I plan to buy either one because in price terms they are similar.

are you planning to mod your car? if you plan to mod then I'd go for Altis..

do u know car enough or not?
if no thn new car is your choice
if u know...thn probably altis
that altis seem to be quite old...7 years

as far as i can say toyota has reliability even if it has 7 years and they don't depreciate as much. I don't intend to mod the car, perhaps keeping it to factory condition. If i were to own altis i'd consider having it for a longer period of time. well of course i know the risk of having a second hand car, but those can be settled by cautious observation as well as sending to mechanic to check.

for persona, i do know that proton has improved quite a lot comparing to previous designs but i highly doubt it would last long. even though the quality is somewhat okay for me. But then again it is a new car we're talking about so the indecisiveness kicks in

wait for the new proton car launch..

(^__^)

any idea when?

if you do not intend to mod that car and plan to keep it as stock as possible, I'm suggesting you to go for persona. new car, got free service from Proton. Old car no matter BMW Ferrari or what, you still have to touch up quite a lot of wear and tear parts.. Timing belts, suspension, overhaul perhaps, bla bla bla too many for me to write

what kind of modifications do you suggest?

---

Added on March 10, 2012, 11:01 pmso that means even if i plan to mod the car i'd have to touch up a lot right?

This post has been edited by jonas.hoh: Mar 10 2012, 11:01 PM

suppose this month or next month the official launch...SA told me, but from website is June...be patient, hehe

(^__^)

those that i mentioned to touch up are actually in mod list.. lol.. for eg: suspension, you'd go for high low soft hard adjustable perhaps.. if you plan to mod that car, of coz you want your car to be in top form condition rite

This post has been edited by shiyau: Mar 10 2012, 11:05 PM

7-year old car & NEW car @same price?
I'd take a NEW car anytime!
NEW car = NEW car! Get it?

OLD car = anything can happen to it anytime!! Gotta b prepared for the WORST! Lots of xtra $$$$ gonna go...

NEW car = anything can happen to it anytime TOO..

well there is something called preventive maintenance. as long as you follow that you shouldn't be facing any car problems.

and for NEW proton eh, how often do you see a broken down NEW proton, and also how often do you see a broken down toyota? my only reason for proton is actually that it is a virgin car(new)

This post has been edited by jonas.hoh: Mar 10 2012, 11:23 PM

Toyota pwn all

who needs proton anyway

Sure la.... Toyota cannot spoil one.

7 years old car wei.

are u kidding me? lol

has anyone own an altis before? i want to know it terms of build quality, ride comfort as well as NVH. i am not really worried about maintenance as i am a mechanical engineer myself. so i do know about those things to a certain extent. just more concerned about the worth(as in the feeling of a good car) at the end of the day.

---

Added on March 10, 2012, 11:56 pmwhat do you suggest?

This post has been edited by jonas.hoh: Mar 10 2012, 11:56 PM

I wanted to get an Altis too. But year 2007, if I'm not mistaken, the last model before the newer Altis.

I love the old Altis looks compared to the new one...BUT, when i was at 2nd hand shop..sat in one and errr....the interior is seriously GrandPa looks...cancel Altis. Many I saw also are accident car. it's easy to know an accident Toyota because the fitment and Gaps are very consistent. If its out means kena accident oledi.

This post has been edited by azbro: Mar 11 2012, 12:02 AM

i suggest toyota altis la~ haha, but if you are looking for a 2nd hand car, make sure dont rush, maybe you can find 1 pristine condition with all the service record at toyota. who know?

agreed

I think both are equal.....but I think its stupid to pay so much for something so old. Aren't there newer (and maybe better equipped) second hand cars at that price range.

and those cars would be?

reliability is the engine only
other parts of the car is pretty much the same as any other car out there
and 7 years ain't what consider as young anymore
wear and tear everywhere
new car = worry free

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 12:40 amno matter how preventive u are
and follow service manual
there is still thing that isn't stated inside the service schedule/manual
and the owner might didn't change it
tensioner/aircon belt...absorber..brake pad...and many of those small small unknown part
the car is consist of many big and small parts ...known and unknown
so new car...if it broke down...at least its covered by warranty...replacement is free...the only thing u have to pay is loan/service
7 years old car = loan, service, minor and major repair = big hole in pocket

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Mar 11 2012, 12:40 AM

I dunno. I'm not the one interested in buying a second hand car. Go do the research and tell us what else is there.

