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 Crank pulley, Stock VS lighten.

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ryan_hustler
post Jan 25 2012, 02:50 AM

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QUOTE(Peekab0o @ Jan 24 2012, 04:07 PM)
So u only read materials ? Have u tried using it technically ? Materials are easy to type out from keyboard warriors technically did u see the market yourself ? Jasma Crank Pulley are undersize and light and yes the lighter the better no wrong there from
those acc shop salesman . Jasma one has been cheap and cheerfull selling so well outthere . Dont juz read materials and create " awareness " . Theory are not always right . Fit in and check out the real thing and how many engine gone case with LCP ? Like one in a million news of it ? Lol
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Without theory, you cant understand how anything works..this will just lead you to taking your car to a shop, paying the guy up front for stuff you dont need or understand, go drink some coffee and come back once the job is done. Take your ride for a test drive later and achieve godlike speed in your head.
point :just because something sells, doesnt mean its good or useful. read : magnetic fuel saver yada yada..
My point is similar to vervain..ive got nothing against jasma or using an LCP, but before you go out there and spend money on a mod, you need to know the pros and cons and the best way to find out is by reading about it and asking in forums. Theory may not always be right, but you cant also go and buy every part out there just to test it and decide.

QUOTE(empire23 @ Jan 24 2012, 10:12 PM)
There's a reason they're heavy, it's because they act as dampeners so the engine doesn't rattle all the front bits to death. The lack of weight contributes to bearing wear and attached component wear.

Without the weight or the harmonic balancing of a good crank pulley, the car rattles itself to an early grave. That's why people who really really want the most power out of their cars go for an ATI performance or Ross Tuffbond crank pulley, note that these are even more heavily built than standard.

It's the same for lightened cam pulleys, for what little you gain, the fact the advance and retard settings are just held together by 5 shithouse screws without loctite in some cases is just a recipe for a blown head.

Best is stock sometimes laugh.gif
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Dude, ive seen aftermarket "pro street" clutch covers which were supplied with allen screws..to quote you, 5 shithouse allen screws. Now thats gonna keep it all together eh?
ryan_hustler
post Jan 26 2012, 10:46 AM

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QUOTE(empire23 @ Jan 26 2012, 06:46 AM)
Behind the crankshaft you have the rotational mass that is the flywheel, the clutch and the whole damned car. In front, you have the aircon, alternator and so on. A reduction of a 2kg tops in just isn't going to bring out the beast in your damned car.

For the amount of money spent on the LCP, I can buy myself KFC and some minyak, go for a hard drive and set my tune correctly and still get more power. Malaysians are just in love with anything shinny when it comes to modding.
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LMAO.. behind the car is a booth full of shit and a 200kg subwoofer.

Another thing I dont get is this :

Wheel (before)
Power 96 hp (72kw) @5868 rpm
Torque 130 Nm @ 4173 rpm

Wheel (after)
Power 99hp (74kw) @6141 rpm
Torque 129Nm @ 4378 rpm

Well, shouldnt your HP be higher (obviously) at a higher rpm? My car makes more HP at a higher rpms without an LCP
In fact right up to 4500rpm, your stock crank pulley is doing a better job than a lightened dampened billetted forged titanium aluminium hybrid alloy crank pulley with a piece of rubber. (LDBFTAHACP + PR)

user posted image
ryan_hustler
post Jan 27 2012, 03:12 AM

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Dampening the crank pulley is definitely a good thing, especially to absorb vibration, but in essence like what empire said in most of his posts, a lightened crank pulley at most shaves off 2kgs tops on a singular part which doesnt really make a significant difference on a mild or road spec car. dont get me wrong, 2kgs on a track car makes a shit load of diff, but those engines are balanced, blueprinted and stripped down after the race. Your crank and engine internals are not expected to last 100 000km as a regular street car is usually overhauled.

QUOTE(the_catacombs @ Jan 26 2012, 09:57 PM)
err... myth lcp is a 1 piece unit with rubber belt slip in the groove... if u got see properly laa...
if u say the rubber will twist, means the whole pulley can twist???.... 
flywheel has springs??... cannot brain bro... got picture??... sorry for my noobness...
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Its attached via a belt, even your crank has torsion stresses.

QUOTE(empire23 @ Jan 26 2012, 10:09 PM)
user posted image
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hmm.gif this will definitely become unbalanced once the springs lose their tensile strength..how often does this need replacing? im guessing very..


Added on January 27, 2012, 3:35 am
QUOTE(sinister_sid @ Jan 26 2012, 10:38 PM)
this not a issue if the aftermarket lcp is same size with stock not those undersize . i installed a handful since i work as mechanic for a living
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There is a significant difference between a mechanic and an engine builder. Also an engineer. I remember a mechanic guy in LYN said he came up with a brilliant design to fit an intercooler to the intake of NA cars.. In fact he was selling the kit and installation service to other car owners.

The purpose? to cool ambient air to ambient temperature notworthy.gif thumbup.gif icon_rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by ryan_hustler: Jan 27 2012, 03:35 AM
ryan_hustler
post Jan 27 2012, 11:45 AM

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that flywheel is rather interesting..where can I get more information on it? Also is there any particular name for it?
ryan_hustler
post Jan 29 2012, 08:13 PM

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Drex, since youre here, can you shed some light on who Mythelogy actually are? Ive tried looking up information on this company and I cant find any.

