Why the worst crime a player can commit is not cheating or injuring another pro, but rather expressing a point of view?

It seems that, in this industry, it is better to lie, dive and prosper than to be honest and be vilified.
It seems also that football is hell-bent on its most important commodity, the players, knowing their place and not having a voice.
When they do speak, it has to be cliches and sanitised nonsense, which is why so many people are surprised when a player actually has an articulate, intelligent view on any given subject.
There are far more astute footballers out there than people would care to realise or accept. The trouble is, for some reason it suits our purposes to believe players are thick.
And it seems we prefer it to remain that way.
Which is why Clark Carlisle is regarded as Clark Kent, just because he speaks well on a variety of issues and does okay on Countdown.

Arsenal's Theo Walcott knew exactly what he was doing when he admitted to diving the other day against Leeds. He was putting his hands up to something that has been the scourge of football for years and was basically trying to be honest.
And yet he was mullered by fans and pundits - some of whom called for the FA to charge him with cheating, for goodness' sake.

Walcott didn't get anything out of his dive, so he didn't benefit from it. But that wasn't enough for the critics, who demanded he was hung, drawn and quartered.

And yet 24 hours later, Dimitar Berbatov, who went down in instalments under challenge from Danny Agger, insisted afterwards: "It wasn't a dive. I'm not like that."
And that was seemingly that.

What's more, ITV slammed Berbatov for going down too easily and yet still awarded him the Man of the Match award at the end of the game. Go figure.

The dysfunctional family of football likes what it knows. It can cope with that.
Anything else and it gets its knickers in a twist.
Which is why there has been such a furore over Twitter.

Ryan Babel retweeted a quite funny mocked-up picture of referee Howard Webb in a United shirt after feeling aggrieved at the penalty decision that cost Liverpool their place in the FA Cup.
The howls of protest and condemnation went on long into Sunday night with, again, fans and pundits calling for Babel to be gutted like a fish.
And yet what had he really done wrong? Was what he did worse than Neil Warnock calling El Hadji Diouf a 'sewer rat' in a post match interview?
Was it worse than Clint Hill appearing to threaten Diouf by saying in a tweet: "That c*** will get what's coming to him"?
Or keeper Paddy Kenny tweeting: "That **** Diouf will get it one day"?
You know and I know that Diouf was bang out of order with his treatment of Jamie Mackie, who had broken his leg in QPR's FA Cup defeat to Blackburn last weekend.
But there was something far more sinister about the thoughts committed to Twitter by the Rangers players than about anything Babel had done.

And just on Babel, why have the FA charged him for what he has tweeted but not Manchester United's Darren Fletcher, who chased and pushed Webb in the game between United and Arsenal last month?
The reason? Because football seems not to want players to have a point of view.

Pundits have them, presenters have them, fans have them, Uncle Tom Cobley can have them. But the most important people in the game, the players, don't. Or can't. And that cannot be the case.

What would you, as a fan, rather have - dull pronouncements on the pass for the goal and how any given player just wants to take one game at a time? Comments put through the PR department that emerge as pure as the driven snow? Or anger, frustration and alternative views within the boundaries of what is acceptable?

Let me be more succinct

Berba is known to dive. Yes he was booked before for diving.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/...shois-yard.html

So IMO he is  a serial diver. I have posted that in MU thread and have been warned that action will be taken against me if I say anymore negative things about MU players in their thread 

Anyways most of us (non MU fans) agree that it shouldn't have been a penalty. That includes Liverpool players who are first account witnesses!

My point is that why and that of BABEL (our main protagonist in this thread) too  does MU always get the rub of the green i.e. Howard Webb apparently and without hesitation always give MU the ADVANTAGE (in this case a penalty & a Goal as a result) ?
And especially at OT. No?

On the contrary, shouting that gf comment in public may lead to defamation unless it is VERY clear that it is a joke, (ie the gf was there when it was shouted and laughed etc), since it is a public place and a place where peopl who know the bf and the gf would appear, and that statement would give these friends or public a negative impression of the person defamed and her status in eyes of friends and society would be tarnished and hence suffered damage to her reputation.

Anyway back to Babel's case, its really a tough situation not just with the FA but with alot of other bodies, ie this social media phenomena. It cannot be denied that the social media reaches out to so much more audience - tens of thousands to millions of readers - and the impact can be disastrous if not handled well. The FA have their disciplinary board and rules and one of it is nothing disrespectful or diminishing the image of the referees / FAs should be published in public. One of the factors considered (rightfully or wrongfully) would have been the need to prevent mass flooding of similar messages by others. So sadly Ryan was made a scapegoat in that sense. But on the other hand if nothing was done, and that act is deemed condoned, imagine how many such tweets will appear on players or manager's blog on a weekly or even daily basis. Imagine the pressure on the referees whose faces are on blogs everywhere with not-so-well-received comments and how can they even stand out to the pitch that weekend to officiate a match?

my 2 cents

yes yes he is a serial diver. is that what u want the posters here to say? thats why you create this thread, instead of discussing FA's inconsistent with their decision, including the Babel incident and even Diouf's issue with QPR?

yes he is a serial diver then. End of story on that. Can we go back on the discussion of FA's issue now? 