Few things to know about these cars... altis has no timing belt so no doubt. But if the engine not well taken care of, like my dad altis... engine damn loud. but the ttorque is there... compare with waja cps, my altis stick more to the chair then waja.hahaha... also the car is vvti, compare with campro... ish... mind you its a 1.8 and its more Fuel economic then campro..

wanna stick on the chair go get CA glue. You can stick on the chair 24/7.

I was the owner of Altis 1.8G. Passed the car already.

If i can share with u, toyota or not, all cars are mechanicals and will need more care after 5 years to maintain its pristine condition.

Depend on your driving style, some Altis do get warped disk quite early. You'll notice that when braking from high speed, at around 120-100 significant shaking on steering and brake pedal. Skim or change both front disk (UMW around rm500 IINM). Brake pads gone case.

After 5 years (over 100K km), all the absorbers and rubbers on the springs were tired and need to be changed. Also the stabilizer bar link sure gone (typical for Altis-both front). That link itself cost RM300 a pair.

If you're unlucky, there's also tok-tok sounds from front suspension, means u have to replace lower arm bushings. 2 bushes per arm, cost around rm500 plus press.

Engine mounting were also finish, 4 pieces, the right and left were are the most expensive. U'll notice the mounting rubber broken when engine noise very obvious from inside the cabin, and some jerk when the gear shift.

Engine wise, some leaking of engine oil after 6 years, from the valve cover or some people call rocker cover gasket (rubber) hardened and have to be change.

Some shaking on highway speed (110-130) due to worn drive shaft. Dont asked me how much it cost.

My Altis cooling coil (aircond) failed on its 8 years last time. Cost RM900 to replace outside (Denso authorised).

2 most unacceptable problem on my Altis were the meter illumination gone and need to change the meter (RM2K UMW), and gearbox whining at 80 to 100km/h very obvious. Change ATF, add additives, but still the 4AT emit whining sounds and it only disappear after 100km/h. Very annoying.

Other than the above, its a good car.

p/s: Better buy new car.

7 years old ad,u wanna take another 7 or 9 years loan?wow
when u finished ur loan it's 16 years old ad
u gonna pay 60k for nothing... wan face cannot get face(coz the car so old ad) and it's problems is coming...

buy a new car,at least u trouble free for 5 years at least

Same like ppl kenot die wan!!

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 8:28 amYu'd b surprised @the millions who depend on Proton EVERY DAY for years oledi AND STILL DO!!

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 8:34 amSimple reason why...?

There are MORE Protons on the road than Toyotas!!
More true for Altis!!!

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 8:37 amTrue. Agreed.
Anything can happen to even a new Merz/BMW or even a Lambo...haha!

This post has been edited by zeone: Mar 11 2012, 08:37 AM

That means you do not have any idea about the market values, then don't go around suggesting that there are other 2nd hand cars that have better or so.

Well.. Spec wise.. Persona still cant match Altis.. Why... Safety, Space & Comfort already loss to Altis...

Safety : TRC (Tration Crontrol for 1.8G)
Space & Comfort : Everyone know Altis is better...

Buying 2nd car also is a gamble, but is better to bring a reputable mechanic to inspect it.. Toyota does have his problem, but durability wise still better.. Ask the owner / car seller to give u the service manual for peace of mine and remember to use only recommendation oil & filter.. If not mistaken Altis is using 5W-30 & YZZE1 filter..

Tips: If parts spoils, direct go to spare part shop and order.. Confirm cheaper to service compare to those official blood sucking service center..

I know the reliability issue of proton as i own one. and 3 years after the purchase problems came in because they used cheapskate parts. speaking from experience, as i do own a proton, i had to literally change the entire innards of the car. and why would you buy a car that breaks down frequently? it's like you know that it is gonna be problematic but still go on with the plan. seriously there are many people out there who drives a toyota. yes the parts for toyota might cost more but also speaking from experience, the part last much longer.

