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 Solar Power Generation, for home use/sell back to tnb

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Two5Kid
post Jun 30 2020, 09:48 AM

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QUOTE(slec @ Jun 30 2020, 09:31 AM)
Hi there, but to challenge that idea is, say disaster really happen, how long can 12kwh battery actually last? What is the cost of installing the solar power? Would it be better to buy a generator instead? Say disaster only happen 10 years later will the efficiency of the solar generator still be good?

The idea of saving the environment or at least reduce my carbon footprint is nudging me but the cost just doesn't justify the means.
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That's a good question, haven't tried it but for me during a disaster most likely daytime I do not need to use any power, unless for boiling water or cooking (gas stove). Say just turn on some fans and make sure the refrigerator stays on. Then night time some lights, maybe charge the phone. I think can last for a while. And don't forget, next day the sun rises and the solar battery is being recharged again. So I think I'm pretty much covered, unless the disaster is the sun goes out.

I agree with the fact that this is a hobby (because this is Malaysia), in an ideal world, I hope that the government can give us a tax rebate for having solar, or that we get the FiT system back but there you go, that's the ideal situation. Actually the NET Metering isn't that bad, you can even lease the solar panels, so they aren't yours but they are actually helping you save on your electricity bills.
slec
post Jun 30 2020, 09:48 AM

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QUOTE(ozak @ Jun 30 2020, 09:46 AM)
Even conservative also more than 6%. Take maybank for example.
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If that's the case, understood on solar generator already! Thanks for input guys!
slec
post Jun 30 2020, 09:50 AM

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QUOTE(Two5Kid @ Jun 30 2020, 09:48 AM)
That's a good question, haven't tried it but for me during a disaster most likely daytime I do not need to use any power, unless for boiling water or cooking (gas stove). Say just turn on some fans and make sure the refrigerator stays on. Then night time some lights, maybe charge the phone. I think can last for a while. And don't forget, next day the sun rises and the solar battery is being recharged again. So I think I'm pretty much covered, unless the disaster is the sun goes out.

I agree with the fact that this is a hobby (because this is Malaysia), in an ideal world, I hope that the government can give us a tax rebate for having solar, or that we get the FiT system back but there you go, that's the ideal situation. Actually the NET Metering isn't that bad, you can even lease the solar panels, so they aren't yours but they are actually helping you save on your electricity bills.
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Yeap! Will be monitoring this thread for the day solar is really a viable option! Good and productive input!
yushin
post Jun 30 2020, 11:44 AM

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Saw in youtube on the virtual power producer (or virtual peak plant?) base on tesla car and power wall.
Where owners use their car battery and powerwall to supply back to the grid during the power peak demand and power company pay the owners back.

Not bad actually, but I'm sure those IPP in Malaysia won't like this concept if it gets big.

This post has been edited by yushin: Jun 30 2020, 11:45 AM
ozak
post Jun 30 2020, 11:55 AM

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QUOTE(yushin @ Jun 30 2020, 11:44 AM)
Saw in youtube on the virtual power producer (or virtual peak plant?) base on tesla car and power wall.
Where owners use their car battery and powerwall to supply back to the grid during the power peak demand and power company pay the owners back.

Not bad actually, but I'm sure those IPP in Malaysia won't like this concept if it gets big.
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Just buy the share.

No thanks the system. tongue.gif (it's not happen here anyway)
Two5Kid
post Jul 3 2020, 03:27 PM

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Alright, I just had a long chat with the solar contractor. This is what I learned. Actually, placing solar panels here in Malaysia for residential isn't really a green move. What it allows you to do is to actually use more electricity than what you are paying for per month. Yes, you do pay upfront of around RM10-20k, but your electricity bills will be either 0 or maybe some small amounts per month. And that is how you achieve a "return" on your initial "investment".

This is also provided that you intend to stay that long at your property (better if it's a newly built one in which you intend to stay more than 20+ years) and also that your roof is big enough and the location is good for solar (north-facing).