---

Added on January 14, 2011, 4:07 pmFairness & Justice dicatates that not only should I & every football fans should support the exoneration of Babel from the FA charge but  that Babel & his fellow footballers should have the freedom to express their POVs.

Drogba, Ronaldo, Nani , Iniesta, Gerrard, Chamakh are serial divers. Berba is not. TS managed to dig what, one evidence so how does that make it serial? The fact that the peno last week has plenty of opinions split says it all really. It was not as clear cut as it's supposedly is.

hahaha i appreciate what TS try to discuss...but in the end he was so bias with his own thought...

Whether berba dive or not is already a past what we want to discuss here as you had decided to open this thread is about the comment from the player itself...

On the contrary, shouting that gf comment in public may lead to defamation unless it is VERY clear that it is a joke, (ie the gf was there when it was shouted and laughed etc), since it is a public place and a place where peopl who know the bf and the gf would appear, and that statement would give these friends or public a negative impression of the person defamed and her status in eyes of friends and society would be tarnished and hence suffered damage to her reputation.

Anyway back to Babel's case, its really a tough situation not just with the FA but with alot of other bodies, ie this social media phenomena. It cannot be denied that the social media reaches out to so much more audience - tens of thousands to millions of readers - and the impact can be disastrous if not handled well. The FA have their disciplinary board and rules and one of it is nothing disrespectful or diminishing the image of the referees / FAs should be published in public. One of the factors considered (rightfully or wrongfully) would have been the need to prevent mass flooding of similar messages by others. So sadly Ryan was made a scapegoat in that sense. But on the other hand if nothing was done, and that act is deemed condoned, imagine how many such tweets will appear on players or manager's blog on a weekly or even daily basis. Imagine the pressure on the referees whose faces are on blogs everywhere with not-so-well-received comments and how can they even stand out to the pitch that weekend to officiate a match?

my 2 cents

Nvm, let TS get what he wants to hear, then we can continue discussing the issue here.

Where does one draw the line between voicing and opinion and making an accusation though?

Rather than taking action, I'd rather they look at prevention. Accusations that a ref is biased usually surface after fans watch replays and the ref was clearly wrong. This in turn can be attributed to FIFAs reluctance to introduce video replays. I'll stop here before I stray any further but you get the gist of it.

For the sake of sticking to the thread title, I'll try to keep this discussion in the context of this incident. If I read you right, you are suggesting that the FA has clamp down on this to set and example. As it is they have been rather inconsistent in dealing with comments or accusations made verbally to the press. This in itself has led to accusations of favouratism practiced by the FA. If they do decide to make an example of Babel, they need to ensure that it is a blanket rule and that they punish any offender, regardless of reputation or status. Or, they can take this as a one-off and deal with each issue as it arises.

Where does one draw the line between voicing and opinion and making an accusation though?

Rather than taking action, I'd rather they look at prevention. Accusations that a ref is biased usually surface after fans watch replays and the ref was clearly wrong. This in turn can be attributed to FIFAs reluctance to introduce video replays. I'll stop here before I stray any further but you get the gist of it.

For the sake of sticking to the thread title, I'll try to keep this discussion in the context of this incident. If I read you right, you are suggesting that the FA has clamp down on this to set and example. As it is they have been rather inconsistent in dealing with comments or accusations made verbally to the press. This in itself has led to accusations of favouratism practiced by the FA. If they do decide to make an example of Babel, they need to ensure that it is a blanket rule and that they punish any offender, regardless of reputation or status. Or, they can take this as a one-off and deal with each issue as it arises.

If someone stands in the middle of 1 Utama and shouts, "my girlfriend is a whore!", can he get sued for defamation? I think not. Social media is basically someone shouting his thoughts out in the middle of 1 Utama albeit with the aid of a powerful sound wave enchancer.

