Since there is a thread on the Big Four, I am thinking why not create a thread on the mid-tier accounting networks in Malaysia.

Below are the list of international mid-tier accounting networks in Malaysia. It is arranged by random order. Similar to the Big Four, these accounting networks below are not individual accounting firms, they are accounting networks with firms around the world.

Including the Big Four, the mid tier accounting networks below in Malaysia are members of the IFAC Forum of Firms.

1. BDO
2. Crowe Horwath International
3. Baker Tilly International
4. Grant Thornton International
5. RSM International
6. PKF International
7. Mazars
8. Nexia International
9. Moore Stephens International
10. HLB International
11. Kreston International
12. UHY International
13. Russell Bedford International
14. IECnet (Lee & Lee)

It was announced today that Baker Tilly has merged with Moore Stephens.
http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...98&sec=business

I hope this thread will be a place where everyone can discuss and share their experience, interviews, etc....or seek help from each other.

Anyone of you work in any of the firms above?

This post has been edited by Blofeld: Aug 17 2014, 10:45 PM

Good work there
I was previously in Grant Thornton Consulting and it was hell of a great experience for me.

I think you need to be specific here.
Big four LOCAL or Big four INTERNATIONAL
Make no mistake that Deloitte is not big four in Malaysia
Even Deloitte employees will tell you that.
Crowe has even taken the initiative of claiming fifth in Malaysia by market cap if im not mistaken

Can a fresh grad join consultancy?

This is about Mid-tier Accounting firms not big 4 firms like KPMG,PWC, Deloitte,E&Y.

During my time serving in GT, they hired 2 fresh graduates.I think it applies to all companies as to whether there is any vacancies for fresh graduates. So do not hesitate to send in your resume to all the companies you are interested in

My point being Deloitte should be in here.
Nobody aspires to work for Deloitte as much
They are considered mid tier meaning small to mid cap companies.
Refer to this years graduan also, BDO for some reason notched up way higher compared to Deloitte.
Worldwide yes, Deloitte arm consulting is NO. 2 in the world.
Its one of the best and highly regarded in Hong Kong too.
Not in Malaysia.
I think perception also differs

any1 work in HLB ler and lum
kreston or russell bedford?

i worry its not big as compared to baker/crowe those.. and its not recognise by others

as if in future i interested to switch to big4, they dramatic decrease/discount my working experience..

anyone can answer me? ...

Anyone experienced interview with BDO? I need advise on interview. Any one can help me?

Anyone here working in mid-tier accounting firms?

I'd like to know whether you are assigned a mentor when you join in.

Anyone knows which mid-tier accounting firms with great seniors are employing audit associate now?

Just curious, how reputable is BDO generally to people in the industry as well as outside in the commercial world? do you think its worth being delayed/discounted by 6 months to join BDO for better exposure? currently in a well known mid tier firm too but not sure should I go for it IF they decide to discount my experience.

go to big 4 directly, even from BDO to big 4, the experience will be discounted as well.

yes but not everyone is fortunate/good enough to impress big4 HR to hire... not that we don't wanna go, just that opportunity yet to open up.

dont worry .

my friend from BDO to pwc (discount 3 month experience, cuz 2 year 3month cannot round up )

another 1 from bakertilly to EY (no discount at all)


as long you're in reputable mid-tier firm . they wont discount all your experience.

so in your opinion do u think BDO is big enough to make it a worth while move which involve a slight downgrade(promotion delayed by 3 or 4 months) from another reputable mid tier firm while waiting the opportunity to big4?

up to you. for example, i got no degree, that why i cant have much choice . hahah
but in medium firm you may learn alot type of industry, where in big firm you only specific one industry

anyway you can plan your "jump" nicely haha (so you wont waste your experience being waive or not recognise)

either
straight to big4,
1 year in mid , then switch to big
2 year in mid , then switch to big

depend on you.

Finally! A thread for the mid tier firms. I'm doing interns in crowe horwath now, its good if u are aiming for exposure to industries. Relationship between juniors, seniors and manager are good. The managers and the seniors are friendly and willing to teach the juniors. The only discount is the brand name. Most of the ppl only know about big 4 but not other mid tier firms. So the value would be a lil bit discounted if u plan to spend your 3 years in audit and jump to commercial afterwards.

R u in Penang or KL?

is it true CH is paying slightly lower than others?

KL

Starting more or less same with the big 4. But from hearsay, for senior post and above. The increment of salary will be lower. If compared with big 4.

fyi, i have a friend from BDO AM level to PWC become senior level...