The only sure win situation is if your electricity bills are in upwards of RM800 to more than RM1k, or perhaps even higher, then you will see a faster ROI.

So in short, it actually promotes more energy usage if you notice that you are producing more solar than you are using, hence you would be using more (aircons, heating, etc) to make sure you don't generate extra solar power (since extra power is not going to give you any bonuses).


Kiding
post Jul 3 2020, 05:04 PM

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QUOTE(Two5Kid @ Jul 3 2020, 03:27 PM)
Alright, I just had a long chat with the solar contractor. This is what I learned. Actually, placing solar panels here in Malaysia for residential isn't really a green move. What it allows you to do is to actually use more electricity than what you are paying for per month. Yes, you do pay upfront of around RM10-20k, but your electricity bills will be either 0 or maybe some small amounts per month. And that is how you achieve a "return" on your initial "investment".

This is also provided that you intend to stay that long at your property (better if it's a newly built one in which you intend to stay more than 20+ years) and also that your roof is big enough and the location is good for solar (north-facing).

The only sure win situation is if your electricity bills are in upwards of RM800 to more than RM1k, or perhaps even higher, then you will see a faster ROI.

So in short, it actually promotes more energy usage if you notice that you are producing more solar than you are using, hence you would be using more (aircons, heating, etc) to make sure you don't generate extra solar power (since extra power is not going to give you any bonuses).
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As we are in equatorial belt, 4 months sun is on top of the sky, 4 months on north and 4 months on south, so you will still lose quite a lot of solar power for 4 months if the solar panel is only north facing.

some more, klang valley area only get 3-4 hours direct sunlight average, this even lower the solar panel power output

last but not least, tropical high temperature climate further reduce the solar panel efficiency.

So it is not really wise to invest solar panel in Klang Valley unless your electricity usage is very high > 700KWh per month
Two5Kid
post Jul 3 2020, 06:05 PM

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True. Those are limiting factors in the situation. I have two systems (one just installed), the first one I installed for 18 months already, (surprise surprise) I have it like you said, one on the North and the other on the South facing, apparently, the North side is generating twice the amount as compared to the South. So for this new installation, I put it on the North side. Fingers crossed it will work.

I'm not from the Klang Valley, but I doubt there is much difference in the sunlight average so that can't be helped. One of the limiting factors.

The heat will cause the solar panel to lose efficiency is also one of the unfortunate limiting factors. But the contractor said, there are now panels going upwards of 400w. Mine is only at 355w, the other is at 295w. So maybe with a better panel, you can offset these a bit.

Yeah, this is mainly for those who have a huge electricity bill as seen during the MCO period. What we can hope for (small hope) is that the government changes its policy on solar power harvesting.

yushin
post Jul 3 2020, 08:38 PM

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Unlike lots of online information that ask you to install panels facing south, Malaysia's sun moved from north to south almost evenly.
You can use suncalc to see how the sun moves relative to your house roof then decide how to fix the panel.
https://www.suncalc.org

Unless the other parts of Malaysia, Klang valley has the problem of cloud and haze thus on average we only get like 3 sun hour per day.

The power generated whether the sun is at south or north side also highly depend on the monsoon season that gets very cloudy.

This post has been edited by yushin: Jul 3 2020, 08:39 PM
ivan89
post Jul 20 2020, 09:35 PM

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QUOTE(yushin @ Aug 15 2019, 09:14 AM)
My hybrid inverter charger is 4kw only. I get 5kw panel so I could get more power when the sunlight is less optimal.
With cloudy klang valley weather, I seldom get optimal power output so put 25% more panel lor.

for 3 phase, there are two ways to do it.
1) Use a single 10kw 3 phase hybrid inverter. costs like 14k.
2) Use 3 unit of single phase 5kw hybrid inverter, costs about 12k. The inverters are linked somehow and got software to sync up the phase. but you will need much more space to put the solar panels for the 3 inverters...

rm22k include 4 x 12v 150ah battery. I am using 48v system.

