Hi all, reading through several downlight related threads, found out no one mentioning the downlight quality issue as I think it might not be a big concern/big deal until today I took some sample downlights from a shop and I found out these. Kindly refer to the photos below for much better illustrations and elaborations.

You all may quite familiar with this design of simple downlight I took 2 samples which are size 4 inch and 6 inch.

Before we install the downlight together with reflector, we should see something as above which are the downlight casing(the white ring) + supports(the black frame). When I have a close up inspection on the quality suddenly found out that the 6 inch one quite abnormal


there are additional unusual holes on the casing as in the photo above.


another close up on the unusual holes. This might not be a big deal as when you fix the reflector, everything are covered up. But I am just curious is this suppose to be on the 6 inch downlight?

seem like there is a missing support as the additional holes are actually used to fix the 4 supports instead of just 3? as below


Other than that, I felt like the supports are forced to be fixed on the 6 inch frame until they are deformed to be out of shape as below


I took another close up inspection on the 4 inch one, everything nicely done without additional holes or out of shape


Sharing is caring, just to share out and see any sifus here are actually know about this or not, dont shoot me la ok? Just FYI, I quoted a few shops for this design of downlight and this shop is selling the cheapest among others. Therefore I would like to ask about the unusual thing as above as I was thinking that this is the reason for the shop to sell cheap

will you feel that, if that 6in downlight having that additional support, will it look uneven? the 3 support are very close to each other, but another 1 is a bit far.. So for this reason, i believe that 3 support may be consider as normal.

Is more on build quality, most china made is like this. And the bulb holding depend on the bulb you need to use the shop will fix it for you.

For the more quality build down light, even the reflector are made of thicker and harder material. But it cost 3 to 5x more. Just do the math, if you keen I think there is one shop in ss2 import the Europe made down light.

Herm It sounds correct also regarding the uneven look if 4 supports. But just felt weird why there are additional holes in which we are not going to use. Further more the deformed/out of shape bulb holder really looks weird, this will affect the light bulb position level and hence affect the light directivity.

I just did a comparison between 6inch and 4inch, the supports for both of them are exactly the same, so it seems like they are using 4inch support to fix on the 6inch one and end up forced until out of shape. Like kena paksa one. Is there any difference of height between the 6inch and 4inch downlight? I will pay a visit to the shop when I am available to reconfirm this.

Btw, based on your experiences on the reno, this kind of downlight should have 3 supports or 4 supports? Because I saw a lot of your nice art with downlight too So you are having higher chance than use to deal with downlight too

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Added on August 27, 2011, 10:46 pmIcic. Thanks for the info, bro. Based on the build quality, I guess this one should be china made. But, I'm still confused about the bulb holder. In what case will they change the bulb holder as I felt this seems to be quite low quality? They quoted me this for E27.

This post has been edited by leeyung: Aug 27 2011, 10:46 PM

Well, my experiance is, 4" & 6" downlight actually look very similar, only the surface are diff only. and from what i remember, 6" downlight also usually hv 3 support only, that look normal for me, may be there is some kind of standard, but i dont know, since every time i buy, it still look like this way.

and Weikee is right, usually bulb holder are fix by the light shop depend on what kind of bulb you prefer to use, if u asking for PLC downlight, then they will install the pin type holder for you with transformer. so i think not really related to the (quality) of the light, and i guess u know, this kind of downlight usually are imported from China or even locally made, so cant really ask for more, unless u willing to pay more (i guess).

I will go for bulb with external ballast, it last longer than bulb build in ballast. So the shop owner will change the correct holder. And ask for good quality ballast.

Only problem is initial starting it blink few times.

This post has been edited by weikee: Aug 27 2011, 11:16 PM

I bought the 6" round downlight with external ballast to try at my plaster ceiling 1st...then i found out is quit hard to remove the downlight casing...the spring is hold the ceiling quit strong...so it may spoil the ceiling edge if we need to change the ballast ...
so end up i bought the build in screw 1 ...but i use downlight on toilet only....

Any 1 use LED downlight, every times i close the led downlight ...it will blink 1-2 times again...consider normal?

The way I see - it's physics. Newton's First Law of Motion. You need only 3 (minimum) to achieve static equilibrium. Why you want to have another one when 3 already serve its purpose? To increase the cost of the product unnecessarily?

Sorry, Is that all 6 inch or only the particular that you get have the extra holes?

off topic though but would to clarify about the Newton's First Law Motion as inappropriate application from your side.