......They had best be careful to remain fair and be seen to be fair, as recent campaigns have shown, if that ocean get whipped up it can envelope mere national bodies in a single dismissive wave.
Any attempt by the FA to become the Twitter Police will not only fail but it will also be incredibly unwelcome in the community of Twitter users and likely end up with the FA looking foolish.
What next for the FA? A full time Twitter officer to scan for and discipline the offenders, a 5th official in the changing room to listen out for “excited utterance” after the game?  May be a Blog bobby to review more considered comments.
As above, however offensive comments are, at the end of the day, offensive and the normal rules apply to me, you and Ryan Babel. His Tweets have become part of a bigger issue. It looks inevitable he will be taken through the FA procedure correctly and punished accordingly. That doesn’t mean though that any punishment is warranted or wise.

As a final thought, please compare Babel’s tweets against the record of the two managers from Saturday’s game. At different times to different games they have both “criticised” the referee. King Kenny appeared to call some of the same referees’ decisions’ a “joke” and who can forget Fergies’ “unfit” claim from a couple of years ago?

If you are neutral in situations of injustice, you have chosen the side of the oppressor. If an elephant has its foot on the tail of a mouse and you say that you are neutral, the mouse will not appreciate your neutrality.

As a final thought, please compare Babel’s tweets against the record of the two managers from Saturday’s game. At different times to different games they have both “criticised” the referee. King Kenny appeared to call some of the same referees’ decisions’ a “joke” and who can forget Fergies’ “unfit” claim from a couple of years ago?

Let me be more succinct

Berba is known to dive. Yes he was booked before for diving.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/...shois-yard.html

So IMO he is  a serial diver. I have posted that in MU thread and have been warned that action will be taken against me if I say anymore negative things about MU players in their thread 

Anyways most of us (non MU fans) agree that it shouldn't have been a penalty. That includes Liverpool players who are first account witnesses!

My point is that why and that of BABEL (our main protagonist in this thread) too  does MU always get the rub of the green i.e. Howard Webb apparently and without hesitation always give MU the ADVANTAGE (in this case a penalty & a Goal as a result) ?
And especially at OT. No?

So are we talking about who dives professionally and who dives like a retard?

If we've decided to carry on with the decision made by FA, I shall share my opinion.

I think FA just over-exaggerate the whole incident. But at same time, putting the ref with Man Utd shirt also somewhat insulting the ref and the club.

'What is it about Howard Webb and Old Trafford' asked the front-page blurb of F365 after Sunday's rather

controversial FA Cup clash. Well now you can judge for yourself with our guide to his last ten matches at OT...




Man United 1 Man City 2, February 10, 2008
City's victory is more comfortable than the scoreline suggests - United score their goal in injury-time - and Webb

enjoys a relatively easy day at the office. The game marks the last time that United fail to win a game at Old Trafford

officiated by the Yorkshireman.



Man 2 United Arsenal 1, April 19, 2008
There is little argument from the Arsenal players - five of whom are booked during the 90 minutes - when William

Gallas handles in the area and Webb awards a penalty that sees Cristiano Ronaldo equalise from the spot. Ten

minutes later, Owen Hargreaves - remember him? - scores United's winner direct from a free-kick.


"You could give or not give the penalty. For the free-kick, Gilberto did not touch him," complains Arsene Wenger.



Man United 3 Chelsea 0, January 11, 2009
Less than 48 hours after Rafa Benitez advises Luiz Felipe Scolari to "man-mark" Ferguson and his coaching staff

at half-time so that the referee is protected from interference, Webb cautions four Chelsea players within half an

hour before a Nemanja Vidic header on the stroke of half-time sets United on their way to an emphatic victory.


Just moments before the Vidic goal, Webb had ruled out a Wayne Rooney 'goal' after United had taken a short

corner that went unnoticed by most spectators inside Old Trafford.



Man United 2 Blackburn 1, February 21, 2009
Webb disallows a Jonny Evans header and cautions Cristiano Ronaldo for diving shortly before the forward scores

the game's winning goal. Rovers complain afterwards that Ronaldo should have also been booked for flicking out - it

hardly amounts to a kick - at David Dunn but the game's most controversial moment occurs in the final seconds

when a clear shirt-pull inside the area by Rafael on Morten Gamst Pedersen goes unpunished.


"It would have to be pretty blatant to get a penalty at Old Trafford. We all know that," rages an angry Sam Allardyce.

"You'd have to ask Howard Webb if Ronaldo should have been on the pitch. Those things come and go when you're

playing at Old Trafford, don't they?"



Man United 5 Tottenham 2, April 24, 2009
In the words of the Daily Telegraph, 'it could have been the decision that secured United the championship'. United

are trailing 2-0 with barely half an hour left to play when Webb - 'who was almost 35 yards away, and behind play' -

awards a penalty when Heurelho Gomes tangles with Michael Carrick. Replays clearly show the goalkeeper took

ball before man. "The players can't believe it," says Harry Redknapp. "It changed the game." Momentum shifted,

Spurs collapse and United never looked back.