Talking about tax, I have one friend working in big4 doing only personal tax, myself working in mid tier doing both corporate and individual tax. Which one is better for career growth?

Seeing this post, I had to comment. The feeling is there. Anyway, regarding SJ Grant Thornton Penang branch, I can say it's a hell there.

1) Hectic and shocking schedule. Why? There are so so much work to do, yet so little time to complete. 1-2 days one audit company.

2) They squeeze all your juices. Why? You can't finish a file, u must work overtime ON YOUR OWN. You will not be paid for OT. Their policy is OT is paid for PLCs and MNCs only. Other companies, makan sendiri la.

3) OT paid is on annual leave. This means no money for OT. Work 2 hours OT for PLCs/MNCs, get 2 hours extra leave.

4) Time off is deducted from your annual leave although many firms adopted the "1 hour time off, replace by working 1 hour extra".

5) Starting pay is around RM2k.

6) Audit timetable schedule sucks. Today, you see the timetable and know you will audit ABC Sdn Bhd. Suddenly, tomorrow when you see timetable, you'll be auditing DEF Sdn. Bhd. Very bad management

7) Bonus paid out is on every January.

8) EPF paid-out always late. Been there for 6-7 months.

9) When you resign, they apportion your annual leave. Meaning your OT annual leave also gets apportioned.

Only one advantage from the firm though
You leave as a better and more improved person

Thanks for the information

Where are you working now?

Still in audit?

This post has been edited by Blofeld: Jun 13 2013, 12:26 PM

hi,i dont have degree yet and acca havent complete 1 of the p paper yet..i apply for audit job at the small to medium firm..they offer me rm1700..is it too high?haha

location?

Means u only left 1 p paper be4 complete ACCA?
I would say rm1,700 quite low.
But depends on location though...

no,i havent start p paper yet..still got 2fpaper

subang area..small firm

Since u took ACCA, sometimes it's a pity because it isn't a degree, but it's more prestigious if u can complete it. RM1,700 is quite high if u're in Penang because you haven't complete all ur F papers yet. Audit firms in Penang including big 4 seldom take in people who don't have a degree and is doin ACCA full time, but still in F papers. Once u complete all ur F papers, then there's the difference.

Depends on your knowledge during interviews..

1) Small firms.. if you know tax and deferred tax. they will likely offer you higher as they can save time on training..

2) Mid Firms.. Deferred tax and your Accounting standards well

3) Big 4.. Audit Standards and accounting standards well...

if KL.. 1700 is VERY LOW. generrally can get 2.2k above

haha..okok..i tot i dun have qualification yet,rm1.7k is considered high ady...but nevermind,i get some experiences 1st

Hi, i wonder how much can a degree holder majoring in Acc and finance ask for in a mid-tier audit firm?

Unofficial graduate, since end of july only results will be out.

I would say i considered myself the first class honors category, speaks decent English, had some temporary accounts-related working experience in the past, even had my internship in KPMG but its not audit tho. if back to SPM, also got decent results.

asking this cause non of the big 3 responded to my application, maybe cause i m still an unofficial graduate so i might consider working in a mid-tier for 1 year then jump ship to big 4.

higher tier medium firm in KL can offer you 2.7~2.8k

Hi, I am think which accounting firm is better in terms of working environment, sponsorship on study and salary for fresh graduate?
Cheng & Co or BDO in KL?

Anyone knows their hiring process?

Is it worth to earn less in medium size accounting firm than Big 4 when I think of their differences in salary. Any advice?

Thanks

Hi thanks for the respond. Do you have any idea other than BDO, any mid-tier firms willing to go up to 2.7-2.8 for freshie?

SJGT and probably Crowe Horwath.

well upper tier medium firm salary for fresh grad is justs about RM100 lower than big4 and a couple of them already match the salary of big4 if not exceed it.

Each firms has its own challenges.. in terms of workload, team chemistry, office politics(inter dept) and culture.

If you have passions towards audit, in any firms you can also excel due to determination and self improvement on the current development of standards. Small firms you may find that after 1 year everything become routine, mid tier 3-5 years (depend on client base), big firms longer but they are highly specialize teams(and you may not like the one you are allocated into)

If you are there to get qualified and skipped to commerical later on, there are many commerical where you can qualified easily as well. Namely banks and investment banks or the bIg glcs SimeDarby,etc (they pay good for starting pay). This will better suit you to prepare yourself for the corporate world later on.

Suitability comes down to fate in whatever you choose, some may offer high $$.. but once you step in, your team leader may not like you, you may accidentally anger other dept and the culture doesnt suit you, in the end you may leave in less than 3 months..