TNB rm450 per month, means one month you use about 1000kwh, one day you use 33.3kwh.
A 5kw system at perfect condition can offset 17.5kwh per day. Which means your monthly consumption will reduce to 474kwh.
At 474kwh TNB bill will be Rm166.78. You can save rm283.22 per month, in a perfect world.

It will take you 77.6 months to ROI the rm22k you spend. Which is 6.5 years.  sweat.gif
BUT!!!
since you're using lead acid batteries, you need to change the battery on the 4th or 5th year so the ROI will be much longer.

PS: Lithium iron phosphate batteries, at 80% discharge rate, have a theoretical lifespan of 10 years.  brows.gif
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Hihi yushin, I asked you some questions last year. Then I was occupied with work and had to put this project aside.

So I have some free time recently, and I'm going to start my hydroponics and solar pv projects soon. I'm thinking to start small and just power the led lights under the balcony, some outdoor lighting, and some small appliances in the room first.

1) I want to check with you about the battery. I saw from Lazada, a MSB ULTRA BATTERY 12V 100ah, it says 500 cycle life span. So, if I set DOD of 50%, meaning that it can last for around 1000 cycle?

2) Is there a setting on the controller that let me power the load directly during day time (only store excess power in battery), so the battery life span won't get shorten so fast?

Solar Panel -> Load, instead of Solar Panel -> Battery -> Load?



Thanks! =)

This post has been edited by ivan89: Jul 20 2020, 09:56 PM
yushin
post Jul 20 2020, 10:02 PM

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QUOTE(ivan89 @ Jul 20 2020, 09:35 PM)
Hihi yushin, I asked you some questions last year. Then I was occupied with work and had to put this project aside.

So I have some free time recently, and I'm going to start my hydroponics and solar pv projects soon. I'm thinking to start small and just power the led lights under the balcony, some outdoor lighting, and some small appliances in the room first.

I want to check with you about the battery. I saw from Lazada, a MSB ULTRA BATTERY 12V 100ah, it says 500 cycle life span. So, if I set DOD of 50%, meaning that it can last for around 1000 cycle?

Thanks! =)
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I'm not familiar with lead acid battery lifespan sweat.gif
But I believe if you set DOD of 50% it should last longer than 500 cycles...



Plan to make a 12v system?

This post has been edited by yushin: Jul 20 2020, 10:15 PM
ivan89
post Jul 20 2020, 10:10 PM

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QUOTE(yushin @ Jul 20 2020, 10:02 PM)
I'm not familiar with lead acid battery lifespan  sweat.gif
But I believe if you set DOD of 50% it should last longer than 500 cycles...

Plan to make a 12v system?
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1) Should I use 12V system? I'm not too sure about this.

2) Is there a setting on the controller that let me power the load directly during day time (only store excess power in battery), so the battery life span won't get shorten so fast?

Solar Panel -> Load, instead of Solar Panel -> Battery -> Load?
yushin
post Jul 20 2020, 10:16 PM

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QUOTE(ivan89 @ Jul 20 2020, 10:10 PM)
1) Should I use 12V system? I'm not too sure about this.

2) Is there a setting on the controller that let me power the load directly during day time (only store excess power in battery), so the battery life span won't get shorten so fast?

Solar Panel -> Load, instead of Solar Panel -> Battery -> Load?
*
Depending on the type of panel voltage and your hydrophonic power consumption. Any decent controller (even the RM25 PWM controller) will store excess energy to the battery if your load is less than solar panel charge.

Example
Solar panel provide 1000w power
Your hydroponic pump only uses 100w
The controller will charge the battery with the remaining 900w(minus some conversion loss)

You will need a solar controller. Whether its pwm or mppt will depend on your panel voltage.

The voltage of the system depends on your hydrophonic pump and power requirement.
What is the estimated power for your hydrophonic? only pumps?