Having that said if i were to get a worthy 2nd hand car with generous boot space and performance what do you suggest. for a 50k budget. i don't mind going cheaper btw

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 9:10 amAgreed.

This post has been edited by jonas.hoh: Mar 11 2012, 09:10 AM

Thank you for telling the true story. I have similar issue with my 8 year old Vios...

But most ppl will think Toyota is indistructable car. They dunno that to maintain one to that level taken money...not only for Toyota, other cars as well

Ya lo...many ppl tend to forget that CARS are juz MACHINES....
AND the Chinese saying re the one that meant "Yu get what yu pay for..." applies here too!
Dun expect to get same quality when only paying <RM60k for a Persona instead of >RM100k for an Altis!! Right?

Like others mentioned earlier, a 2nd Hand Altis with UNknown & possible props due2 its age (7 yrs?), a better bet wld b a Proton Persona cos it's NEW & no worries for 3 yrs cos there's warranty to fall back on...

Yup, Proton cars got their probs...so do others...even the LUXURY ones...
I kno...I hv had 2 Protons...they served me well...the first was still ok after 20+ years!! No major probs...minor wear & tear as do other cars. Moreover replacement parts are so much cheaper & easily available!

So if yu had probs with yr Proton that yu cld not accept, feel yu are one of the UNlucky ones....happens to ALL makes & esp the below RM200k ones.
Juz need to browse arnd all common car forums...to see the truth...

Sorry...not mean to "score" any points for Proton but saying it as it is...Cars = Cars = Machines....
If one can afford a better one, go for it!
If gotta make a choice, it's yours to make, with your own reasons...
Be happy with your decision...

Best wishes...& Good Luck in yr choice!

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 11:49 amps. Eg a Merz 300 is better than most cars & may last longer...
BUT one wld b paying >RM600k for ONE car, not 4getting maintenance, etc!
With that amount, another cld buy 10 Proton Personas...changing one after another...having a completely NEW car each time!

If each Persona is kept for only 3 yrs (warranty period), those 10 cars wld hv lasted 30 years!!

pps. Juz for fun in exchange...hehe...
Honestly, there's NO end to this kind of comparison...so...

This post has been edited by zeone: Mar 11 2012, 11:51 AM

Then why are you considering the Persona in the first place?

Good Advice...

In any decision-making when intending to purchase a car for one's use, make yr choice acc2 yr own reasons & prefs...
Be responsible for yr own choice & decision after...
NEVER condemn any make of car...all got pros & cons.

Juz need to count one's blessings...Be happy!

Moden cars are designed for 10 years life span only. Im not saying after 10 years it will die. But ideally the car is for 10 years or 250,000km. After that, most of the time you have to prepare for very major maintenance if you want to keep your car in certain condition.

Why?... Because in developed country, 10 years old car have to be scraped or send to 3rd world. So, no reason for manufacturer to design a car for 15yrs - 20yrs like before.

That is why, every 2-3 years face lift and every 5-6 years new generation come out with new gadgets and new tech. This is the trend now. If fact the manufacturer hope you change your car every 5-6 yrs. Your 20 yrs old refrigenerator might still running fine but the 5 yrs old might started to give you problem now.

So.... happy choosing your comming car.

agree to the 1st point
every car nowadays are made to have a lifespan
my opinion is 10 years or 200k KM
its becuz the material used aren't as good as used last time like cars be4 year 2000

but i can see TS defending his altis...thn i think TS should go for it and see the outcome of it
i personally dn't recommend it....HIGHLY

The previous generation Altis? Sat in one before, feels smaller than Wira. The current generation feel more spacious.

Old altis kinda ugly plus its old car.
many unknown things happened to the car and you will never know.

Better go for new persona. even its Proton. but comparing these 2. Persona wins.

Why not go for J Vios like me. New car.. kinda cheap.. petrol consumption low.. 2nd value high... unless you want drive the car more than 7years then..

i've done some research, and the next best thing i can get for is maybe 2006-2007 vios, 2007 honda city, 2008 nissan sentra.. damn i am spoilt with more choice.

i do agree that a car is only a machine that's why i want to know what is the best worth for me. anyway thank you everyone for the opinions. haha you guys are just awesome

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 2:31 pmwell i(my dad) already have a j vios. and it's giving me headache. with all the dust problem. but i think it's quite good aside from the dust problem.