So in the end is comes down to pure luck

$$ into a firm is just a starting guide.. if you excel, you may get 5%-10% increment just on confirmation. and there on promotion at every 6months of appraisal..
The sky is the limit, is how high you want to reach.(p/s: some are bloody stingy firms.. You will only know how stingy is a firm with insider info or when you start working at the place.)

Anyone know what firm in medium tern is hiring ppl for audit now?seem no reply from several firm I applied although I have 1 yr working experience.

What is your qualifications other than experience?

FYI, mid firm prefers full degree or P Level ACCA. You can try if you are F level and diploma.. but it will be KIV tray.. until they really desperate only will call you.

Why you want to choose mid tier compare to the Big 4 (or 5 as BDO claimed itself)/ small firm

I get my full degree and ACCA just leave 3 paper outstanding. I won't try big 4 coz my friend work there everyday work til midnight....I prefer to join medium firm if can....but seem now is not recruitment season for audit firm.haiz

LOL... Mid firm also work till midnight... but maybe not so stress on Audit dateline. Cos big4 more Bursa company... Bursa is 4months after closing. Non Bursa is 7 months

Dont be surprise!

Honestly speaking. No pain No gain. If you want a normal comfortable 9-5 working hours.. DONT CHOOSE AUDIT in Big 4 or Mid tier ..

I know the situation in both big4 and medium term,i know that big4 will be learn the most compare to other audit firm....but for me maybe I need some life also except working, coz i also tried medium firm also and i know the feeling.

Terrible audit life!!!

Even in commerical.. those accountant every month closing alos need to work late.. just that their peak period is 3-5 days every month only.. also no life for a few days...and also the audit period.. haha.. those auditors will dump load of questions to them to answer

So its all up to the more $$ = more work.

Of cos unless you are running a business you can play will the $$ still coming in

This post has been edited by richard831: Jun 24 2013, 03:33 PM

Hello, I will be going for internship and I have went for interview with Crowe Horwath and UHY. Have yet to get their reply but just wanna ask which firm would be the better option for me? As I am relying on public transport during my internship, UHY would be nearer for me compared to Crowe. However, I understand that Crowe has better reputation. FYI, the wages paid by UHY is slightly lower than Crowe. Just wondering too, if I were to intern at UHY, will it be possible (in other words will it be hard) for me to enter Crowe after my graduation? Thanks!

if you want to work with crowe.. then intern there la.. dont for the sake of convenience and bet on your future...

if there are no vacancies for entry lvl audit assistance position in their website, should we try email them also?

i applied BDO, Baker Tilly, GT and mazar already but havent receive any reply yet.

T.T

thinking of applying crowe also but their recruitment page dont have a position that suits me.

Hi everyone,

Can you share with me whether there is any technical questions will be asked in the interview by the mid-tier audit firm?

If there is, could you share some of the example in here?

Thank you.


Hi Kenchi Lee,

I am also looking for audit assistant position. Do you know which months are their recruitment? I have the same issue with BDO. Are you apply through online?

This post has been edited by rocketm: Jul 2 2013, 03:15 PM

no idea man. i m looking for an audit assistant position too.

BDO i applied through their website, it was a simple form and i attached my resume inside. i applied last week, until now no news yet.

Hi, did anyone heard about Kreston John & Gan?? how is the working environment there? i just get call for interview..
haven't receive any news from others firm i applied..

I understand that. But, after my internship I have to go back and complete my last year of degree before my graduation. And Crowe said that in that case we will still have to undergo another interview, whereas those who straight away work with them after internship no need to interview. So I am thinking, maybe I could intern at other smaller firm as well since both also need to undergo interview in the future. And from what my senior told me, smaller firm will give higher appraisal compared to big firms. So I have been weighing the issue.

normally for fresh grad entry level position, they won't ask technical question

Definitely better to go CH if u plan to go back there again after grad.

Reason? Don't bother about the higher appraisal from small firm, what is important is, since u intern at CH, u know the style and audit methodology of CH, u know how they work, so they don't need to teach you again, that's definitely a bigger plus than higher appraisal from small firm.

yes u should, Audit Firm always need people cuz always got people leaving, just the matter of how many people needed only.

So no harm to try your luck even though no vacancy officially posted on their website.

Hi all,

I have question to ask about the job of auditor.

During my internship period, i have assisted my senior in preparing a report about the annual meeting, particulars about the BOD (address, remuneration, shares held), number of shares allow to issue, etc.