The question is :
Who are/is mythelogy?
When was the company founded and by who?
Whats their pedigree or experience in manufacturing car parts etc..

Since EA autoworks supplies their crankpullies, I guess youre the best person to ask..
ryan_hustler
post Jan 30 2012, 12:12 PM

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QUOTE(maddriver @ Jan 30 2012, 08:50 AM)
then care to explain how my engine is still running fine after 200,000km with a lcp installed, plug and play?
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simple..

1) you own a workshop
2)ive never heard a bad review of your services means you know your shit and you do a good job.in fact before you even quota a price you always ajak ppl over to discuss what needs to be done and have a look at ur workmanship.

do you dare vouch for the quality of products you dont carry or the services of any other workshop?

tongue.gif
ryan_hustler
post Jan 31 2012, 11:18 AM

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QUOTE(sinister_sid @ Jan 30 2012, 08:47 PM)
I still dont get it ? ur answer looks more like shoe licking and butt polishing unker maddriver . i tot u earliar said lighten crank pulley will destroy crank .
and i believe maddriver sold many of these and install on totally standard engine without any1 race prep and harmonic balancing . care to explain ?
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lol.. i dont anything from kissing his ass, just speaking my mind. I dont have a problem with a lightened crank pulley, or a balanced lightened crank pulley. The problem is :

tons of aftermarket parts with no history or proven RnD
some are undersized, some are lightened, some lightened and undersized, some with harmonic balancer, some with dodgy looking rubber damper
The question is, do you want to take the risk of running your car with a product with no history or proven RnD or engineering skills?

Who are mythelogy? try googling them, no history..maybe its a proper Engineering house with tons of credentials and racing designs under their belt, but think about it..if they did, im sure it will be plastered all over LYN, ZTH, have their own wiki etc..

Who are Jasma? http://jasmajapan.com/index.php website is jasmajapan, parts made in pahang? hmm.gif

maddriver can use it in his "stock" wira/satria end of the day he owns a workshop, so if his car gets f***ed, no big deal. Same story with drex, but I got nothing against them. In fact I respect their contribution to providing knowledge in an open forum for discussion. If you followed drex and guans fotopic last time, you will know these guys are very serious and smart in what they do. BUT i will never go to their workshop because I had some bad experience there. End of the day no hard feelings, maddriver and drex business are still going strong irrespective of what I say or my clientele. You just gotta decide for yourself if you wanna put your trust in watever product in the market.

I can honestly say im not a car modding god. but ive worked in a workshop and I have a very strong engineering background. As a part of this online forum, im sharing my knowledge and thoughts, bottom line is its your F**king car and money. I always answer questions as unbiased as possible. Should I change wira to rear disc brake? i tell you the pros, the cons you f**kin decide. Thats what brains are for, to be used

edit : typo

This post has been edited by ryan_hustler: Jan 31 2012, 11:20 AM
ryan_hustler
post Feb 1 2012, 01:17 AM

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Well said and well written.. i honestly appreciate it

back to the context of LCPs, why do I or others place RnD and proper engineering on a high pedestal when anyone can make a good performance part? Simple, and let me take you up on your extractor story.
I have reasonable welding skills and I previously handmade a turbo manifold out of high grade,heavy gauge buttweld fittings. Was it hard? very. Did it work? perfectly..in fact it was neater and i put in a considerable effort in calculating the fluid dynamics of exhaust gases in an effort to maximize scavenging effect. After roughly a year and a half, a small leak appeared in the weld joint and started leaving toxic exhaust gases. I check my engine bay regularly and diagnosed the problem and fixed it. Speaking to a few other friends, they have purchased aftermarket extractors which had similar leaks and they brushed it off. This is serious shit. If you breathe in the toxic carbon monoxide gases over a prolonged period of time in a confined environment, you will DIE..no doubts, no second chances. Therefore should there be an importance in choosing a quality extractor from a cap ayam one? I would say yes..

What would the average lifespan of an engine be? Lets say 100,000km of hard driving before being overhauled. thats roughly 5 years give or take. Buying a half baked poorly designed part for instant gratification would not justify the possibilities of something going wrong. How would an unbalanced crank react spinning at 6000rpm? Engine malfunction? I can life with that..Could be worse.. does anyone care to educate the general public of these problems that may occur? Ask a mechanic how to increase your HP, he will say get a stroker it, janji laju..what are the side effects? Tada punya, saya sudah buat untuk banyak kereta..modifying is not something you wanna take on without proper research, reputable products and sincere mechanics

Ive seen engine blocks with holes the size of a cigarette box because a bolt worked itself loose and shot out of the block..if it carries enough force it can go thru your firewall and kill you..it could hit a pedestrian and kill him or her..your car could sieze and hit another car, a motorcycle or a pedestrian. I find it rather irresponsible to say who cares when your decisions affect innocent unrelated people. no RnD? who cares! no QA? who cares! no QC? who cares!

I guess its all fun and games until someone takes a chunk of 6000rpms worth of poorly designed crank pulley in the face. would you still care then?

Use a product for a few months and everyones a brand ambassador. Why do we need quality, research, design, maths,physics,engineering when Muthu my trusty metalworker can turn a chunk of steel into a car part? Who cares? Malaysia boleh thumbup.gif

 

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