"I think it was a case of a referee crumbling under the pressure at Old Trafford really," complains Jermaine Jenas.

"The atmosphere, the occasion, the importance of the match, a lot of factors take their toll when making decisions.

One thing which struck me about it was that he didn't even think. It was like he'd already made his mind up when he

came out for the second half that he was going to give something. It was a very important moment in the season."



Man United 3 Man City 1, January 27, 2010
Webb makes his first return to Old Trafford since the Gomes controversy for the second-leg Carling Cup semi-final.

United eventually progress to Wembley courtesy of an injury-time aggregate winner from Wayne Rooney, but the

outcome could have been very different had Rio Ferdinand justifiably received his marching orders after 24 minutes

of play after a clash with Carlos Tevez.


In the words of the BBC match report, 'Ferdinand was fortunate to escape punishment from referee Howard Webb

when he caught the Argentine in the face with a swinging arm as they tussled for possession.'



Man United 2 Liverpool 1, March 21, 2010
Sir Alex Ferguson and Rafa Benitez clash on the touchline after Webb awards the home side a controversial 19th-

minute penalty that enables the champions to draw level after Fernando Torres' early opener.


With replays also showing that the initial contact between Javier Mascherano and Antonio Valencia occurred

outside of the box, Benitez accuses the United player of diving to win the penalty. Ferguson responds by applauding

Webb's decision and arguing Mascherano should have been dismissed. "Refs are professional but we know about

the influence of Sir Alex in everything," counters Benitez.



Man United 3 Liverpool 2, September 19, 2010
Though Liverpool claw their way back into the match through two disputed decisions, neither call is made by Webb.

"They didn't offer anything and depended on decisions from the linesman to get back in the game," notes Sir Alex.

With Darren Cann flagging for both infringements, and replays offering no evidence that Webb would have awarded

either the free-kick or the penalty from which Steven Gerrard scores, the referee's big decision of the day is whether

or not to dismiss last man John O'Shea for pulling back Fernando Torres.


As F365 argued at the time: 'The decision was taken quickly and apparently made without any consultation between

Webb and Darren Cann, his long-time assistant whose flag-waving prompted the award of a free-kick. Ref365

argues in support of Webb on the basis that replays 'suggest' Torres would not have reached the ball. Denied the

use of a replay, it must have been a 50-50 call from the officials and it's certainly debatable whether a defender

making such a cynical foul in the full knowledge that he was the last man deserved the benefit of any doubt.'



Man United 1 Arsenal 0, December 13, 2010
Cann is not on duty and it is Webb's new assistant Dave Bryan who awards United a second-half penalty for a non-

existent handball by Gael Clichy. Webb rubber-stamps the award and justice - or something close to it - is only

served when Rooney blazes over the ball.


Four of the visitors are cautioned over the course of the game, while Rio Ferdinand escapes punishment for a hip-

high, studs-up challenge on Bacary Sagna and Darren Fletcher isn't even cautioned for chasing after Webb before

pushing the official.



Man United 1 Liverpool 0, January 9, 2011
In sharp contrast to events six months previously, it is Webb, from a distance of around 25 yards, who awards

United their match-winning penalty for an alleged offence that occurs on almost exactly the same part of the pitch

that saw Cann award Liverpool their penalty at Old Trafford in September. Replays indicate that Berbatov falls to the

ground in an exaggerated fashion and show that Webb linesman did not signal that any foul took place. "The penalty

is a joke," says new Pool boss Kenny Dalglish.


The Scot is further aggrieved by Webb's decision to dismiss Steven Gerrard but there is little sympathy for the

Liverpool captain after his reckless lunge

Worse crime ? Easy john terry tidur dgn awek wayne bridge.  Hands down. Tweeting cant even come close to this.

LOL. TS clearly have that much HATRED against Man Utd.

The thread started fine and he keep on babbling on Berbatov and Babel. To add insult to injury, he then go on find all of the matches that 'went' United's way.

TS, these things have their own fate and story. You have decisions go and against you. People, if they want, could easily dig up all of the materials on De Jong and pointed them up here.

Get back to the topic. Don't be an ass and make yourself look stupid.

Just to entertain you, here you go

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/no...ter-united-live

no offense to the chelsea fans, this is just a matter in entertaining the TS 'love' of Man United.

Worse crime ? Easy john terry tidur dgn awek wayne bridge.  Hands down. Tweeting cant even come close to this.

Well, at least Terry tak tido ngan nenek LOL. Rooney, once allegedly, tido ngan nenek. WTF? Tak leh blah. 

LOL. TS clearly have that much HATRED against Man Utd.

The thread started fine and he keep on babbling on Berbatov and Babel. To add insult to injury, he then go on find all of the matches that 'went' United's way.