It is a report relatively simply to prepare as I just need to obtain the minutes and relevant documents from the secretarial firm or their company secretary and type the info into the softcopy or tick if they have comply.

This is what I still remember. Can anyone tell me what is this report call?

Thank you.

Anyone working at bdo kl before? May I know its working environment in audit department? Thank you

hmmm... a report? How many pages is there?

From what u described, what comes to my mind is, Director Confirmation, or probably Company Secretary confirmation. But these are confirmations, not report tho.

Would love to know more too, anyone care to share? Or none of the BDO audit staff visit LYN?

Thanks shirley.

You seem like know a lot of things in audit. Are you looking for audit position?

One more question.

What is statutory audit? What is the difference between it and the audit report that the auditor normally do?

Thanks

Based on my view in several posts in LYN, there is not any person claim that they are the staff of the company.

But, depend on which branch and people you are working in, some you will meet good people and some may not.

It will still depend on your luck, no one can give a correct answer.

If you meet the requirements of the Big 4 accounting firm, I would suggest you apply with them. You will definite learn and exposure to more things and have benefits of study leave, sponsor of your study with bond, trainings and higher salary.

well it depends on the Manager in charge of you.. some are badass manager.. and will give you a so so review.. some are kind.. and will give you high review even if you did so so

If you have an internship and did well.. your 2nd interview for permanent position will be a breeze..

Is not a report. is one of part of the Working paper call Statutory audit.. you are just recording the summary for your senior conveniences..

Dont learn how to record, understand the purpose of each forms, F11, F49, F44, F24, F32, etc.. and why they need to record and use those forms.

UNDERSTAND the reason behind each workings.. then you know how to adapt to every companies records.

BDO likes BIG4 alumni, or mid tier high level staff (ie. Supervisor above). or freshies..

If other than that.. they will offer you 1 or 2 position lower than your previous position.

It depends on which manager you follow.. every firm got a few badass manager which make the place a living hell

After audit, you produce a report..READ IT. You can read lots of Listed Company such as Airasia, etc and learn a lot.

http://www.bursamalaysia.com/market/listed...cements/1284981

Because of this sentence, you need to do a Statutory Audit which is part of the Company's Independent audit "In our opinion, the accounting and other records and the registers required by the Act to be kept by the Company and its subsidiaries of which we have acted as auditors have been properly kept in accordance with the provisions of the Act."

Because you need to audit and form an opinion on it.

This post has been edited by richard831: Jul 2 2013, 10:08 PM


Attached File(s)
 Auditor_report.pdf ( 34.8k ) Number of downloads: 152
 Auditor_report2.pdf ( 27.83k ) Number of downloads: 84

statutory audit is going to the client's company secretary(the company in charge of preparing Company's resolutions etc documents) to get information(photostat) all of the company's information(resolutions, issue of shares, change of directors, etc) up till the audit signing date.

Correct half..

The other half is: You need to understand the Company Act and if the records are keep in accordance to the Act. Any findings need to be rectify by the Secretary or else will be report to the Audit Committee for further actions.

Last resort will be to state a different opinion on the final report..


"In our opinion, the accounting and other records and the registers required by the Act to be kept by the Company and its subsidiaries of which we have
acted as auditors have been properly kept in accordance with the provisions of the Act."

Therefore as an auditor you need to know not only debit and credits but various Acts such as Company Acts, Income Tax Act, BAFIA, Anti Money Laundering Act (AMLA), Securies Commission regulations, MIA by-laws on what can an auditor do and what auditor cannot do...

Haha.. so Think before you really want to go into audit line.. the title and everything you do sounds glamour.. But how many out there are competent enough to carried out audits.. Sometimes these so called "auditors" are laughing stock as they failed to understand before engaging.

so hard to get into a medium firm also


applied so many, none got response

at first i was aiming for big 3 only, then realize i dont stand a chance, not even mid-tier also hard.

i really dont want to work for a china man audit firm

from tax point of view

expenses incurred on statutory audit is deductible under special deduction under audit expenses pursuant to rules 129/2006 smtg

any other audit (interim audit / due diligence ) expenses are not deductible

which city are you applying.. Dont be surprise... almost ALL mid tier plus the self acclaimed no.5 also practising china man style management.. just that their Working paper up to Current standards requirement only compare to small firms..

Statutory audit is the report that the auditor has audited the financial report of the company?

Is director confirmation is part of the auditing process? What is it for? Statutory audit is equal to director confirmation right?

Just wondering, which mid tiers firms have the most balanced number of employees of all 3 races ( even mix of malay, chinese and india colleagues)?