This post has been edited by jonas.hoh: Mar 11 2012, 02:31 PM

old altis kinda ugly? you haven't seen those with pretty bodykits with good sport rims

Btw, which spec wise does persona wins an Altis?

btw shiyau how much do you need to mod the whole car?

depends on you. see you wanna mod till what extent.. lol

given a choice for you to buy new persona and those choices of 2nd hand car what would you choose? i reckoned i can get a vios or city should be good enough actually. then i can mod kau kau

go and test drive 1 and feeeeeel it

I don't know but i think you will buy the new P3-21A.

TS go for the 7 years altis plz,u sure wont REGRET it,u will juz cry out loud after 2-3 more years

y?becoz u dun hav a big head but still u wan a big helmet, gud luck

This post has been edited by Jazz6218: Mar 11 2012, 06:12 PM

what makes you say so?

becoz TS is tight on budget?
becoz altis maintenance is high?if any major breakdown can he afford to repair it?

but still his money his choice

Hmm....weird case, maybe you both got a lemon car cz as far as i know Toyota, Honda & Perodua is problem free and almost indestructible not to mention the face factor you get driving a Japanese car comparing to Proton bcz buying Proton is basically buying problem one....it comes as free gift together with your car and chicks hate proton. Proton = cheap so get the 7 years old Altis and forget about the new Persona

which comment or post of him saying that he's tight on budget?

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 7:02 pmThis post has been edited by shiyau: Mar 11 2012, 07:02 PM

hi ts, i would suggest u wait for the new proton. they r accepting bookings next week at their proton carnival. i've driven the old altis and a new persona before. the old altis is pretty nice but it is getting a little old. the spare parts for an altis is not cheap and the rubbers will b a little worn and most of the parts r due for replacements. FYI, i find the car's suspension abit too soft..but that can be changed.. for persona, i think its a very good car..good handling..low maintenance and best of all, new car! i'm driving a vios btw.. old model.. never gave me any problems till today. but alot of wear n tear parts needs to be replaced soon. Hope that helps!

if the price is about same, i take the altis(ofcoz the 2nd hand car condition must at good condition), sit inside altis(even if the car is 7 years old) the feeling is totally different from a proton

hes comparing an altis to a persona
which mean something like he ngam ngam can afford an altis
but what he haven't count in is all the minor and major repair that will happen

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 8:35 pmfeeling inside cannot compare to the wear and tear of the part located outside
its not abt how does it feel sitting inside a 7 years old car...its abt how worn out the part of a 7 year old car that matter
if many part is seriously worn...it really doesn't matter how nice is the interior...unless u plan to buy and sleep in it only(no plan to drive it)

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Mar 11 2012, 08:35 PM

TS I suggest you wait for this wednesday where Proton launch it new sedan!

Look at given spec also makes me

Price expected for the high line is RM75K with the cool specs and performance, it wins any car below 100K
But it is a Proton lah, scared small small part problem. The turbo and cvt from good reputation company, so no nid worry

Problem free? From personal experience, I don't think so. But chicks hate Proton prolly true lol.

But really people, T H P problem = Lemon? Potong problem = very big issue? Potong not allowed to have lemons eh?

Potong have to churn out perfect cars 100% of the time izzit?

Not denying potong is potong and they have their (sometimes very obvious) faults, but this fanatical devotion of T H stuff is mind boggling. Really.

Unless you're being sacarstic, in which case I'm just being an idiot here.

This post has been edited by Eiraku: Mar 11 2012, 08:53 PM

P3-21A

Yes. The CVT in P3-21A is VT3 from Punch Powertrain. Can support high torque for the CFE turbo engine.

People are so used to bash proton, everything problem is Proton.