TS, these things have their own fate and story. You have decisions go and against you. People, if they want, could easily dig up all of the materials on De Jong and pointed them up here.

Get back to the topic. Don't be an ass and make yourself look stupid.

Just to entertain you, here you go

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/no...ter-united-live

no offense to the chelsea fans, this is just a matter in entertaining the TS 'love' of Man United.

to be fair, all the games he quoted were refereed by Howard Webb

Yes, I can see that. If he puts it that way, I could have said FA is against United by having most of the refs to produce decisions favoring us. But, that would be silly, right?

Fixed.

To be fair, in UK 30 y/o already can jadi nenek woo. NILF?

Oh Modric just dived. but no card. Ref and FA like him too?

I thought this is a great thread to discuss  & I think is timely to address it in every football forum.
The fans, football pundits & every Jackass, Dicks & Ah Kows are allowed to expressed their POVs. Why can't the Players?

Here is an article for your reference

By Darren Lewis

Published 12:19 12/01/11

http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/opinion/co...icle671271.html
Or am I too simplistic about the politics of football?
I'll start first
Players, no matter how thick or dense they are, are in most instances able to give 'first witness account'.
If Walcott says he dove, can an 'incompetent' referee or FA official  states otherwise?
OTH Berba denied but then would you believe him?

OK Your turn to discuss next.

Please keep it civil & as usual follow forum rules!

Our  discussion here is why Babel (or any other footballer)  is not allowed to express his POV regarding Webb's ruling. Would it be fair of me to say that there is a bias or selective ruling for and against certain clubs or individuals. Whether its Berba or Rio or Scholes or Gerrard or de Jong or Terry etc. the ruling is up to the FA official. If he is biased or prejudice in his ruling then shouldn't he be singled out when there is a preponderance amount of evidence indicating so especially Howard's performances at OT especially vis a vis Babel POV
http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8...6648615,00.html

'What is it about Howard Webb and Old Trafford' asked the front-page blurb of F365 after Sunday's rather controversial FA Cup clash. Well now you can judge for yourself with our guide to his last ten matches at OT...



Man United 1 Man City 2, February 10, 2008
City's victory is more comfortable than the scoreline suggests - United score their goal in injury-time - and Webb enjoys a relatively easy day at the office. The game marks the last time that United fail to win a game at Old Trafford officiated by the Yorkshireman.



Man 2 United Arsenal 1, April 19, 2008
There is little argument from the Arsenal players - five of whom are booked during the 90 minutes - when William Gallas handles in the area and Webb awards a penalty that sees Cristiano Ronaldo equalise from the spot. Ten minutes later, Owen Hargreaves - remember him? - scores United's winner direct from a free-kick.


"You could give or not give the penalty. For the free-kick, Gilberto did not touch him," complains Arsene Wenger.



Man United 3 Chelsea 0, January 11, 2009
Less than 48 hours after Rafa Benitez advises Luiz Felipe Scolari to "man-mark" Ferguson and his coaching staff at half-time so that the referee is protected from interference, Webb cautions four Chelsea players within half an hour before a Nemanja Vidic header on the stroke of half-time sets United on their way to an emphatic victory.


Just moments before the Vidic goal, Webb had ruled out a Wayne Rooney 'goal' after United had taken a short corner that went unnoticed by most spectators inside Old Trafford.



Man United 2 Blackburn 1, February 21, 2009
Webb disallows a Jonny Evans header and cautions Cristiano Ronaldo for diving shortly before the forward scores the game's winning goal. Rovers complain afterwards that Ronaldo should have also been booked for flicking out - it hardly amounts to a kick - at David Dunn but the game's most controversial moment occurs in the final seconds when a clear shirt-pull inside the area by Rafael on Morten Gamst Pedersen goes unpunished.


"It would have to be pretty blatant to get a penalty at Old Trafford. We all know that," rages an angry Sam Allardyce. "You'd have to ask Howard Webb if Ronaldo should have been on the pitch. Those things come and go when you're playing at Old Trafford, don't they?"



Man United 5 Tottenham 2, April 24, 2009
In the words of the Daily Telegraph, 'it could have been the decision that secured United the championship'. United are trailing 2-0 with barely half an hour left to play when Webb - 'who was almost 35 yards away, and behind play' - awards a penalty when Heurelho Gomes tangles with Michael Carrick. Replays clearly show the goalkeeper took ball before man. "The players can't believe it," says Harry Redknapp. "It changed the game." Momentum shifted, Spurs collapse and United never looked back.


"I think it was a case of a referee crumbling under the pressure at Old Trafford really," complains Jermaine Jenas. "The atmosphere, the occasion, the importance of the match, a lot of factors take their toll when making decisions. One thing which struck me about it was that he didn't even think. It was like he'd already made his mind up when he came out for the second half that he was going to give something. It was a very important moment in the season."