I am looking forward to work in a multicultural environment though.

This post has been edited by OMG!: Jul 2 2013, 10:37 PM

Independent Statutory Audit is the whole process... Audited Financial Statement is the Product...

Statutory Audit = Statutory Audit on the Company records (Ie. Checking the secretarial files and records). <Auditor like to call "stat audit" for short, which eventually confuse all juniors and there on passed to those who do not UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT OF INDEPENDENT AUDIT. > This work done is to ensure that the Company keep its records in Accordance to the Companies Act.

Directors Confirmations's is actually a Blank Form passed on to each director in which they have to declare their Shareholdings, remunerations and any other related service provided to the Group during the year.

This form is actually has to be completed by the Directors themselves.. <But auditors mostly done the work by typing everything in. and ask them sign.. and the Directors will mostly sign blindly just to comply without checking the figures correct or not>

The form is actually another source to tied the amount back to the Financial Statement (Remuneration) and Company Records (shareholdings).

In audit, the more source tied back to an item, the more reliable the items is. <Audit evidence- another topic which can go on for pages>


"Statutory audit is equal to director confirmation right?" NO

LOL.. if you want multicultural.. should not choose 3 only right....

It is a Chinese populated industry... it wont be balanced.. but a firm can consider Malaysian Firm (rather than chinese firm, Malay Firm, Indian Firm) if it has a diversity of ppl working it. But still majority Chinese i would say.

WOW, thanks for the explanation, Richard831.

I believe you are an auditor. Are you still working in audit firm or in commercial firm.

Really appreciate your efforts.

yes as richard mentioned, there's the majority there, BUT I'll advice u to stay away from medium if u want more balance, cuz medium firm people like to speak chinese among themselves, so unable to understand chinese would be a disadvantage unless u're the very engaging type.

Cuz when they speak chinese and u don't understand, eventhough its just casual chat, you bound to miss out on a fair share of informal and indirect learning from the seniors and managers.

Sad but its the truth.

This post has been edited by shirley_andy: Jul 2 2013, 11:07 PM

Thank you for the insight shirley_andy

Thank you for the insight richard831

In a Mid -Tier firm.

Bear in mind, there is plenty of works and reading to do if you wish to stay in audit line.. kiss goodbye to 9 to 5 if you want to really learn.

Audit is not just tying figures, checking documents, vouching.(this is just the tip of the iceberg)

It is to ensure that the Company COMPLY. So you need to be very well verse in the various Acts, regulations, accounting standards.

Understand and Apply. Not following Step 1, 2, 3.. If this is so simple, i can just get an SPM grad and ask them to follow saja

Agree

But is good to learn up Mandarin, China is opening up, Many Singaporeans and Malaysian are opening factories and businesses there. And they dont trust China's Chinese.

It would be a lucrative job to head the finance dept there; salary report as high as USD3000 - USD20000. Depending on the scale of the project.

time to brush up on my mandarin

anyway just curious, are u still in audit line? Management lvl staff? If u don't mind disclosing

Haha... the one between management level and non-management level... juggling both management and hands-on work+light review work.

supervisor?

I wouldnt use that.. Cause supervisor should only supervise right?

I felt that the title is very very misleading..

But in actual fact.. you do a lot of little things and a little of big things....

Kuala Lumpur.

cause i have an intention of working 1-2 years in mid-tier firm, then jump to big 3. if i work in those small firms in Selangor, like those what what & co. i scared big 3 wont take into consideration the experience

i m only a degree holder, plan to start part time acca this january, still got 5 papers to go

assistant manager perhaps?

Probably not advisable to plan that way, unless the Big3 really don't accept u at the moment then no choice.

Lol u playing trial and error?

apa boleh buat? too bored...

next time can help ownself think of a unique title

Acting Supervisor... such a funny title..

haha.. i need to act that i m supervising?

What degree? Local Uni?

ah.... A VERY familiar title there...

yup, no choice ler.

EY rejected me through email 2 days after my application.
KP applied 3 weeks+ ago, only HR call and confirm details.
PWC applied early last week, until now no news also


the sad thing is, even BDO,BT,GT and Mazar also not responding.

Any particular reason u avoid Deloitte?

anyway EY has just changed their logo and the tagline

EY

This post has been edited by tzxsean: Jul 2 2013, 11:49 PM

well, the stuff i read online is not that positive for deloitte malaysia.


but then, the last time i check, only deloitte (out of the big 4) not having open vacancies for fresh degree grads in audit. ><

This post has been edited by KenichiLee: Jul 2 2013, 11:50 PM