7 years altis is still the best choice. Proton, the engine will make u cry.

for certain/many ppl...toyota = god car...it will NEVER broke down
but what they really dn't know/misconception is that proton and T, H are using the same stuff from the same supplier
all are bosch, denso also...all those part are not from proton
and they also dn't know...T nowadays are not as godly as T last time already
even hilux also all plastic already

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 9:01 pmbut its a new car
7 year old altis engine might still be great if service accordingly
but the wear and tear part are all worn out already and needed to be change
and the part ain't what u consider cheap ..its quite expensive since its an altis part
they sell the part based on car price
the more expensive your car is..the more expensive the part is...despite the cost producing it is the same(or almost)
for persona...its cheap only...and since under warranty..its free

This post has been edited by MR_alien: Mar 11 2012, 09:01 PM

Pretty sure I'm not getting a lemon and i enjoy my ownership with Altis. As usual, the intention was to buy a premium car and keep it forever (like our oldman keeping their Sunny and KE30).

But its true. Not to say the manufacturer reduce the quality and engineered the car to last mere 10 years. But new cars now equipped with much more components, electronics, plus recyclable material (environment friendly) which couldn't last as long. Plus the way we drive now different; lots of highspeed, thousands of hours stuck in jam, both contribute to rapid wear and tear.

Ask any Altis owners. yes we do enjoy the car and its comfortable (though too much body roll and fail handling). But to maintain its pristine, like new, tip-top, cost money. Absorbers and suspension bushings/rubbers change after 5 years, cooling coil after 7 years etc is normal for any cars. And sometimes, we not really speak about it to preserve the brand image, for whathever reason...

First of all i am not on a tight budget. secondly i truly believe that your idea of an old car, regardless of whether it is T H or P, there will still be wear and tear. in fact that is being taken into account. The reason i set it to 50k is so that i can allocated for more possibilities. I certainly do not believe in spending a HUGE amount on cars as well, there are better things to invest in. and seriously don't really fall into the trap of FREE warranty and things like that, they do have terms and conditions applied. they can tell you maintenance is free, but the parts ain't free. That's typically how they want people to believe, after all in a way it is a selling point. Neither AM I FIXED into buying the altis, it is just a thought, that's why i put it in such great community to talk about things, as many people have different perspective, in fact i do have some faith in persona as i tested one before, comfort wise it's okay for a person like me, after all i am still young, haha. But one thing, lotus handling isn't much to be boasted about. in fact i am currently driving a wira, and that feels sharper, aside from the motor oil bleeding everywhere once in a while and also drying up quickly, as well as faulty auto transmission(fixed it a million times, no difference) but then again, if proton makes a good car one day, i won't hesitate to support it. in fact, call me slow as i have just only found out the launching of the new car, looks quite promising, thanks for the rich informations, i shall wait and see.

Im comparing both stock. If u said about bodykits. A 20 years car honda delso with bodykits looks hundred times better than your modified altis

this is brilliant. and of course nobody wants to buy a lemon car. if i walk into a showroom and found faults in the car, i shall not hesitate to walk away.

---

Added on March 11, 2012, 9:31 pmdriving performance wise it's no problem. not lemon at all. just want get more worth for the money we pay for. who doesn't want that.

This post has been edited by jonas.hoh: Mar 11 2012, 09:31 PM

thn i think u should wait for the p3-21a
for proton...everything if it broke when its under warranty..they will change it for free
the free service is only 1st 3 service only(labour free only)
the warranty will still work if u continue service in the SC...many ppl complain SC won't replace part for them but the fact it they didn't even service in SC at all
i've claimed a few items for free from SC when it broke/not suitable...no issue also

+1

My 3yrs old more then 100k not much problem. Any problem claim, never face any problem where SC refuse to replace the new parts. Never heard :Proton is like that: from the SC that I used to go. Proton has been improving, it is true.

Maybe those that they are arrogant, but now I would say not bad. In fact, some japs services are worst as some sharing from my friends.