Man United 3 Man City 1, January 27, 2010
Webb makes his first return to Old Trafford since the Gomes controversy for the second-leg Carling Cup semi-final. United eventually progress to Wembley courtesy of an injury-time aggregate winner from Wayne Rooney, but the outcome could have been very different had Rio Ferdinand justifiably received his marching orders after 24 minutes of play after a clash with Carlos Tevez.


In the words of the BBC match report, 'Ferdinand was fortunate to escape punishment from referee Howard Webb when he caught the Argentine in the face with a swinging arm as they tussled for possession.'



Man United 2 Liverpool 1, March 21, 2010
Sir Alex Ferguson and Rafa Benitez clash on the touchline after Webb awards the home side a controversial 19th-minute penalty that enables the champions to draw level after Fernando Torres' early opener.


With replays also showing that the initial contact between Javier Mascherano and Antonio Valencia occurred outside of the box, Benitez accuses the United player of diving to win the penalty. Ferguson responds by applauding Webb's decision and arguing Mascherano should have been dismissed. "Refs are professional but we know about the influence of Sir Alex in everything," counters Benitez.



Man United 3 Liverpool 2, September 19, 2010
Though Liverpool claw their way back into the match through two disputed decisions, neither call is made by Webb. "They didn't offer anything and depended on decisions from the linesman to get back in the game," notes Sir Alex. With Darren Cann flagging for both infringements, and replays offering no evidence that Webb would have awarded either the free-kick or the penalty from which Steven Gerrard scores, the referee's big decision of the day is whether or not to dismiss last man John O'Shea for pulling back Fernando Torres.


As F365 argued at the time: 'The decision was taken quickly and apparently made without any consultation between Webb and Darren Cann, his long-time assistant whose flag-waving prompted the award of a free-kick. Ref365 argues in support of Webb on the basis that replays 'suggest' Torres would not have reached the ball. Denied the use of a replay, it must have been a 50-50 call from the officials and it's certainly debatable whether a defender making such a cynical foul in the full knowledge that he was the last man deserved the benefit of any doubt.'



Man United 1 Arsenal 0, December 13, 2010
Cann is not on duty and it is Webb's new assistant Dave Bryan who awards United a second-half penalty for a non-existent handball by Gael Clichy. Webb rubber-stamps the award and justice - or something close to it - is only served when Rooney blazes over the ball.


Four of the visitors are cautioned over the course of the game, while Rio Ferdinand escapes punishment for a hip-high, studs-up challenge on Bacary Sagna and Darren Fletcher isn't even cautioned for chasing after Webb before pushing the official.



Man United 1 Liverpool 0, January 9, 2011
In sharp contrast to events six months previously, it is Webb, from a distance of around 25 yards, who awards United their match-winning penalty for an alleged offence that occurs on almost exactly the same part of the pitch that saw Cann award Liverpool their penalty at Old Trafford in September. Replays indicate that Berbatov falls to the ground in an exaggerated fashion and show that Webb linesman did not signal that any foul took place. "The penalty is a joke," says new Pool boss Kenny Dalglish.


The Scot is further aggrieved by Webb's decision to dismiss Steven Gerrard but there is little sympathy for the Liverpool captain after his reckless lunge

Ts failed. It has nothing to do with players since you highlighting Webb with games. Who is the idiot now? You and your articles is like that guy in k full of crap only. Babel criticize Webb and its related to the fa. Cos we all know Webb is from the fa. Or did you think Webb is under united payroll? If refree are under united payroll why rafael sent off. Can you even highlight some issue that has no Webb or united involve? De Jong karate kick into xabi? Busquests fake injury? Oh I know ts is on a mission to save babel and condemn berba.

How about Drogba got banned cos he said f king disgrace in front of tv in the semifinal game between chelsea and Barcelona? Or is it you could not be bothered with them cos it ain't united related.

Good topic but just a cover up. Grow some balls and banter like a man. Valid reasoning will always win. You flawed understanding is that webb is helping united that is Webb's problem. Not united. All your arguement always revolve united issue and don't act holy by quoting your long ass post in the first post cos it's full of crap already.

If no refree want to help your club maybe could be your face problem. Lol.

Look we want Honesty & Integrity in the Game. Whats wrong with that?
For example
God willing, City win the title by pipping Arsenal or MU by 1 point.
We  want to say City won the title honestly.
We don't want to say at the end of the season to say Arsenal should have won because they could have if Rio should have been red carded etc.
Or MU pipping Arsenal by 1 point when rightly Neville should have been sent off!
I think most of us (other than you MU 'fans') understand the thrust of my argument.

