agree with you. too much work.

why not Malaysia government be generous and just give out 1K rm per month/12K rm per year to everyone above the age of 60 years old. The majority will love this as this will help everyone alive past age 60, help the poor especially and the rural voters.

Those who don't need this 1Krm per month can sign a annual form and donate it to whichever charity they want.

according to our demographics, only 8% of Malaysians (out of around 30 million) is above 60 years old. so that is 2.4 million persons, or around 30 billion ringgit per year. Malaysia definitely can afford it now as oil price shot up to 130 usd per barrel. Just lock in all the profits...

when we are talking about taking from Paul to pay Peter, it will never be fair.
Why should a person who didn't work as long or as hard as they can deserve a good retirement by "leeching" off someone else?

and is it fair that those with low balances in EPF because they took as much as they can to punt in equities and buy properties, but later in life demand extra interest rate because their EPF balances are low?

I think you mixed up taxes with pension fund. in almost all countries (ie I cannot think of one, but i am willing to be corrected for my ignorance), pension while not being drawn/spent in general are not taxed.

If government of Malaysia wish to do good, by all means tax people legally, morally and properly and build a proper social safety net for the citizens. Start by taxing a certain ex-PM who is basically found guilty of tax evasion.

after wondering about this, I think maybe we should encourage the gov to force EPF to allow RM 10K withdrawal... nay, should up it to RM 40K withdrawal.

a few reasons (albeit a bit sinister the rational):
a) if 10K withdrawal earlier caused a outflow of 100 billion, hopefully a 40K will cause at least 200 billion outflow
b) silly people who said it is troublesome for EPF to manage so much money, should now rejoice when EPF's AUM drop to 800 billion and more nimble
(psk: lets see if epf management get scared or not when outflow of 20% of aum happens)
c) smaller AUM means EPF can manage better returns for rest of us
d) 200 billion outflow will spur the economy of Malaysia and in return boost stock return in Malaysia
e) those of us who remain in EPF will now enjoy more than 8% div for 2022 (edited... wrote the year 2020 in error).

It is not my problem that people cannot afford to retire... just continue to work for me then, while I enjoy my EPF return.

This post has been edited by Wedchar2912: Mar 11 2022, 10:33 PM

no way... I don't believe you.... i think you are a evil person who is selfish and only think of yourself. These members are in financial trouble and has every right to demand and spend their 40K rm as and how they wish. You don't need to withdraw and hence you can talk holy but you are ruining the poor. In fact, you should give your EPF balance to the poor.

EPF are just taking money from the rich to give to the poor. where got investment agreements or commitment... all fake news...

(hahaha... btw, I am being silly here. These are amongst the stupid reasons people use to justify tiering, taking money out, EPF is a ponzi, etc... )

that may come to be true... but looking at how our country is developing/regressing, by 2050 the majority of population will be doomed eitherway. So may as well let these politicians hasten the decent.

Up to 2050, pandai pandai stash part of one's wealth (it is more retirement funds) overseas and at worst, the elderly who didn't squander away our savings now will still be able to treat Malaysia like how Americans treat Mexico for retirement. By then, it is the future Malaysian Youth's, similar to how much worse global climate change will impact us.


Btw, I am not saying don't help those who are impacted by the economic displacement now. That help should come from the government directly. Not asking the EPF members to use their own retirement funds to help themselves.

this may sound crude and simplistic, but if we planned and accounted for this regression, we just need to do what some forumers already planned/doing. Live 6 to 9 months overseas and then come back here for remainder 3 months.
The problem of the country is to be left to the youth of 2050 already. We tried, but the majority is just too stupid.

I am sure those with 10 mio in EPF already can afford to do so. On average they have almost 18 million ringgit, which at lousy 6% is like 90K rm per month of spending money, tax free. Definitely can rent airbnb even at SG and live there...

Problem is I can barely pass 10 mio in EPF balance by 60 years old, and that is assuming I don't retire early. how leh....

I disagree, if want to do it, the cutoff should be a lot lower....

I say 50 to 100K rm. Anyone above say 100K balance, just pay 4%, and pass all the extra to those below 100K balance.

Only then can it be a meaningful 10% pa for those below 100K balance.

This post has been edited by Wedchar2912: Mar 13 2022, 07:25 PM

well, I was just improving upon your suggestion; that instead of 4% to the 1-10m group, it should be 4% for anyone with balance above 100K rm. As it is just a better modification to your suggestion, I do not need to provide any justification...