Well again, what ever car, please send to authorize SC at least during warrantty period.

totally agree on sc. that's how my beloved avanza kill itself. my dad sent to outside, within months the car started giving problems

lol, dont so arrogant, i own campro yet it deliver sufficient power and reliable if take care well

what car and what year is it? just curious.

proton persona year 2010, my friend own manual gen2 1st model 2005, already 7years engine still good, and u still saw lot gen-2 1st gen still on the road. that the proved

that's why there is a consideration for persona. but of course i would get the manual one. more reliable in a way. and easy to maintain

lol.. if you are comparing stock, then it's very subjective according to individuals.. Some fella thinks that Peugeut looks great, but I feel it's fugly (especially Peugeut 207) no offense to owners here.. hahahahaha.. you think that persona wins, i feel that altis looks better.. no one's wrong

Agreed that most of peugeot car looks ugly especially the hatchback model.. The ass looks damn ugly than a 100 years old tortoise lol

yala, everything proton worst one...
proton power window rosak, proton fault.. toyota power window rosak, say it is old already, not toyota fault...

---

Added on March 13, 2012, 2:03 amcorrect, i love pug design, and those conti compact such as citroen ds3 and renaut magnane.. but my friend hate it

This post has been edited by AlexLee277: Mar 13 2012, 02:03 AM

Too bad , H-Line don't have manual for persona. Just check out the new Proton car, they have manual for that too.

When you saw it topic is a bit out of compare here

Persona is brand new & altis is 2nd hand.

Everything is just depend what you prefer or like.

Need more durable on T spare parts and pay higher services then to be go T for altis 1.8A is no regretted lah.

If wanna buy local made then just grab the high end persona, that is end storey here

Good luck.

Well, are you sure all are warranty? I have seen cases of new Gen.2, Persona within 50,000~70,000 range putus timing belt, still within 3 years warranty.. But when drag to Proton SC, they say what u know.. The timing belt we got guarantee, but the engine damage is owner fault.. Coz didnt check and heard the belt sound?!? So the owner si pek angry and got quoted around RM1k just to change valves, piston & new casket set..

Lucky he drag his car to road side mechanic only cost around RM500~600... So all those bloody money u spend in SC, do you think they didnt earn it to cover your warranty? Coz they already mark up kau kau in their service & part charges.. Go compare the parts SC quote and go to spare part shop and ask, which 1 selling expensive?

By the way, those tear & wear parts they will not warranty.. Please read it in your manufacturer "limited" warranty guidebook..

Well, I am lucky as I did not face this timing belt putus problem (touch wood) as I change my timing belt every 80,000 km. If owner send the car to the SC for every services acording to the manual, he should complain kow kow as each services, the technician should check the timing belt. I am not sure if other car manufacturer will cover for the engine damage for this case. Any sharing there??

Anyway, it is good for the sharing.

if its under wrty & service according to schedule at SC, engine damage due to t.belt snap shld b covered.
shld also look at which SC u send. i faced claims problem at smaller authorised SC but when send to big main SC i got it claimed w/o problem..

proton sucks..

Why backwards wan? Timing belt is wear & tear item, but they have warranty for the timing belt but not the engine?

In any case, the warranty only cover manufacturing defect. If your engine kong due to timing belt putus, Proton has the right not to honor the engine's warranty, and since the timing belt is wear & tear item, there is no warranty to begin with.

Heck, cockroach urine will also void the ECU's warranty, as far as Toyota is concerned.

This thread is so typical of one with NO true answer...

Conclusion? Each & every time?
Juz this :
YOU are YOU; He is He; And so on...

Each one is an individual, with own tastes & preferences.
Really NO one is wrong.
So be happy with wat yu can afford & hv.
Count yr blessings as is...

I own a 2003 Altis passed on to me by my dad. My dad take care of his car very well and I am trying my best to follow suit too...

Here are my changes last year...

1. New front disc and brake pads as a whole front set last year after being using the stock ones previously...

2. New rear shock absorbers after being using the stock ones previously...

3. Cooling coil got leakage which I believe kena small rocks...

Otherwise others all working fine until now... Air cond super cold... Crossing fingers...

The comfort level of my Altis is still good. Looking at the interior, my Altis still has the comfortable side door finishing, not plasticky like the new models nowadays... Uncle car or whatsoever, I don't give a d*mn...

true true... +1

becos there is no true answer, so we need a forum la. otherwise we need a textbook.


This post has been edited by turbocharged: Mar 13 2012, 12:02 PM

CONCLUSION = test drive both the cars.. decide after tht..
test = used altis vs used persona, so u can judge the car which is already done some km's on the road..