Players are important cogs of the game.

The title said the worst crime a footballer can commit. But all I can see are posts about Webb. Can anyone explain to me what referee had to do with the term 'footballer'? They oso kick the ball in the match isit? I'm a noob and a glory hunter, I dont know all this thing. I only know how to celebrate 

Look we want Honesty & Integrity in the Game. Whats wrong with that?
For example
God willing, City win the title by pipping Arsenal or MU by 1 point.
We  want to say City won the title honestly.
We don't want to say at the end of the season to say Arsenal should have won because they could have if Rio should have been red carded etc.
Or MU pipping Arsenal by 1 point when rightly Neville should have been sent off!
I think most of us (other than you MU 'fans') understand the thrust of my argument.

Players are important cogs of the game.

The title said the worst crime a footballer can commit. But all I can see are posts about Webb. Can anyone explain to me what referee had to do with the term 'footballer'? They oso kick the ball in the match isit? I'm a noob and a glory hunter, I dont know all this thing. I only know how to celebrate 

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story/_/...-report?cc=4716

I bet this is one the the top 5 in the list of worst crime.

Reminder,
This thread is all about Berbatov Dive and Babel,
PLEASE DO NOT EXPECT TS TO TAKE THAT AS DISSCUSSION POINT.
Modric's dive is just out of topic .

Thanks. 

lol

lastly, sorry! i pull back all my words now.

been noticing your post lately, seriously quite annoying

"you try so hard, obvious troll is obvious,now a single lol"

if you got nothing better to say............................
usually i always ignore, but i guess today im in a mood to highlight you out
your post in MUST also one kind only.
no worries having said that its not a crime for you to behave this way, no mods will ban nor warn you.
its just me, felt the need to tegur you

now i quote this from /k/ for you,
belok kiri, pusing kiri kanan, tengok belakang, make a u turn...tak suruh you pergi mampus, but just shuddap will ya

in before why so serious 

lastly, sorry! i pull back all my words now.

been noticing your post lately, seriously quite annoying

"you try so hard, obvious troll is obvious,now a single lol"

if you got nothing better to say............................
usually i always ignore, but i guess today im in a mood to highlight you out
your post in MUST also one kind only.
no worries having said that its not a crime for you to behave this way, no mods will ban nor warn you.
its just me, felt the need to tegur you

now i quote this from /k/ for you,
belok kiri, pusing kiri kanan, tengok belakang, make a u turn...tak suruh you pergi mampus, but just shuddap will ya

in before why so serious 

lastly, sorry! i pull back all my words now.

lol

lol

'What is it about Howard Webb and Old Trafford' asked the front-page blurb of F365 after Sunday's rather

controversial FA Cup clash. Well now you can judge for yourself with our guide to his last ten matches at OT...




Man United 1 Man City 2, February 10, 2008
City's victory is more comfortable than the scoreline suggests - United score their goal in injury-time - and Webb

enjoys a relatively easy day at the office. The game marks the last time that United fail to win a game at Old Trafford

officiated by the Yorkshireman.



Man 2 United Arsenal 1, April 19, 2008
There is little argument from the Arsenal players - five of whom are booked during the 90 minutes - when William

Gallas handles in the area and Webb awards a penalty that sees Cristiano Ronaldo equalise from the spot. Ten

minutes later, Owen Hargreaves - remember him? - scores United's winner direct from a free-kick.


"You could give or not give the penalty. For the free-kick, Gilberto did not touch him," complains Arsene Wenger.



Man United 3 Chelsea 0, January 11, 2009
Less than 48 hours after Rafa Benitez advises Luiz Felipe Scolari to "man-mark" Ferguson and his coaching staff

at half-time so that the referee is protected from interference, Webb cautions four Chelsea players within half an

hour before a Nemanja Vidic header on the stroke of half-time sets United on their way to an emphatic victory.


Just moments before the Vidic goal, Webb had ruled out a Wayne Rooney 'goal' after United had taken a short

corner that went unnoticed by most spectators inside Old Trafford.



Man United 2 Blackburn 1, February 21, 2009
Webb disallows a Jonny Evans header and cautions Cristiano Ronaldo for diving shortly before the forward scores

the game's winning goal. Rovers complain afterwards that Ronaldo should have also been booked for flicking out - it

hardly amounts to a kick - at David Dunn but the game's most controversial moment occurs in the final seconds

when a clear shirt-pull inside the area by Rafael on Morten Gamst Pedersen goes unpunished.


"It would have to be pretty blatant to get a penalty at Old Trafford. We all know that," rages an angry Sam Allardyce.

