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 EPF DIVIDEND, EPF

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Jordy
post Sep 12 2019, 01:13 PM

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QUOTE(Dratini @ Sep 12 2019, 01:01 PM)
RM4000 for EPF Self Contribution? I tried to search but didn't find any thing, mind sharing any link/reference please?
You are not talking about the RM6K annual income tax relief right?
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The RM6k tax relief for EPF contribution / life insurance has been split and separated starting this year.
It is now RM4k for EPF and RM3k for life insurance. So effectively your tax relief for any EPF contribution is only capped at RM4k regardless of how much more you contribute.
This was announced in Budget 2019 since October last year. Source is in the Budget 2019 announcement.
Jordy
post Sep 13 2019, 11:46 AM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Sep 12 2019, 03:20 PM)
Indeed, income tax is taxable regardless. That is where the problem lies. I do not mind being taxed for income which I can decide on what to do with.
But an EPF contribution is forced upon and taxed at the same time.

So, I am seeing my income stuck in a fund while paying a tax on it. So if my tax is 24% and EPF pays 6% pa, it will take 4 years to recover the paid taxes.
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Better than 401(k) or IRA's in US actually. In the case of 401(k) and traditional IRA, contributors get taxed upon withdrawal of the retirement funds, meaning the capital + gains will get taxed.
Our EPF earnings are not taxed, we will only be taxed at our income source. Come to think of it, we are quite fortunate that we have no capital gains tax.
Jordy
post Sep 13 2019, 12:29 PM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Sep 13 2019, 11:51 AM)
But we get taxed before investing. They do not get taxed if they put it into the 401(k)
And if they withdraw according to some conditions, there is no tax if my understanding is right.
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From my own understanding, there are indeed some special tax benefits when withdrawing under certain conditions, but tax benefit does not mean total elimination of tax. It simply means that there are certain conditions to meet in order to lower the amount of tax upon withdrawal. Under normal circumstances, withdrawal is still subject to the income tax rate at the point of withdrawal. That in itself totally defeats the purpose of the tax deduction in the first place.
One can do a rollover into another retirement fund when they leave the employer to avoid paying tax on the income immediately, but one will still need to pay tax upon withdrawal eventually.
Jordy
post Sep 20 2019, 12:13 PM

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QUOTE(netken @ Sep 19 2019, 07:27 PM)
hi - i am abt to purchase a house and planning to withdraw from acc 2.

Since december is almost here, can i sign the loan and spa first and withdraw next year? ie after 31st Dec 2019? Say 2nd Jan 2019? I think epf allow 3 years max grace period to withdraw?

Shall i be entitled for my entire amt in Act2 for dividend then? If i withdraw 2nd Jan but before the actual payout in April 2020, or shld i wait to withdraw after April 2020 when payout happens?

Many Thanks!
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You do not have to wait for a full financial year to end to withdraw as the dividend will be pro-rated on a monthly basis. Meaning every moth your money will be generating dividend and calculated up to the month your money is withdrawn. So if you withdraw your Account 2 in January 2020, the dividend will be calculated up to December 2019. Don't have to wait until the actual payout date.

To answer your question, yes EPF allows you to claim back cash for the downpayment up to a 3 years period from the date your S&P is signed.

QUOTE(aspartame @ Sep 20 2019, 09:09 AM)
How? Prop investing had been and will continue to be the greatest generator of wealth for most people...
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A little misleading. If one is to own a property in the city center, at this current market condition, it will be more of a liability than a wealth generator.
Not everyone is cut out for property investment because most people tie too much emotion into property investing, just like every other types of investments.
The only way property investing will make people rich is by buying properties in less popular areas and wait for the major developers to get into that area.
If you buy in maturing areas, you will only make enough to pay off your loan. Can't make you rich.
Don't compare properties bought 10 years ago to properties that would be worth 10 years later. They are simply too different.

QUOTE(aspartame @ Sep 20 2019, 11:58 AM)
How is EPF income taxed oh? EPF pays a dividend which is then reinvested right? It is only locked up.. but there is no further tax on it
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EPF income is not taxed. His meaning is that the contribution that goes into EPF is already taxed, and there is no way to claim back the tax on this forced-savings (except for the RM4000 tax allowance cap) and yet the money would have to be locked up until retirement.
Jordy
post Sep 20 2019, 12:56 PM

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QUOTE(aspartame @ Sep 20 2019, 12:25 PM)
I was replying to earlier post saying property invesrmdnt is sunset investment ...it is anything BUT

If one uses basic common sense and at the very least purchase the house that they are staying in... they won’t go very wrong in life.... no need to overstretch in loans..
The same cannot be said about stocks investment

Most layman can do well in prop.. most layman will lose in stocks
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Like what I mentioned, one can only have enough to repay the loan for the property in maturing areas (most probably will be the one they are living in).
In this current situation, most of the time it would be financially wiser to rent than to buy for own stay. It's a renter's market right now.
So by stating that "Prop investing had been and will continue to be the greatest generator of wealth for most people" is misleading.
But it is more agreeable when you changed your tune to "at the very least purchase the house that they are staying in... they won’t go very wrong in life".
I agree with the previous comment that property investing is a sunset investment FOR maturing areas. It could still be a worthy investment FOR under-developed areas.

QUOTE(Drian @ Sep 20 2019, 12:40 PM)
Yes it's possible, the problem is that it is not all the time. That's the problem. Need to take into account down period as well.

I got 20% from my globaltech unitrust but that's only for 2017 . Couldn't achieve the same thing for 2018, 2019.
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Exactly the point. Some people just do not know how hard it is to repeatedly aim for 15% pa year after year for over 2 decades long. After all, Donald Trump might not be able to tweet that much after 2020.
Not just the compounding period, even the amount will have to be taken into account as well. As the investable amount grows, so does the difficulty to maintain the similar performance. We are not talking about investment of RM10k, but we are speaking of at least RM300k, RM500k or even RM1mil. To achieve 15% pa consistently for investment of RM1mil and above, that is quite a chore. The risk of failing is higher than success.
Jordy
post Sep 20 2019, 01:27 PM

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QUOTE(aspartame @ Sep 20 2019, 01:06 PM)
My view is it is always better to buy than rent ... and matured areas are actually better for most people.. less risk with mature areas as you are holding long term.... of course, that is just my view
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If you have bought the property prior to 2012, then yes it does make more sense to buy instead of renting as price was low back then.
The same can't be said for those who are just starting out, especially this year. It all depends on when you started out.
I could rent a whole double storey unit for less than RM2k, but I will have to fork out at least RM2600 for the same unit if purchased. How does that make good financial sense?
Jordy
post Jan 13 2020, 03:27 PM

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Guessing only, no right or wrong. I bet on 5.90% for this year.
Jordy
post Feb 19 2020, 12:10 PM

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I stick to my previously stated prediction of 5.95%

 

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