This post has been edited by yushin: Jul 20 2020, 10:24 PM
ivan89
post Jul 20 2020, 10:35 PM

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QUOTE(yushin @ Jul 20 2020, 10:16 PM)
Depending on the type of panel voltage and your hydrophonic power consumption. Any decent controller (even the RM25 PWM controller) will store excess energy to the battery if your load is less than solar panel charge.

Example
Solar panel provide 1000w power
Your hydroponic pump only uses 100w
The controller will charge the battery with the remaining 900w(minus some conversion loss)

You will need a solar controller. Whether its pwm or mppt will depend on your panel voltage.

The voltage of the system depends on your hydrophonic pump and power requirement.
What is the estimated power for your hydrophonic? only pumps?
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I see, that's good to hear.

I'm looking at this one, https://www.lazada.com.my/products/ready-st...s975450935.html?

Review seems good. Panel Voltage is 34.5V. You have other better panel suggestions?

For the hydroponics pumps, I might start with one which is AC 40Watts. Start small first. Trial and error. I'm new to hydroponics too. I also haven't figure out how many hours to run it yet.

For now, just to kick start, mainly some led lightings under the balcony and outside the house.


yushin
post Jul 22 2020, 10:40 AM

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QUOTE(ivan89 @ Jul 20 2020, 10:35 PM)
I see, that's good to hear.

I'm looking at this one, https://www.lazada.com.my/products/ready-st...s975450935.html?

Review seems good. Panel Voltage is 34.5V. You have other better panel suggestions?

For the hydroponics pumps, I might start with one which is AC 40Watts. Start small first. Trial and error. I'm new to hydroponics too. I also haven't figure out how many hours to run it yet.

For now, just to kick start, mainly some led lightings under the balcony and outside the house.
*
For your smaller 12v system, that panel is good enough to start.
If you're going to use AC water pump then I would recommend you get a hybrid inverter that can draw power from TNB in case your battery empty during 3 consecutive days of rainfall. Or size your panel and battery much larger...
In some hydroponic implementation, plant will die if the pump fails.

if you want to try purely dc system then get a 12/24v dc pump
Lazada 12/24v pump

This seller's solar pump set can be a base for you to start explore
Lazada solar pump set

My own hydroponic system uses 80w AC pump as I already have full solar AC system wired to the house's electric supply.

This post has been edited by yushin: Jul 22 2020, 10:43 AM
9m2w
post Aug 16 2020, 07:30 PM

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Hi solar gurus. I have a few questions regarding storage batteries. Was just wondering if the price of lithium ion batteries have gone down in comparison to lead acid? Also do we have anything on the local consumer market resembling a Powerwall? And apologies in advance for this noob question are there actually battery solutions that do away with the charge controller and possibly the inverter?

Not looking to significantly reduce my electricity bills. Just powering devices, garden lights and occasionally some electronic devices.

This post has been edited by 9m2w: Aug 16 2020, 09:21 PM
billyboy
post Aug 20 2020, 01:46 PM

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are there any active solar contractors here ? i'm looking to do a NEM 6kw system......
enduser
post Aug 20 2020, 06:09 PM

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QUOTE(billyboy @ Aug 20 2020, 01:46 PM)
are there any active solar contractors here ? i'm looking to do a NEM 6kw system......
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Try contact gsparx,
https://www.gsparx.com/Packages/Residential
billyboy
post Aug 20 2020, 07:31 PM

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tks for the tip....i don't really like to work with govt entities (too much red tape) but lets try....tks again smile.gif

QUOTE(enduser @ Aug 20 2020, 06:09 PM)
bengang14
post Sep 26 2020, 07:58 AM

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QUOTE(bengang14 @ Jun 20 2020, 10:56 AM)
user posted image

4kVA

earlier i cincai called a company online..

was quoted RM16xx for repair. including dismantle and fix it back...
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hi guys. some how its is "working" now. the error is gone

how do i know if it is really generating. the display


output: 250W(and increasing).
Today:0 Wh

any tnb number i can call?? thanks

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