"You'd have to ask Howard Webb if Ronaldo should have been on the pitch. Those things come and go when you're

playing at Old Trafford, don't they?"



Man United 5 Tottenham 2, April 24, 2009
In the words of the Daily Telegraph, 'it could have been the decision that secured United the championship'. United

are trailing 2-0 with barely half an hour left to play when Webb - 'who was almost 35 yards away, and behind play' -

awards a penalty when Heurelho Gomes tangles with Michael Carrick. Replays clearly show the goalkeeper took

ball before man. "The players can't believe it," says Harry Redknapp. "It changed the game." Momentum shifted,

Spurs collapse and United never looked back.


"I think it was a case of a referee crumbling under the pressure at Old Trafford really," complains Jermaine Jenas.

"The atmosphere, the occasion, the importance of the match, a lot of factors take their toll when making decisions.

One thing which struck me about it was that he didn't even think. It was like he'd already made his mind up when he

came out for the second half that he was going to give something. It was a very important moment in the season."



Man United 3 Man City 1, January 27, 2010
Webb makes his first return to Old Trafford since the Gomes controversy for the second-leg Carling Cup semi-final.

United eventually progress to Wembley courtesy of an injury-time aggregate winner from Wayne Rooney, but the

outcome could have been very different had Rio Ferdinand justifiably received his marching orders after 24 minutes

of play after a clash with Carlos Tevez.


In the words of the BBC match report, 'Ferdinand was fortunate to escape punishment from referee Howard Webb

when he caught the Argentine in the face with a swinging arm as they tussled for possession.'



Man United 2 Liverpool 1, March 21, 2010
Sir Alex Ferguson and Rafa Benitez clash on the touchline after Webb awards the home side a controversial 19th-

minute penalty that enables the champions to draw level after Fernando Torres' early opener.


With replays also showing that the initial contact between Javier Mascherano and Antonio Valencia occurred

outside of the box, Benitez accuses the United player of diving to win the penalty. Ferguson responds by applauding

Webb's decision and arguing Mascherano should have been dismissed. "Refs are professional but we know about

the influence of Sir Alex in everything," counters Benitez.



Man United 3 Liverpool 2, September 19, 2010
Though Liverpool claw their way back into the match through two disputed decisions, neither call is made by Webb.

"They didn't offer anything and depended on decisions from the linesman to get back in the game," notes Sir Alex.

With Darren Cann flagging for both infringements, and replays offering no evidence that Webb would have awarded

either the free-kick or the penalty from which Steven Gerrard scores, the referee's big decision of the day is whether

or not to dismiss last man John O'Shea for pulling back Fernando Torres.


As F365 argued at the time: 'The decision was taken quickly and apparently made without any consultation between

Webb and Darren Cann, his long-time assistant whose flag-waving prompted the award of a free-kick. Ref365

argues in support of Webb on the basis that replays 'suggest' Torres would not have reached the ball. Denied the

use of a replay, it must have been a 50-50 call from the officials and it's certainly debatable whether a defender

making such a cynical foul in the full knowledge that he was the last man deserved the benefit of any doubt.'



Man United 1 Arsenal 0, December 13, 2010
Cann is not on duty and it is Webb's new assistant Dave Bryan who awards United a second-half penalty for a non-

existent handball by Gael Clichy. Webb rubber-stamps the award and justice - or something close to it - is only

served when Rooney blazes over the ball.


Four of the visitors are cautioned over the course of the game, while Rio Ferdinand escapes punishment for a hip-

high, studs-up challenge on Bacary Sagna and Darren Fletcher isn't even cautioned for chasing after Webb before

pushing the official.



Man United 1 Liverpool 0, January 9, 2011
In sharp contrast to events six months previously, it is Webb, from a distance of around 25 yards, who awards

United their match-winning penalty for an alleged offence that occurs on almost exactly the same part of the pitch

that saw Cann award Liverpool their penalty at Old Trafford in September. Replays indicate that Berbatov falls to the

ground in an exaggerated fashion and show that Webb linesman did not signal that any foul took place. "The penalty

is a joke," says new Pool boss Kenny Dalglish.


The Scot is further aggrieved by Webb's decision to dismiss Steven Gerrard but there is little sympathy for the

Liverpool captain after his reckless lunge

Who resurrect this thread?
Must be full of raging hormones or 'mixed' emotions eh?
Just to be clear what this thread was all about I have summarised them here below!
Question here is that I have offered in general a QUALITATIVE opinion especially on Webb's bias and or refereeing and the inordinate amount of favouritism to MU by FA's officials. Does it have any merits then & NOW?


http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8...6648615,00.html

We must not drop points at JJB Stadium tonite by hook or by crook. Obertan on left tonite anyone or bebe or rooney?