According to Newton's First Law:
The velocity of an object/body will remain constant unless the body is acted upon by an external force

Simply say
The object that is at rest will stay at rest unless an additional force acts upon it.
The object that is in motion will not change its velocity unless an additional force acts upon it.

3 Is not the minimum to achieve static equilibrium, you can use only 1 support & manage to hang the downlight at static equilibrium as assuming no any other directional/additional forces act towards the frame, the only force is the gravitational force produced by earth.

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Added on August 28, 2011, 10:28 amI only have 1 unit of 6 inch and 1 unit of 4 inch as samples. This is because I would like to see how is the feeling for different size on the ceiling. My next visit to the shop I will check the rest see whether they consist of the additional holes or not . Btw, do you see such case on your downlight?

This post has been edited by leeyung: Aug 28 2011, 10:28 AM

leeyung...Sorry. I'm yet to decide my downlight, hence that the reason I'm asking whether because only your unit or all , else I could already give feedback....

What are your concerns? 3/4 legs. Extra unused holes?

You are buying some really cheap fittings. Don't expect too much.

The difference with quality fittings and cheap is in the built quality and unseen research. Good fittings have reflectors that dont cause glare. Next time you go shopping, go look at Zara shop. They use Erco fittings(German made). Look at the light. There is no glare unless you are looking directly at the bulb. There are cheaper variants of it.

When buying lights, don't keep looking for the cheapest. Look at the lighting quality that it produce. You already spent so much on the house, why save on one of the most important aspect of the space - the light. Lighting is what creates the ambiance in your home. Bad lighting design and fitting will make the nicest house look bad.

That is why Zara so expensive loh Erco also light Twin tower and many 5 starts hotel. Too expensive already. Wonder can get any mid range like Taiwan good lighting brand.

Y not LED

Aiya bro, dont straight jump to conclusion la, I'm here to ask and discuss the issue only. No offence. Sometimes cheap things do not mean all those poor quality things, same for the case as there are expensive things but with low quality. I'm new with downlights, and thats why in order not to get con by the shop, so I'm here to seek for advice. And by the way, I am not looking for the cheapest downlight in market. The 'cheapest' I mean is exactly same model and quality but a lot different in price from this shop compared to other shops around my area, and the main reason it is cheaper than other shops is because the shop having Raya promotion. Of course I know those 3x or 5x more expensive downlights have better quality. But sometimes it depends on budget also, thats why I'm surveying around for mid-range downlights instead. And thanks for your comments. I do agree that 'Lighting is what creates the ambiance in your home' and thats why I'm here to discuss about the mentioned issue and see if anybody face the same situation or not.

Lumen / RM is still low, Energy saving bulb is still much value for money. If only couple of down light is not much a problem, but entire house is about 20 to 30 units.

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Added on August 28, 2011, 11:55 pmCheap may not be bad, but majority of cheap stuff come with low quality. After survey some light shop, i can tell you most come from same source, design are similar.

This post has been edited by weikee: Aug 28 2011, 11:55 PM

Yes, that is why the first thing I asked you is what you are concern here?

The framing is not that important. What you need to be looking for is the quality of the reflectors. Expensive fittings also use the same bulbs, but the difference is in the quality of the reflectors. Most light shops also don't know about this. All they concern about is the out look and the wattage. Good fittings are a lot brighter because they will reflect a lot more light thus higher efficiency at the same wattage. To most ppl that is not an issue.

The real issue is actually glare. Cheap fitting causes a lot of glare. And this will cause fatigue when exposed too long. You will find that you are tired and irritated when in these spaces.

Choose good fittings that have less glare.
(test it in the shop and walk around looking at it at different angle)

Bishop,
wah...so difficult lal...which shop or what should we look for?

I don't sell lights. (not yet... ) those I recommend you will say damn bloody expensive...

Best is to see the light in action and walk around looking at it. if you can, see if you can look at the reflectors. Touch it and look at the surface/reflector quality. The good imported fittings actually has Polaroid coating on it to reduce glare. That is why they are so expensive. The china cheap one only copy the outlook but not the technology.

If don't want to spend too much on light fittings then make sure your lighting layout is properly designed. Position them so that they are bright where you need them to be only and not too 'over exposed'. Last time they always want house to be VERY bright. It needs to be bright enough to do what you need and not more. else you will find it very tiring when you are there too long. This is what we call fatigue.

I'm sure I could not look into downlight direct, hence I plan to get those with glass for most part on house except wet kitchen area.
Also, at least 2 light bulb point so that I could choice to put 1 or 2 bulb.
* For sure can't control those kids not to look at those light