehdus @ May 15 2014, 10:26 AM)
Hmm...30mil for Lallana? Man he's gonna have a huge weight on his shoulders if he comes at that price. I'd rather we spend a total like 50m on a few players, wishful thinking but players like Shaqiri, Griezmann, De Maria seem more worth it
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Di Maria is apparently targeted by City and Arsenal not sure if true. His touted price is also in excess of 30m pounds.

Many people are saying Griezmann but not sure how many have actually watched him play. Personally he plays more like a striker to me. People are pointing at his number of goals from "midfield" but his position is supposed to be winger and if you watch his goals most of them come from central positions staying on the shoulders of defenders aka Sturridge's position. He is quick but he is not the flair close control player you need to unlock tightly packed defenses. Griezmann actually needs space to run into as he is much better off the ball than on hence his number of goals coming from playing effectively as a striker.

Shaqiri is a player I like but Bayern CEO just came out saying none of their players are looking to leave. Hmm...
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:38 AM

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QUOTE(Max_07s @ May 15 2014, 10:32 AM)
good then, if we can perform like this next season plus UCL money. we can get into top 10 again in the world richest club
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United finished at 7th but only 6m less from PL earnings. Whoever is in charge of our commercial revenue needs to make sure we capitalize on this resurgence like United did during the 90s. We won a lot in the 80s but failed to capitalize commercially.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:42 AM

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For those who have not watched it yet.

Jack Dunn's finishing is amazing.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/footb...ck-dunn-7116105
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 10:56 AM

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QUOTE(hfi @ May 15 2014, 10:46 AM)
I honestly have not watched him play but if he can defend as good as Arbeloa then i reckon he might be a good bet. All i want from our fullbacks next season is for them to just be able to defend when required. Attacking contribution will be icing on the cake.

While i really rate all those players, we need to look at the areas in the team where we need strengthening. For me the main areas that requires immediate attention are the fullbacks and the left side of the mdifield. The fullback situation speaks for themselves but the left side of the midfield is why we might splash huge amount for Lallana. We tried few players at the left side last season and none of them have made that position his own - not like how Gerrard and Hendo have made the other positions their own. Lallana is two footed and seems intelligent which means he is versatile - tactically you should able to play him across the midfield or at the tip of the diamond.
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I would say Moreno is more of a attacking wingback. Very quick but not very strong, typical Spanish, which is why I'm not too convinced. Arbeloa's strength is also his ability to play on both flanks. Moreno is only comfortable with his left foot from what I've seen.

If we need a winger we might as well give Ibe a chance. He seems to be the next most ready to step up from our reserves/academy.

Brendan Rodgers believes teenager Jordon Ibe has the potential to become an “outstanding” young player for Liverpool FC.

He said: “He's such a talent. He's 18 years of age, still only a second year scholar.

“It was interesting, I asked him to do something different here. I played him on the side in the first half, but we switched to a diamond in the second half. I wanted to see him.

“It was similar to what I have done with Raheem (Sterling). I wanted to improve his football intelligence, play him in a different position. He played at the top of the diamond and he was excellent.


http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/footb...tential-7122254
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 11:02 AM

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QUOTE(reehdus @ May 15 2014, 10:57 AM)
I get what you mean, granted a lot of those guys are attacking minded and Lallana did make it into soccernet's EPL team of the season (I think), but 30m pounds is really a lot for one good season. Scared it'll be another Carroll case.

I do think we need better fullbacks too and one area I think we really do need strengthening is the DM department. Gerrard is good in his quarterback role, but occasionally he does lack a little discipline. I would like to have a bulldog back in that position, close down the ball and pass it to Gerrard to spray it.
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Isn't that supposed to be Hendo's job though? Which is why we need Hendo's stamina and Coutinho's creativity. Also exactly why BR had Lucas slotted further forward instead of sitting back there with Stevie. Who do you suggest we take out if we were to go with another defensive midfielder? I think Coutinho's best position is in the middle as he seems to go missing sometimes on the flanks.
Cloud0890
post May 15 2014, 11:10 AM

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QUOTE(reehdus @ May 15 2014, 11:05 AM)
There's gonna be room for rotation with more games and we probably can't expect to keep the same personnel throughout. Hendo's suspension illustrated the lack of depth in that position. I'd think another equally gifted player as him would serve us well.
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Yeah I agree we need someone of a similar mould to step in in Hendo's absence but can't see us playing TWO Hendos stifling our creativity upfront. Unless of course that player is a Yaya Toure who can do everything. biggrin.gif
Cloud0890
post May 19 2014, 08:19 PM

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QUOTE(8sg9ft @ May 19 2014, 05:48 PM)
He's a CB. Quite a solid defender. Just not sure whether he's comfortable playing the ball out from the back like Agger.
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He nutmegs like a baws rclxms.gif
Cloud0890
post May 25 2014, 05:27 AM

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What a final!

Grats to Xabi Alonso!
Cloud0890
post May 25 2014, 05:29 AM

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Di Maria is by far the best player tonight outshining both Ronaldo and Bale combined.

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