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 Asset Allocation Investing using US ETF, Basic approach to asset Allocation ETF

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rjb123
post Nov 16 2014, 06:15 AM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 15 2014, 10:00 PM)
Hi Dreamer101 & forumers,

would like to draw your attention to the plausible estate tax if you were to hold more than 60K of equities/ bonds with a US-based broker house like Interactive broker.

http://andrewhallam.com/2010/11/how-britis...comment-page-8/
http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=150851
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Thanks for sharing this.

It seems like only US situ assets would fall under the Estate Tax as a non-resident (ie US domiciled ETFs, cash in broker account)

You could get around this by buying ETFs from different exchanges

Eg. Instead of SPY, buy VUSA (GBP) / VUSD (USD) on the LSE - this also gets around the 30% Withholding tax a bit - as the ETF is Ireland domiciled it internally pays 15% rather than 30% in its holding and dividends are paid out gross.

I'll worry about this when I get older, if I were to die tomorrow I don't think anyone would know where I have my savings / broker accounts anyway sweat.gif

This post has been edited by rjb123: Nov 16 2014, 06:16 AM
rjb123
post Nov 16 2014, 10:29 AM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 16 2014, 08:05 AM)
Hi rjb123, thanks for replying.
I have found another thread http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=150851 which could stir your interest.

Yes you are definitely correct about the the purchase of perhaps VWRD, a non-US domiciled ETF which results in a 15% taxation instead of a 30% taxation for US domiciled ETF.

However, the risks that Im highlighting is regards to the purchase of ETFs using a US-based broker such as Interactive broker. Even if it's non-US domiciled, there could be a chance that YOUR assets that IB holding is subjected to estate law.

Btw do you use interactive broker? Im so much leaning to use that platform
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Well from what I read on the estate taxes - US domiciled ETFs are classed as US situ assets, as is cash kept in a broker account, so one should be able to stay underneath the $60K threshold by switching some holdings over to ETFs not traded on USA exchanges , such as Ireland domiciled, or Luxembourg domiciled.

As you get older it would also be possible to transfer holdings out to another broker - eg. TD International (Luxembourg) I have an account there too but it's not currently being used due to the high trading fees - however it may be an option to transfer there later (I'm only 27, not too concerned about estate tax yet!)

Yes - I have Interactive Brokers, TD Ameritrade, TD International (not used yet)

VUSA/VUSD actually has lower expense ratio by 0.02% than SPY for example, only downside is trading charges are a bit higher on LSE compared to US markets. Anyway with IB you have plenty of options, can build up portfolio of ETFs which aren't US domiciled then when getting older transfer over to Luxembourg based broker for example.

Other option seems to be to set up an IBC or trust offshore and hold your investments there .. might be worth looking at if holdings become large

This post has been edited by rjb123: Nov 16 2014, 10:51 AM
rjb123
post Nov 16 2014, 11:22 AM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 16 2014, 11:16 AM)
Hi rjb123,

My participation bogleheads forum (http://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=150851&p=2260381#p2260381) has also helped shed light that IB is transiting its non-US investors to IB UK. While we have ascertained that non-US domiciled ETF should not be subjected to estate tax, it could certainly give us a higher (perhaps less significant) level of certainty and confidence for us to continue using IB.

The official IB announcement can be found here: https://ibkb.interactivebrokers.com/article/2016
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Yeah, I've seen the IB announcement before also.

Anyway, in 30-40+ years time the tax laws will have probably changed again multiple times so I'm not overly concerned at this stage about estate tax.

FYI, here's the fees if you buy ETFs through TD Luxembourg (really not worth it if you're topping up frequently)

user posted image
rjb123
post Nov 16 2014, 07:34 PM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 16 2014, 05:01 PM)
@rjb123, thanks much for sharing. May i know why would you use TD when the rates are so much higher than IB. Furthermore, though IB has fixed annual commission of $120USD, considering its tight spread for FX rates, it should still be competitive.
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TDAM I use for commission free ETF and enrolled in DRIP which IB doesn't offer

FYI, IB charge is waived with balances over $100K
rjb123
post Nov 17 2014, 02:50 PM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 17 2014, 02:38 PM)
Hi rjb123, may I know what ETFs are you currently vested in?
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Currently a bit unorganised, as I started off with commission free ETFs on TDAM which I'm now looking to switch mostly to the below from LSE resulting in no 30% withholding tax:

VUSA
VUKE
VMID
VERX
VFEM
VAPX


rjb123
post Nov 26 2014, 12:59 PM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 22 2014, 10:21 PM)
Hi rjb123, you r not vested in bond etf?
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I have some BND

But still quite cash heavy at present - ready for any dips thumbup.gif
rjb123
post Nov 28 2014, 04:31 PM

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QUOTE(inchvbeam @ Nov 26 2014, 06:46 PM)
Hi may I know why would u be vested in only US bonds? I thought for the bonds portion, we should be tilting the allocation to home country?
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This depends where "home country" is

I've been in Malaysia for 4-5 years, will I stay here for another 5-10 years, will I retire here? I have no idea.

As such I mix it up by holding different currencies and adjust once I'm closer to retirement age (some time away, unfortunately!)
rjb123
post Jan 16 2015, 12:40 PM

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QUOTE(endau02 @ Jan 15 2015, 05:26 PM)
hi bro, can share which website?
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You can try Interactive Brokers or TD Ameritrade
rjb123
post Jan 21 2015, 10:02 PM

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QUOTE(Hapeng @ Jan 21 2015, 09:16 PM)
any way to get around the withholding taxes?
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If you use Interactive Brokers for example, you can purchase alternative ETFs - such as VUSD/VUSA listed on LSE and domiciled in Ireland, this halves withholding taxes.

eg. instead of SPY, purchase
QUOTE(langstrasse @ Jan 21 2015, 09:42 PM)
Interactive brokers requires a minimum amount of 10000 USD, not sure about TD Ameritrade
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Yes, IB is minimum $10000 USD, TD Ameritrade I think less.

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