I whole heartedly agree that EPF balance is not the right gauge of poverty, but somehow many seems to think so. Beats me why they bought this idea.

Btw, making dividend taxable... while it can be a good idea if the reason is good, but what is the point of this suggestion may I ask? I thought the whole idea of your earlier suggestion is to help the poor? How does taxing the EPF dividend going to help in this? Do you tax after the members take out the money to spend, or do you tax just based on balance? Is this tax independent of the current income tax, or separate? Is that consistent with current tax laws in Malaysia?
(we don't even have estate/death tax anymore nor do we have capital gain tax on equities)

If the idea is to tax the rich, I believe a certain ex-PM (nay, all the living PM and ex-PMs) should be taxed heavily first right? 2.6 bio ringgit anyone?

Don't worry.... there are still enough in the country for certain group to steal and squander.... Not so bad yet...

when we start "selling" our youth out overseas as cheap labor, or when we start selling land to SG, that is when we know it is too late...

The wealth of the country should last us another generation I hope... enough for me to enjoy my early retirement.

https://www.theedgemarkets.com/article/epf-...s-tengku-zafrul


The blame game has started... damn fast lor... barely 2 days after Johor

This post has been edited by Wedchar2912: Mar 14 2022, 05:46 PM

unfortunately, I agree with you on GST....

but can go get the money a certain ex-PM owe to LDHN first ar? there is quite a lot there eh....

Just curious... if Umno does not call for election this year, then next year will be another great year for EPF dividend.... could even breach 7%....

lets hope PM Sabri not call for election this year.

suddenly glad again...

I always advice anyone old enough and/or has close to or more than 1 million in EPF to pump as much as they can into EPF. Especially if said person has cash lying around in CASA or FD.
But for rest, really need to look at each individual's circumstances, as main concern for most people is liquidity.

Not every year we get to withdraw money out like i-Sinar...

Do it... you will thank EPF every year when you realize that for every 50K rm you put into EPF, vs leaving it in FD, means you get a pick up of at least 3% pa.
50K rm x 3% pa = 1.5K rm... yes, that is 1500 rm.
That is a nice amount to have for a very nice dinner for the family. real nice dinner (no alcohol pls, as I do not believe in spending money on alcohol in a restaurant... lol).

Sound consideration for
a) anyone who is old enough; OR
b) close or above 1 million in EPF

AND

has cash left in FD earning some silly stepup high interest rate like 2.5%.


50K rm ==> 1.5K rm extra to spend on nice dinner
100K rm ==> 3K rm extra to spend on nice dinner and a affordable laptop for kids to play
500K rm ==> 15K rm extra. Dinner and lodging at Pangkor laut resort for a few days and a nice laptop
...
10 mio rm ==> 300K rm extra. Donate to poorer people. Don't eat so much....
(always wondered what those 248 persons do with their dividends)

It should be under some CSR or ESG budget that they have.
Luckily it was only 10 mio...

nice....

and then every few days go login online to do 1K rm withdrawals or as much spending money as you need from EPF into your bank accounts. (assuming done pushing spare cash into EPF... else deploy the cash in CASA/FD first).

wah... nice man.... still have gratuity from your firm? I thought those almost no longer exists anymore...

What an envious position to be in... Some more right timing to retire: we are about to open up and can choose to travel around already. Consider taking first class/biz class for safety purposes?

long time ago (I didn't update my own knowledge base about asnb since, but I suspect the main details are still relevant) I did consider ASNB, but found that it is too troublesome due to various limits/conditions placed and also the lack of transparency on how it achieves superior returns.


EPF was a lot easier for me to contribute and EPF Act, which is a parliament Act, provided a lot of comfort to me: it stated very clearly that minimum return shall be 2.5% pa and guaranteed by Gov of Malaysia. Implicit in this point is that whatever inside is quaranteed also.
ASNB does not have "security" for me. (EPF also lack transparency, but the "security" override the concern)

When we are talking about 10 to 50K/100K rm worth, yeah, we don't really need to care much about capital preservation, but when the amount becomes a few millions, safety of capital outweights any small 1% return. (Tabung Haji comes to mind)

This post has been edited by Wedchar2912: Mar 15 2022, 05:38 PM

Very rare... Giving equities/stock options still have, but gratuities. Plus you still get EPF contributions from employer?